Make of this what you will.....

[Rick2583]

GARDNER = 7-31-287 vs. 10-27-217
JETER = 2-20-273 vs. 2-30-242
ELLSBURY = 4-34-288 vs. 12-36-243
TEIXEIRA = 15-41-242 vs. 7-21-191
BELTRAN = 8-24-219 vs. 7-25-232
McCANN = 9-36-221 vs. 14-39-242

The numbers you see above if you haven't already figured it out are the totals for our 6 top players for there 1st 81 games vs the last 81 games. I'll take it a step further for these 6 players................

The 1st 81 games = a 255 batting average & a .322 OBP
The 2nd 81 games = a 227 batting average & a .289 OBP

Even the running game came to a halt.....

1st half = Gardner (15 of 18) & Ellsbury (22 of 25) = Total 37 of 43
2nd half = Gardner (6 of 8) & Ellsbury (17 of 19) = Total 23 of 27

All I can say is thank God for Prado (37 games) 7/16/316 & Headley 6/17/262 & stellar defense.

If you're curious, in the 2nd half OBP = Gardner .285, Jeter .281, Ellsbury .280, Teixeira .284, Beltran .318 & McCann .291. Damn, I can't imagine why we sucked this year.

 

[Mattingly23NY]

GARDNER = 7-31-287 vs. 10-27-217
JETER = 2-20-273 vs. 2-30-242
ELLSBURY = 4-34-288 vs. 12-36-243
TEIXEIRA = 15-41-242 vs. 7-21-191
BELTRAN = 8-24-219 vs. 7-25-232
McCANN = 9-36-221 vs. 14-39-242

The numbers you see above if you haven't already figured it out are the totals for our 6 top players for there 1st 81 games vs the last 81 games. I'll take it a step further for these 6 players................

The 1st 81 games = a 255 batting average & a .322 OBP
The 2nd 81 games = a 227 batting average & a .289 OBP

Even the running game came to a halt.....

1st half = Gardner (15 of 18) & Ellsbury (22 of 25) = Total 37 of 43
2nd half = Gardner (6 of 8) & Ellsbury (17 of 19) = Total 23 of 27

All I can say is thank God for Prado (37 games) 7/16/316 & Headley 6/17/262 & stellar defense.

If you're curious, in the 2nd half OBP = Gardner .285, Jeter .281, Ellsbury .280, Teixeira .284, Beltran .318 & McCann .291. Damn, I can't imagine why we sucked this year.

I guess one could say, "like a fine wine aged with time"....the wine did not get better, rather that 'fine wine' soured into vinegar....!

 

[Rick2583]

I guess one could say, "like a fine wine aged with time"....the wine did not get better, rather that 'fine wine' soured into vinegar....!

A .289 OBP between your best players through 81 games is just plain ridiculous.

 

[blgridesagain]

GARDNER = 7-31-287 vs. 10-27-217
JETER = 2-20-273 vs. 2-30-242
ELLSBURY = 4-34-288 vs. 12-36-243
TEIXEIRA = 15-41-242 vs. 7-21-191
BELTRAN = 8-24-219 vs. 7-25-232
McCANN = 9-36-221 vs. 14-39-242

The numbers you see above if you haven't already figured it out are the totals for our 6 top players for there 1st 81 games vs the last 81 games. I'll take it a step further for these 6 players................

The 1st 81 games = a 255 batting average & a .322 OBP
The 2nd 81 games = a 227 batting average & a .289 OBP

Even the running game came to a halt.....

1st half = Gardner (15 of 18) & Ellsbury (22 of 25) = Total 37 of 43
2nd half = Gardner (6 of 8) & Ellsbury (17 of 19) = Total 23 of 27

All I can say is thank God for Prado (37 games) 7/16/316 & Headley 6/17/262 & stellar defense.

If you're curious, in the 2nd half OBP = Gardner .285, Jeter .281, Ellsbury .280, Teixeira .284, Beltran .318 & McCann .291. Damn, I can't imagine why we sucked this year.

____________________________

Take a look at Cervelli's 2nd half stats:
114 PA, .386 .461 .847

...and some people laughed at me when I blamed Girardi for not shaking up the lineup more often, especially the 3-4-5- spots...and I DID mention Cervelli....and Headley as players he should've used in those spots..and I would've also sometimes used Ichiro......and DROPPING TEX down to 6th or 7th was a must. He became a very easy out. Very easy to pitch to.

