OT My Sis Is An Angry Lib

[Propagandist]

So, no one has the freedom to have a different opinion than you, or you lable them, and degrade them.

You just proved my point.

Upon further reflection, maybe I was a little heavy handed. I actually love this conversation. Mostly because I always think after laying out the inclusion vs exclusion, love vs tough lough, etc argument, people would be like oh yeah, I agree. But no one ever does. I will never understand us humans. So it goes.

 

[ABM]

That's right. And I'll be here if you ever want to start debating.

barfo

Heh, you always are.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Upon further reflection, maybe I was a little heavy handed. I actually love this conversation. Mostly because I always think after laying out the inclusion vs exclusion, love vs tough lough, etc argument, people would be like oh yeah, I agree. But no one ever does. I will never understand us humans. So it goes.

There are parts of what you said I agree with. Like Trump... I seriously do not get it, and it's not that I think all of his "political stances" are bad, because some of them, I'm like ok that seems alright. I legit don't get why Evangelicals were so enamored with him, why they can't see that even if he espouses similar views to them, his language and life doesn't at all match up with what they say believe.

Climate Change is an interesting issue, I don't know if I 100% agree with you there in terms of how people feel, but your opinion has its validity.

The problem is even in this little microcosm of society voicing opinions, concerns, etc even just asking questions can be met with very heavy-handed replies, and it can get people to not even engage, or to take the opposing view just because they feel like they've been attacked. I've had people on here literally tell me because they found a decade-old link suggesting something different that whatever data I put out there didn't matter they were going to take the side they agreed with and said basically I wasn't capable of researching a subject unless I agreed with them... Like how do you have a conversation if right off the bat you're view is right and mine is wrong, and whatever information I find doesn't matter? I only bring that up, because I think some times, that's how arguments seem to be, on important topics too often it's an I'm right, you're wrong.

 

[oldfisherman]

Upon further reflection, maybe I was a little heavy handed. I actually love this conversation. Mostly because I always think after laying out the inclusion vs exclusion, love vs tough lough, etc argument, people would be like oh yeah, I agree. But no one ever does. I will never understand us humans. So it goes.

Thank you. I highly respect your taking time to reflect on this. If more people were open to a free exchange of two way information, on equal terms, we would have a better understanding of each other. And have fewer conflicts.

Few topics are black and white. Seldom is one side 100% right, and the other side 100% wrong. The best solution is often somewhere in the middle ground.

Calling someones opinion stupid will close the door to debate and an exchange of info. And push the other person away from your opinions. Regardless of what barfo thinks.

I have had people give me info that changed my mind on a topic. But calling my original opinion stupid, labeling me, or degrading me is NOT how it happens.

 

[CupWizier]

It all makes sense

Wait, did your mother also have a wooden leg

No, but she drove a Kia Soul.

 

[Hobbesarable]

Honestly, it's always been pretty normal that in our family we don't talk politics with each other at all... I have a couple of brother in-laws who like to get into it and sometimes try to start it with me, but honestly, I only talk politics in person with people I'm close to and usually in small groups or one on one.

The problem is, and you see it every day. In arguments, you never really win. You only lose, because both sides almost always end up pushed further apart. No one is going to convince us that our convictions are wrong, only experiences will change our opinions.

I enjoy friendly conversation and discourse, and respectful disagreements can be engaging. Just chances are all an argument will do is further entrench someone in their position, because whether it's meant as a personal affront it will be taken that way.

I will engage in an occasional discussion, but I do not go out of my way looking for arguments. I converse with a lot of different people in my job position and I would rather relax once I am home. That's my time to decompress and love life.

I'm not looking to change someone's mind about a particular subject or point-of-view anymore. I'm more interested in having a conversation where we can civilly discuss our points-of-view and understand a little more about each other. Personally, it's that sincere connection making a conversation worthwhile. If someone wants to argue and be belligerent about it, then I will just look at them, wait for them to finish their diatribe and simply excuse myself politely from the conversation.

 

[riverman]

My mother was a hamster and my father smelt of elderberries.

barfo

never let hamsters fuck under an elderberry tree or on your PBJ sandwich fixings

 

[calvin natt]

Both sides have very extreme views. But for the most part, far right people acknowledge your freedom to have a different opinion then theirs.

While the far left takes the position that you must agree with them, support, and validate their views. Or everything you believe in is wrong, even unrelated topics.

Crazy talk

 

[H.C.]

As mentioned, I refuse to talk about politics, period, with her. I want to enjoy her as my sister...as a person. She just has so much hate for Trump, she can't help herself venting to me. I'll absolutely listen, but I've since refrained from response. I ask if we could just change the subject and talk about the beautiful trails near The Dalles. I totally understand she (and most of you) hates Trump. Seriously, though, do we really want to destroy relationships over him? Chances are, he won't last past next year. Conversely, (family/friends) relationships are for a lifetime.

This is the problem.
But if you don't see it, it's not worth typing out why. Simply because you never will.

Makes me sorry for even responding to this thread.

 

[Hoopguru]

Thank you. I highly respect your taking time to reflect on this. If more people were open to a free exchange of two way information, on equal terms, we would have a better understanding of each other. And have fewer conflicts.

Few topics are black and white. Seldom is one side 100% right, and the other side 100% wrong. The best solution is often somewhere in the middle ground.

