Malaysia Airlines plane carrying 239 people goes missing

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MarAzul said:
I don't buy it.

1. I don't know how they know this plane went to 43+ thousand feet. Normal Radar is in no way equipped to calculate the elevation of a target from a primary return. The Transponder send the elevation data but without that a normal radar can't do it. There are radars that can, called a Height finding radar which is designed to measure the elevation angle and trig out the height from the angle and the range to the target. Some Navy ships have these and air defense systems but I have seen no report of that contact.

2 So all the transponders go out at the same time. OK, why don't this pilot radio a Mayday?
I can't buy it that all his communication gear all went in one instant unless the friggin plane blew up. In that case there would be shit all over the south China Sea. I am pretty sure a 777 has more redundancy in communication gear than I have on my boat and no way does my boat go dark with two SSB radios, 2 VHF radios, and a World Wide capable Ham radio. All this on independent Battery banks.

3. The last thing we should have heard from this plane in a catastrophic event , was the broadcast from one or more of it's emergency beacons that deployed and broadcast on 406mhz which would be picked up by satellite or another aircraft or ship at sea.

That plane is on the ground some where, next chapter to play when ready.
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$10 says the Wired article is closer to what happened than your conspiracy theory that terrorists have the plane.

If I win you have to spend $10 the way I tell you to and you have to take a picture to prove it. If you win I will spend the $10 like you tell me to, I can donate it to someone or something, whatever you want.

Bet?
 
Denny Crane said:
The "facts" being reported aren't so factual. Stuff like the two communications systems being shut off several minutes apart is now corrected to them both being shut off at the same time.

It's more sensational to make a lot of hooey about it.

Given the facts as they are actually becoming known, the fire and subsequent crash makes the most sense.

Reminds me of the case of Payne Stewart. He was a pro golfer whose private plane had a malfunction that killed everyone on board from hypoxia. The plane was on autopilot and flew itself for hours until it ran out of fuel.

I find it hard to believe that after all the defense spending we've done over the years, and post 911, that we would lose track of a plane this size, no matter what they tried to do on the plane.

If anything, it's surprising that there is no report of jets being scrambled to go check out what was going on. I suspect there were.
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But the pilot has a flight simulator at home. Do you know how bad that looks?!? That should tell you that he was up to something bad. People don't bring their work home with them. You work in the computer industry and I very much doubt you have a computer at home. Why would you? You use them all the time at work. Just like a pilot wouldn't have a computer with flight software on it at home. It makes no sense!
 
SlyPokerDog said:
But the pilot has a flight simulator at home. Do you know how bad that looks?!? That should tell you that he was up to something bad. People don't bring their work home with them. You work in the computer industry and I very much doubt you have a computer at home. Why would you? You use them all the time at work. Just like a pilot wouldn't have a computer with flight software on it at home. It makes no sense!
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The pilot is Muslim. Have to make him be evil.
 
Denny Crane said:
The pilot is Muslim. Have to make him be evil.
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It may not be that specific one Muslim but you can be quite sure it was a Muslim involved with the deed.
The track record of Piracy at sea and in the air is damn near all Muslim.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
$10 says the Wired article is closer to what happened than your conspiracy theory that terrorists have the plane.

If I win you have to spend $10 the way I tell you to and you have to take a picture to prove it. If you win I will spend the $10 like you tell me to, I can donate it to someone or something, whatever you want.

Bet?
Click to expand...

Ok, you be the judge when the story is in and I will buy you a beer with winnings. But I will be dammed if I will perform for your fertile mind and film it.
 
MarAzul said:
Ok, you be the judge when the story is in and I will buy you a beer with winnings. But I will be dammed if I will perform for your fertile mind and film it.
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I was just going to make you drink a pint of something girly like peach schnapps.
 
MarAzul said:
I don't buy it.

1. I don't know how they know this plane went to 43+ thousand feet. Normal Radar is in no way equipped to calculate the elevation of a target from a primary return. The Transponder send the elevation data but without that a normal radar can't do it. There are radars that can, called a Height finding radar which is designed to measure the elevation angle and trig out the height from the angle and the range to the target. Some Navy ships have these and air defense systems but I have seen no report of that contact.

2 So all the transponders go out at the same time. OK, why don't this pilot radio a Mayday?
I can't buy it that all his communication gear all went in one instant unless the friggin plane blew up. In that case there would be shit all over the south China Sea. I am pretty sure a 777 has more redundancy in communication gear than I have on my boat and no way does my boat go dark with two SSB radios, 2 VHF radios, and a World Wide capable Ham radio. All this on independent Battery banks.