Still chuckling when I think some had a problem with shaking up the lineup, MIXING and MATCHING (<-- I did use those words), according to the opposing starting pitcher.
For those VERY FEW, lol, who agree with me..this isn't intended for you:

And please don't tell me there were never any favorable matchups for Girardi to work with regarding the lineup.

 

[Mattingly23NY]

____________________________

DROPPING TEX down to 6th or 7th was a must. He became a very easy out. Very easy to pitch to.

They shoot broken down horses, don't they?

 

[Mattingly23NY]

____________________________
For those VERY FEW, lol, who agree with me..this isn't intended for you:

I agreed to disagree, doesn't that much count? LOL....!

 

[Hammerojustice]

I knew we weren't giving McCann enough time (at least power-wise).... New division, new league, new pitchers.... He had a lot to adjust to.... I'd still like to see the ba go up

 

[Rick2583]

I knew we weren't giving McCann enough time (at least power-wise).... New division, new league, new pitchers.... He had a lot to adjust to.... I'd still like to see the ba go up

Now lets just hope that the way he was hitting in the 2nd half can carry over into next season.

 

[yankeesince59]

____________________________

Take a look at Cervelli's 2nd half stats:
114 PA, .386 .461 .847

...and some people laughed at me when I blamed Girardi for not shaking up the lineup more often, especially the 3-4-5- spots...and I DID mention Cervelli....and Headley as players he should've used in those spots..and I would've also sometimes used Ichiro......and DROPPING TEX down to 6th or 7th was a must. He became a very easy out. Very easy to pitch to.

Still chuckling when I think some had a problem with shaking up the lineup, MIXING and MATCHING (<-- I did use those words), according to the opposing starting pitcher.
For those VERY FEW, lol, who agree with me..this isn't intended for you:

And please don't tell me there were never any favorable matchups for Girardi to work with regarding the lineup.

...lol...why don't you just stop.

...I asked you multiple times when Girardi was supposed to switch the 4-5-6 hitters with the 7-8-9 hitters?
...the only reply you offered was "on occasions"

...I then asked you specifically when the supposed "occasions" were...you wouldn't/couldn't answer.

...I also asked you which other manager had ever used your master plan...again you wouldn't/couldn't answer.

...as far as you claiming you suggested mixing and matching depending on "the opposing pitcher", yeah, you said that McCann should have been "replaced/moved when facing LHed pitching"... I laughed and pointed out that McCann actually hit LHers (.292 .324 .526 .850) better than RHers. (.209 .272 .360 .633)...again you had no answer. Remember?




...you simply still cannot grasp what myself and others have been trying to get through your thick skull on this matter, which is, moving the line up around does not matter when the whole line up is under-performing. Please explain how your plan of moving Ichiro, Headley, and Prado into the 4-5-6 spots was somehow going to help the team when as rick pointed out in his OP that the OBP of the 1-2-3 hitters was also abysmal? ("Gardner .285, Jeter .281, Ellsbury .280")

 

[blgridesagain]

...lol...why don't you just stop.

...I asked you multiple times when Girardi was supposed to switch the 4-5-6 hitters with the 7-8-9 hitters?
...the only reply you offered was "on occasions"

...I then asked you specifically when the supposed "occasions" were...you wouldn't/couldn't answer.

...I also asked you which other manager had ever used your master plan...again you wouldn't/couldn't answer.

...as far as you claiming you suggested mixing and matching depending on "the opposing pitcher", yeah, you said that McCann should have been "replaced/moved when facing LHed pitching"... I laughed and pointed out that McCann actually hit LHers (.292 .324 .526 .850) better than RHers. (.209 .272 .360 .633)...again you had no answer. Remember?




...you simply still cannot grasp what myself and others have been trying to get through your thick skull on this matter, which is, moving the line up around does not matter when the whole line up is under-performing. Please explain how your plan of moving Ichiro, Headley, and Prado into the 4-5-6 spots was somehow going to help the team when as rick pointed out in his OP that the OBP of the 1-2-3 hitters was also abysmal? ("Gardner .285, Jeter .281, Ellsbury .280")

____________________________

Are you serious? Really, ARE you serious? Is this a joke?

What the hell kind of questions are those?
"When"? How many times? "When the supposed occasions were..."
" when Girardi was supposed to switch the 4-5-6 hitters with the 7-8-9 hitters"?

Are you nuts?
When did I say the 3-4-5 hitters had to be switched with the 7-8-9 hitters?

