Miller signs qualifier

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We are so over the top on Glass it is funny to me. YES he is awful, but for the love of god he makes 1.45 mill not 5 mill per. Send him to the minors and save 950 K if we want to. That would leave 500 K on the cap for him. That is an option, one that I just don't think they will take. They like Glass, and we need to deal with it. Much bigger things to focus on.

As for the goalie, no point in mentioning him Prod. He is the best player on the team. He makes what he makes. Is what it is.

It comes down to the D. We made our own bed by resigning Girardi AND Staal, clearly should have been one or the other. Now we are in a spot that we must move Yandle or Klein IMO. The honest issue is neither one of them has a big enough cap hit this season to be a game changer if dealt. 2.9 for Klein and 2.62 for Yandle is not huge money cleared for either. YES I do think we need to move one because we have 8 dmen, because we need another forwward, and because we are so tight against the cap. So I would deal one, but the truth is neither one of them gives us this major room since both have AAV's under 3 mill.

The clear issue to me is having G and Staal both in the mid 5's cap hit wise. Truth is if we won't resign Yandle, and to have ANOTHER dman in the 5's cap hit wise is going to be very tough to do and have a balanced team, maybe we should move Yandle. It really is a balancing act right now. This season is huge for us, and maybe our last great chance to win a cup with this group, although maybe we can squeeze another year or two out of it with the right moves. Yandle here for a full camp and then season I think would be really good for us. Plus he would only clear 2.62 mill in cap space if moved. BUT the flip side is do we really want to resign him and have G AND Staal AND Yandle AND McD all making 4.7 mill or more against the cap?

It really is a slippery slope. Do you stay on the course to go all in to win a cup, and if you do I think you keep Yandle this year. Or do you focus on the future a little and say are we really resigning Yandle next summer for a cap hit in the 5's when we have all these other dmen locked up already. It will be really hard to resign Yandle next summer, not because we won't have any money, we can find the money with expiring deals, but because do we really want all those bigger money dmen locked up AND have a goalie with an 8.5 mill cap hit? How are we going to have balance.

We talk a lot about Klein, but the real truth is the smart play may be to deal Yandle because I just don't see how it makes sense team balance wise to resign him next summer unless we can move G or Staal. That's the reality of the situation if you are taking an honest look at the team right now. Dealing Yandle maybe means a little step back this season, but if you add a decent R shot forward by dealing Yandle maybe it isn't a step back at all because we are more balanced and would still have a top D. Plus our cap situation gets better for next season.

No easy answer, but I have to think some dman deal is coming for sure based on the team makeup right this second. We'll see...
 
I'm mentioning the goalie because if we want to have the highest paid goalie, which is fine by me and he deserves, then we shouldn't also have the highest paid d core while getting shut out in home game 7s. Everything is connected and we missed a big opportunity to improve our situation on qualifier deadline day. But this discussion is going in circles at this point so I'll let this go.
 
I don't disagree. Is what it is. Not sure Miller would have signed for longer anyway unless we really bumped it up. So it may be a moot point, but who knows.

All I know is the NHL cap is too restrictive AND we need to move a dman since we won't play with 8. Should be Klein I think, but if we don't think we'll be able to resign Yandle (or if we don't want another bigger cap hit dman locked up long term) I would move him now.

NHL cap...love it...hail Canada...:).
 
The increases in the cap the past two years have been far less than expected due to the very weak Canadian dollar. Not sure that anyone saw that coming, or should have seen that coming. I think most GM's and capologists would have had the cap at around 76-79M for this season if you had asked them two years back. Think they would have said 75M if you asked them 10 months ago.

Signing G and Staal to those contracts at that time wasn't such a bad thought process IMO, but its very easy for us to say that it wasn't the right thing now, in hindsight, with the cap at this low number. We do still have the overall best D in the league though, with Hank behind them, most teams would gladly trade our cap issues for our D/Goalie.

With the constraints we are working with, NYR have done a great job so far. Step is going to get his 6.75-7.25 and we will be all set.

