Merged: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

[illmatic99]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5609817&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines

At the referees' annual meeting in Jersey City, N.J., on Thursday, the league announced the guidelines for technical fouls will expand to include "overt" player reactions to referee calls.

Referees have been instructed to call a technical for:

• Players making aggressive gestures, such as air punches, anywhere on the court.

• Demonstrative disagreement, such as when a player incredulously raises his hands, or smacks his own arm to demonstrate how he was fouled.

• Running directly at an official to complain about a call.

• Excessive inquiries about a call, even in a civilized tone.

In addition, referees have been instructed to consider calling technicals on players who use body language to question or demonstrate displeasure, or say things like, "Come on!" They can also consider technicals for players who "take the long path to the official", walking across the court to make their case.

Seriously, wtf. One of the reasons basketball (hell, any sport) is so popular, is because you can see emotion from players and relate to their joys and sorrows. Is Stern trying to create robots?

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5609817&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines



Seriously, wtf. One of the reasons basketball (hell, any sport) is so popular, is because you can see emotion from players and relate to their joys and sorrows. Is Stern trying to create robots?

Wow. This is an absolutely ridiculous list of "offenses". Exactly what defines an "aggressive gesture" anyway? Is it supposed to be a "Can't define it but I know it when I see it" standard? At what point do inquiries about a call become "excessive"? Is this yet another thing that is completely up to the discretion of the officials?

I can't understand how a league about which there is so much consternation about the efficacy of the officials would want to increase their latitude. In real life, people get more power and responsibility when they demonstrate excellence--apparently the NBA prefers to reward inconsistency and incompetence.

 

[Rhal]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

This is absolutely retarded unless they will start calling them on the "superstars" of the league. If they don't then its a rule that will just demonstrate more and more how Stars are treated in the league and what they can get away with compared to role players.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

I honestly don't see anything wrong with those listed int he post. All 4 of those listed all drive me crazy when players do them.

 

[illmatic99]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Wow. This is an absolutely ridiculous list of "offenses". Exactly what defines an "aggressive gesture" anyway?

I'm guessing these:

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Similar guidelines have been tried before and they didn't last the preseason.

btw, why against players so much? It's the coaches that drive me nuts more than the players.

 

[mgb]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

This is absolutely retarded unless they will start calling them on the "superstars" of the league. If they don't then its a rule that will just demonstrate more and more how Stars are treated in the league and what they can get away with compared to role players.

I agree. As long as they call it on all players, rookies or vets alike. Also I get tired of some coaches being able to get away with complaints to the point of the ref asking if they are ok now?

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Why are we complaining? This will mean that Kobe Bryant lasts about ten minutes tops in any game.

Wait a minute - what does that small print say: "not applicable to Kobe Bryant"...?

 

[crandc]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Threatening or running towards an official is one thing. But how do you remove emotion? Games are played on high adrenaline, they are often close and tense. They are not played by robots. How do they not show emotion? Mammals are emotional creatures by nature! Do you want a league populated by Commander Data and Mr. Spock? (at least they would be smart players)

I think sports leagues should get rid of the overbright video, the constant calls for "noise", the fakery and just let the game be its own emotional experience.

 

[Wheels]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Brandon will pass up Sheeds record if he gets a T for everytime he yells "HEEEEEY" When he thinks he gets fouled.

 

[HailBlazers]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

more Sterno BS

btw, why against players so much? It's the coaches that drive me nuts more than the players.

+1x

 

[espn_hall_of_famer]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

I honestly don't see anything wrong with those listed int he post. All 4 of those listed all drive me crazy when players do them.

May be the first time I've agreed with you.

I'm in agreement 100%. I think the key is the "aggressive gestures" part of the that one listed. This has NOTHING to do with positive emotions. This has to do with players portraying violent acts on the floor. Similar swiping your finger across your throat, that is implicating violence. If a ref makes a bad call and you start punching the padding under the basket (like Sheed likes to do) that should be T'd up. Obviously no ref is going to call a "T" on a fist pump or celebration fist swing. Come on guys.

