Nate and Pace... again (again)

[Ed O]

Nate wants to run. He implores his guys to run. He REALLY wants to run.

He didn't run this year? He'll run next year. When he has the right roster. Or the right PG. Or the right astrological situation.

The fact is, Nate's teams never run as much as other teams.

Quibble all you want about how Pace is figured out, but looking at Nate's teams over his career, I can't believe there are still people who are willing to put his teams' slow-footed games at the feet of someone OTHER than McMillan.

I'm not a "run at all costs" guy, but I find it odd that Nate allegedly WANTS to run, but he is so bad at getting his teams to execute. That signals a failure at some level: either a dishonesty on his part or a lack of coaching on his part.

Year: Pace (NBA rank)

2000-01: Incomplete (67 games coached; I don't know how to break out Pace)
2001-02: 89.0 (24 of 29)
2002-03: 88.0 (27 of 29)
2003-04: 89.9 (15 of 29)
2004-05: 87.9 (27 of 30)
2005-06: 87.6 (28 of 30)
2006-07: 88.3 (29 of 30)
2007-08: 87.9 (29 of 30)
2008-09: 86.6 (30 of 30)
2009-10: 87.7 (30 of 30)
2010-11: 87.9 (30 of 30)

I don't think it takes a math whiz to see a pattern here... Nate's teams DO NOT RUN as much as other teams.

Is this bad? Perhaps. Perhaps not.

Is it Nate's responsibility? I think that it undoubtedly is, given how markedly consistent his teams have been.

Ed O.

 

[Reep]

It is really an oddity. The numbers don't lie. But, I have heard him on multiple time-outs imploring the team to push the pace, only to see them slog it up the court again.

Maybe it is the make-a-turnover-and-see-the-bench position he has taken many times?

 

[Nikolokolus]

I think it's a lack of coaching (willingness or ability?). He's had two years with Andre Miller who was a great up tempo point guard with the Nuggets, Sixers and Cavs and he basically defanged him. LMA is one of the best open floor power forwards in the league, Nic Batum is a glider, Wallace is one of the best slashing open court small forwards in the last ten years ... and yet we still walk the ball up.

It won't change until he's gone, I've accepted that.

 

[magnifier661]

I'm not as concerned with Nate "wanting to run" and not running, than his proclamation that stresses D. Last season, we were one of the worst defensive teams headed to the playoffs. That has to change, and it really surprises me seeing such defensive specialists like Wallace, Camby, Batum and Matthews on the team.

Frankly, I want to see a serious effort to solidify the D; especially on the perimeter penetration. Good D makes easy offense.

 

[e_blazer]

Frankly, I see the slower pace and the D problems as being intertwined. The Blazers cover for many of their shortcomings by slowing the pace down so that the opposing team has fewer possessions than they're used to having, covering to some degree for defensive lapses. Slower pace also keeps the turnovers down. I think when Nate says he wants the team to push the ball, he means that he wants to get it over the half-court line as quickly as possible so that the team can look for an early easy shot if it's there, and otherwise slow it up and go into the offense to work for an open shot later in the shot clock.

The formula has worked to produce a pretty good winning percentage even with an incredible number of injuries. Also, looking at the way the playoffs are going, it's pretty hard to argue that a quick pace is the way to go. Half-court, slow-paced games seem to be the way most of these late round games go.

That said, I love a fast break game style and I think the Blazers have the personnel to implement it more than they have in the past, but they're going to need to get better on the defensive end and at rebounding than they were at times this season. Greg Oden would help immensely with both.

 

[Ed O]

It is really an oddity. The numbers don't lie. But, I have heard him on multiple time-outs imploring the team to push the pace, only to see them slog it up the court again.

Maybe it is the make-a-turnover-and-see-the-bench position he has taken many times?

That's my thinking, too... he does LITERALLY shout for his team to push the pace. Which seems to indicate it's a failure of the players, right?