Who said it HAD TO BE 3,4,5, with 7,8,9,?
And just what does 7,8,9 mean? What about the other 3 batters? lmao

Yeah sure, you did point out McCann hit better vs LHP than RHP. And I said THANKS..if I was Girardi I would ALSO have those numbers to work with as I MIXED and MATCHED and shook up the lineup.
Again--> are you nuts?
You helped prove my point as I said AT THE TIME- those McCann numbers were just another factor to consider when Girardi was to shake-up the lineup. You should agree with me. lmao....

On occasion --> you want exact dates and times? lol stop being an ass!
Don't you think it just might (lmao) depend on the opposing pitcher for a particular day?

Then you had another brilliant question:
"which other manager had ever used your master plan"

If you were paying attention, or cared to-
I did say OTHER MANAGERS HAVE shaken up their lineups and have bunched their hot/hotter hitters together in the lineup ON OCCASION...SOMETIMES....ONCE IN A WHILE.....EVERY NOW AND THEN......NOT EVERYDAY.......WHEN THE TEAM WAS SLUMPING.......take your pick dopey, and stop playing games.

Don't try and tell me--OR THE BOARD that there haven't been times when a manager juggled or shook-up his lineup when it was underachieving to the point this Yankee lineup was. And don't try and convince me that dropping TEX out of the middle of the lineup in August and September (want to see his 2nd half numbers?) by itself wouldn't be an improvement.

 

[yankeesince59]

____________________________

Are you serious? Really, ARE you serious? Is this a joke?

...no, it's not a joke and yes, I'm serious.

What the hell kind of questions are those?

...the kind you can't/won't answer.

"When"? How many times? "When the supposed occasions were..."
" when Girardi was supposed to switch the 4-5-6 hitters with the 7-8-9 hitters"?

Are you nuts?
When did I say the 3-4-5 hitters had to be switched with the 7-8-9 hitters?

...are you denying that?

Who said it HAD TO BE 3,4,5, with 7,8,9,?

...uhh, who was batting in the 7-8-9 spots much of the time and the ones you mentioned??...uhh, Headley, Prado, Ichiro, Cervelli. Who else would you replace them with?derp


And just what does 7,8,9 mean? What about the other 3 batters? lmao

...well, if you move the 4-5-6 batters, where would you put them?...1-2-3?...and "7-8-9" refers to the batting order. derp

Yeah sure, you did point out McCann hit better vs LHP than RHP. And I said THANKS..if I was Girardi I would ALSO have those numbers to work with as I MIXED and MATCHED and shook up the lineup.

...it points to your general lack of baseball knowledge...just as the other stats provided by me and others have shown. You made an erroneous statement and were proven wrong, again.


Again--> are you nuts?
You helped prove my point as I said AT THE TIME- those McCann numbers were just another factor to consider when Girardi was to shake-up the lineup. You should agree with me. lmao....

...no, that's not what you said, not at all. You indicated that McCann should not have faced LHed pitching...are you denying that too?

On occasion[/B] --> you want exact dates and times? lol stop being an ass!
Don't you think it just might (lmao) depend on the opposing pitcher for a particular day

...yes, it would be nice...if you're going to make dumbassed statements, it helps to be accurate and precise...you were not.

Then you had another brilliant question:
"which other manager had ever used your master plan"

...simple question, but you can't answer it for obvious reasons. Find a manager who has had success with switching the bottom of the order batters with those in the heart of the line up....I'll wait, not that it will matter.

If you were paying attention, or cared to-
I did say OTHER MANAGERS HAVE shaken up their lineups and have bunched their hot/hotter hitters together in the lineup ON OCCASION...SOMETIMES....ONCE IN A WHILE.....EVERY NOW AND THEN......NOT EVERYDAY.......WHEN THE TEAM WAS SLUMPING.......take your pick dopey, and stop playing games.

...NO ONE said managers don't shake up their lineups. But managers don't switch the heart of the line up with the bottom of the lineup...big difference, and that is what you're missing here.

Don't try and tell me--OR THE BOARD that there haven't been times when a manager juggled or shook-up his lineup when it was underachieving to the point this Yankee lineup was. And don't try and convince me that dropping TEX out of the middle of the lineup in August and September (want to see his 2nd half numbers?) by itself wouldn't be an improvement.



...see the previous reply. and NO ONE disputed that Tex should have been moved, especially during the 2nd half.

.
.
.

 

[blgridesagain]

I commented on the op - and '59 felt insecure.

His position appears to be - unless you're blind- that Girardi, and OTHER MANAGERS should not - and have never - shook up their lineups.

I have my opinion, and he has his...and now - I'm done with this bullsh!t.