Calling someones opinion stupid will close the door to debate and an exchange of info. And push the other person away from your opinions. Regardless of what barfo thinks.

I have had people give me info that changed my mind on a topic. But calling my original opinion stupid, labeling me, or degrading me is NOT how it happens.

Very well said and true.
I feel I'm responsible to not only be open minded and receptive to other points of views, along with being respectful and civil, but the most important mission we all should consider is how we coach our little nuggets, (kids) and grandkids in this area. And if you don't have either maybe a neighbor kid or relative.

 

[Hoopguru]

My dad was a staunch Republican that Clint Eastwood and Charlton Heston could love. I turned out to be a Democrat, a moderate liberal.

My folks were staunch union democrats that would be much moire moderate these days as they would support some of the social issues.
I was initially a demo and still do vote for some democrats, I became and independent a number of years back, Im a fiscal conservative with liberal view points on many issues. I also have some conservative view points as well.
I was raised in a society/culture where people were much more receptive to having friends that differed from you politically. Its sad to see that somewhat fading away. I blame the media for selling hype and hate.

 

[Lanny]

It's as if she thinks you get to vote or something, isn't it? It's as if she's afraid you are going to vote - again - for someone who will harm both you and her.



I know, right? Having your opinions challenged is not something you'd want to spend time on.



Not in my family per se, but there's a guy on a message board who thinks if he closes his eyes, covers his ears, and chants 'abortion bad, Trump good', everything will work out fine.

barfo

Only one guy?

 

[ABM]

I know, right? Having your opinions challenged is not something you'd want to spend time on.

Actually, I'm very much the debater of the family. And, as you may have noticed, I have no problem sharing my opinions in these parts. I just get a bit weary engaging with all the anger.

 

[MARIS61]

I've heard that, and it is interesting. My mother always says her liberal friends act like she's a moron...

What I see is this...let's use examples (not to argue them, but to prove a point!)!

Climate change: So science say shit is getting bad, melting ice, rising sea levels, animals dying, desertification, etc. Liberals see it as a real existential threat; conservatives talk of natural cycles or deny it or talk about the oil industry or something bad about Priuses. See the difference? Liberals the science is saying we're going to die! We need to all work together! Conservatives deny the science (wtf!) and say something snarky when it snows. There is concern and a let's-tackle-this-problem on one side and a willful ignorance on the other.

Trump: Trump tweets and talks and we see it. Liberals are like damn, dude is racist, sexist, and inarticulate. Conservatives are like nah, he's the least racist guy, likes women the most, and the teleprompter broke. Liberals here are reading and listening. Conservatives are lying.

The border: children have been separated from their parents holy fucking shit. Liberals are like get them back with their goddamn parents and treat them like humans. Conservatives are like their parents shouldn't have tried to cross the border illegally. Hard not to look down on victim-blaming sociopaths.

I can keep going forever but what it really comes down to is: inclusion versus exclusion. For the most part liberals are looking out for others and conservatives are looking out for themselves.

For the most part liberals are being manipulated to hate their countrymen and conservatives are thinking for themselves.

 

[Propagandist]

For the most part liberals are being manipulated to hate their countrymen and conservatives are thinking for themselves.

Is that why you post so many articles and conspiracy theories, freethinker?

 

[MARIS61]

People can have strong convictions

Unless they’re illegal aliens in sanctuary cities.

 

[Chris Craig]

Unless they’re illegal aliens in sanctuary cities.

Nah, those people can have strong convictions too

 

[julius]

My sister is an angry drunk.

 

[MARIS61]

Nah, those people can have strong convictions too

Doesn’t matter, they release them anyway.

 

[Shaboid]

I don't have any sisters.

 

[Lanny]

For the most part liberals are being manipulated to hate their countrymen and conservatives are thinking for themselves.

Ha ha ha, perfect example of bullshit.

 

[calvin natt]

For the most part liberals are being manipulated to hate their countrymen and conservatives are thinking for themselves.

Bot

 

[Strenuus]

For the most part liberals are being manipulated to hate their countrymen and conservatives are thinking for themselves.

Lol. I know youre a character and you are not to be taken seriously, but at least live in some sembelence of reality as the character.

 

[MARIS61]

Bot

See? You were programmed to say that.

 

[Lanny]

See? You were programmed to say that.

Us Liberals are a product of the Deep State. We get programmed on Wednesday evenings at the meeting hall.
Anyhow, it'll all come out in the indictments which are coming any day now.

 

[Road Ratt]

You hate your own sister for being an angry lib. How sad.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Awesome, I'll set you up with her. She's a really sweet gal!

Careful barfo, your new girlfriend comes from a crazy family.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Actually, I'm very much the debater of the family. And, as you may have noticed, I have no problem sharing my opinions in these parts. I just get a bit weary engaging with all the anger.

"I support a senile narcissist conman who is destroying the planet and accommodating Nazis but what I can't bear is that people get angry at me."

 

[barfo]

Careful barfo, your new girlfriend comes from a crazy family.

Thanksgivings with ABM should be a riot.

Perhaps literally.

barfo

 

[CupWizier]

For the most part liberals are being manipulated to hate their countrymen and conservatives are thinking for themselves.

And your proof is? Is thinking for yourself copying and pasting links that are mostly bs?