More metadata on man-made climate change

[Eastoff]

food shortages caused by using our food to make ethanol.

Food waste could be used for making ethanol, I don't hear anti-green people championing that idea. Such as corn stalks. And I agree that using corn to make ethanol and not food is stupid. But not making fuels from plant material entirely is shortsighted.

 

[Denny Crane]

Food waste could be used for making ethanol, I don't hear anti-green people championing that idea. Such as corn stalks. And I agree that using corn to make ethanol and not food is stupid. But not making fuels from plant material entirely is shortsighted.

I don't have a problem with it as long as we aren't wasting taxpayer money on it.

 

[oldguy]

If you reject that man is causing the Global Warming, er, Climate Change, then, Mr. Sceintist, you will never receive federal funding for the rest of your life. The IRS will audit your tax status every year until you die. NSA will monitor your whereabouts by GPS, and the Attorney General will tap your phone lines to find out who is filling your head with that garbage. (Because you are a risk to national security.) All the data collected will be held at the Utah Data Center.

My God have mercy on your soul.

Go Blazers

 

[Eastoff]

I don't have a problem with it as long as we aren't wasting taxpayer money on it.

agreed with oil and gas as well?

 

[Eastoff]

If you reject that man is causing the Global Warming, er, Climate Change, then, Mr. Sceintist, you will never receive federal funding for the rest of your life. The IRS will audit your tax status every year until you die. NSA will monitor your whereabouts by GPS, and the Attorney General will tap your phone lines to find out who is filling your head with that garbage. (Because you are a risk to national security.) All the data collected will be held at the Utah Data Center.

My God have mercy on your soul.

Go Blazers

If you do accept it, they will monitor you anyway. What's your point?

 

[MarAzul]

If you do accept it, they will monitor you anyway. What's your point?

All of these clues and fears you seem to have gathered are all of real recent current events. For an old guy you are pretty darn quick!

 

[Denny Crane]

agreed with oil and gas as well?

Taxpayer money doesn't fund oil and gas, but sure.

 

[MarAzul]

So are you suggesting that human overpopulation is the root problem? Dare I ask what you would suggest is the solution?

Well we could avoid adopting a plan to set us on the path to a population number that has been known to be over population for many many years.
As the Nation that consumes the highest percentage of resources per person of any nation, we certainly should not plan to double and set the tone that population growth is good! If the world does follow this lead with their own growth, following the leader, we are all doomed. I don't know what the sustainable, high quality of life population number is for this nation and or the world, but we damn well better know before we plan to exceed it.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

On a pure economic basis, the market drives the right things to be done. Like McDonalds serving food in landfill-friendly packaging.

Checkmate.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Taxpayer money doesn't fund oil and gas, but sure.

It does indirectly through the military.

 

[blazerboy30]

Where has anyone said that humankind is controlling the temperature?

Having an effect on something does not mean control.

Then this point is moot.

 

[Denny Crane]

It does indirectly through the military.

It's probably not a smart thing for the military to buy it's oil and gas from overseas, so I guess it has to buy it here or drill for and refine it for itself. I wouldn't be unhappy with the latter.

 

[Eastoff]

Taxpayer money doesn't fund oil and gas, but sure.

tax exemptions aren't subsidies?

 

[blazerboy30]

I also can't tell you what color pants you're wearing. But that doesn't mean everyone in the world is ignorant on the subject. There are Blazerboy pant experts. I trust them to give me the right color.

You believe man is influencing climate change.
You believe it is warming and causing the ice caps to melt.

Therefore you believe man can influence warming of the earth.

If the earth started to cool, and headed towards a cyclical ice age, would you be saying that we should be doing what we can to warm the earth, since you feel we have the ability to do so?

 

[Denny Crane]

tax exemptions aren't subsidies?

Nope. They don't get any special tax exemptions anyhow. They're treated no different than any business, including the corner laundromat.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

carbon dioxide in the air will only continue to rise as south america deforests and china keeps burning fuel

if oceans rise 50 feet, the government will bail out the insurance companies and keep all the skyscraper and seafront property owners satiated with mounds of cash for the new waterfront, wherever that my be, the rivers will dry up and create stifling humidity, and the poor will die by the hundreds of millions

same old same old

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Nope. They don't get any special tax exemptions anyhow. They're treated no different than any business, including the corner laundromat.

Yep, they are totally equal, due to the corner laundromat's excessive lobbying presence in DC.

 

[Denny Crane]

Yep, they are totally equal, due to the corner laundromat's excessive lobbying presence in DC.

Due to the simple fact that taxable income (for business) is equal to gross income minus expenses.

They may lobby for other reasons, but then why shouldn't they? They have both the right to assemble and to redress their grievances to the government.

It's faulty logic to think that because they get taxed $100 instead of $110 that they're getting some mythical $10 tax break that's some mythical actual expense by the taxpayer.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

What was that about only taking economic matters into consideration?

 

[Denny Crane]

What was that about only taking economic matters into consideration?