 

[yankeesince59]

...here, in your own words;

"And I did say....I would've put just about ANYONE ELSE in place of Tex IN THE 4TH or 5TH spot...NOT REPLACING HIM ON 1b. lol yeesh.
This includes Ichiro, Prado, Cervelli, Headley WHOEVER...just get Tex out of the middle of the lineup and drop him down.. NOT OUT of the lineup. I would've used 3 different players in the 3-4-5 spots on occasions INSTEAD of the usual Tex, McCann and Beltran. <--- those three would be dropped out of the middle of the order ON OCCASIONS."

 

[yankeesince59]

I commented on the op - and '59 felt insecure.

His position appears to be - unless you're blind- that Girardi, and OTHER MANAGERS should not - and have never - shook up their lineups.

...when did I ever say that?...I didn't, and you know it.

I have my opinion, and he has his...and now - ]I'm done with this bullsh!t[/B]

....same typical and predictable bail out...that's what you generally say after you are made to look foolish

..
.
.
.

 

[blgridesagain]

...here, in your own words;

"And I did say....I would've put just about ANYONE ELSE in place of Tex IN THE 4TH or 5TH spot...NOT REPLACING HIM ON 1b. lol yeesh.
This includes Ichiro, Prado, Cervelli, Headley WHOEVER...just get Tex out of the middle of the lineup and drop him down.. NOT OUT of the lineup. I would've used 3 different players in the 3-4-5 spots on occasions INSTEAD of the usual Tex, McCann and Beltran. <--- those three would be dropped out of the middle of the order ON OCCASIONS."

________________________

I commented on the op - and '59 felt insecure.

His position appears to be - unless you're blind- that Girardi, and OTHER MANAGERS should not - and have never - shook up their lineups.

FART...ahhhhhhhhhhhh

 

[blgridesagain]

I commented on the op - and '59 felt insecure.

His position appears to be - unless you're blind- that Girardi, and OTHER MANAGERS should not - and have never - shook up their lineups.

FART...ahhhhhhhhhhhh

 

[yankeesince59]

...and there you have it folks!

 

[blgridesagain]

...and there you have it folks!

_________________________

I commented on the op - and '59 felt insecure.

His position appears to be - unless you're blind- that Girardi, and OTHER MANAGERS should not - and have never - shook up their lineups.


In a nutshell !


lmao

 

[yankeesince59]

...yup, ^^^ this is definitely a defeated person waving the white flag.

 

[Mattingly23NY]

You know brides, you indeed can look at every single game, with the links on the top of the board index, ie,
http://www.baseball-reference.com/

there you can look at every single game in a nutshell, as some say put up of shut up....(no disrespect)...

If you've got a point to make, then provide the details specific to your point. Do your own Home work too, remember Teacher's don't allow others to do their home work for another....

Yes, some stats are provided in some posts, yet repetition is lacking in others, as are the details, the stats, et al...

You seem to use stats to argue your point, yet lack details in others. Anyone can take stats, numbers, to their advantage to make shit smell like a rose, or make a rose smell like shit.....! Which one is it....?

I too will wait......til the Sun burns out.....

BTW- "Don't take this Life Personal" - its only a freaking message board, and a damn good one at that, less the resident troll know it all.....who can't take the pacifier out of his mouth long enough to utter a sensible sentence...

 

[blgridesagain]

You know brides, you indeed can look at every single game, with the links on the top of the board index, ie,
http://www.baseball-reference.com/

there you can look at every single game in a nutshell, as some say put up of shut up....(no disrespect)...

If you've got a point to make, then provide the details specific to your point. Do your own Home work too, remember Teacher's don't allow others to do their home work for another....

Yes, some stats are provided in some posts, yet repetition is lacking in others, as are the details, the stats, et al...

You seem to use stats to argue your point, yet lack details in others. Anyone can take stats, numbers, to their advantage to make shit smell like a rose, or make a rose smell like shit.....! Which one is it....?

I too will wait......til the Sun burns out.....

BTW- "Don't take this Life Personal" - its only a freaking message board, and a damn good one at that, less the resident troll know it all.....who can't take the pacifier out of his mouth long enough to utter a sensible sentence...

__________________________


Okay Matt, you said your piece and tied it up with a cute little ribbon.

Now, do you want to run around in circles too?

There are 9 batters in the batting order....are you following me?.......okay....now, I felt, and still do, Girardi didn't shake-up the lineup nearly enough--> that means switch around those 9 batters. I also mentioned in that thread that it (imo) wouldn't hurt and could take some pressure off or maybe light some kind of fire under their butts.
Not everyday and not all the time...not even frequently and certainly not early in the season before it became apparent the Yanks' projected 3-4-5 hitters were going to underachieve,to put it nicely.