That aggressive gestures is just masking what it is really trying to control. That is the Kobe, Wade, LeBron and AI's of the world that drive to the hole and make a big grunt like they're being fouled. Then coming towards a ref or looking at the ref with some incredulous look. That is 100% what this is about. Folks will comply, and it is a good thing. I'm personally tired of Wade and Kobe flinging some worthless shot into the air and then starting down a ref with their palms up disrespecting their authority.

So great job by the league in this one. It may cost Miami the championship this year with two of the biggest offenders on their roster, but they finally are getting the league set right and making these guys into role models.

 

[LittleAlex]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

I wonder if it has to do with what will be an increase in complaints against refrees during Miami Heat games?

Seriously, will anyone on the Heat foul out of a single game next season?

Will there be a single traveling call against that team?

We are going to see superstar pandering taken to a new level next year.

 

[hasoos]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

We need a new basketball league. This one is going to be a completely anal referree controlled bore show pretty soon. This pretty much just gives the NBA more leverage for refs to fuck up games.

Can anybody tell me that they aren't going to be pissed the first time their team loses a game because at some point in the game after making a great play, a player pumps his fist, and gets a T and the other team scores and that is the difference of the game? Fans will be outraged.

Another fact I just thought about is that this will hurt running teams. Running teams depend on the game being fast paced. This will increase the number of stops in the game, and stops in the flow of the game. Teams that play slow ball will benefit for sure.

 

[illmatic99]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

That is the Kobe, Wade, LeBron and AI's of the world that drive to the hole and make a big grunt like they're being fouled. Then coming towards a ref or looking at the ref with some incredulous look. That is 100% what this is about. Folks will comply, and it is a good thing. I'm personally tired of Wade and Kobe flinging some worthless shot into the air and then starting down a ref with their palms up disrespecting their authority.

Suprised you didn't include Roy in that. He's patented his voice flop.

 

[STOMP]

if they were to insist on all players acting respectful towards the refs along the lines of baseball and college hoops, I'd think the game would benefit greatly. Unfortunately as others have pointed out, this probably only means the NBA is going to continue to catering the officiating to their favorites (players and teams) possibly taking it to another level. Stern already openly boasts of his league's selective enforcement of the calls on actual fouls as if it's a good thing we should appreciate. It only makes sense he wants only the right players and teams to be expressing themselves/showing their passion

STOMP

 

[Wheels]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Suprised you didn't include Roy in that. He's patented his voice flop.

yeah he has, and unfortunately its a lot higher pitched sounding than others in the league.

 

[Charcoal Filtered]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Emotion is fine. Working the officials is the problem. I get tired of watching guys like Sasha Vujacic acting like they have never committed a foul. Never been fond of Lebron acting like a baby either.

 

[handiman]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Just because it's worded that way, doesn't mean it will be enforced to the letter. Gotta have the wording in place in order to attempt to enforce it. Legal wording is almost always more severe sounding than its reality... I don't see how that means they're trying to remove emotion from the game.

 

[espn_hall_of_famer]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

if they were to insist on all players acting respectful towards the refs along the lines of baseball and college hoops, I'd think the game would benefit greatly. Unfortunately as others have pointed out, this probably only means the NBA is going to continue to catering the officiating to their favorites (players and teams) possibly taking it to another level. Stern already openly boasts of his league's selective enforcement of the calls on actual fouls as if it's a good thing we should appreciate. It only makes sense he wants only the right players and teams to be expressing themselves/showing their passion

STOMP

I honestly don't think with the way they worded this that they can possibly selectively enforce it or leave the superstars out of the enforcement.

To me a foul is very subjective, as where coming off the bench during a fight or slashing a finger across your throat is very cut-and-dry. You can have video evidence that it happened and suspend or enforce the act.

