Lillard makes for an intriguing trade asset--discuss

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jlprk said:
Someone named her dog "Lillard" ??

I hadn't heard. Wow. "Here, Lillard. Here, Lillard."
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I got a dog for christmas when I was 4yrs old, I named the dog Christmas.
 
Mediocre Man said:
The assist argument is comical.

Who makes their team better, the one who starts the offense and gets everyone involved leading to the defense being off balanced, or the guy who dominates the ball and passes to guys at the end of the clock?

The last guy would have more assists
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Nice try. Getting the ball at the end of the clock is the worst shot in basketball.
 
Mediocre Man said:
Cause he is a nice offensive player that doesn't really make anyone around him better, and he's a defensive liability

His words, but he's right.
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Lillard can't MAKE Aminu hit 3s. Turner isn't a player than anyone can MAKE better. Lillard couldn't MAKE Plumlee finish at the rim like a real big man. Lillard can't MAKE Meyers hit 3s or okay strong in the paint. Lillard has MADE Harkless better (which is why he plays better with starters).

When you have a 1-on-1, elite level scorer next to you (CJ), you're gonna get less assists. When you only have 1 player other than that he can shoot decently, you're gonna have less assists. When you have big men that play soft and don't finish in the paint, you're gonna get less assists.

Canzano (and anyone who agrees with him, for that matter) is an absolute idiot.
 
This team has 2 players of starting star-quality value and needs 4 more to be competitive.

Trading either Lillard or CJ would only make the team weaker and less valuable.

N.O. needs to be replaced, and we need to trade all of our summer pickups for players more suited to playing with Lillard and CJ.
 
Nobody wanted to trade a young Greg Oden when rumors were swirling that even Tim Duncan was on the table. Nobody wanted to trade Aldridge. Roy was untouchable. Look at what Boogie Cousins could have netted two years ago. Think the Thunder wished they'd traded Durant when they could have?

The problem with franchise talent is that it's only after they leave or have dumped all value that fans look around and desperately cast about for rebuilds. Nobody stops at this point in a Lillard or CJ career path and says, "This isn't going to work. Not now, not two years from now. It only ends badly. If we rip off the band aid now, it's going to suck, but it won't be nearly as terrible as it will in a couple of seasons. He's going to get us a lot of shiny nice things that can get us through it. It's better than seeing all that value evaporate."

Portland just doesn't have the talent to be relevant, and with Dame/CJ we'll never be terrible enough to get top picks, at least in time to maximize Dame/CJ's window. Quality free agents never come. We're wasting precious years here of their careers.

All teams acquire talent in three ways:
1. Draft
2. Free agency
3. Trade

Number three is our only hope, and Damian is probably the better trade asset if we are looking to do a full reboot. He's older, he's marketable, and he's probably less excited about a full rebuild. I'm not eager to trade him, but they have to look at it.
 
I don't think many teams are calling though. When you look through the entire NBA there are several teams with a point guard better than him or at least equal: Cavs, Warriors, Wizards, Hornets, Celtics, Clippers, Raptors, Thunder and Grizzlies have playmakers who are comfortably around the level of Dame or better and thus have no need for him. Lakers would probably rather develop Russell who they consider a huge talent than give up much value for Lillard. Teams who clearly do not have a good playmakers and would want one:

- Philadelphia - they may as well wait until the draft and choose between Fultz, Ball, Smith and Fox, whoever is available by the time they pick, whose peak will come at the same time as Embiid's, Simmons' and Noel's

- Chicago - would have to give up Butler to get Lillard, not sure they want it

- Indiana - would have to give up Paul George

- Timberwolves - would probably need to give us Towns or Wiggins and a pick, they can also choose a new point guard in the draft plus they have young Kris Dunn who is still yet to develop

- Nuggets - no assets to trade for someone like Lillard either unless they move Jokic, which they won't for obvious reasons

- Knicks - Porzingis would be the only asset that could maybe get them Lillard and they love him there

- New Orleans - yeah, what could they trade? Zilch.

- San Antonio - their picks are worthless because they are always amazing and all their players except the one they absolutely wouldn't trade under any circumstances are 45 years old

Then there's literally no one I can think of. With the abundance of talent at point guard and the upcoming draft being all about playmakers I would honestly not expect to even get 80 cents on a dollar if we were to trade Dame now. He's a good player, a great one in fact but there are 10 playmakers in the NBA that are the same level he is and there are additional 6 or 7 coming through who look like they could get to that level at a time that will be convenient for their team anyway because they don't plan to win now. Even a team like Indiana or Chicago trading for him makes no sense as they'd have to drop the quality elsewhere to trade for him and Dame is not capable of winning you titles on his own.

I don't think we will get any serious offers for him, really. Maybe some teams trying to get him for peanuts but we are not Sacramento, we won't trade him for Emmanuel Mudiay and a #22 pick.
 
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e_blazer said:
Melo, by a nit on a gnat's nut.

32 years old vs 26 years old as a franchise cornerstone? Honest question.
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Oh, I think Melo is awful. Just speaking about defense.

I think Dame is amazing, but I also think there is a lot of truth in Canzano's article. It seems some people have a hard time understanding you can love a player, think he is an elite player, but still understand that player has flaws....MAJOR flaws.
 
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Mediocre Man said:
Oh, I think Melo is awful. Just speaking about defense.