Think we will carry all eight D-men for a little bit, and see what happens, and hope that another team is desperate for a D-man after training camp when someone gets injured or doesn't pan out, then we will move one of them, freeing up enough injury cap room for us to get through the season. Not sure if it would be a move of one of our established D or one of the 7-8 guys, but as other posters have said, we wont carry all of them through the season, and I don't think any of them would make it through waivers...

I like what Gorton did, this is pretty much the best we could expect at this point.

Miller and Etem on one year contracts should definitely have something to prove, looking for pretty big numbers from them this year.
 
Personally, I don't think it takes hindsight to say signing G AND Staal to long deals with cap hits in the 5's was going to put us in a tough spot cap wise. G was resigned 16 months ago +/-. Staal was resigned 4 months ago +/-. I think the trends were in place at that time and we all knew the cap wasn't going to jump way up.

I also went back and forth on Staal. I was against resigning him big time. Then I flipped and thought it was a solid move. Now I realize I was right the first time and we never should have resigned him given the fact that G, McD, and Klein are all signed long term. And adding Yandle made it even that much worse. Now having Yandle makes the Staal resigning look bad IMO.

That is why as much as I think Yandle can add, dealing him now might be the right play. Either that or play the season out, hopefully win a cup, and then he walks because I don't see how we can lock up another dman for 5 mill + per...that would be crazy.

I also don't see anyway we start the season with 8 dmen on the opening night roster. We have 13 forwards also. I don't see us carrying 23 players.
 
A trade almost has to happen to alleviate the D problem. I don't see klein bringing back a top 6 rw unless packaged with something else. Yandle, however would bring that type of player back and more. Can't see how they possibly sign Yandle next year with the other contract situations coming up which is why I think he goes. Still hoping slats to gorton can talk boyle into a trade somewhere he'd like to go as klein is a better fit for us especially from a cap perspective. I can see both big mac and skjei in the starting lineup in that scenario as the 5th and 6th D and we would be fine. Come playoff time they will both have the experience and be ready. This team has too much talent plus what they get back in the aforementioned trade(s) to not make the playoffs
 
I don't think we would be fine with two totally unproven kids as our 5th and 6th dmen this year. Most reports say Skjei needs some time in Hartford this year and then we'll see as the season progresses. And McIlrath is a question mark still for sure. I want him here to start, but not as the 5th dman.

So I don't think having those two as the 5th and 6th dmen to start is even a small discussion point, and thankfully so right now.
 
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theProdigy223 said:
I'm mentioning the goalie because if we want to have the highest paid goalie, which is fine by me and he deserves, then we shouldn't also have the highest paid d core while getting shut out in home game 7s. Everything is connected and we missed a big opportunity to improve our situation on qualifier deadline day. But this discussion is going in circles at this point so I'll let this go.
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Quoted for truth.

The cap isn't restrictive because it's the same rules for everyone in the league, so it doesn't "restrict" us any more or less than it "restricts" another team. At least with a Cap a GM has to earn his money instead of just signing free agents every year to make up for mistakes.
 
NYR31 said:
Quoted for truth.

The cap isn't restrictive because it's the same rules for everyone in the league, so it doesn't "restrict" us any more or less than it "restricts" another team. At least with a Cap a GM has to earn his money instead of just signing free agents every year to make up for mistakes.
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Everyone understand the premise of why the cap is in the place. That has nothing to do with the restrictive nature of the current cap number which for various reasons hasn't risen as high as some would've thought. It's not a matter of wanting to run out and sign every free agent available or the big market teams severely outspending so many other teams. It's a matter of being able to keep the team you have together.
 
Nailed it Mess. That's what it is all about. You can manage your cap pretty much perfectly and still not be able to keep your team together for any great length of time outside of 4 or 5 main players. It is too restrictive IMO for the whole NHL not just us. That is why every year the better teams have to deal off core players. It isn't good for the sport in the long run.

100% there should be a cap in the NHL, I fully support it, but it's way too restrictive and low. They need to tweak the rules to allow some flexibility to resign your own core players.

