Lillard's invisible performance

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yuyuza1 said:
Exactly.

His release is quick. He can handle shooting with a contest. But the chucks from top of the key early in the shot clock, and the curls when he throws it up when he tries to draw fouls? Those need to go. Getting rid of even 2 or 3 of those attempts per game would make him so much more efficient.

And every bad miss last night was doubly painful because they led directly to Clipper fast breaks.
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Yet without him don't win the game.
 
Strenuus said:
Did he, or did he not, help us win in the 4th quarter, when it counted?

I can wait.

Has he, or has he not, hit key shots for us all year?

Has he, or has he not, willed this team to the playoffs?

I can wait.
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You're arguing against strawmen. Nobody is claiming that we're better without him.

Pull off your blinders and actually address what's being discussed.
 
Strenuus said:
Yep. People want him to fight through the double team, then get pissed when he does try it and he turns it over.

It's baffling people actually think like that.
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You're putting words in people's mouths. Show me one post where anyone said they wanted him to fight through the double team.

He needs to make the pass out of the double team and curl off the ball to get open later.
 
Strenuus said:
Yep. People want him to fight through the double team, then get pissed when he does try it and he turns it over.

It's baffling people actually think like that.
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Who besides @Binx actually wants him to fight through the double-team?
 
Strenuus said:
Good. End of discussion then.
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smh.

1. You did not truly argue even a single post against your claims.
2. You threw up strawman arguments that no one mentioned.
3. Your one liners show how blinded you apparently are, and when someone calls your posts out, you run away and end the discussion.
 
yuyuza1 said:
smh.

1. You did not truly argue even a single post against your claims.
2. You threw up strawman arguments that no one mentioned.
3. Your one liners show how blinded you apparently are, and when someone calls your posts out, you run away and end the discussion.
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Because it is ended. I know.

I'm sorry you don't see it that way.
 
The videos from last night's game aren't uploaded to NBA.com yet, but I just went through Dame's threes from earlier in the series.
  • Game 1 (3-8 from 3): 6 shots off the dribble (2-6), 2 off the pass (1-2)
  • Game 2 (0-6 from 3): 4 shots off the dribble, 1 off a pass where he had to double-clutch because he was challenged, and 1 clean 3 off the pass.
  • Game 3 (3-8 from 3): 5 shots off the dribble (2-5), 1 off the pass (0-1), and 2 that the video didn't show.
  • Game 4 (2-8 from 3): 4 shots off the dribble (0-4), 3 off the pass (2-3), and 1 that the video didn't show.
So, 4-19 off the dribble, 3-8 off the pass, and 1-3 unknown. Almost without exception, when he shoots on balance off a good feed, it drops. Almost without exception, if he's moving sideways at all, either 1-on-1 or around a screen, his 3's off the dribble were off. The ones he made off the bounce were mostly uncontested and after a step toward the hoop.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
The videos from last night's game aren't uploaded to NBA.com yet, but I just went through Dame's threes from earlier in the series.
  • Game 1 (3-8 from 3): 6 shots off the dribble (2-6), 2 off the pass (1-2)
  • Game 2 (0-6 from 3): 4 shots off the dribble, 1 off a pass where he had to double-clutch because he was challenged, and 1 clean 3 off the pass.
  • Game 3 (3-8 from 3): 5 shots off the dribble (2-5), 1 off the pass (0-1), and 2 that the video didn't show.
  • Game 4 (2-8 from 3): 4 shots off the dribble (0-4), 3 off the pass (2-3), and 1 that the video didn't show.
So, 4-19 off the dribble, 3-8 off the pass, and 1-3 unknown. Almost without exception, when he shoots on balance off a good feed, it drops. Almost without exception, if he's moving sideways at all, either 1-on-1 or around a screen, his 3's off the dribble were off. The ones he made off the bounce were mostly uncontested and after a step toward the hoop.
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Thanks for going back and looking. Matches the eye test.
 
Stren's point is there is no point left because the horse has been kicked for a while now...
Round and round we go... Where we stop, only I know....

The discussion has faded because its the same complaint from the same people after every missed shot from Dame. As if they expect him to go 100% every time or something, or ONLY shoot in a stable, non moving, non off the dribble game.

You guys keep wanting to corral someone who CLEARLY cant be corralled. You start trying to limit shot selection and he no longer feels the freedom to knock down the ones he does.

