Nets Debate: Ma3oxuct vs giftedvisionz

[NJNetz]

Welcome to the Nets debate. Today we are going to have "Ma3oxuct" face of against "giftedvisionz". This debate will begin once the first reply is submitted and will last approximately 48 hours. If you are interested in being in the next debate, be sure to send a private messege to "vcwannabe15". Here is the rules I stole from the Bulls debate.

1. Only the two people participating should post in this thread after the debate is over there will be a thread for discussion and voting.

2. You can only have a debate if the people involved disagree so please try to take opposing views on the topic.

3. Keep it to clean, no personal shots

Now here is the question

What has been the worst move made by the Nets' management?
(Trade,Free Agency etc)

Now I hope we won't have a problem like last time.

 

[Ma3oxuct]

The worst move made by the Nets is drafting Antione Wright. Now do not get me wrong, he is not an aweful player. He might end up contiributing eventually and be a decent baller. Heck he might even be in the rotation this season. The reason that it was a bad move was because instead of him that could have picked up a bigman who would have helped them last season. Not that I have anything against Clifford Robinson, but he could not provide what a young guy could have provided: Energy and athletisicm. The Nets were very shallow at thier big men positions last season. This was witnessed by the fact that they signed some guy (I forget his name) for the playoffs just so that he could come in when Shaq was on the floor. Antione Wright did not contribute to last season,
and were the Nets not to draft him and a big man instead the outcome of last year could have been more positive.

 

[giftedvisionz]

Interesting choice. While I do agree that drafting Wright was questionable, we still have yet to see what he has to offer. Obtaining one big man would not have helped us defeat the Heat for various reasons, mainly depth. We're severely lacking in the scoring department; we didn't have guys who could provide points when the offense became stale. We also lacked perimeter defense, leaving the Nets frontline vulnerable to the likes of Shaq and Alonzo. If we somehow passed the Heat, battling the Wallace brothers wouldn't have been a walk through the park either.

07-15-04 The Nets send forward Kenyon Martin to Denver in exchange for three future first-round picks.

There were so many reasons why this trade was bad. Nets fans were shocked and dismayed that all we recieved for this trade was three draft picks, which quickly dropped in value the past 2 years. K-mart was the soul of the team, anchored our defense, and gave us an energy boost when we needed one. If he was kept, Kittles and Mourning would still be here for a shot at the title.

We were able to obtain Carter from Toronto, but why should we have messed with a bad thing? We had a championship caliber team. We had a championship caliber team with fastbreak offense, great perimeter defense, and greater depth than we had today. All that team needed was a shooter or two, not a complete overhaul. It wouldn't have been as tough to get there because the Nets could have taken advantage of the then weak Eastern Conference.

Where did that leave us today? The relocation to Brooklyn is getting close, and Nets management is looking to keeping spending low when we need it the most. While we arguably have the best trio in the league, we're sorely lacking in the frontline, we don't have great defense, and we don't have depth. The East is becoming very strong, very quickly, and Jason Kidd is only getting older. We've essentially wasted his best years, along with the best shot for the Nets to win the chip.

 

[Ma3oxuct]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting giftedvisionz:</div><div class="quote_post">Interesting choice. While I do agree that drafting Wright was questionable, we still have yet to see what he has to offer. Obtaining one big man would not have helped us defeat the Heat for various reasons, mainly depth. We're severely lacking in the scoring department; we didn't have guys who could provide points when the offense became stale. We also lacked perimeter defense, leaving the Nets frontline vulnerable to the likes of Shaq and Alonzo. If we somehow passed the Heat, battling the Wallace brothers wouldn't have been a walk through the park either.</div>
Last season the Nets had two good defensive big men: Collins and Cliff. Bigmen not only have to defend the opposing team's bigmen, but have rotate and not let drivers score. With Krstic and Collins, the Nets had the rotation from Collins, but not Nenad. What did this force the Nets to do? It forced the SFs, SGs, and PGs to play back from thier player in an attempt to prevent a drive to the basket. This opened the opposing team's perimeter offense. Had the Nets another decent big man off the bench (to come in and give Collins relief; Collins was not healthy all season), they would have had a much better record in the regular season and perhaps faced Miami in the Conference Finals rather than semi-finals.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting giftedvisionz:</div><div class="quote_post">07-15-04 The Nets send forward Kenyon Martin to Denver in exchange for three future first-round picks.

There were so many reasons why this trade was bad. Nets fans were shocked and dismayed that all we recieved for this trade was three draft picks, which quickly dropped in value the past 2 years. K-mart was the soul of the team, anchored our defense, and gave us an energy boost when we needed one. If he was kept, Kittles and Mourning would still be here for a shot at the title.</div>
I can't agree with you more about what Martin brought to the table. The question however becomes is would he had brought the same things to the table if stayed. Certainly he would still bring the energy and soul, but would his knees allow him to run and be effective on floor. Martin has been struggling in Denver with tendinitis in his knees. The same tendinitis that he began in the season before he was traded. The same goes for Kittles. The season after he was traded, he blew out his knee (or something simular), never to play a game afterwards. He is now considered retired as no team has sought to add him to thier rosters.