I think Dame is amazing, but I also think there is a lot of truth in Canzano's article. It seems some people have a hard time understanding you can love a player, think he is an elite player, but still understand that player has flaws....MAJOR flaws.
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Canzano's basic schtick is that he typically builds a strawman argument against which he can push whatever idea has popped into his head and that the Blazers are being dumb or somehow nefarious in not doing what he suggests. In this column he implies that the Blazers aren't considering trading Lillard, but for various reasons really should be. That serves Canzano's repeated take that Blazers management is dumb while he alone is blessed with the ability to see things clearly. The reality is that Olshey undoubtedly knows that his job and his reputation around the league are in a precarious situation after last summer's spending spree has resulted in a horribly disappointing season. Do you really think that he wouldn't trade Lillard if he saw a chance to improve the team and salvage his reputation? Of course he would, but it's dependent upon getting the right package back and that doesn't often happen in the NBA. I'm absolutely certain that Olshey knows full well that his offensively gifted, but defensively challenged, backcourt is unlikely to pan out as the basis for a contending team. Given the right offer, he'd move either Dame or CJ. But it takes two or more teams to have a meeting of the minds and he can't manufacture the deal on his own. So, are the Blazers willing to talk about trading Dame? I'd be stunned if they weren't. Are they willing to take chopped liver for him ala Vlade and the Boogie deal? No flipping way.
 
Holy shit you guys, I can't believe a misleading tweet, that even the tweeter acknowledged was not accurate, is generating so much buzz. Local media "Trade rumors swirling around Lillard" no they aren't... even other NBA writers have come out and said there's no way Portland I entertaining offers at this point.
 
Schilly said:
Holy shit you guys, I can't believe a misleading tweet, that even the tweeter acknowledged was not accurate, is generating so much buzz. Local media "Trade rumors swirling around Lillard" no they aren't... even other NBA writers have come out and said there's no way Portland I entertaining offers at this point.
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Does it surprise you? People are bored of hearing about politics. They're latching on to anything else they can find.
 
e_blazer said:
Canzano's basic schtick is that he typically builds a strawman argument against which he can push whatever idea has popped into his head and that the Blazers are being dumb or somehow nefarious in not doing what he suggests. In this column he implies that the Blazers aren't considering trading Lillard, but for various reasons really should be. That serves Canzano's repeated take that Blazers management is dumb while he alone is blessed with the ability to see things clearly. The reality is that Olshey undoubtedly knows that his job and his reputation around the league are in a precarious situation after last summer's spending spree has resulted in a horribly disappointing season. Do you really think that he wouldn't trade Lillard if he saw a chance to improve the team and salvage his reputation? Of course he would, but it's dependent upon getting the right package back and that doesn't often happen in the NBA. I'm absolutely certain that Olshey knows full well that his offensively gifted, but defensively challenged, backcourt is unlikely to pan out as the basis for a contending team. Given the right offer, he'd move either Dame or CJ. But it takes two or more teams to have a meeting of the minds and he can't manufacture the deal on his own. So, are the Blazers willing to talk about trading Dame? I'd be stunned if they weren't. Are they willing to take chopped liver for him ala Vlade and the Boogie deal? No flipping way.
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Schilly said:
Holy shit you guys, I can't believe a misleading tweet, that even the tweeter acknowledged was not accurate, is generating so much buzz. Local media "Trade rumors swirling around Lillard" no they aren't... even other NBA writers have come out and said there's no way Portland I entertaining offers at this point.
Click to expand...

:cheers:
 
SlyPokerDog said:
I believe everything posted on the internet.
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DOGS AREN'T THAT SMART, SLY!

the_best_dog_gifs_on_the_internet_15.gif


I AM NOT FOOLED!
 
Sarni said:
I don't think many teams are calling though. When you look through the entire NBA there are several teams with a point guard better than him or at least equal: Cavs, Warriors, Wizards, Hornets, Celtics, Clippers, Raptors, Thunder and Grizzlies have playmakers who are comfortably around the level of Dame or better and thus have no need for him. Lakers would probably rather develop Russell who they consider a huge talent than give up much value for Lillard. Teams who clearly do not have a good playmakers and would want one:

- Philadelphia - they may as well wait until the draft and choose between Fultz, Ball, Smith and Fox, whoever is available by the time they pick, whose peak will come at the same time as Embiid's, Simmons' and Noel's

- Chicago - would have to give up Butler to get Lillard, not sure they want it

- Indiana - would have to give up Paul George

- Timberwolves - would probably need to give us Towns or Wiggins and a pick, they can also choose a new point guard in the draft plus they have young Kris Dunn who is still yet to develop

- Nuggets - no assets to trade for someone like Lillard either unless they move Jokic, which they won't for obvious reasons

- Knicks - Porzingis would be the only asset that could maybe get them Lillard and they love him there

- New Orleans - yeah, what could they trade? Zilch.

- San Antonio - their picks are worthless because they are always amazing and all their players except the one they absolutely wouldn't trade under any circumstances are 45 years old

Then there's literally no one I can think of. With the abundance of talent at point guard and the upcoming draft being all about playmakers I would honestly not expect to even get 80 cents on a dollar if we were to trade Dame now. He's a good player, a great one in fact but there are 10 playmakers in the NBA that are the same level he is and there are additional 6 or 7 coming through who look like they could get to that level at a time that will be convenient for their team anyway because they don't plan to win now. Even a team like Indiana or Chicago trading for him makes no sense as they'd have to drop the quality elsewhere to trade for him and Dame is not capable of winning you titles on his own.

I don't think we will get any serious offers for him, really. Maybe some teams trying to get him for peanuts but we are not Sacramento, we won't trade him for Emmanuel Mudiay and a #22 pick.
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Pretty good post. It may be that the sweet spot to trade one of them was a year ago. We shouldn't be desperate to find a deal, and I won't be disappointed at all to see them remain through the season.
 
Good points made on the ringer NBA show today when talking about trading stars in their primes.

UTA hasn't made the playoffs since trading Deron.
MIN hasn't made the playoffs since trading KG.
ORL hasn't made the playoffs since trading Dwight.
 
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