Leading Blazer Playoff scorer (1 Viewer)

[Dutchman063]

Meyers should get the supermax deal, obviously

 

[Wizard Mentor]

The larger picture is that your issue isn't really with s2 board members, it's with Stotts AND EVERY OTHER GM IN LEAGUE.

GS: Leonard's efficiency is better than Draymon, yet somehow they won't trade Draymon for Biebs.
SA: ditto with DeRozan and LMA.
Every other team: ditto with many of their players.

Biebs doesn't have trade value. Why aren't you launching a tirade against all of the "stupid" GMs out there? Doesn't he deserve
to be on a team that appreciates him more? Just imagine what stats he'd have if he was playing 35 mpg!!!

The point is the scoring efficiency, which is shown here ranked by eFG%, where Meyers has 63.1 that is well above his teammates. Meyers also led the WS/48 with 0.154, and TS% of 61.6, despite his limited number of min and number of shots.

<PRE>
Rk FG% 3P 3PA 3P% 2P 2PA 2P% eFG%
1 Meyers Leonard .523 14 33 .424 20 32 .625 .631
2 Rodney Hood .468 18 51 .353 34 60 .567 .550
3 Zach Collins .506 7 21 .333 34 60 .567 .549
4 Enes Kanter .514 1 4 .250 74 142 .521 .517
5 Maurice Harkless .477 7 28 .250 45 81 .556 .509
6 Damian Lillard .418 59 158 .373 79 172 .459 .508
7 CJ McCollum .440 46 117 .393 108 233 .464 .506
8 Seth Curry .366 21 52 .404 9 30 .300 .494
9 Al-Farouq Aminu .349 15 51 .294 23 58 .397 .417
10 Evan Turner .326 1 1 1.000 14 45 .311 .337
11 Skal Labissiere .250 0 2 .000 1 2 .500 .250
12 Jake Layman .143 0 5 .000 1 2 .500 .143
13 Anfernee Simons .000 0 2 .000 0 5 .000 .000
</PRE>
Provided by <a href="https://www.sports-reference.com/sh...irect&utm_medium=Share&utm_campaign=ShareTool">Basketball-Reference.com</a>: <a href="https://www.basketball-reference.co...=Share&utm_campaign=ShareTool#playoffs_totals">View Original Table</a><br>Generated 5/22/2019.

 

[swish3]

Wizenheimer, you are ignoring the leading role that Meyers played in WCF Game 4 first half. Meyers scores swish3s from catch and shoot plans, much like Kyle Korver and some other leading swish3 shooters do. GSW, like MEM, did play defense against Meyers to try and stop him. But if Dame and Rodney had passed to wide open Meyers on the arc, we might have won that game.

You can't just discount leading the team in shooting and ignore the offensive force that can bring 25 points per half against GSW in a Playoff game. But if you do, then you are making the major mistake that Blazer coaches made by not continuing to rely on the talented swish3 shooter with the hot hand. Can you name any other NBA player who is better than 83.3% in the Playoffs?

Your arguments show the major improvement that Meyers has made in his 6th and 7th years. He is still developing both offense and defense, as might be expected for a big man and his age. If you recognize his team leadership in communication, selflessness, hustle, and continued improvement, you must conclude that he is much better than someone who does not make major contributions to Blazer scoring and wins. If you review his Playoff games, it is not accurate to say that he did not contribute to Blazer offense and defense.

 

[swish3]

The larger picture is that your issue isn't really with s2 board members, it's with Stotts AND EVERY OTHER GM IN LEAGUE.

GS: Leonard's efficiency is better than Draymon, yet somehow they won't trade Draymon for Biebs.
SA: ditto with DeRozan and LMA.
Every other team: ditto with many of their players.

Biebs doesn't have trade value. Why aren't you launching a tirade against all of the "stupid" GMs out there? Doesn't he deserve
to be on a team that appreciates him more? Just imagine what stats he'd have if he was playing 35 mpg!!!

Meyers doesn't want to play for GS or SA or anyone else, and has consistently been a hard worker who is loyal to the Blazers, so your question is an unanswerable foil. When you see swish3 scoring that matches Steph in the Playoffs, you could be impressed. I am. Yes Meyers should be starting and playing 24+ min in my view in all of the GSW Playoff games, where he has proved to be more effective than Enes and a major scoring factor for us. Meyers efficiently scored 25 points on 83.3% shooting in the first half! At this point, Meyers deserves better from the fans than to be dismissed while we waste swish3 scoring opportunities with missed shots.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Meyers doesn't want to play for GS or SA or anyone else, and has consistently been a hard worker who is loyal to the Blazers, so your question is an unanswerable foil. When you see swish3 scoring that matches Steph in the Playoffs, you could be impressed. I am. Yes Meyers should be starting and playing 24+ min in my view in all of the GSW Playoff games, where he has proved to be more effective than Enes and a major scoring factor for us. Meyers efficiently scored 25 points on 83.3% shooting in the first half! At this point, Meyers deserves better from the fans than to be dismissed while we waste swish3 scoring opportunities with missed shots.

