Knicks Future

[Mr. J]

I was on RealGM not to long ago and I noticed something very important. This can make or break the New York Knicks for future generations. Depending on how Isiah Thomas manipulates this, we can be a great team with a very bright future, or we could be a mediocre team for a while or we could just be really bad for a while. Our worst problem can be taken care of significantly if we play it smart. Our worst problem? You know it?cap room.

Okay, it starts off with Penny Hardaway and Tim Thomas. Next year Penny Hardaway will be making about 16 million while Tim Thomas will be making 14 million in their expiring year. Together they are 30 million dollars worth in expiring contracts. Now the very next year, Allan Houston will be making about 21 million and Maurice Taylor will be making about 10 million. Together that equals 31 million. After that year, Kurt Thomas, Jerome Williams, and Malik Rose will all be up. All 3 of them together make roughly 7 million each. That right there is about 21 million. Now adding those three years up if the Knicks decide to keep their expiring contracts, they will scratch nearly 82 million in dollars off the cap all in 3 years!!! The next year, Marbury?s 22 million will be coming off the books as well.

What many would want is a sign and trade or something to get a good player. This will gives the Knicks an immediate player and could make them a pretty good team. While we would want the Knicks to be a good team right away, we have to look at the overall state of the franchise. Sometimes we need to make some sacrifices for some benefits in the future. We can?t be impatient and if we?re really true fans we would support this idea.

We also have to think about resigning Sweetney, and Ariza who would want some big bucks and rightly so. They will be the future and foundation of this franchise and making sure that they?re locked up is should be our primary option. The only way they might stay without some cash is if the direction of this club is hitting elite. So maybe signing a big name free agent with some of our expiring contracts would do us some good, but if we can?t it?s still all good. Isiah said he wont trade his young players (Ariza, Sweetney and Crawford) which means he has to try and lock them up some how and this will be a good way in doing so.

While we?re loaded in the cap, in the next few years we can make some great moves to put this franchise over the top with our expiring contracts. It depends on what Isiah Thomas does. If he saw what I?m seeing right now, I think we can be a very good ball club in the next couple of years. Let?s not be impatient because patience pays off and hopefully it pays off with some W?s and possibly a championship in the next couple of years??? It depends on how patient we can be.

 

[Chutney]

The Knicks need to start drafting solid young players right now. If they can get a young starting lineup, it will begin to mature in about 3 or 4 years. When those contracts come off the books Isiah can sign good players that fit the team.
As long as he doesn't go crazy with the extra space, Isiah's got a great oppurtunity to rebuild this dysfunctional team.

 

[Tribute to H2O]

These are the things I feel we should do to improve our future.

1)We should trade Marbury for a lottery pick for this draft and a first rounder for next season and pack up Maurice Taylor with him. Then use the lottery pick to draft Jarett Jack. He's a great all around point guard and plays probably the best defense of all the point guards in the draft(I'm tired of being burned by every point guard in the league).

2)Pack up our expiring contracts along with JYD and do a sign and trade to get one player.

3)Resign Frank Williams and make him the starting point guard again.

4)Along with Jarett Jack we should also draft Tiago Splitter, Ryan Gomes, Vladimir Veremeenko. Then in the next offseason we'll have three first round draft picks to use.

5)Keep that center we got from the CBA.

If we do all of this we'll get rid of hefty contracts and get younger at the same time. We'll have a nice young promising group that just may win us a championship if were lucky.

 

[JWohl]

but....

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">it depends how patient we can be</div>
then we are screwed... i would love to let the expiring contracts run out seeing as we could then sign free agents ....on the other hand if we use the contracts right (knowing isiah its not too likely) we could do sign and trades with the expiring contracts to land big names without gutting the rest of our roster so we could potentialy get a big name good player each year for the next 3,4 years if we handle the situation correctly...that is our best option because than we could group the good players we get (most likely guys in their prime or starting to declin) with the young players from the draft picks we have...

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">These are the things I feel we should do to improve our future.

1)We should trade Marbury for a lottery pick for this draft and a first rounder for next season and pack up Maurice Taylor with him. Then use the lottery pick to draft Jarett Jack. He's a great all around point guard and plays probably the best defense of all the point guards in the draft(I'm tired of being burned by every point guard in the league).

2)Pack up our expiring contracts along with JYD and do a sign and trade to get one player.

3)Resign Frank Williams and make him the starting point guard again.

4)Along with Jarett Jack we should also draft Tiago Splitter, Ryan Gomes, Vladimir Veremeenko. Then in the next offseason we'll have three first round draft picks to use.

