Merged: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

[Draco]

http://nba.fanhouse.com/2009/05/24/magic-cant-afford-to-keep-turkoglu/

Turkoglu has proven throughout the last two season -- and certainly in this playoff run -- that he deserves to be paid handsomely by NBA standards, which the Magic can't do and still stay under the luxury tax limit that terrorizes all the small market teams.

The Magic are unlikely to offer anything more than a four-year deal worth an estimated $30 million. Yet there are several teams in the league desperate to find a go-to guy, and one of them will offer considerably more.

The Trail Blazers have talked about waiving Channing Frye to make room for a Turkoglu contract. The Pistons are weighing the option as Joe Dumars continues his reconstruction process. The Grizzlies and the Thunder could find the salary cap room.

 

[oldmangrouch]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Yet another example of how the current salary cap is broken.....and Stern thinks the solution is to make the situation worse!

As for the Blazers trying to make room to sign Hedo, I find that claim suspect. They need whatever cap space they have to find an upgrade at PG.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Hedo is pretty good but not what we need.

 

[handiman]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Disagree. He's a very good SF with good PG skills ... fills two positions of need. He would be a great fit on offense and probably adequate defensively. Not sure about age and contract demands.

 

[MAS RipCity]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

good signing if true, then we would have other assets to upgrade pg

 

[BlazersBlood]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Disagree. He's a very good SF with good PG skills ... fills two positions of need. He would be a great fit on offense and probably adequate defensively. Not sure about age and contract demands.

Yeah, how much does he want? Max $$$?

Hedo's been clutch for a long time, and the Magic are proving that you can't have too many clutch guys on the team. Outside of Roy, we don't have anybody that can get their own shot and actually make them when it really counts.

 

[B-Roy]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

I'd love to get Turkey Glue, another ball handler to take the pressure off of Roy. (And an actually good ballhandler, unlike Sergio)

 

[ehizzy3]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Yeah, how much does he want? Max $$$?

Hedo's been clutch for a long time, and the Magic are proving that you can't have too many clutch guys on the team. Outside of Roy, we don't have anybody that can get their own shot and actually make them when it really counts.

some could argue travis, but im not sure he can when it really counts. i think lamarcus is a clutch player just never gets the oppurtunity....

anyways, if wikipedia is right, he is only 30 and turned it in march. so he is younger than i thought...i'd love to sign him for 3 years but i doubt we'll have the cap unless we dont bring back outlaw or blake.

 

[ehizzy3]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

man i hate hedo though lol

 

[hasoos]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Yet another example of how the current salary cap is broken.....and Stern thinks the solution is to make the situation worse!

As for the Blazers trying to make room to sign Hedo, I find that claim suspect. They need whatever cap space they have to find an upgrade at PG.

Really, how is it supposedly broken? It does exactly what it was meant to do.

 

[MARIS61]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Hedo will stay with the Magic, because he won't be offered more than $30 million by anyone else.

 

[oldmangrouch]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Really, how is it supposedly broken? It does exactly what it was meant to do.

Really? I thought the point was to stop big market teams from poaching other teams' free agents, while allowing ALL teams to re-sign their own free agents. (IE Bird rights) The "luxury tax" has become a backdoor way of repealing Bird rights.

 

[<-=*PdX*=->]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

3 guys I wouldn't mind seeing Portland go after this offseason are Hedo, Birdman and Artest and in that order also. I list Ron Ron last because he is a loose cannon and is ready to erupt at any time. I think Hedo would be a fabulous pickup for this team. That would leave Martell, Travis, Blake, Sergio and possibly Bayless (who I do think will take over at PG in the coming seasons). Those players could net us a decent PG.

 

[Chuck Taylor]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

I would love to get Turkoglu. He just turned 30, so he's a little older but would be productive for quite a few more years. Outlaw and/or Webster (preferably both, IMO) would have to get moved for a PG, or our SF situation would really be murky. Bottom line, if you can sign Turkoglu as a FA and give up nothing, you have to jump on him and trust KP can make a trade for a PG.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

I'd love to get Turkey Glue, another ball handler to take the pressure off of Roy. (And an actually good ballhandler, unlike Sergio)

Yeah - that Sergio can hardly dribble at all.

[video=youtube;PdBaQWh54n8]

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Re: Turkoglu. A while back I responded to MM's suggestion of targeting him thusly:

Turkoglu is Mike Miller in a better system. He's fool's gold. Do you really want him handling the ball like he does for the Magic when you've got Brandon Roy? And his defense is laughable. I hope Webster will do everything good that Turkoglu does that doesn't involve ball-handling.

We do NOT need to target a SF. SFs are like appendixes or coccixes - they're useless extra appendages that only need to hit 3s and play defense (okay, in that respect they're not like coccixes, even if mine can do that). Unless you are Scottie Pippen or Grant Hill. In which case you're really just a big guard.

Having actually watched Turkoglu play for more than just snippets (my lack of doing so before was not an impediment to me forming firm opinions) I need to reassess. He's a lot taller than Mike Miller and less athletic-looking (in fact, he has an unattractive hunch) BUT: he's sneaky-good. He reminds me of the older Toni Kukoc. You don't think he should be able to penetrate, but [video=youtube;KG5p3HBs9pQ] with fakes and long strides. And while I stand by my assessment that he's really helped by the Magic's system, you can't argue with the numbers of assists he's getting and his general clutchness. And he is playing like a guard - a 6'10" guard. I would be in favor of getting him PROVIDED we got rid of Blake. Having Turkoglu as an extra passer would enable us to play Bayless or Rudy in the backcourt with Roy. Turkoglu could also play some backup 4, meaning that we'd have minutes at the three for Batum & co. He would be an interesting alternative to signing a veteran point, and he might enable us to play Rudy for a lot more mpg.