Just my opinion.
 
chuckd3534 said:
Nailed it Mess. That's what it is all about. You can manage your cap pretty much perfectly and still not be able to keep your team together for any great length of time outside of 4 or 5 main players.
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This is true and nobody would debate it. The purpose of my original post was to point out that, in my opinion, we are NOT managing our cap pretty much perfectly. Having the highest paid goalie on top of the highest paid defense, preventing us from upgrading an offense that crashed and burned when it mattered most, is not good cap management. We could not even afford to give a former first round pick a bridge deal. I cant recall the last time that happened. We'd all love for the cap to be higher, and it should be, but focus should be spent on working with the cap that is currently in place. And right now (in my opinion), the front office is not being creative enough to manage it. But we shall see if more moves are coming, training camp is still two months away.
 
theProdigy223 said:
This is true and nobody would debate it. The purpose of my original post was to point out that, in my opinion, we are NOT managing our cap pretty much perfectly. Having the highest paid goalie on top of the highest paid defense, preventing us from upgrading an offense that crashed and burned when it mattered most, is not good cap management. We could not even afford to give a former first round pick a bridge deal. I cant recall the last time that happened. We'd all love for the cap to be higher, and it should be, but focus should be spent on working with the cap that is currently in place. And right now (in my opinion), the front office is not being creative enough to manage it. But we shall see if more moves are coming, training camp is still two months away.
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They have had four straight seasons of deep playoffs runs. A cup final appearance and two ECF appearances. The past is the past but in recent years management has done the best it can. You can bring another forward in here and how do you guarantee he's going to light it up in the playoffs?
 
if GM's are willing to give out those large contracts that "restrict" them, then that's the effect they have to live with when others have to be traded to have a full team. And as long as these top players stay in the NHL the league as a whole won't be affected. Once these players start leaving to other leagues you can begin to say it's affecting the league.
 
To me the one move you can question is signing Staal long term after you already had Girardi, Klein, and McD locked up long term. I won't even mention Hank, but the D thing is the issue. Staal should not have been resigned based on the dmen we already had signed long term.

And for the record, I am not saying we have manged our cap perfectly, I am saying even if a team does they are still F'd after a few years because the NHL cap is ridiculous.
 
NBA cap and the NHL cap are essentially the same number this year. NBA has a max 15 man roster. The NHL has a minimum 20 man roster. The NBA allows you to go over the cap to resign your own players (Bird rights). The NHL is a rock hard cap. The NBA allows you an exception every season so you can actually try and improve your team. The NHL is a rock hard cap. The NBA allows you to sign players over the cap for the vet minimum. The NHL is a rock hard cap. The NBA has a big luxury tax for teams that go over the cap. The NBA has a huge luxury tax for teams that go over the cap consecutive years.

Not saying the NBA cap is the model, but the NHL needs to loosen up a little to allow teams to try and keep more of their core together, at least RFA's. Put a stiff tax in over certain % above the cap. Do something, because it is crazy right now IMO.

Cap barely goes up, 71 mill for at least 20 players. Way too low.
 
ran into this website. not sure how accurate it is but shows us as 5th in Cap for defenseman and 2nd for Cap for Goalies while 26th in Cap for Forwards. That's Sather's doing, no one else's.

http://www.spotrac.com/nhl/cap/
 
What top 6 W are even available that we are hypothetically trading for? Seems you'd be robbing Peter to pay Paul by trading an important player like Yandle and then losing offense on the backend. Whether they keep him next year or not he's too good a bargain plus a part they haven't had, to get rid of imo.
 
I like Yandle, but he is slated to be our 3rd pair L dman. That's the reality of it. On top of that do you resign him long term at over 5 mill per? SO we have Staal AND G AND Yandle AND McD all at 4.7 mill or more per long term? If we are being honest that simply does not make sense.

And I agree 31...the Staal deal is the one that hurts now IMO. Should have been Staal OR Girardi long term, not both. To me that is pretty clear now.
 
what top 6 wingers are "available" doesn't matter, because trades lots of trades happen where we (fans) had no idea were in the works and those players were available.
 
We're spending only about 1m more on forwards than Phoenix is? Yikes. I know that's not how you should judge the quality of a team's unit, but it's still disconcerting.

I guess we don't have THE most expensive D like I had previously heard, but we're certainly up there. Only about a mil behind the leader (congrats Subban and your ridiculous 9m hit, you bring the trophy home to MTL).