1) B.S.
2) What about my whole point about other GMs? Neil doesn't care about what the player's destination preferences.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Meyers doesn't want to play for GS or SA or anyone else, and has consistently been a hard worker who is loyal to the Blazers, so your question is an unanswerable foil. When you see swish3 scoring that matches Steph in the Playoffs, you could be impressed. I am. Yes Meyers should be starting and playing 24+ min in my view in all of the GSW Playoff games, where he has proved to be more effective than Enes and a major scoring factor for us. Meyers efficiently scored 25 points on 83.3% shooting in the first half! At this point, Meyers deserves better from the fans than to be dismissed while we waste swish3 scoring opportunities with missed shots.

I'll give you this, in the Denver Series when Enes and Company were really struggling vs the size and thickness of Milsap / Jokic, I definitely thought they should've tried more ML.
His one on one defense vs "big" bruiser types is good enough, and he is a big strong guy who could've frustrated Jokic.

The one thing I saw vs GS was when ML had the confidence to shoot the freaking ball his release didn't look nearly as bad, but too often he seems to be thinking rather than playing. He's always been a really good shooter but you can tell he's thinking basketball instead of playing it. Which really makes him look like he's 2-3 seconds behind the rest of the players out there. I don't know if it's the lack of minutes, us fans, or just ML but when he's second-guessing should he shoot, should he switch, should he follow his man, he just looks lost especially on defense. When he doesn't shoot wide open shots because he's thinking, he also looks pretty bad at times on offense.

I don't know about 24 minutes, but if you give me a confident, ML a guy who's just going to play basketball and not think basketball. I'd take him as a good solid role player any day. When we get the not quite sure of himself version it can get bad in a hurry. I thought last season he looked, "better" and this season he was on a similar trajectory, but to me, Nurkic is far and away from the best center on the roster and Zach / Meyers are almost polar opposites of each other.

 

[swish3]

1) B.S.
2) What about my whole point about other GMs? Neil doesn't care about what the player's destination preferences.

You seem to imply that I think of trading Meyers to another team, but I don't. And I know relatively little about GM preferences, and find many of their decisions to be confusing. Neil and we care about optimizing available talent and that is my focus.

Do you have an answer to my question: Can you name any other NBA player who is better than 83.3% in the Playoffs?

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

You seem to imply that I think of trading Meyers to another team, but I don't. And I know relatively little about GM preferences, and find many of their decisions to be confusing. Neil and we care about optimizing available talent and that is my focus.

Do you have an answer to my question: Can you name any other NBA player who is better than 83.3% in the Playoffs?

Given time they would've adjusted their defense and brought that down, say if the Blazers had of actually won a game... No doubt offensively ML had a really special couple halves of basketball though.

 

[swish3]

I'll give you this, in the Denver Series when Enes and Company were really struggling vs the size and thickness of Milsap / Jokic, I definitely thought they should've tried more ML.
His one on one defense vs "big" bruiser types is good enough, and he is a big strong guy who could've frustrated Jokic.

The one thing I saw vs GS was when ML had the confidence to shoot the freaking ball his release didn't look nearly as bad, but too often he seems to be thinking rather than playing. He's always been a really good shooter but you can tell he's thinking basketball instead of playing it. Which really makes him look like he's 2-3 seconds behind the rest of the players out there. I don't know if it's the lack of minutes, us fans, or just ML but when he's second-guessing should he shoot, should he switch, should he follow his man, he just looks lost especially on defense. When he doesn't shoot wide open shots because he's thinking, he also looks pretty bad at times on offense.

I don't know about 24 minutes, but if you give me a confident, ML a guy who's just going to play basketball and not think basketball. I'd take him as a good solid role player any day. When we get the not quite sure of himself version it can get bad in a hurry. I thought last season he looked, "better" and this season he was on a similar trajectory, but to me, Nurkic is far and away from the best center on the roster and Zach / Meyers are almost polar opposites of each other.