I'd worry about his D, but the Magic have amazing D, and I don't think it's all on Dwight Howard.

(Oh, I guess if Mediocre Man is reading, I should apologize for my earlier snark.)

 

[azsun67]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Now he is a difference maker, much more than Josh Childress. wink wink Stomp

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

I really never even notice how tall he is when he's playing. Yeah he can dribble and pass very well for a guy his size, but I also see him drive wildly and throw up crazy shots more often than not. He is not very athletic and his defense is poor. He doesn't ever get past his defender he just gets side to side with him and tries to get fouled or bank it off the glass from hard angles because he doesn't get close enough to the hoop. I'm not saying he's terrible I'm just saying I don't think he is as good as people think. He will probably want a lot of money and will probably get it from somewhere. But I don't think he is what we should be targeting. I think the two glaring needs are PG and a big that can come in the game for 10-15 minutes, defend, hustle, and rebound.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

It all depends on the contract. I honestly view Batum as the future but Turkyglu is a massive upgrade at the moment.

Max deal? no.

 

[Ed O]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Really? I thought the point was to stop big market teams from poaching other teams' free agents, while allowing ALL teams to re-sign their own free agents. (IE Bird rights) The "luxury tax" has become a backdoor way of repealing Bird rights.

It is doing what it's supposed to do: control spending by NBA teams that can't afford spending as much as the big teams.

A hard cap (the league without Bird rights) limits EVERY team, while the luxury tax only limits the less wealthy ones.

It hurts competitive balance a bit, because it makes teams like Orlando choose which 6'10" small forward they want to pay $10m a year to while a Paul Allen-owned team might not have to make such a choice, but it IS doing what its intent is: to reduce salaries paid across the NBA as a whole.

Ed O.

 

[MARIS61]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Yeah - that Sergio can hardly dribble at all.

...

Repped for pointing out B-Roy's penchant for silly notions.

 

[B-Roy]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Yeah - that Sergio can hardly dribble at all.

Maybe I should have specified. I meant ball dominating player, not ballhandler.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

BUT: he's sneaky-good. He reminds me of the older Toni Kukoc. You don't think he should be able to penetrate, but somehow he manages it with fakes and long strides.

Nice move, but that was Andrea Bargnani he drove around and dunked on. It would have been much more impressive against an NBA player.

BNM

 

[alex42083]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

I'd love to have Hedo on this team. The guy is clutch, love his versatility and would fit right in at the SF position. He'd be a legitimate third scorer with Roy and Aldridge.

 

[KingSpeed]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

It would be awesome to get Hedo. That would immediately make us a legit contender if we weren't already. A completely reliable third scorer who can do almost anything. Rebound, assist, drive to the basket, hit clutch threes. Make this deal!

 

[KingSpeed]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

He'd also be that playoff veteran people are always calling for. The guy has played in lots of big games back with the Kings and now with the Magic. He would be great to have in our locker room.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Would signing him take up our cap space? in that case we can't get a PG or a back up PF, and I would rather get either of those over Turkoglu.

 

[Minstrel]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Using cap space on a small forward, leaving nothing to sign a point guard upgrade, would seem like a bad idea...except that Turkoglu happens to have some point guard skills himself, so he actually partially addresses the need for a point guard. Solidifying the small forward position and adding another distributor would be a pretty interesting and possibly very good move.

If Portland did add Turkoglu, do they continue running Blake/Sergio at point guard (I won't comment on Bayless until he's actually being used in the rotation) or should Portland try putting Batum at "point guard" for defensive purposes? Let Turkoglu and Roy handle and distribute, have Batum pass, slash and shoot on offense and defend the opposing point guard?

I'm not entirely sure it would work, but it's an interesting idea to me. I don't really want Batum buried, since I think he's already a pretty useful player and I don't want his defense removed from a team struggling with its perimeter defense.

 

[hasoos]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Would signing him take up our cap space? in that case we can't get a PG or a back up PF, and I would rather get either of those over Turkoglu.

Backup PF are a dime a dozen. Joe Smith and Mikki Moore were both picked up very late in the year. I can guarantee Joe Smith is better than all of our backup PF.

As for PG, who are you planning on picking up? There has to be somebody to pick up in order to pick them up, and I don't see anybody out there.

 

[Wheels]

Re: Turkoglu to leave the Magic?

Using cap space on a small forward, leaving nothing to sign a point guard upgrade, would seem like a bad idea...except that Turkoglu happens to have some point guard skills himself, so he actually partially addresses the need for a point guard. Solidifying the small forward position and adding another distributor would be a pretty interesting and possibly very good move.

If Portland did add Turkoglu, do they continue running Blake/Sergio at point guard (I won't comment on Bayless until he's actually being used in the rotation) or should Portland try putting Batum at "point guard" for defensive purposes? Let Turkoglu and Roy handle and distribute, have Batum pass, slash and shoot on offense and defend the opposing point guard?

I'm not entirely sure it would work, but it's an interesting idea to me. I don't really want Batum buried, since I think he's already a pretty useful player and I don't want his defense removed from a team struggling with its perimeter defense.

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