3. The last thing we should have heard from this plane in a catastrophic event , was the broadcast from one or more of it's emergency beacons that deployed and broadcast on 406mhz which would be picked up by satellite or another aircraft or ship at sea.

That plane is on the ground some where, next chapter to play when ready.
Click to expand...

Stupid objections.
1. Both the author, a very experienced commercial pilot, and Malaysian authorities say you're wrong.

As for the reports of altitude fluctuations, given that this was not transponder-generated data but primary radar at maybe 200 miles, the azimuth readings can be affected by a lot of atmospherics and I would not have high confidence in this being totally reliable. But let’s accept for a minute that the pilot may have ascended to 45,000 feet in a last-ditch effort to quell a fire by seeking the lowest level of oxygen. That is an acceptable scenario. At 45,000 feet, it would be tough to keep this aircraft stable, as the flight envelope is very narrow and loss of control in a stall is entirely possible. The aircraft is at the top of its operational ceiling. The reported rapid rates of descent could have been generated by a stall, followed by a recovery at 25,000 feet. The pilot may even have been diving to extinguish flames. But going to 45,000 feet in a hijack scenario doesn’t make any good sense to me.
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2. If you'd read the author's theory you'd know his answer. There was a fire in the transponder area. The pilot and copilot turned it off to restart it, circuit by circuit. But the fire took over, the oxygen burnt up, and everyone onboard went unconscious fast before a pilot could return to the cockpit to make voice contact with the ground. The plane sailed on autopilot for hours till it ran out of fuel.

3. See #2 answer. Next time, read the article before ventilating your hole on us.
 
jlprk said:
Stupid objections.
1. Both the author, a very experienced commercial pilot, and Malaysian authorities say you're wrong.



2. If you'd read the author's theory you'd know his answer. There was a fire in the transponder area. The pilot and copilot turned it off to restart it, circuit by circuit. But the fire took over, the oxygen burnt up, and everyone onboard went unconscious fast before a pilot could return to the cockpit to make voice contact with the ground. The plane sailed on autopilot for hours till it ran out of fuel.

3. See #2 answer. Next time, read the article before ventilating your hole on us.
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Sure a fire destroyed redundant transponders, redundant communications system, wiped out the oxygen in a heart beat but left the autopilot and flight control completely intact.
Then when it did auger in, redundant beacons failed to deploy. naw! now go suck your thumb son, your in a mans game without a toolkit.
 
Both transponders are next to the front door, under the floor, accessible through a hatch. They may be electronically redundant, but one fire can take out both. Depressurization would render everyone unconscious immediately, but leave the autopilot unaffected.
 
maxiep said:
I just came on to post this very article. It's the best reasoning I've heard or read so far.
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yeah..I have seen this theory as well as several others. I think that I suffer from having been lied to by the press and government for so long, I have a hard time believing anything that is too simple or convenient.
 
What makes sense to me, after seeing the equipment room of the 777, is that a fire started and someone went into the machine room and threw all the circuit breakers to off position. This took all redundant systems off the air. The idea would be to turn them all on, but one by one, to find out which one was causing the short or fire.

The guy passed out before he could turn on the breakers for the communications systems.

The plane changed heading and altitude because the systems were damaged, turned off, rebooting, etc.
 
Denny Crane said:
What makes sense to me, after seeing the equipment room of the 777, is that a fire started and someone went into the machine room and threw all the circuit breakers to off position. This took all redundant systems off the air. The idea would be to turn them all on, but one by one, to find out which one was causing the short or fire.

The guy passed out before he could turn on the breakers for the communications systems.

The plane changed heading and altitude because the systems were damaged, turned off, rebooting, etc.
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I suppose it could be, but damn, that would be piss poor engineering to have all redundant systems one power source or circuit control panel. Hard for me to believe the Boeing engineers could be that dim. I know some of those guys and they are not dim.

Now it could be the circuits are on separate panels like they should, and piss poor performance by the flight crew proceeded as you suggest, shutting down multiple panels. That might do it.
But it does not account for emergency beacons failed to deploy (again multiple systems failing).
They should be floating on the sea beaming out the Aircraft ID and location on 406 mhz right now.
 
MarAzul said:
I suppose it could be, but damn, that would be piss poor engineering to have all redundant systems one power source or circuit control panel. Hard for me to believe the Boeing engineers could be that dim. I know some of those guys and they are not dim.

Now it could be the circuits are on separate panels like they should, and piss poor performance by the flight crew proceeded as you suggest, shutting down multiple panels. That might do it.
But it does not account for emergency beacons failed to deploy (again multiple systems failing).
They should be floating on the sea beaming out the Aircraft ID and location on 406 mhz right now.
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http://abcnews.go.com/International...h-race-time-black-box-ticks/story?id=22950852

The search for the missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 is becoming a race against time as the plane's black box will ping for only a month, and instead of narrowing, the search area has been expanded to mind boggling dimensions.

