Lakers got Davis.

[Sarni]

By my statement you can see that’s what I think happened. They got a bunch of mediocre players. If the goal is to be good they’ll probably succeed. Something like the Pelicans with Anthony Davis have been.

I think once people start looking past Lakers hate they will realize Lonzo and Ingram aren’t mediocre.

 

[Sarni]

Seems impossible to know if Tatum was the only other player they could have got...
I've said as much that AD's agent did a good job of chasing off other teams by telling them he was going to leave next year, which is part of why I think this deal looks so bad. I think they could've gotten much more for AD if his agent hadn't chased everyone off. Like I said, probably was the best deal available, but that doesn't mean it was a good deal.

I keep wondering why NO wanted to do it now, why not wait until mid-July find a desperate team that struck out in FA and do it then?

Doesn’t matter. Deals wouldn’t get better. Teams who would likely be after him are not the ones that would have the assets to outbid this. Knicks couldn’t possibly put together a better package, neither could Clippers or Nets.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

I think once people start looking past Lakers hate they will realize Lonzo and Ingram aren’t mediocre.

I saw a ton of Lonzo in college and thought he was really over hyped then, I think he's been over hyped because of him being in LA. I don't think Ingram is a bad player, but I see his potential as maybe a good starter type.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Doesn’t matter. Deals wouldn’t get better. Teams who would likely be after him are not the ones that would have the assets to outbid this. Knicks couldn’t possibly put together a better package, neither could Clippers or Nets.

Couldn't out bid this? What was the bid throw in a bunch of draft picks? Literally every team could do that... The rest of it Josh Hart, Lonzo, Ingram a lot of teams had young guys who have been hurt a lot or have some potential. I think a desperate team next month could find a way to put at the least the same type of package that NO got.

 

[Sarni]

Ingram sucks. He's a bad shooter both from 3 and the FT line. His defense is average at best. Passing is okay but not anything to elevate his status. Sure he scored 18 ppg this year but he's an inefficient scorer. More promise than Tatum? I wish you were the Celtics GM then.

Lonzo might be a tad underrated but I can't stand guards that can't shoot from 3 or the FT line. He hasn't been durable at all so far either.

I do like Hart's game but he'd be better as a bench player on a good team instead of a rebuilding one, in my opinion.

How could NO do this trade without the other team taking Solomon Hill? The sneaky part about not taking Hill means that the Lakers could sign a really good player this summer that they wouldn't have otherwise. If that player signs a 4-year deal and they re-sign AD then those picks could have really low value. The pick swaps won't matter if the Pelicans are worse than the Lakers.

He shot 39% from three the season before. His technique is fine, and he’s just 21 with plenty of room to improve. I like him a lot as a prospect.

 

[Sarni]

Couldn't out bid this? What was the bid throw in a bunch of draft picks? Literally every team could do that... The rest of it Josh Hart, Lonzo, Ingram a lot of teams had young guys who have been hurt a lot or have some potential. I think a desperate team next month could find a way to put at the least the same type of package that NO got.

The no. 4 pick in this draft also gets conveniently disregarded here for some reason. That is a good asset as well.

I guess I will not agree with many here on Ingram and Lonzo because people can’t look past Lakers hate. I expect at least one of them to develop into a top 5 player in the league in their position at some point of their career.

I’ve seen people say CJ and Collins would have been a better deal which is an absolutely ridiculous nonsense.

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

Sometimes the cap space is more valuable than the draft picks and roster filler.

Sometimes, yes. But it certainly wasn't for Blazers.

 

[Sarni]

Tatum, Brown, Smart all Celtics picks this year plus Grizzlies pick would have been a better deal.

And it would have never been on the table because Ainge isn’t dumb. Griffin has probably spoken with them and knew the deal they would willing to offer wouldn’t be close.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

The no. 4 pick in this draft also gets conveniently disregarded here for some reason. That is a good asset as well.

I guess I will not agree with many here on Ingram and Lonzo because people can’t look past Lakers hate. I expect at least one of them to develop into a top 5 player in the league in their position at some point of their career.

I’ve seen people say CJ and Collins would have been a better deal which is an absolutely ridiculous nonsense.

Well, my only point on the #4 this year is this draft is incredibly top heavy, after Morant, I'm not sure there's any one in this draft that jumps out as top end prospect, that doesn't mean guys can't pop, there are always surprises, but this is a weird draft in my opinion, I think the #4 in other years is probably more valuable then this year, to be fair NO doesn't have a time machine to go back and make this the 2003 draft class or whatever.

Time will tell on Lonzo and Ingram, I don't see either of them as growing into that type of player, but we'll see. I think Ingram has a higher upside than Ball.

I think CJ and Zach are a worse deal all by themselves, but if they added all those picks it would be a much better deal. However, Portland wouldn't of given them all those picks and swaps.

I guess time will tell on how all those future picks play out.