Does he take more bad shots than good shots? Not in my opinion.... so
Take the bad with the good people. Its they only way you are going to be completely happy.
He is helping us win playing the way he is playing and yet he gets gunned down for it.
I don't know what the definition of a Blazer fan is, but I know I don't fit the same description as some of you here who expect perfection or something.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
The videos from last night's game aren't uploaded to NBA.com yet, but I just went through Dame's threes from earlier in the series.
  • Game 1 (3-8 from 3): 6 shots off the dribble (2-6), 2 off the pass (1-2)
  • Game 2 (0-6 from 3): 4 shots off the dribble, 1 off a pass where he had to double-clutch because he was challenged, and 1 clean 3 off the pass.
  • Game 3 (3-8 from 3): 5 shots off the dribble (2-5), 1 off the pass (0-1), and 2 that the video didn't show.
  • Game 4 (2-8 from 3): 4 shots off the dribble (0-4), 3 off the pass (2-3), and 1 that the video didn't show.
So, 4-19 off the dribble, 3-8 off the pass, and 1-3 unknown. Almost without exception, when he shoots on balance off a good feed, it drops. Almost without exception, if he's moving sideways at all, either 1-on-1 or around a screen, his 3's off the dribble were off. The ones he made off the bounce were mostly uncontested and after a step toward the hoop.
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So herein lies the problem, because the Clips have taken away the drive for him, and by your count he's getting around 2.75 shots per game that are off a pass. So are we condoning him only taking shots that are off a pass? Are we saying he shouldn't shoot unless he's open? The guy would take 5 shots per game with how LAC is defending him.
 
Natebishop3 said:
So herein lies the problem, because the Clips have taken away the drive for him, and by your count he's getting around 2.75 shots per game that are off a pass. So are we condoning him only taking shots that are off a pass? Are we saying he shouldn't shoot unless he's open? The guy would take 5 shots per game with how LAC is defending him.
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@PtldPlatypus noted "threes," not total shots.

5 3pt attempts is not that low. Especially given his %'s.
 
Orion Bailey said:
Stren's point is there is no point left because the horse has been kicked for a while now...
Round and round we go... Where we stop, only I know....

The discussion has faded because its the same complaint from the same people after every missed shot from Dame. As if they expect him to go 100% every time or something, or ONLY shoot in a stable, non moving, non off the dribble game.

You guys keep wanting to corral someone who CLEARLY cant be corralled. You start trying to limit shot selection and he no longer feels the freedom to knock down the ones he does.

Does he take more bad shots than good shots? Not in my opinion.... so
Take the bad with the good people. Its they only way you are going to be completely happy.
He is helping us win playing the way he is playing and yet he gets gunned down for it.
I don't know what the definition of a Blazer fan is, but I know I don't fit the same description as some of you here who expect perfection or something.
Click to expand...

They are all Blazer fans. I don't think one is worse than the other.

But everything else, yeah.
 
Natebishop3 said:
So herein lies the problem, because the Clips have taken away the drive for him, and by your count he's getting around 2.75 shots per game that are off a pass. So are we condoning him only taking shots that are off a pass? Are we saying he shouldn't shoot unless he's open? The guy would take 5 shots per game with how LAC is defending him.
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To answer the question--if an opponents' defensive strategy is such that the majority of the shots he can take would result in a TS% of 31.5% (4-19 from 3 off the dribble), then yes, I would prefer he not take those shots, and instead work the offense for shots that the defense is permitting that will result in more points per possession. I fully believe that if Dame had not taken those 19 3's off the dribble in those first 4 games, the Blazers would have ended up with more than 12 points out of those 19 possessions. However, I also think that if he had passed out of those 19 shots, we'd still be up 3-2 right now, so it probably doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Still, the point still stands that he could be more efficient with his choices, which is all anyone really wants.
 
Natebishop3 said:
So herein lies the problem, because the Clips have taken away the drive for him, and by your count he's getting around 2.75 shots per game that are off a pass. So are we condoning him only taking shots that are off a pass? Are we saying he shouldn't shoot unless he's open? The guy would take 5 shots per game with how LAC is defending him.
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What is wrong with taking fewer shots if they are highly defended? The Clippers are face guarding him and doubling him, so why force bad shots instead of taking fewer?
 
blazerboy30 said:
Some mods are too emotional to do the job correctly.
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Heh, yeah.... because there's so much to do.

Did he edit your post? Delete anything? Ban anyone?

I think I've deleted one thread in the last six months, and I'm not even sure Stren has done much more than that. Why don't you keep it about basketball?
 
PtldPlatypus said:
To answer the question--if an opponents' defensive strategy is such that the majority of the shots he can take would result in a TS% of 31.5% (4-19 from 3 off the dribble), then yes, I would prefer he not take those shots, and instead work the offense for shots that the defense is permitting that will result in more points per possession. I fully believe that if Dame had not taken those 19 3's off the dribble in those first 4 games, the Blazers would have ended up with more than 12 points out of those 19 possessions. However, I also think that if he had passed out of those 19 shots, we'd still be up 3-2 right now, so it probably doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Still, the point still stands that he could be more efficient with his choices, which is all anyone really wants.
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Well stated.
 
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