But he's coached a lot of players over the 10 years, and he gets pretty consistent results.

I think you nail it that he forms the team to be averse to running... presumably he runs his practices and makes his substitution decisions based on risk aversion, and you can't run much and take great care of the ball all the time.

Ed O.

 

[Mediocre Man]

It could be that he doesn't really want them to push at all. Maybe it's a ploy so that the opponent will not send as many guys to the offensive boards? Maybe the team, as well as the Sonics teams have tuned him out? Maybe they know he wants them to run, but will also yank then out if they make a TO?

A coach simply can't scream to his team to run, and then never do it. Something is broken in that model

 

[Boise Blazer]

The whole thing just seems silly to me. Lay-ups and free throws are easier than jumpshots and rushed, ill-advised, 24 second clock beating shots. The percentages dont really lie. Im not naive enough to think that you can run all the time but there is just no excuse to be last in the league. Maybe if we truly were a great defensive team then we could get away with it - but we're not.

I dont see how it can be anyone other than Nate's fault. As the previous poster said either Nate is lying or has no control over his players. And since I havent seen him bench anyone for NOT running then its kinda hard not to think that he is just plain lying.

I like Nate as a person and I think he has some great coaching skills but if his (and it is his) trend continues then we arent getting what we can out of this team and its going to be really hard to advance in the playoffs. I'd like to think that a full season with a healthy Oden would change this but I just dont think thats enough. Im ready to move on from Nate but I dont claim to have the answer for his replacement.

Its like leaving that decent paying job that you really dont like. At some point you just have to force yourself to move on or accept that you will never get any further in life.

 

[Tince]

I wonder what the correlation between PACE and winning is. Of the four teams left, only one is inside the top 18 (OKC - 13th)

Minnesota played at the fastest PACE.

I agree with the main point of this thread that something is off when you hear one thing in the interviews/huddles, yet you see something different on the court.

 

[BlazersBlood]

I don't think it's necessarily Nate's inability to push the team to run but it's actually his philosophy of either early or late in the shot clock to get a shot up. We NEVER look for a shot halfway through the clock and only really start the offense going until about 8 seconds left on the clock. That leads to rushed shots getting jacked up from the corner or some terribly contested jump shot.

 

[PapaG]

I wonder what the correlation between PACE and winning is. Of the four teams left, only one is inside the top 18 (OKC - 13th)

Minnesota played at the fastest PACE.

I agree with the main point of this thread that something is off when you hear one thing in the interviews/huddles, yet you see something different on the court.

I was just going to point this out. Repped.

I'll add that of the 4 teams left, in terms of fast break points, OKC was 5th, Dallas was 16th, Miami was 18th, and Chicago was 19th.

The major difference between those 4 teams and Portland is that each of those teams have at least one MVP-caliber player, while Portland has zero.

Frankly, getting a superstar (or superstars) matters more than Pace, IMO.

 

[Ed O]

Frankly, getting a superstar (or superstars) matters more than Pace, IMO.

What about a coach's ability to get his team to do what he says he wants it to do? Does that matter?

Ed O.

 

[PapaG]

Or, perhaps the players ARE listening to Nate, but they're just so sluggish and slow without Nate's reminders that they would never get up a shot.

 

[Ed O]

Or, perhaps the players ARE listening to Nate, but they're just so sluggish and slow without Nate's reminders that they would never get up a shot.

A decade's worth of players who are sluggish and slow?

I find that hard to believe.

Ed O.

 

[PapaG]

A decade's worth of players who are sluggish and slow?

I find that hard to believe.

Ed O.

No, I'm pretty sure that's it. "RUN!" is a relative command. It's not Nate's fault that he's been given these plodding plowhorses for players. Yep, that's it!

 

[Minstrel]

I don't think it's too hard to resolve. McMillan wants lots of things, but he (like anyone) has a priority list. He'd like to run...but he'd like to avoid turnovers and mistakes even more. That priority gets communicated to his players through what he stresses and the consequences he imposes, so his players--unable to both run and avoid errors because that really isn't possible--don't run.