And regarding the "who's available"discussion, I would have been perfectly find trading Klein at the draft for picks, then signing a guy like Williams on that very friendly deal he signed in Wash. But we didnt have the space to even be in the discussion. And he'd be as close to a playoff guarantee as you'd be able to find.

Again, it doesnt have to be a bona fide superstar. Like I said previously, Boyes and Semin are both out there who are right shots and could be a fit if we had even a sliver of space. But we dont, and a large part of that is the imbalance shown in those numbers 31 posted. Let's hope they figure out a way to make this team a little more balanced.
 
People are too obsessed with what the defense are making. The cap hits aren't that bad. As much as we love him we know the cap hit that's making things tougher and that's Hanks. He's just over a millon more than #2 Bobrovsky and 1.5 million more than #3 Rask. Another million to spend out of that position and a trade of a say a Klein and you would have the flexibility of adding another damn good forward.
 
Staal blows, doubtful another team would have been so generous to Marc if the Rangers let him test free agency waters. Staal has 131 points in 540 games and zero physical presence with a 6'4" willowy 207 pound frame that abhors contact. While the ranking of cap towards forwards is certainly influenced by the youth infusion last year the irony is that AV's system demands that the forwards get back and aggressively play defense so not only do the defenders get all the money, they get a higher ranking thanks to the help from the forwards.

I still think AV should move Stepan to RW unless he busts his ass in the offseason to improve on faceoffs - 44% doesn't cut it on a top line. I think Diaz will be sent down to take Hunwick's role as an injury fill-in and Klein/Yandle both stay. The Rangers can't worry about losing guys next year when the focus should be winning the Cup this upcoming year, Hank and his deservedly earned money are getting older.
 
Messiah717 said:
People are too obsessed with what the defense are making. The cap hits aren't that bad. As much as we love him we know the cap hit that's making things tougher and that's Hanks. He's just over a millon more than #2 Bobrovsky and 1.5 million more than #3 Rask. Another million to spend out of that position and a trade of a say a Klein and you would have the flexibility of adding another damn good forward.
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I disagree Mess. YES the individual cap hits are fine for the dmen, that is not the issue IMO. The issue is we have too many locked up for bigger money long term. Just because their AAV's are all good doesn't mean it is good to have all of them signed for a long time with bigger cap hits.

It should have been Staal OR Girardi not both. Not with Klein locked up, and McD locked up, and Skjei coming up, and McIlrath needing to at least get a chance, and now you add in Yandle (who is the 3rd LD because of Staal being here) and it is too much.

Once we locked up Girardi we never should have locked up Staal long term. To me that was the one cap mistake we have made based on the rest of the roster we have, and the balance we need upfront.
 
Staal does not blow. Yet, I do think the defense is overrated around the league. They make a lot of turnovers for the credit they get. It was dumb of them to give Girardi and Staal NTC's. No reason to give any player that unless it's Hank. If you don't want to play in MSG without, too bad. They'll find a new home for you. However, I do think a lot of players will waive their NTC if they are told they team wants to get rid of them.

A lot of our fans don't realize this team is quietly rebuilding. Last year they played three rookies in Fast, Miller and Hayes. This year you could very well make the case they will play two in McIlrath and Lindberg and a kid who is really like a rookie in Etem. Next year it will be Skjei. So basically, you are talking about 7 young kids added to a team. Maybe 8 if you count Buchnevich. That could be called a quiet rebuild. Though, I'll believe them not screwing over Lindberg and McIlrath when I see it because Av has this stupid love affair with Glass and Boyle.
 
I agree 31 you don't often hear about trades until they happen, i'm just curious as to what names we'd legitimately look at and could possibly be dealt by current teams. And as for Yandle Chuck, it dosen't matter where he slots on D it's about what he brings that the others can't. He's arguably the most talented blueliner they have as McDonagh has flatlined and just dosen't have those offensive gifts 93 does.
 
McDonaugh had two bad shoulder injuries that I'm sure took a toll. I expect a solid bounce back from him this coming season.
 
That's fair Mess although i think we overrate him a bit at times in here.
 
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