We all agree the lineup/offense was bad- they were near the bottom in runs scored. I believe Girardi didn't do a good job because he didn't do (imo) all he could managing the weakest area of the team- the lineup.


That's all...and as the saying goes...you may have heard it:
Take it or leave it.

 

[yankeesince59]

...you're the only one who's "running around in circles", and you have been since the beginning. For about the 10th time, if "we all agree the offense was bad" why do you still think "switching it around" would have put the Yanx over the top?

 

[blgridesagain]

...you're the only one who's "running around in circles", and you have been since the beginning. For about the 10th time, if "we all agree the offense was bad" why do you still think "switching it around" would have put the Yanx over the top?

_________________________

No, actually you and a couple of others choose to run around in circles.
I thought I gave my opinion, and answered all your questions.

Here, from my above response to Matt (who also struggled with the concept of a basic shake-up of a lineup). lol jeez

(from post 21)
There are 9 batters in the batting order....are you following me?.......okay....now, I felt, and still do, Girardi didn't shake-up the lineup nearly enough--> that means switch around those 9 batters. I also mentioned in that thread that it (imo) wouldn't hurt and could take some pressure off or maybe light some kind of fire under their butts.
Not everyday and not all the time...not even frequently and certainly not early in the season before it became apparent the Yanks' projected 3-4-5 hitters were going to underachieve,to put it nicely.

We all agree the lineup/offense was bad- they were near the bottom in runs scored. I believe Girardi didn't do a good job because he didn't do (imo) all he could managing the weakest area of the team- the lineup.



You want stats? lol
How about just for the sake of TRYING to do SOMETHING else ? lmao
Wasn't it obvious to YOU the "normal" order wasn't clicking?
Just shake-up the freekin lineup *ONCE IN A WHILE....if it helped generate just a few more runs and a couple of more WINS- it was worth it..and we all know what the results were just leaving it be .
Now, could we wrap this up? And by the way, you chose to comment on MY response to Rick (op).



* once in a while--> take your pick

Occasionally, every now and then,
once a week (<--a new one just for you)
Here and there
Sometimes

See, I'm trying to make it easier for you to understand.

 

[yankeesince59]

...how many times are you going to contradict yourself?...how many times are you going to try to run around the end in an attempt to cover up/amend/alter what you said or meant to say?

...earlier you said this;


"I would've used 3 different players in the 3-4-5 spots on occasions INSTEAD of the usual Tex, McCann and Beltran. <--- those three would be dropped out of the middle of the order ON OCCASIONS."


...sorry, but you can't simply move "shit" around and expect different results.

 

[blgridesagain]

...how many times are you going to contradict yourself?...how many times are you going to try to run around the end in an attempt to cover up/amend/alter what you said or meant to say?

...earlier you said this;


"I would've used 3 different players in the 3-4-5 spots on occasions INSTEAD of the usual Tex, McCann and Beltran. <--- those three would be dropped out of the middle of the order ON OCCASIONS."


...sorry, but you can't simply move "shit" around and expect different results.

_________________________

I've said in another thread- pick the lineup out of a hat yep just to loosen things up.
And I stand by it. This team/lineup was pressing and desperate to score runs...maybe a good shake-up (occasionally, once in a while) would've made them more loose and relaxed....who knows..WORTH A TRY.......as I ALSO said: could the results have been worse?

I hear what you're saying about moving sh!t around.
I won't expect the manager to "shake-up" the 1927 Yankee lineup for crissakes.
Break the tension, try SOMETHING. Maybe, perhaps, possibly there were cases (I'm sure) when a couple/few of the other hitters had favorable numbers vs certain opposing starting pitchers when Tex, Beltran and or McCann did not.
Put them together in the lineup and try and maximize offensive output. <---Yes, I DID also say that.
I always thought this was what it was all about when a MANAGER shook-up his lineup.
Are you trying to re-invent the wheel?


Okay, I'll give you the last response and can we drop this?

 

[yankeesince59]

...uhhh, the issue is not whether or not it would have been worse, the issue is if it would have been better to the degree of realistically being enough to put the Yanx over the top...and if it's not, wtf are you bitching about?...it's a moot point.

...and you've said let's "drop this" several times in different threads...but still you keep bringing it up again and again in different threads. (see your 1st post in this thread, #4)

...if you truly want it to end, stop bringing it up.