 

[Sarni]

Also Pelicans wanted to make it now to have control over that pick. This also makes sense. They can choose their own player, they can flip it for 2+ picks or other assets. It’s completely understandable that they wouldn’t wait.

 

[Sarni]

Well, my only point on the #4 this year is this draft is incredibly top heavy, after Morant, I'm not sure there's any one in this draft that jumps out as top end prospect, that doesn't mean guys can't pop, there are always surprises, but this is a weird draft in my opinion, I think the #4 in other years is probably more valuable then this year, to be fair NO doesn't have a time machine to go back and make this the 2003 draft class or whatever.

Time will tell on Lonzo and Ingram, I don't see either of them as growing into that type of player, but we'll see. I think Ingram has a higher upside than Ball.

I think CJ and Zach are a worse deal all by themselves, but if they added all those picks it would be a much better deal. However, Portland wouldn't of given them all those picks and swaps.

I guess time will tell on how all those future picks play out.

We couldn’t give them an equally good pick this year. You reckon CJ and Collins is better than Ingram, Ball, Hart and Garland/Hunter/Culver for a rebuilding team? Not for me. And as you say, Portland would have never given them all those picks anyway.

 

[blazerfan11]

The 2021 pick is protected the other way around too. Pelicans get it if it’s top 8. If it’s not it moves to 2022 unprotected. Then they basically won everything Lakers get.

Are you sure about that?

 

[Sarni]

It’s also a very bad deal from Lakers perspective as it gives them zero flexibility, basically for the next 4 years. Either they succeed with James and Davis, or they don’t. No way out of this.

 

[Sarni]

Are you sure about that?

That’s what I’ve heard.

 

[PCmor7]

I mean this trade is probably better than letting him walk for nothing next summer, though my immediate reaction to the trade was a long the lines of, "why not just let him walk lol", but ok it's not that bad. I just think it's a trade that could easily end up being really, really bad for NO, their banking on what AD in his prime not being able to keep the Lakers afloat.

I don't think that's necessarily so. What I'm saying is if you'd got a bunch of guys who are role players or, worse, on a team that lacks the star or stars to allow those role players to shine in a special role, and the draft picks you are getting are 25-30, you probably are filling your roster with a bunch of guys who do nothing but keep your team hanging around the periphery of the lottery. If you are treading water between 6-10 in your conference everywhere, that actually can be worse than being horrible, where you can draft a guy with star potential.

Did the Pelicans get anyone in this deal who move the needle? It remains to be seen. I wrote somewhere else that both teams could end up drafting in the teens for years. The Pelicans might have gotten just enough to be competitive but not enough to be really successful.

 

[Hobbesarable]

Well, my only point on the #4 this year is this draft is incredibly top heavy, after Morant, I'm not sure there's any one in this draft that jumps out as top end prospect, that doesn't mean guys can't pop, there are always surprises, but this is a weird draft in my opinion, I think the #4 in other years is probably more valuable then this year, to be fair NO doesn't have a time machine to go back and make this the 2003 draft class or whatever.

Time will tell on Lonzo and Ingram, I don't see either of them as growing into that type of player, but we'll see. I think Ingram has a higher upside than Ball.

I think CJ and Zach are a worse deal all by themselves, but if they added all those picks it would be a much better deal. However, Portland wouldn't of given them all those picks and swaps.

I guess time will tell on how all those future picks play out.

Both sides mention good points as to the pros and cons. I enjoy conversations like this.

Do the Pelicans have a top-notch scouting program in place? I honestly don't know much about their scouts. It'll be interesting to see what NO does going forward.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

We couldn’t give them an equally good pick this year. You reckon CJ and Collins is better than Ingram, Ball, Hart and Garland/Hunter/Culver for a rebuilding team? Not for me. And as you say, Portland would have never given them all those picks anyway.

I've been on the record multiple places that after Morant, I think the rest of the players in this draft look like at best role players and maybe a few starter level guys, I'm really not high on this draft. I mean there are definitely a few guys I like in there. I could be wrong and this ends up being the best draft ever who knows.
I am also not thinking about this from the perspective oh Portland should have gotten him, I think it was pretty apparent Portland didn't really have the type of assets that they wanted and the future assets they wanted Portland wouldn't have given up.
I just don't believe that this is an amazing haul for New Orleans, but time will tell. You may end up being right.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Both sides mention good points as to the pros and cons. I enjoy conversations like this.

Do the Pelicans have a top-notch scouting program in place? I honestly don't know much about their scouts. It'll be interesting to see what NO does going forward.

I like this place a lot when it's basketball conversations like this, I think @Sarni has made some good points. At the end of the day time will tell, maybe it ends up being just ok, maybe it ends up being great, maybe it's bad who knows.
I don't know a ton about New Orleans front office, other then the more obvious things like GM / Owner / Coach.

