Mavs with Kidd

[Deeznets]

I see at least 5 teams that can knock them out in the playoffs. Lakers, Suns, Spurs, Nugs and GS. Even with Kidd, the don't stand a chance against the Suns and Spurs, and my gut tells me the Nuggets would beat them 4-1. The Warriors may have the same results as last year. Kidd's defense will be exploited against GS with Ellis and Davis. Will they put him on Stephen Jackson and make Terry and Howard guard their little guys?

I do see them beating the Jazz and Rockets, and I think they have a shot against the Lakers, but if Bynum comes back then it wont be close.

 

[Really Lost One]

Kidd is good, but he won't put them over the top. Losing Diop will really hurt their team because now they are absolutely horrible up front. They have no one on the roster to stop all the bigs in the West. Shaq, Amare, Gasol, Bynum, Duncan, Yao, and Boozer will have a field day in the paint. Unless they have another deal up their sleeves, this move will get them absolutely nowhere.

 

[Moo2K4]

I honestly see them as at best, the 6th best team out West. The Lakers, Suns, Spurs, Rockets and Jazz, I think are all better then them. They all have a big guy that can score points in the post, and right now, that's the biggest weakness for the Mavs (assuming this trade gets finalized). They will have zero post defense. Damp will be all they have and he's certainly not enough. Dirk is soft. Bass is undersized. So, when they have to go against the Lakers frontline, who are all 6'11" and taller, what will happen? Or when they have to play Yao? How will they stop a frontcourt of Shaq and Amare? As well as Boozer out in Utah? If you look at it, the Mavs are going to be the only team with weak post play on BOTH ends of the court. While the Warriors offensive post play isn't that great, Biedrins is solid at defending the post, and that's the same with Chandler out NO. Both those guys get most of their points of lobs and put backs. The Mavs will have NO ONE who can stop the paint and very little that can score in the paint. They go from finesse to even more finesse with this trade. I look for a first round knock out, regardless of who they end up against in the first round.

 

[Deeznets]

Cuban really screwed up by not making a strong run for Gasol. He could've had Gasol and Kidd had he tried.

 

[Run BJM]

I don't think they'll be much better, they may even be worse. Kidd is a stud but as mentioned before their frontcourt takes a big hit on this trade. Dampier, Bass, and Howard is looking pretty weak in the west. They still have a lot of talent with Kidd, Dirk, Howard, and Terry but they just seem a lot smaller now. They'll still be a good team but they can't compete with the monster front lines in the west.

 

[Moo2K4]

I honestly think this team would be better with a different coach. If Don Nelson was still running the show, they may still be a top team. However, Avery has taken the offense away from the team. He wants them to focus more on defense and play more halfcourt. With Kidd as the PG, they would have greater success if they switched back to the way they played under Nelson. Play small ball and make teams match up to you. However, with Avery, that's not going to happen, so teams will have a field day pounding his weak frontcourt.

 

[Belarus]

I see only 3 teams that can knock them out in the playoffs : Lakers, Suns, Spurs. The key word is can. Playoffs is another level where some mentally soft teams doesn't play up to their regular season performance. Kidd definitely adds mental toughness to Mavs and that's a huge asset in the playoffs.

 

[Really Lost One]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Belarus @ Feb 18 2008, 02:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I see only 3 teams that can knock them out in the playoffs : Lakers, Suns, Spurs. The key word is can. Playoffs is another level where some mentally soft teams doesn't play up to their regular season performance. Kidd definitely adds mental toughness to Mavs and that's a huge asset in the playoffs.</div>
"Playoffs is another level where some mentally soft teams doesn't play up to their regular season performance."

And that's a perfect example of the Dallas Mavericks, who got eliminated by the 8th seeded Warriors last season. The Mavs are not going anywhere in the playoffs unless they get someone to clog the paint. Like I said, teams will have a field day scoring down low.

 

[Kidd Karma]

Kidd gets them over the Warriors last year and this year. He takes up the leadership void. They will have problems in a series with the Lakers, and Spurs. I can see them taking out the Suns. Kidd will have his way with Nash offensively and with Kidd getting into the paint everytime out, he will draw fouls on their bigs.

 

[Deeznets]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kidd Karma @ Feb 18 2008, 02:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Kidd gets them over the Warriors last year and this year. He takes up the leadership void. They will have problems in a series with the Lakers, and Spurs. I can see them taking out the Suns. Kidd will have his way with Nash offensively and with Kidd getting into the paint everytime out, he will draw fouls on their bigs.</div>


Huh? I don't picture Kidd abusing Nash on the offensive end. I do see Nash abusing Kidd when he has the ball. Kidd is horrible at guarding PGs like Nash, Parker, Baron, etc......And who on the Mavs are stopping Amare and Shaq? I know Shaq is old, but he'll have an easy time with Damp and friggin Mailk Allen.

 

[Universe]

Kidd made our team sucsessful with Jason Collins at center. I think he can do something with Dampier if he ever learns to catch a ball.

People are hating on them but they barely gave up anything for Kidd. Devin Harris along with Diop were the only peices from there 60 win season while you guys say they cannot handle big men in the post, they can out run all them now.

Terry is extremely underrated and was about 2 games away from being Finals MVP.

 

[Jizzy]

they give up way to much and they just got really old. that 2010 pick could be really valuable

 

[Kidd Karma]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jizzy @ Feb 18 2008, 02:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>they give up way to much and they just got really old. that 2010 pick could be really valuable</div>

No doubt about that, watch that Kidd extension talk, will help determine how good the pick will be. They should be on the hook for 60-70 million if he gets that 20 million extension for 4 players.