5)Keep that center we got from the CBA.

If we do all of this we'll get rid of hefty contracts and get younger at the same time. We'll have a nice young promising group that just may win us a championship if were lucky.</div>
Funny thing is he's projected to be the next Stephon Marbury! I don't ctach Georgia Tech all that much, but is he kind of selfish? If we get a PG, it should be a distributor. If his defense is good though, we can definitely use him.

What kind of player do you have in mind? If we do that, could we resign Sweetney and Ariza?

Yeah, Frank Williams was my boy. What a waste of young talent. He was really breaking out in his second year. Penetrating and passing better, shooting better, playing defense. He could have become a good player. Who do you think he would have potentially turned out like?

Who should we draft if we can't get Splitter? I like Vlad and I would be very happy getting him. I don't know to much about Gomes. I'll do some research on him.

I didn't see him play yet not even in clips in the CBA.

I like that idea. You really have some interesting ideas on the team. I'd take you over Isiah any day. Sorry though, I'd take myself over anyone to be GM though. I'll let you be assitant though lol!

 

[Tribute to H2O]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">Funny thing is he's projected to be the next Stephon Marbury! I don't ctach Georgia Tech all that much, but is he kind of selfish? If we get a PG, it should be a distributor. If his defense is good though, we can definitely use him.

What kind of player do you have in mind? If we do that, could we resign Sweetney and Ariza?

Yeah, Frank Williams was my boy. What a waste of young talent. He was really breaking out in his second year. Penetrating and passing better, shooting better, playing defense. He could have become a good player. Who do you think he would have potentially turned out like?

Who should we draft if we can't get Splitter? I like Vlad and I would be very happy getting him. I don't know to much about Gomes. I'll do some research on him.

I didn't see him play yet not even in clips in the CBA.

I like that idea. You really have some interesting ideas on the team. I'd take you over Isiah any day. Sorry though, I'd take myself over anyone to be GM though. I'll let you be assitant though lol!

</div>

Jarett Jack is definetely not a Stephon Marbury type of player! He's a pass first point guard, He's big so he can post up other point guards. And best of all he can play DEFENSE! Best case scenario is Gary Payton.

I could honestly care less who it is get for our expiring contracts. I just want to move as many people as possible to clear up room for the new young guys. We'll be able to resign Ariza and Sweetney but we'll probably be over the cap.

Yup. What happened to Frank Williams was a shame. People were talking about him being a potential All Star then BANG. The kid couldnt get off the bench. I'd give him another chance though. I'm really not sure who can turn into. Maybe a lesser Jason Kidd or Gary Payton.

Vladimir is going to be a late first round pick most likely so no way do we use a lottery pick on him. I'm not sure who we should pick up if Tiago Splitter isnt available but he should be available. There's so much hoopla around Martynas and Aleksandrov he should available by the time our pick comes around. Gomes is a post up player. He can post up NBA small forwards and finish. He also has a nice midrange jumper and bankshot. I'm thinking he can be a great back up to Ariza.

I didnt see the CBA guy play either but from what I hear he performed well at the summer league so I'll be willing to give him a shot to prove himself.

I know I can do a better job than Isiah. Dolan should fire Isiah and hire me. I can do the job twice as good for half the price

. I should try talking to him one day and give him some of my ideas. You honestly think you can do a better job than me??

Silly rabbit. Let me have some of your brilliant ideas if you think you can do a better job than me.

 

[Platehpus]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">These are the things I feel we should do to improve our future.

1)We should trade Marbury for a lottery pick for this draft and a first rounder for next season and pack up Maurice Taylor with him. Then use the lottery pick to draft Jarett Jack. He's a great all around point guard and plays probably the best defense of all the point guards in the draft(I'm tired of being burned by every point guard in the league).

2)Pack up our expiring contracts along with JYD and do a sign and trade to get one player.

3)Resign Frank Williams and make him the starting point guard again.

4)Along with Jarett Jack we should also draft Tiago Splitter, Ryan Gomes, Vladimir Veremeenko. Then in the next offseason we'll have three first round draft picks to use.

5)Keep that center we got from the CBA.

If we do all of this we'll get rid of hefty contracts and get younger at the same time. We'll have a nice young promising group that just may win us a championship if were lucky.</div>
So you want to build around Sweetney with unproven talent? Please, think about what you're saying for a second.

 

[Tribute to H2O]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Platehpus:</div><div class="quote_post">So you want to build around Sweetney with unproven talent? Please, think about what you're saying for a second.</div>

Hmm... You have a point there. I mean the group of guys we have now are working so well for us why would we want a change?