Yes, the confident Meyers is the one that we want to watch! And he is influenced by fans cheering him on. His swish3 shot is deliberate and he appears to be thinking carefully and choosing his shots. His defensive placement is good and constantly getting better. Meyers is benefiting from coaching and experience. And I think that Meyers and Zach are good influences on each other, have given each other open shots, and offer a strong big front that can win competitive Playoff games. I object to saying that he looks lost on defense, as this is a holdover comment based on previous seasons. He looked composed and effective in this Playoff series, and I think his performance merits dropping that often repeated phrase. Let' encourage him and look for more wins!

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Yes, the confident Meyers is the one that we want to watch! And he is influenced by fans cheering him on. His swish3 shot is deliberate and he appears to be thinking carefully and choosing his shots. His defensive placement is good and constantly getting better. Meyers is benefiting from coaching and experience. And I think that Meyers and Zach are good influences on each other, have given each other open shots, and offer a strong big front that can win competitive Playoff games. I object to saying that he looks lost on defense, as this is a holdover comment based on previous seasons. He looked composed and effective in this Playoff series, and I think his performance merits dropping that often repeated phrase. Let' encourage him and look for more wins!

Its not about discouraging him, but he gets lost in what we like to call no mans land on defense. Even this year, its still a problem for him at times. He also hasn't quite figured out how to follow a guy driving and meet them and the ball at the rim. His offense the last two games was good. Id even say in game 2 when people blamed him for the bad defense it was more the weak side help that didnt do their job then Meyers. He’s got work to do.

 

[swish3]

Its not about discouraging him, but he gets lost in what we like to call no mans land on defense. Even this year, its still a problem for him at times. He also hasn't quite figured out how to follow a guy driving and meet them and the ball at the rim. His offense the last two games was good. Id even say in game 2 when people blamed him for the bad defense it was more the weak side help that didnt do their job then Meyers. He’s got work to do.

I agree with you that he is working on placement and being a rim defender. This is where experience, coaching, and Zach can help him use his size and strength to improve. In WCF Game 4 he did a great job of taking the charge and getting a foul call. Yes he was doing his job when the forwards failed to cover the drive into the paint, so that was not his mistake. He will improve, and there are a number of indicators that he can help us win as he continues to gain Playoff game experience and achievements.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

You seem to imply that I think of trading Meyers to another team, but I don't. And I know relatively little about GM preferences, and find many of their decisions to be confusing. Neil and we care about optimizing available talent and that is my focus.

Do you have an answer to my question: Can you name any other NBA player who is better than 83.3% in the Playoffs?

It doesn't matter what you supposedly "think" about. If he's hot stuff, he should be in high demand. He isn't, period. Maybe, because everyone else is right, and you are wrong.

As for your question, it's a complete non sequitur.

 

[swish3]

It doesn't matter what you supposedly "think" about. If he's hot stuff, he should be in high demand. He isn't, period. Maybe, because everyone else is right, and you are wrong.

As for your question, it's a complete non sequitur.

The fact is that Meyers scored 5 of 6 swish3s in the 1st half, and scored 25 points with efficient 83.3% shooting of 3s and 2s. Steph Curry, at times called the greatest swish3 shooter, scored only 5 of 7 of his swish3s and needed 5 FT to reach his 25 point first half. In the swish3 game, Meyers outperformed Steph, and he scored as many points as the GSW leader. That is un-excelled hot shooting! You can't find an answer to my question.

 

[SportsAndWhine]

I have an odd take on ML. I appreciate that he's never been a bad locker room guy. I think he's a "nice" guy.
I think he's one of the worst team defenders I've ever seen. I think he's a great shooter, and when he's confident to just shoot the ball he's a valuable role player. It was nice that the fans gave him some love, I think he's worked hard.

I think you can tell he's worked to be better. His contract, well if NO is willing to give you a contract then sign it and who cares if people don't like it...

He’s basically this team’s Travis Outlaw.

 

[DaLong]

I get it. This is Leonard's agent. Clear as fucking day.

 

[swish3]

I get it. This is Leonard's agent. Clear as fucking day.

No, you don't! When you refuse to recognize the facts and attack a Blazer fan, you are de facto a Blazer anti-fan. To be a Blazer fan, cheer the hot hand shooting and look for ways to win!

Can you find an NBA player who scored swish3s more efficiently than 83.3% in the Playoffs?

 

[borim69]

When we took ML over Steve Adams I was unhappy ( I think I remember that correctly)but I figured the front office knew better then me. Which is why I work on airplanes and am not a Basketball talent scout or GM. I rooted for Meyers for 3 years and he sucked for 3 years Hardens defense was better than his then his contract year came up and he started to show improvement and he got injured and sucked ever since. Until this year. His last 2 games are the product of GSW letting him do what he wanted and he made them pay for that. As far as I am concerned he has earned the right to play out his contract and battle for the starting spot until Nurk gets back. I think it will put your theory to the test and unfortunately I think your posts will be fewer far between as he himself will prove you wrong. But like I said earlier I work on airplanes and I am not a coach, a talent scout, nor did I sleep in a Holiday Inn if he becomes a 7 ft. clone of Steph Currey I will be the first to rip off all my clothes and go screaming into the night that you were right and I was all wrong and buy a Meyers Jersey.