 

[Mediocre Man]

I think both teams did what they needed to do. As a fan base that's all you can ask for in a trade.

LA got a superstar to make a run with Lebron and whoever else signs there

NO got assets to build around Zion.

Now, both teams could screw it up, but the start worked out for both teams

 

[SharpesTriumph]

I'm very surprised New Orleans got such a great haul of picks. With the #4 and a future first the Lakers still had the best offer on the table. New Orleans got 3 potential lottery picks, even #1 overall picks, beyond that.

The Lakers current 4th and 5th best players on the roster are Moritz Wagner and Isaac Bonga. Sure they will add someone in free agency, but even then their depth will be horrible. Add in an extended injury as LeBron and AD both had last season and this team may miss the playoffs.

Does Davis resign to a lottery Lakers squad? Could be Dwight Howard 2.0

Not saying this is for certain happening... But it's all a very realistic scenario just as all the Lakers picks being in the second half of the 1st round is possible.

I'm just in shock New Orleans got such a haul for a player on an expiring contract.

 

[oldmangrouch]

Frankly, I find it laughable that Paul is claiming that AD might not stay in LA. IMHO, this is just a half-hearted attempt at spinning this as something other than a player/agent/big market team working together to screw a small market team.

 

[Pinwheel1]

I think both teams did what they needed to do. As a fan base that's all you can ask for in a trade.

LA got a superstar to make a run with Lebron and whoever else signs there

NO got assets to build around Zion.

Now, both teams could screw it up, but the start worked out for both teams

Yep New Orleans got about as much as they could have. They had a gun to their head. They were never going to get equal value. Anytime you are forced to trade a super star you might think you are getting good young players back in return but 9 times out of 10 when you look at the trade in 5 years the team who gets the all "nba player" is far and away the winner.

But again New Orleans was never going to come out the winner. and they knew that. Just like Orlando wasn't when they got Lamar Odom, Caron Butler, Brian Grant and a future first-round pick for Shaq or Philly receiving Jeff Hornacek, Tim Perry and Andrew Lang for Sir Charles. It sounds good at first, but not after a few years when the team with the super star is playing for championships and the draft picks you received for him turn out to be.....easily replaceable.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

Yep New Orleans got about as much as they could have. They had a gun to their head. They were never going to get equal value. Anytime you are forced to trade a super star you might think you are getting good young players back in return but 9 times out of 10 when you look at the trade in 5 years the team who gets the all "nba player" is far and away the winner.

But again New Orleans was never going to come out the winner. and they knew that. Just like Orlando wasn't when they got Lamar Odom, Caron Butler, Brian Grant and a future first-round pick for Shaq or Philly receiving Jeff Hornacek, Tim Perry and Andrew Lang for Sir Charles. It sounds good at first, but not after a few years when the team with the super star is playing for championships and the draft picks you received for him turn out to be.....easily replaceable.

Denver did better than the Knicks with the Melo trade.

Orlando did better than the Lakers with the Dwight Howard trade.

Anthony Davis is closer to those two than an MVP Shaq or MVP Barkley.

 

[illmatic99]

amateur hour

 

[Pinwheel1]

Denver did better than the Knicks with the Melo trade.

Orlando did better than the Lakers with the Dwight Howard trade.

Anthony Davis is closer to those two than an MVP Shaq or MVP Barkley.

You are right that the Knicks never did anything with Melo. They didn't have anything left to build around. Plus No free agents wanted to play with Melo.
Do players dislike AD and LBJ in the same way? But its not like Denver did anything with what they got in return.

Denver Nuggets traded Anthony to the Knicks along with Chauncey Billups in exchange for Wilson Chandler, Raymond Felton, Danilo Gallinari, Timofey Mozgov, a 2014 first-round pick and the swap rights in 2016. (Denver also landed Kosta Koufosin the deal from the Minnesota Timberwolves.)

 

[PCmor7]

Felton ... anyway we can divert him to LAL so we can hate the Lakers more?

 

[kjironman1]

I was wondering something along the same lines. When has LeBron played with a low-post difference-maker. Love was a good rebounder, but he plays offense like a stretch four. Bosh was a handful in the low post with Toronto who could face up from 19 feet, but he turned into a stretch four in Miami with LeBron and D-Wade.

Talent-wise, it's a trade the Lakers had to make. Getting it all to fit together might be the devil in the details. A lot's going to depend on who they sign in free agency and how the heck they fill out their rotation. Even if their two stars stay healthy.

Starting to sound like Chris Paul wants out. How does that work?

 

[kjironman1]

With the unprotected picks, the Pels are one Davis injury from true greatness.

Or if he opts to leave after one year?

 

[Hobbesarable]

Felton ... anyway we can divert him to LAL so we can hate the Lakers more?

And send the lakers a carton of cupcakes. They'll need them at his press conference. Haha

 

[BonesJones]

Or if he opts to leave after one year?

That would be beautiful