Already the black box has lost a third of its battery life since the plane vanished and the search area now encompasses 2.24 million square miles -- 10 times the size of Texas -- extending in the north from China and Kazakhstan south to Australia. Authorities hope to find the black boxes in order to understand what went wrong on flight MH370.
 
MARIS61 said:
Another coverup?

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message435580/pg1
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That site speculates that President Clinton murdered golfer Payne Stewart.

Denny Crane said:
You're joking, right?.
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Well duh. Not too sharp today, eh?

maxiep said:
It amazes me people even bother responding to several posters on this board. MARIS has proven himself to be a complete waste of time.
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Many in this thread have joked about weird theories. Take yourself less seriously.
 
Denny Crane said:
http://abcnews.go.com/International...h-race-time-black-box-ticks/story?id=22950852

The search for the missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 is becoming a race against time as the plane's black box will ping for only a month, and instead of narrowing, the search area has been expanded to mind boggling dimensions.

Already the black box has lost a third of its battery life since the plane vanished and the search area now encompasses 2.24 million square miles -- 10 times the size of Texas -- extending in the north from China and Kazakhstan south to Australia. Authorities hope to find the black boxes in order to understand what went wrong on flight MH370.
Click to expand...

Well the Black box is one thing and the 406 beacons are another. The 406 beacons deploy or are suppose to when it goes into the sea. The black box stays with the aircraft I think and it will ping under water. The 406 beacons have to be above the surface to broadcast on 406.

Yeah so, the plane pinged or answer pings from communication satellites for about 7 hours last known. So that put it on that arc of x distance from the satellite but we never hear the 406 beacons. That should tell them where it is, about 7hrs flight time from the last radar contact, on that arc line of position.
That means it is North because the beacons did not deploy.
 
They are looking in an area about 2500 kilometers from Perth on that southern line of position identified a couple days ago. The only land close is St Paul Island about 540 knots to the west.

The interesting thing is, Beijing is around 4300 Km from KL where the plane took off and this search sight is about 4300 KM from KL also so if it only had fuel for Beijing then this sure could be about right for how far it could get.

The sea in this area is about 3600 meter deep and far enough North that it won't be too ruff
only about 20 foot seas. Not quite down to the Roaring 40s.


But?? WTF do you fly 240 people 7 hours due south into oblivion in the southern ocean?
I guess he did take out a load of Infidels, most of the Chinese would qualify.
 
http://news.yahoo.com/australia-che...QDBHBzdGNhdAMEcHQDcG1oBHRlc3QDU1NMX09u;_ylv=3

KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia (AP) — Four military search planes were dispatched Thursday to try to determine whether two large objects bobbing in a remote part of the Indian Ocean were part of a possible debris field of the missing Malaysia Airlines flight.

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Australian PM says satellite finds objects possibly from missing Malaysian jet Reuters
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Australia says objects 'possibly' related to MH370 spotted AFP
Malaysia Airlines says plane missing Associated Press
Australia narrows search area in southern Indian Ocean for missing jet Reuters
One of the objects spotted by satellite imagery had a dimension of 25 meters (82 feet) and the other one was smaller. There could be other objects in waters nearby in the area that's a four-hour flight from Australia's southwestern coast, said John Young, manager of Australian Maritime Safety Authority's emergency response division.

"This is a lead, it's probably the best lead we have right now," said Young, while cautioning that the objects could also be seaborne debris along a key shipping route where containers periodically fall off cargo vessels.

Young told a news conference in Canberra, Australia's capital, that planes had been sent to the area about 2,500 kilometers (1,550 miles) southwest of Perth to check on the objects. He said that satellite images "do not always turn out to be related to the search even if they look good, so we will hold our views on that until they are sighted close-up."

Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott had earlier told Parliament about the debris, and said Orion search aircraft were expected to arrive in the area Thursday afternoon.

Young said visibility was poor and may hamper efforts to find the objects. He said they "are relatively indistinct on the imagery ... but those who are experts indicate they are credible sightings. The indication to me is of objects that are a reasonable size and probably awash with water, moving up and down over the surface."

View galleryA Chinese relative of a passenger aboard a missing …
A Chinese relative of a passenger aboard a missing Malaysia Airlines plane is carried out by securit …
Military planes from Australia, the U.S. and New Zealand have been covering a search region over the southern Indian Ocean that was narrowed down from 600,000 square kilometers (232,000 square miles) to 305,000 square kilometers (117,000 square miles).