 

[Charles]

A lot of people are underrating how much Kidd is going to help all the Mavs players. You don't think he'll find Dirk and Josh Howard in open spots more than Devin Harris would? The Mavericks team as a whole has had two games where someone got 10 or more assists. And one of the two was Dirk. Jason Terry can play D against the opposing point guard while Kidd plays against the 2.

I still don't think they are the favorites, but I do think they got a whole lot better. Kidd is going to be rejuvinated and ready to prove everyone wrong. Dirk is probably the best teammate he's ever had (Team USA aside).

 

[pegs]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Feb 18 2008, 02:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Kidd made our team sucsessful with Jason Collins at center. I think he can do something with Dampier if he ever learns to catch a ball.

People are hating on them but they barely gave up anything for Kidd. Devin Harris along with Diop were the only peices from there 60 win season while you guys say they cannot handle big men in the post, they can out run all them now.

Terry is extremely underrated and was about 2 games away from being Finals MVP.</div>
You're underrating how important Diop is. I mean, if Diop wasn't included, this trade would look a whole lot sweeter for the Mavs. But by giving up Diop, they're giving up their best shotblocker, a great bench big to go to, 6 more fouls, and someone to provide depth in case another big goes out (which we've seen alot with Damp).

If they didn't give up Diop, I'd say they'd be a top 3 team. Without him, it's probably top 6.

 

[Moo2K4]

See, it's not that the Mavs gave up too much to get him, but it's what happens when they get him that hurts the most. Throw out the draft picks, they don't really matter since they'll be so late, and since you're wanting to win, this is logical. Do keep in mind though, Kidd is going to be demanding a $20mil extension. That's a lot of money to have wrapped up in Howard, Dirk, Terry, Damp and Kidd. They're cap flexibility is going to be non-existent. That's what I think is the worst thing about this move. However, I still think they're overpaying to get him.

 

[Universe]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Feb 18 2008, 04:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Feb 18 2008, 02:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Kidd made our team sucsessful with Jason Collins at center. I think he can do something with Dampier if he ever learns to catch a ball.

People are hating on them but they barely gave up anything for Kidd. Devin Harris along with Diop were the only peices from there 60 win season while you guys say they cannot handle big men in the post, they can out run all them now.

Terry is extremely underrated and was about 2 games away from being Finals MVP.</div>
You're underrating how important Diop is. I mean, if Diop wasn't included, this trade would look a whole lot sweeter for the Mavs. But by giving up Diop, they're giving up their best shotblocker, a great bench big to go to, 6 more fouls, and someone to provide depth in case another big goes out (which we've seen alot with Damp).

If they didn't give up Diop, I'd say they'd be a top 3 team. Without him, it's probably top 6.
</div>
The thing about Diop is if he was really that important, why was he only getting 17 minutes a night?

Dampier will just have to step up defensively which will be easy now that the offense will be much smoother.

Also, Dampier lead the team in blocks but in more minutes.

 

[Moo2K4]

The one convenience you had with Diop though is that if Damp got in foul trouble, you had another big body to throw out there. Now, if Damp gets in foul trouble, you either go with the undersized Bass or the soft Dirk. Either way, it's a downgrade defensively from Diop, so you get worse on that end, regardless of the fact that he's only playing 18mpg.

 

[Really Lost One]

If Dirk and Ericka Dampier are the best bigs you have on your roster, then you're in big trouble. Again, they will not be able to stop all the big men in the West. Come playoff time, they will get dominated again and again in the paint. Small ball does not win championships. Even the Phoenix Suns realized this and gambled with Shaquille O'Neal. They are not going to get anywhere with this roster unless they get another big who can defend the paint. Small ball does not win championships, it never has, and it probably never will. They can score all the points they want, but the game slows down in the postseason, and in a seven game series, opposing teams will be able to figure them out. Jason Kidd is an upgrade presently, but he's not going to take them to the next level.

 

[pegs]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Feb 18 2008, 04:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Feb 18 2008, 04:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Feb 18 2008, 02:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Kidd made our team sucsessful with Jason Collins at center. I think he can do something with Dampier if he ever learns to catch a ball.

People are hating on them but they barely gave up anything for Kidd. Devin Harris along with Diop were the only peices from there 60 win season while you guys say they cannot handle big men in the post, they can out run all them now.

Terry is extremely underrated and was about 2 games away from being Finals MVP.</div>
You're underrating how important Diop is. I mean, if Diop wasn't included, this trade would look a whole lot sweeter for the Mavs. But by giving up Diop, they're giving up their best shotblocker, a great bench big to go to, 6 more fouls, and someone to provide depth in case another big goes out (which we've seen alot with Damp).

If they didn't give up Diop, I'd say they'd be a top 3 team. Without him, it's probably top 6.
</div>
The thing about Diop is if he was really that important, why was he only getting 17 minutes a night?

Dampier will just have to step up defensively which will be easy now that the offense will be much smoother.

Also, Dampier lead the team in blocks but in more minutes.
</div>

I'd say he was only getting 17 min because Avery loves playing the matchup game. He usually plays certain players against certain teams. My thoughts were, that with Shaq and Pau coming to the West and with Duncan still in the West, there'd be more of a need for him once the playoffs come.

IMO the Mavs will simply be screwed when facing up against Shaq and Amare, Pau and Bynum, and Duncan in the playoffs. Say Damps gets injured. They're completely screwed. Say Damps gets in foul trouble, and they're forced to rely on Bass. IMO they're screwed there, too.

 

[Dumpy]

I see them as 9th best in the West.

 

[Moo2K4]

Haha, might not be too far fetched though. The West is extremely tight and if you lose a couple in a row, you can go from top 4 to 9th.