 

[swish3]

Thanks Borim69, I appreciate your open mind and willingness to recognize that Meyers in fact was one better than Steph with swish3s in WCF Game 4 first half. I imagine that Meyers will continue to bring energy, poise, and teamwork facilitation that makes us better next season. I am a pilot, and do appreciate aircraft mechanics, checklists, and always working to improve as a mindset.

Meyers is continuing to improve on defense, rebouinding, boxing out, screening, and getting open shots for teammates. Let's look for him to continue improving next year and the Championship!

 

[tlongII]

Thanks Borim69, I appreciate your open mind and willingness to recognize that Meyers in fact was one better than Steph with swish3s in WCF Game 4 first half. I imagine that Meyers will continue to bring energy, poise, and teamwork facilitation that makes us better next season. I am a pilot, and do appreciate aircraft mechanics, checklists, and always working to improve as a mindset.

Meyers is continuing to improve on defense, rebouinding, boxing out, screening, and getting open shots for teammates. Let's look for him to continue improving next year and the Championship!

The things is @swish3 you labeled this thread "Leading Blazer Playoff scorer". That is factually incorrect. If you labeled the thread "Leading Blazer Playoff 3 pt percentage" I wouldn't have a problem with it. But you didn't.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

When we took ML over Steve Adams I was unhappy ( I think I remember that correctly)but I figured the front office knew better then me. Which is why I work on airplanes and am not a Basketball talent scout or GM. I rooted for Meyers for 3 years and he sucked for 3 years Hardens defense was better than his then his contract year came up and he started to show improvement and he got injured and sucked ever since. Until this year. His last 2 games are the product of GSW letting him do what he wanted and he made them pay for that. As far as I am concerned he has earned the right to play out his contract and battle for the starting spot until Nurk gets back. I think it will put your theory to the test and unfortunately I think your posts will be fewer far between as he himself will prove you wrong. But like I said earlier I work on airplanes and I am not a coach, a talent scout, nor did I sleep in a Holiday Inn if he becomes a 7 ft. clone of Steph Currey I will be the first to rip off all my clothes and go screaming into the night that you were right and I was all wrong and buy a Meyers Jersey.

Leonard was drafted a year before Adams. We took CJ over Adams (and Giannis, and Gobert...)

 

[Labinot41]

@wizenheimer can you give me a compare between Lillard and CJ Playoff stats please?

 

[wizenheimer]

@wizenheimer can you give me a compare between Lillard and CJ Playoff stats please?

PER: CJ 17.9....Dame 20.7
TS%: CJ .527....Dame .566
points/shot: CJ 1.13....Dame 1.30
FT Rate: CJ .160....Dame .345
assist rate: CJ 16.8%....Dame 28.9%
turnover rate: CJ 7.4%....Dame 13.6%
winshare/48: CJ .079....Dame 1.20
box plus/minus: CJ 1.2....Dame 4.8
value over replacement: CJ 0.5....Dame 1.1

offensive rating: CJ 108....Dame 111
defensive rating: CJ 115....Dame 113

GameScore by series (Points + 0.4FGM – 0.7FGA – 0.4(FTA – FTM) + 0.7OREB + 0.3DREB + STL + 0.7AST + 0.7BLK – 0.4PF – TO - rather like PER):

OKC: CJ 16.2....Dame 23.8
Denver: CJ 17.3....Dame 17.3
Golden State: CJ 12.6....Dame 15.2

 

[Strenuus]

No, you don't! When you refuse to recognize the facts and attack a Blazer fan, you are de facto a Blazer anti-fan. To be a Blazer fan, cheer the hot hand shooting and look for ways to win!

Can you find an NBA player who scored swish3s more efficiently than 83.3% in the Playoffs?

Its one game. The dude couldnt find the court for 3/4th of the playoffs.

Let it go. Hes not good enough. One game that was meaningless. Thats it.

He sucks. Deal with it.

 

[swish3]

The things is @swish3 you labeled this thread "Leading Blazer Playoff scorer". That is factually incorrect. If you labeled the thread "Leading Blazer Playoff 3 pt percentage" I wouldn't have a problem with it. But you didn't.