You can't be LeBron or Kobe and start walking towards a ref with your palms up and an incredulous look on your face and not get called for this. There is no wiggle room that says "walking towards the refs with an agreesive manner" or "slapping your wrist in a manner that seems disprespectful". It says "walking towards the ref", "slapping your wrist", "complaining about being fouled". End of story. A ref would go on probation immediately if he didn't enforce a black-and-white rule against a star but did against non-stars. So get ready Miami.

 

[BBert]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Great. More opportunities for biased officiating. Anyone who thinks this will even the playing field is delusional. I love this game.

 

[BBert]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

ESPN, you have more trust than I do. Dare I hope you are right?

 

[Mediocre Man]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

May be the first time I've agreed with you.

I'm in agreement 100%. I think the key is the "aggressive gestures" part of the that one listed. This has NOTHING to do with positive emotions. This has to do with players portraying violent acts on the floor. Similar swiping your finger across your throat, that is implicating violence. If a ref makes a bad call and you start punching the padding under the basket (like Sheed likes to do) that should be T'd up. Obviously no ref is going to call a "T" on a fist pump or celebration fist swing. Come on guys.

That aggressive gestures is just masking what it is really trying to control. That is the Kobe, Wade, LeBron and AI's of the world that drive to the hole and make a big grunt like they're being fouled. Then coming towards a ref or looking at the ref with some incredulous look. That is 100% what this is about. Folks will comply, and it is a good thing. I'm personally tired of Wade and Kobe flinging some worthless shot into the air and then starting down a ref with their palms up disrespecting their authority.

So great job by the league in this one. It may cost Miami the championship this year with two of the biggest offenders on their roster, but they finally are getting the league set right and making these guys into role models.

You should have waiting to deduct a point from me until after you read this

 

[Rhal]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

I'm guessing these:

Can you imagine what would have happened if the Refs called a Tech on Roy after he made that shot? There would have been a Riot and the Refs would have been hung from the rafters.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Can you imagine what would have happened if the Refs called a Tech on Roy after he made that shot? There would have been a Riot and the Refs would have been hung from the rafters.

The rules are referring to people like Sheed who used to punch the sky when he got a fould called on him. Not for celebrating

 

[Paxil]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

I am all for it. NBA is the biggest collection of whiners I have ever seen. They are trying to get rid of emotion about calls... not Rudy raising 3 etc... This is good for the Blazers since we tend to do less whining that other teams in recent years... though Roy is stepping up the grunts and arm flailing.

 

[hasoos]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

Ian weighs in over at SI: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/ian_thomsen/09/24/technicals/index.html?eref=sihp

 

[hasoos]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

I am all for it. NBA is the biggest collection of whiners I have ever seen. They are trying to get rid of emotion about calls... not Rudy raising 3 etc... This is good for the Blazers since we tend to do less whining that other teams in recent years... though Roy is stepping up the grunts and arm flailing.

You are incorrect. Fist pumping, which is often done after a big play, is illegal. Many celebrations, are illegal. Most of these rules are subject to the referee's decision, much like the hanging on the rim rule.

I bet the first time in a Blazer game where some of our guys get called for some bullshit and somebody like Kobe doesn't get called for the same shit you will change your mind about this. In fact, I would have to bet that the first game where a game is decided by one of these calls will be a call to arms for the fans who were short changed. Let players decide the games. Not the refs.

 

[THE HCP]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

My boy Bayless gets pretty pumped after a hoop and 1! Hope they don't T him up for screamin into our cameras!

 

[espn_hall_of_famer]

Re: WTF?! Stern trying to remove emotion from games

You are incorrect. Fist pumping, which is often done after a big play, is illegal. Many celebrations, are illegal.

Do you have a link for this? Are you referring to another rule? I've never seen anything that "fist pumping" or celebrations or anything dealing with the emotions of a great play being in the refs hands.

The topic of this conversation was on the recent rules that just came out which make aggresive acts like simulating punching someone or punching the padding under the basket in response to the refs. There is obviously nothing regarding "fist pumps" just because a guy is showing some emotion over making a 3-point basket or something like that.