Let's be serious here. You're talking as if we have some great team that is a serious contender. If we do things my way the worst thing that could happen is that we dont make the playoffs and end up in the lottery. Which is what's probably going to happen this year anyway. I'm tired of having such a huge payroll and having nothing to show for it. I'm tired of being excited about barely making the playoffs just to get become a four game pass to whoever we play in the first round. I want to start over. Period. At least this way we'll get some younger players, clear up some cap room and give the future some hope. So maybe you are the one who needs to think about you're saying.

 

[Kwan1031]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">These are the things I feel we should do to improve our future.

1)We should trade Marbury for a lottery pick for this draft and a first rounder for next season and pack up Maurice Taylor with him. Then use the lottery pick to draft Jarett Jack. He's a great all around point guard and plays probably the best defense of all the point guards in the draft(I'm tired of being burned by every point guard in the league).

2)Pack up our expiring contracts along with JYD and do a sign and trade to get one player.

3)Resign Frank Williams and make him the starting point guard again.

4)Along with Jarett Jack we should also draft Tiago Splitter, Ryan Gomes, Vladimir Veremeenko. Then in the next offseason we'll have three first round draft picks to use.

5)Keep that center we got from the CBA.

If we do all of this we'll get rid of hefty contracts and get younger at the same time. We'll have a nice young promising group that just may win us a championship if were lucky.</div>

1) What you are asking is to dump 20 mils of salary for a pick. Not only hardly any team has 20 mils salary cap to begin with, even if they has that caproom, they certainly won't want to fill that slot for Marbury and Taylor, while giving up high pick.

2) NY can fatch something good for expiring contracts. However, it's very hard for them to be used for sign-and-trade. The only reason other side will agree on sign and trade is to receive a quality player for losing thier player. But, expiring contracts are good for cleaning the caproom. If other side wants to clean up their salary, best way for them to do is just letting that player go, and it would make a little sense to receive expiring contract.

I don't think NY has much chance of making trade for picks or sign-and-trade, because there aren't too many chips to play with. But, if NY does some good research, I am sure they can receive quality players for their two expiring contracts, Penny and Thomas. After all, NY got Marbury for practically nothing, and adding another heavy contract doesn't seem to bother NY much. And, there are teams, who would love to shed some contracts, even if it means to give up their star...

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Kwan1031:</div><div class="quote_post">1) What you are asking is to dump 20 mils of salary for a pick. Not only hardly any team has 20 mils salary cap to begin with, even if they has that caproom, they certainly won't want to fill that slot for Marbury and Taylor, while giving up high pick.</div>
I think Marbury is worth a lottery pick. Maybe not Taylor, but why not Marbury. If a team sucks enough to be in the lottery 20 extra points and 8 extra assists can't hurt. I mean Jamison went for the 5th pick and him and Marbury are in the same league if not Marbury is higher. Also the Knicks expiring contracts are worth 30 million.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">2) NY can fatch something good for expiring contracts. However, it's very hard for them to be used for sign-and-trade. The only reason other side will agree on sign and trade is to receive a quality player for losing thier player. But, expiring contracts are good for cleaning the caproom. If other side wants to clean up their salary, best way for them to do is just letting that player go, and it would make a little sense to receive expiring contract.</div>
Well there have been many good players that were traded because of expiring contracts. 30 million is a fortune and packaging Hardaway and TT are bound to get us a really good player. I don't know about sign and trades and all that, I just know we can get a good player.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I don't think NY has much chance of making trade for picks or sign-and-trade, because there aren't too many chips to play with. But, if NY does some good research, I am sure they can receive quality players for their two expiring contracts, Penny and Thomas. After all, NY got Marbury for practically nothing, and adding another heavy contract doesn't seem to bother NY much. And, there are teams, who would love to shed some contracts, even if it means to give up their star...</div>
Those expiring contracts are good ebough chips. Also nothing for Marbury?? I beg to differ. The Suns used us as pawns to get them the second best record in the league now. We gave them cap space, 2 great prospects (one projected as the next Dirk) they used the space we gave them in getting an MVP candidate Steve Nash and Q Richardson.

 

[Umer remU]

go ahead and take frank williams from us, we certainly dont need him

 

[Kwan1031]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">I think Marbury is worth a lottery pick. Maybe not Taylor, but why not Marbury. If a team sucks enough to be in the lottery 20 extra points and 8 extra assists can't hurt. I mean Jamison went for the 5th pick and him and Marbury are in the same league if not Marbury is higher. Also the Knicks expiring contracts are worth 30 million.