I don't think it's that he pretends to want something or that he fails to teach his team what he wants. It's that he'd like to do everything but some things conflict and his priority of what should supersede what is clearly picked up by his players.

 

[MARIS61]

I used to think it was Nate that kept the pace slow, but having seen the team run an effective and entertaining fastbreak offense keyed off a pressing defense every time Roy was out with injuries over the last 3 seasons, and then revert back to their plodding ways when he returned, it's now obvious that Roy is the tortoise in this drove of hares.

 

[Tince]

I used to think it was Nate that kept the pace slow, but having seen the team run an effective and entertaining fastbreak offense keyed off a pressing defense every time Roy was out with injuries over the last 3 seasons, and then revert back to their plodding ways when he returned, it's now obvious that Roy is the tortoise in this drove of hares.

I'm not anti-Roy by any means, but I've been saying this for a while. Roy doesn't like to fast-break and when your best player doesn't run, your team doesn't run. Paul Westhead couldn't get Roy to run!

 

[OddEnormous]

Which seems to indicate it's a failure of the players, right?

Or they dont care to listen to him.

Many also used to blame the pace on Roy.

 

[Tince]

Or they dont care to listen to him.

Many also used to blame the pace on Roy.

Didn't they run a lot more when Roy was out this season?

 

[MickZagger]

We need to hire Nelly as a consultant.

 

[Ed O]

Or they dont care to listen to him.

I think not listening to a coach IS a failure of the players... but if a decade's worth of NBA rosters are failing, then... it might be the coach

Many also used to blame the pace on Roy.

Roy thrives, seemingly, in Nate's slow-down style, but considering Nate was a slow-it-down coach before he even got Roy, I think it'd be hard to pin it on Brandon.

Ed O.

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

I'm not anti-Roy by any means, but I've been saying this for a while. Roy doesn't like to fast-break and when your best player doesn't run, your team doesn't run. Paul Westhead couldn't get Roy to run!

This is true. How many times have we seen Roy get the ball in the back court and Nate is imploring him to push the ball and Roy walks it up. That's not to say a team can't win with great set plays, but we seem to have built a team to run with the exception of one player.

 

[jlprk]

he runs his practices and makes his substitution decisions based on risk aversion, and you can't run much and take great care of the ball all the time.

That's how he played, too. K.C. Jones was so disgusted with his risk aversion that he got Whitsitt to draft Payton.

 

[Mediocre Man]

I wonder what the correlation between PACE and winning is. Of the four teams left, only one is inside the top 18 (OKC - 13th)

Minnesota played at the fastest PACE.

I agree with the main point of this thread that something is off when you hear one thing in the interviews/huddles, yet you see something different on the court.

I don't think any of us want to be the fastest, just not the slowest. Last in the league in pace and fastbreak points usually isn't a blueprint for success.

 

[Pinwheel1]

They can always run more. It is more fun to watch and yes you get easy baskets. Then the playoffs start and everything comes to a screaching halt. Teams who are not used to a half court game are screwed. But I get what you guys are saying. You want a compromise. A good half court offense with more fast breaks. Greg sure would help with that. It would be nice to get a quick outlet pass to three guys breaking down the court. Wallace and his one man fast break is not enough.

And once again Roy is not the issue. He only played half the game. The Blazers need a huge upgrade at PG (especially the back up) and at center. Two pieces that will help with the pace. Nate will always stress rebounding and if they have to send everyone in to crash the boards then the fast breaks will be less frequent.

I realize that GS does it without quality bigs, but that is a whole different committment. And a style that has yet to win in the playoffs.

 

[PapaG]

We need to hire Nelly as a consultant.

I'd prefer Nellie.

 

[BrianFromWA]

both would, presumably, lead us to at least 30th place.