Actually, Meyers scored 30 points which was the leading scorer, in addition to the exceptional 5 of 6 swish3 scoring. Both are Championship quality accomplishments!

 

[tlongII]

Actually, Meyers scored 30 points which was the leading scorer, in addition to the exceptional 5 of 6 swish3 scoring. Both are Championship quality accomplishments!

He was the leading scorer for the Blazers in game 4. That is not what the thread title says.

 

[swish3]

Strenuus, you are consistently negative and unreasonably incorrect. Meyers has had several outstanding games in which he scored more than 75% swish3s, including in tough highly contested Playoff games. While you maintain your bias against Meyers on this forum, you are failing to recognize important contributions and steadily improving performance. If Dame, CJ, Rodney, and Seth had passed to an open Meyers in the 4th Q of Game 4, we might have won it. Looking for the catch and shoot game plan for Meyers on the arc should be how we beat GSW next season when Nurk is back and the 2 Centers can together score 30+ points per game and set up open shots for Dame, CJ, Rodney, and others.

 

[swish3]

He was the leading scorer for the Blazers in game 4. That is not what the thread title says.

OK. You are correct. I am focused on the remarkable performance in Game 4.

Edit: Please see my original post which shows that in 3 important statistics, Meyers did in fact lead all Blazers for the composite of Playoff games. While his Game 4 was outstanding, the fact stands undiminished that he led shooting efficiency in these intense Playoff games.

 

[Labinot41]

PER: CJ 17.9....Dame 20.7
TS%: CJ .527....Dame .566
points/shot: CJ 1.13....Dame 1.30
FT Rate: CJ .160....Dame .345
assist rate: CJ 16.8%....Dame 28.9%
turnover rate: CJ 7.4%....Dame 13.6%
winshare/48: CJ .079....Dame 1.20
box plus/minus: CJ 1.2....Dame 4.8
value over replacement: CJ 0.5....Dame 1.1

offensive rating: CJ 108....Dame 111
defensive rating: CJ 115....Dame 113

GameScore by series (Points + 0.4FGM – 0.7FGA – 0.4(FTA – FTM) + 0.7OREB + 0.3DREB + STL + 0.7AST + 0.7BLK – 0.4PF – TO - rather like PER):

OKC: CJ 16.2....Dame 23.8
Denver: CJ 17.3....Dame 17.3
Golden State: CJ 12.6....Dame 15.2

Thank you very much, i had a conversation with a friend (okc fan) who hates Lillard and said CJ was the best Blazer in the Playoffs, haha i will kill him with these stats

 

[Minstrel]

OK. You are correct. I am focused on the remarkable performance in Game 4.

It's nice that he had a good game. He should be very proud.

 

[swish3]

Now that the Raptors are the 2019 Champions and all statistics are final, the extraordinary Meyers accomplishments of leading six categories for the composite Playoffs, scoring 25 points in 16 min on GSW's court, and leading Blazer scoring with 30 points in that Game 4 emerge as beyond what any NBA player achieved in the 2019 Playoffs!

The list of leading statistics for Meyers in the 2019 Playoffs includes the following, which add on to his NBA swish3 Playoff 10 or more (10 of 13, which is 76.9%) record from 2014-2015.
14 of 33 (42.4%) swish3s
34 of 65 (52.3%) FG
eFG% of 63.1%
WS/48 of 0.154
TS% of 61.6
These are impressive numbers not achieved by other Blazers, and the limited sample outplaying of GSW in WCF Game 4 shows the plan for winning the NBA Championship next year. Not even Kawhi or Kyle or any of the Raptors in winning the NBA Championship achieved the 5 of 6 swish3 scoring produced in those 16 min by Meyers!

The 2019 Playoffs have shown the path to the Championship that is available to the Blazers for the next season, as we have the elements identified that can beat GSW and TOR. The solution depends on optimizing Blazer talent, gameplans that keep high intensity play constant throughout the game (with sufficient substitutions), moving the ball, motion off-ball, and increasing the number of passes that provide catch and shoot and cuts to the basket.

Starting Meyers at Center (as in WCF Game 4) until Nurk returns, and alternating Nurk and Meyers using gameplans that feature running parts of the offense through the high post with Dame-Meyers or Dame-Nurk PNRs will produce scoring a reliable 36+ points from the Center position. Enes should be used as backup to Meyers who should be relied on for high efficiency scoring, excellent screening and passing, further developed court vision assists, spacing, rebounds, and team cohesion. Zach and one or more enhanced Forwards will add advanced passing options to counter the double teams of the Guards, and the continuing progression to the Championship will continue! The past year was a major step forward that continues the steady march to being 2020 NBA Champions!