Well there have been many good players that were traded because of expiring contracts. 30 million is a fortune and packaging Hardaway and TT are bound to get us a really good player. I don't know about sign and trades and all that, I just know we can get a good player.


Those expiring contracts are good ebough chips. Also nothing for Marbury?? I beg to differ. The Suns used us as pawns to get them the second best record in the league now. We gave them cap space, 2 great prospects (one projected as the next Dirk) they used the space we gave them in getting an MVP candidate Steve Nash and Q Richardson.</div>

What I meant is that teams with 20 mils caproom with high draft pick will not make a trade for Marbury and Taylor while dumping their high picks. Sure, if Knicks banged our door and asked if we were interested in trading D. Davis' expiring contract and this year's pick for Marbury, I am sure many people would have made that trade before B. Davis' trade. For contract for contract trade, Marbury can certainly fatch high draft pick for taking some contracts in return to make a deal, as how Wiz made Jamison trade; dumping Stack's contract. But, I don't think any team that starts over from the ground would want Marbury, while giving up their pick and filling up their 12+ mils salary cap, and especially not with Taylor and his contract. At this point, I don't think Marbury will wait for few losing seasons to just make PO when he is like 31 years old, and I think those rebuilding teams also know that.

Yeah, there is no question that Knicks and 30 mils expiring contract can bring some quality players, if used wisely. After all, we received B. Davis for D. Davis and Speedy's expiring contract while not losing a single pick. But, it would be quite hard to use those expiring contracts for sign and trading situation, because the main reason for those expiring contracts are for dumping salary, and in sign and trading situation, best way to dump the salary is to just let players go without signing.

Those expiring contracts are great chips for getting pick. Heck, many Warriors fans would love to dump Foyle and Fisher's contracts for one of expiring contract, even if it would cost this year's first rounder. Interested?

Heh, you sound bitter for Marbury trade. Because, for Knicks stand, what you sent was practically nothing. Expiring contracts mean nothing to Knicks, and who knows those two prospects would actually make an impact in NY? As long as you didn't give up picks, I don't think Knicks gave up a lot. Of course, for Suns, it's totally different story.

Indeed next year will be a make or break year for Knicks. And, hope that some superstars are not happy with their current teams

 

[REREM]

Penny and Thomas=$30 million. Pure insanity.

 

[Umer remU]

im from chicago and we have frank williams and im wondering cuz i dont see him play much at all, excpet when he played back for the illini, but how good was he when he playd pro for the knicks? im just wondering

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Umer remU:</div><div class="quote_post">im from chicago and we have frank williams and im wondering cuz i dont see him play much at all, excpet when he played back for the illini, but how good was he when he playd pro for the knicks? im just wondering</div>
Well in his first year, just like most rookies due to the horrible GM'ing and coaching of Layden and Chaney he got little burn no matter how effective he was or any rookie. When Eisley's production started decreasing, Williams logged some minutes and when he did, he was very effective. I remember it was somewhat of a break out season for him.

He was playing great basketball and him becoming an all-star in the near future was definitely not out of the question. He could pass well, actually broke down the defense (something Knick fans have not experienced in years.) He was a good defender, he was tough (ask Jason Kidd) he also stepped up in the clutch. I remember him having some big games and one against Memphis. Although Van Horn was the leading scorer, Williams stepped up big with 14 points and scored the game wining bucket to ice the game. He also had 17 points in helping beat the Timberwolves and when the Knicks were playing the Lakers at MSG, he scored 11 points in the 2nd quarter and Kobe Bryant asked ?Who is that guy?? After someone gave him the answer he said ?He?s good!?

Once everyone in the Knick organization actually opened their eyes, and saw this guy was developing well they started him and he continued playing well. With him at the point, I remember the Knicks went on this 4 game wire to wire streak including 3 blow outs. Isiah Thomas sacrificed his development and threw him on the Chicago Bulls bench. This makes us very unhappy and to tell you the truth, I?d much rather have Frank Williams here and continue watching him develop than see Marbury. What a waste of talent along with Lampe.

 

[Tribute to H2O]

Yup. Frank Williams was a stand up guy. He almost got into a fight with Richard Jefferson. I miss that toughness the Knicks used to have. Frank Williams is a free agent when this season is over I think. We should resign him and Andre Barett has been waived we can pick him up if noone has already. Then get Marbury out of New York for a lottery pick and draft Martynas or Petro. That way we have two great young point guards with potential and a big man to go along with Splitter. Man I'm a genius!