How can they take purely economic matters into consideration if the govt. is regulating them? Can't drill in ANWR by decree. Can't run a pipeline to New Orleans by decree. Better get a lobbyist or your interests will all be gone by decree.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

How can they take purely economic matters into consideration if the govt. is regulating them? Can't drill in ANWR by decree. Can't run a pipeline to New Orleans by decree. Better get a lobbyist or your interests will all be gone by decree.

Are you kidding, all they do is consider the world in economic terms. They can't drill in a wildlife refuge, which means profit loss and profit loss alone to them. Regulations win.

 

[Denny Crane]

Are you kidding, all they do is consider the world in economic terms. They can't drill in a wildlife refuge, which means profit loss and profit loss alone to them. Regulations win.

They feel the need to hire lobbyists. That's consideration of political terms.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homestead_principle

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

They feel the need to hire lobbyists. That's consideration of political terms.

If they didn't want to make more money by doing things that the American people might disapprove of, they wouldn't need to hire lobbyists. They're "considering" in political terms, but for economic reasons. It's not like they spend hundreds of millions of dollars on lobbyists for the good of the public.

Where is maxiep to say "The only purpose of a corporation is and should be to make money" when you need him?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homestead_principle

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manifest_destiny

 

[Denny Crane]

It seems 82% of the American people APPROVE of the keystone xl pipeline. Have another claim?

Who said the only purpose of a corporation is to make money? Its purpose is to benefit its shareholders and not necessarily anyone else.


http://www.forbes.com/sites/brighammccown/2013/06/07/keystone-approval-rate-reaches-new-high/

Harris Poll: 82% of Americans Believe Keystone XL is in the National Interest.

http://truth-out.org/buzzflash/comm...-sf-fundraiser-blames-middle-class-priorities

In fact, a just released Pew Poll finds that nearly 2/3's of Americans support the construction of the pipeline. Only 23% oppose it, according to the poll. Even given inevitable flaws in polls, Obama has not shown the kind of courage to run against the political wind with those sort of lopsided margins.

 

[Denny Crane]

To be more precise, the purpose of a corporation is to provide a vehicle for investment that shields the investors from liability.

People continue to invest in Amazon (an example), even though its profits are declining. They invested in twitter and Facebook for years while there were no positive cash flows at all.

People invest in utility companies for the dividends, not necessarily expecting growth or higher profits.

Fwiw

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

It seems 82% of the American people APPROVE of the keystone xl pipeline. Have another claim?

Who said the only purpose of a corporation is to make money? Its purpose is to benefit its shareholders and not necessarily anyone else.


http://www.forbes.com/sites/brighammccown/2013/06/07/keystone-approval-rate-reaches-new-high/

Harris Poll: 82% of Americans Believe Keystone XL is in the National Interest.

http://truth-out.org/buzzflash/comm...-sf-fundraiser-blames-middle-class-priorities

In fact, a just released Pew Poll finds that nearly 2/3's of Americans support the construction of the pipeline. Only 23% oppose it, according to the poll. Even given inevitable flaws in polls, Obama has not shown the kind of courage to run against the political wind with those sort of lopsided margins.

Polls. Barf. All those do are prove that the discourse on a particular issue has been swayed in the most profitable direction. People approve of the pipeline? Obama is close to approving it? Some PR guru (http://keystone-xl.com/) and a couple hundred lobbyists all get bonuses.

And for what? Helping the U.S.A. ween its dependance on foreign oil?

From the article you quoted:

...it will only create a few thousand short-term jobs more or less. Furthermore, the tar sand extraction process in Canada is what will cause the devastating impact on carbon release, not the pipeline itself. It is the Keystone XL Pipeline that will facilitate, at a lower transportation cost, the transfer of this heavy oil to Houston thus making it profitable to proceed with its environmentally disastrous production. Furthermore, the oil is not directed at lowering US gas prices. It will be sold on the world spot market to the highest bidders, whoever will provide the biggest profits to the oil companies.

 

[Denny Crane]

I see. If 80%+ poll different than your wishes, ignore it or belittle it and claim you know better what they really want.

Sorry, not buying it.

I don't remember the pipeline ever being sold as a way to get us more cheap oil. It was all about the jobs constructing it, maintaining it, refining the oil, etc.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

oh and this:

"Opponents responded by questioning the legitimacy of the Harris Poll since it was paid for by the American Petroleum Institute."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/brighammccown/2013/06/07/keystone-approval-rate-reaches-new-high/

 

[Denny Crane]

OMG! Debate is happening in public in a "democracy!"

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

I see. If 80%+ poll different than your wishes, ignore it or belittle it and claim you know better what they really want.

Sorry, not buying it.

You really think polls reflect what people "really want"? You really think polls can report on the subtlety of any argument, especially one with so many ramifications to so many pieces of a larger puzzle?

Sorry, not buying it.

I don't remember the pipeline ever being sold as a way to get us more cheap oil. It was all about the jobs constructing it, maintaining it, refining the oil, etc.

http://keystone-xl.com/about/energy-security/