The hunt for the Boeing 777 has been punctuated by several false leads since it disappeared March 8 above the Gulf of Thailand.

Oil slicks that were spotted did not contain jet fuel. A yellow object thought to be from the plane turned out to be a piece of sea trash. Chinese satellite images showed possible plane debris, but nothing was found.

But this is the first time that possible objects have been spotted since the search area was massively expanded into two corridors, one stretching from northern Thailand into Central Asia and the other from the Strait of Malacca down to southern reaches of the Indian Ocean.

Abbott said he spoke to the prime minister of Malaysia, Najib Razak, about the latest developments. Australia's envoy to Malaysia, Rod Smith, joined a meeting of senior Malaysia search officials at a Kuala Lumpur hotel after Abbott's announcement. Smith did not respond to reporters' questions.

View galleryA Chinese relative of passengers aboard a missing Malaysia …
A Chinese relative of passengers aboard a missing Malaysia Airlines plane cries as she holds a banne …
"As I've been doing from day one, I've followed every single lead. And this time, I hope it is a positive development," Malaysian Defense Minister Hishammuddin Hussein told reporters.

The FBI has also joined forces with Malaysian authorities in analyzing deleted data on a flight simulator belonging to the pilot of the missing jet.

Files containing records of flight simulations were deleted Feb. 3 from the device found in the home of the pilot, Capt. Zaharie Ahmad Shah, Malaysian police chief Khalid Abu said.

It was not clear whether investigators thought that deleting the files was unusual. They might hold hints of unusual flight paths that could help explain where the missing plane went, or the files could have been deleted simply to clear memory for other material.

Hishammuddin told a news conference Wednesday that Zaharie is considered innocent until proven guilty. He said members of the pilot's family are cooperating in the investigation.

View galleryAn elderly woman, one of the relatives of Chinese passengers …
An elderly woman, one of the relatives of Chinese passengers aboard missing Malaysia Airlines Flight …
Zaharie was known to some within the online world of flight simulation enthusiasts.

A U.S. official, speaking on condition of anonymity because the official was not authorized to discuss the ongoing investigation by name, said the FBI has been asked to analyze the deleted simulator files.

U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder said in Washington that the FBI was working with Malaysian authorities. "At this point, I don't think we have any theories," he said.

Flight 370 disappeared March 8 on a night flight from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing. Malaysian authorities have not ruled out any possible explanation, but have said the evidence so far suggests the flight was deliberately turned back across Malaysia to the Strait of Malacca, with its communications systems disabled. They are unsure what happened next.

Investigators have identified two giant arcs of territory spanning the possible positions of the plane about 7½ hours after takeoff, based on its last faint signal to a satellite — an hourly "handshake" signal that continues even when communications are switched off. The arcs stretch up as far as Kazakhstan in central Asia and down deep into the southern Indian Ocean.

Police are considering the possibility of hijacking, sabotage, terrorism or issues related to the mental health of the pilots or anyone else on board, and have asked for background checks from abroad on all foreign passengers.
 
If this debris is indeed the missing aircraft, I am afraid I owe Sly 10 bucks.
The plane must have flown down there on autopilot, it's almost impossible to believe
a man did intentionally.

The debris distance from origin is almost the same as destination, equals out of fuel.
 
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MarAzul said:
If this debris is indeed the missing aircraft, I am afraid I owe Sly 10 bucks.
The plane must have flown down there on autopilot, it's almost impossible to believe
a man did intentionally.

The debris distance from origin is almost the same as destination, equals out of fuel.
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Doesn't even have to have been on autopilot. Left to itself, the plane can keep flying until it runs out of fuel.

barfo
 
Floating objects were checked a week ago, much closer to Malaysia. They turned out to be unrelated. This new stuff is a glimmer of light picked up from 22,000 miles high. They send a P-3 on a 10-hour flight to check. The media gets its daily headline from this, and this thread goes nuts.

MarAzul said:
Well the Black box is one thing and the 406 beacons are another. The 406 beacons deploy or are suppose to when it goes into the sea. The black box stays with the aircraft I think and it will ping under water. The 406 beacons have to be above the surface to broadcast on 406.

Yeah so, the plane pinged or answer pings from communication satellites for about 7 hours last known. So that put it on that arc of x distance from the satellite but we never hear the 406 beacons. That should tell them where it is, about 7hrs flight time from the last radar contact, on that arc line of position.
That means it is North because the beacons did not deploy.
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Both kinds of transmitters have a short range. You act as if searchers a thousand miles away can receive their signals.
 
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