Another problem that could have arised was that Martin and Mourning had bad blood with each other. Before Mourning had to be sidelined for the rest of the season before his transplant, Martin mocked him in practice for his lack of effort when running. To make a long story short Martin and Mourning almost came to blows.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting giftedvisionz:</div><div class="quote_post">We were able to obtain Carter from Toronto, but why should we have messed with a bad thing? We had a championship caliber team. We had a championship caliber team with fastbreak offense, great perimeter defense, and greater depth than we had today. All that team needed was a shooter or two, not a complete overhaul. It wouldn't have been as tough to get there because the Nets could have taken advantage of the then weak Eastern Conference.</div>
It is tough to say that we had a Championship caliber team. Remember first that Kidd was coming off knee surgery. It was uncertain whether it would take him a season to recover from it. The season prior the Nets lost to Detroit in game 7. The season that we are talking about, Detroit was a stronger team than before; it once again reached the finals. As that season also showed, Martin's knees bothered him much of the season. Had he been on the Nets (a team deficient of big men) he would have had to work play even harder. This would have forced more stress on his fragile knees, probably eradicating any possibility a deep run in the playoffs.

The team needed a shooter or two, that is true. Shooters however are not that easy to come by and it is unlikely that the Nets would have acquired shooters to make a championship teams. They have thier shooter now: Carter, now they only need 1/2 a K-Mart to make it to the top.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting giftedvisionz:</div><div class="quote_post">Where did that leave us today? The relocation to Brooklyn is getting close, and Nets management is looking to keeping spending low when we need it the most. While we arguably have the best trio in the league, we're sorely lacking in the frontline, we don't have great defense, and we don't have depth. The East is becoming very strong, very quickly, and Jason Kidd is only getting older. We've essentially wasted his best years, along with the best shot for the Nets to win the chip.</div>
The Nets' best chance to win the Championship was during thier second trip to the finals (against the Spurs). The year after, Martin's and Kidd's knees slowed the Nets down. The year after (had Martin been retained), injuries might have slowed the Nets even further than before. In otherwords the Nets were in decline (not a lightning fast decline, but a decline nontheless).
The aquisition of Carter brought the Nets back to thier former power. This season they are as strong as ever with a well developed Krstic (someone who the Nets might not have rushed to bring over had Martin not gone), a young promising bench, a trio that has earned experience playing with each other, and an energetic big man in Moore, and once Boone recovers, they will have a young big man to bring in.

The Nets lack a good big man right now. Had they not acquired Wright and a bigman instead, they would have had the same team now (Adams is arguably better than Wright) with the exception of a better bigman than Moore in addition to a better seaon last year.

They would also have a better future. Even if Wright became a good player, they would end giving him up because they would rather keep Carter and Jefferson. They would not be able to use him as trade bait either since other teams would not see him play because he would not gain much playing time with Carter and Jefferson on the team.

Thus I stand by argument that the drafting of Wright was the worst move.

 

[giftedvisionz]

Sorry for the late response, I gotta make this quick too. The draft had quality bigs, but they were all picked before the 15th. The only solid prospects left were tweeners like Graham, Granger, and Warrick and swingmen like Green, Hodge. The only arguable big man left was Petro, who was less then spectacular on the defensive end this past year. Bah, sorry for the crappy rebuttal, gotta go.

 

[Ma3oxuct]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting giftedvisionz:</div><div class="quote_post">Sorry for the late response, I gotta make this quick too. The draft had quality bigs, but they were all picked before the 15th. The only solid prospects left were tweeners like Graham, Granger, and Warrick and swingmen like Green, Hodge. The only arguable big man left was Petro, who was less then spectacular on the defensive end this past year. Bah, sorry for the crappy rebuttal, gotta go.</div>

A quick rebuttal, but a strong one! I'll help you out by explaining why: I have been talking all this time about how the Nets should not have drafted Wright. However, who else could they have attain if not him?

Who was availible after #15? Let's take a look.

Warrick, #19: Averaged 4.1 points, 2.1 rebounds, and .31 blocks in only 10 minutes per game for Memphis. Later in the season he was scoring double figures and getting multiple blocks. He would have given the Nets a shotblocking presense, some rebounding and some scoring. Much more than what Wright gave.

Johan Petro, #25: Averaged 5.2 points, 4.4 rebounds, and .75 blocks per game, but in 18.9 minutes. He would have given pretty much the same stuff that Warick would have given.

Wayne Simien, #29: Stat are not really significant in his case. Not the shotblocker that I expected him to be, but would have clogged the middle enough for the Nets off the bench; more than Wright does.

David Lee, #30: Surprisingly good for the Knicks: Averages of 5.1 points, 4.5 rebounds, and .3 blocks. He could have brought energy, rebounding, and some defense for the Nets.

Ronny Turiaf, #37: Perhaps the best after #15, he provide energy and motivation off of the bench. He never backed down. Was quite productive for the Lakers in the playoffs.

Christ Taft, #42: Did not get enough playing time to display what he can do, but certainly has size that the Nets could have used.

The Nets also drafted at #43, so there is no point in going further with the list. Mile Illic was an excellent pick-up for the future.

 

[NJNetz]

Ok the debate is pretty much over. I will set up a poll in a few mins.


Will a Mod please close this thread. Thanks.