Politics Official 2024 Presidential Election Thread

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Who will "Win?"

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Phatguysrule said:
If you aren't voting for Harris you are voting for Trump. I hate it, but that's just the way it is (unless you live in a heavily dem state that Harris will carry anyway).

I'm sorry, but Trump is far worse than any other president we've had. We must rise up and defeat him, and anybody else like him. We must force the republicans to be less extreme or we'll never be able to move democrats to the left. And burning the whole thing down is not an option.
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I agree, but you should tell Kamala this. Not me. Tell her to give us reasons to vote for her. It's simple. Stop the genocide. Provide solutions to the health care crisis in America. She's not even offering to codify Roe v Wade.

This is a really low bar that she doesn't seem to know how to clear.

Give me a reason.

Also, I'm in California so my vote doesn't count so don't come at me.
 
noknobs said:
What a load of shit. The current vice president of the US isn't responsible for what's happening in the Middle East, and using that as an excuse not to vote for her is pathetic. Especially when the alternative is a Russian puppet and wannabe dictator.
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This post is a load of shit and everybody knows it. She's been asked time and time again and has offered no differences in her policy from Joe Biden. She has been given numerous opportunities to do so and hasn't. Cope somewhere else.
 
barfo said:
I read it, that's what I was referring to. You want her to win, but you aren't willing to vote for her.

I guess you think sitting on your hands will get you what you want, and perhaps that is true (I think you are in CA, and if so it is indeed the case that your vote is irrelevant).

But if you were in a swing state it would be a very foolish decision.

barfo
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I might prefer she wins, but not enough to defy my morals by voting for a genocide enabler. It ain't that difficult, bud. And yes, my vote is irrelevant.

Perhaps if I was in a swing state I'd feel differently.
 
AmirIcon said:
I agree, but you should tell Kamala this. Not me. Tell her to give us reasons to vote for her. It's simple. Stop the genocide. Provide solutions to the health care crisis in America. She's not even offering to codify Roe v Wade.

This is a really low bar that she doesn't seem to know how to clear.

Give me a reason.

Also, I'm in California so my vote doesn't count so don't come at me.
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I don't think she has any control over any of that as VP.

She's not going to offer any difference other than just being not Trump. Otherwise she risks pissing off lobbyists and losing funding or pushing leaning or undecided voters more toward Trump.

And I don't think there's any motivation to fix healthcare.

As long as there is a candidate like Trump there will not be a change candidate. We're just fighting to keep our heads above water.
 
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PCmor7 said:
Let's take your bad take apart a little bit more, Beast.

First, your side is the one that keeps pushing for state's rights. You're all about "various edicts" in every other case. But this? States' rights are the problem now that kept Trump from getting the job done? Too rich.
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I didn't say that, I said the states governments were the primary agents of determining the lockdowns of businesses and schools, because they literally were. Trump doesn't have that authority. His lies in the realm of federal edicts. Shutting down of international travel, mask wearing on airlines, which though annoying is a drop in the bucket compared to the local edicts.



PCmor7 said:
He's the president. His job is to handle it. He didn't. We employ him. If he's a clerk in our store and his main job is to make sure something is on the shelves or the prices are correctly marked, we wouldn't excuse him for not getting it done.
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I don't like how he handled it, for very different reasons than you. But the democrats still seem to be very much in favor of those measures I hate where as he is less so. He doesn't support vaccine mandates, and he's lambasted by the left for ideas that actually turned out to be correct. He allowed the wrong people to run things.

Side note, we had more excess death under Biden than Trump, and Biden had the magical vaccine. So you're playing a really silly game.

PCmor7 said:
The Obama carryover to Trump is very important because the economic trends were progressing at the exact same curve as Obama's until COVID came and Trump botched it in the worst way possible.

And, again, Biden took over and our recovery surpassed that of the same countries that were doing better than us when Trump was president.

But, yeah, let's give a guy who was objectively one of the most failed presidents of all time another chance because it hurts your feelings to see him lose.
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You guys talk about how "Biden" brought jobs back, which was the result of the covid restrictions ending, the very restrictions they supported more ardently, and continue to support. The same way you flung open the border through terrible executive orders, then suddenly pretend, right before the election that you're concerned about it.

I don't understand how you all don't see through such BS.
 
beast blazer said:
I didn't say that, I said the states governments were the primary agents of determining the lockdowns of businesses and schools, because they literally were. Trump doesn't have that authority. His lies in the realm of federal edicts. Shutting down of international travel, mask wearing on airlines, which though annoying is a drop in the bucket compared to the local edicts.





I don't like how he handled it, for very different reasons than you. But the democrats still seem to be very much in favor of those measures I hate where as he is less so. He doesn't support vaccine mandates, and he's lambasted by the left for ideas that actually turned out to be correct. He allowed the wrong people to run things.

Side note, we had more excess death under Biden than Trump, and Biden had the magical vaccine. So you're playing a really silly game.



You guys talk about how "Biden" brought jobs back, which was the result of the covid restrictions ending, the very restrictions they supported more ardently, and continue to support. The same way you flung open the border through terrible executive orders, then suddenly pretend, right before the election that you're concerned about it.

I don't understand how you all don't see through such BS.
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Again with the equivocation. I'll try to explain a couple of the simpler points for you.

Biden brought jobs back because Trump lost them. Trump. Not just COVID restrictions, but Trump's handling of COVID.

I'm not sure how to make you get this, but our country lost more per capita during COVID than our allies, our peers, you know, mostly the Western European countries that operate like we do. Why did that happen? If you blame it on states doing different things, well, that's on Trump because he, you and the GOP continually use the excuse that should have died with the end of the Civil War that states' rights take precedent over federal laws.

So, that's on Trump.

It also means Trump couldn't unify the country to combat the pandemic, which is largely because he sent so many mixed messages. For heaven's sake, the guy fought his own immunology expert, essentially tried to sell quack cures, downplayed masking and mitigation efforts, focused on the virus coming from China instead of what we needed to do to save lives ... everything he did was divisive, because that's what he always does.

And that's what a president absolutely can't do in a crisis.

That's why he'd be an abject failure even if he wasn't such a joke in general and a danger in that he convinces rubes like you to try to overthrow the government because his feelings got hurt by the results of a free and fair election.

Now, back to your inane point about Biden bringing jobs back that Trump lost as some kind of win for Trump.

YOU'RE WRONG.

Maybe actually look up the statistics before you post.

We lost 2.7 million jobs under Trump because of his pathetic handling of COVID. Trump inherited an economy that had added more than 10 million jobs under Obama.

More than 16 million jobs have been added during the Biden administration.

This is simple math, if you can understand it. Sixteen million is more than 13 million more than what Trump lost.

In other words, Biden not only recovered the jobs Trump lost, an additional FOUR TIMES what Trump lost were created.

If you look at the stats even pre-pandemic, Trump only was at the helm for about half as many created jobs as were created under Biden.

And, again, comparison -- under Trump, we struggled worse than the rest of the world, under Biden, we are doing better than the rest of the world. Inflation is happening everywhere as a result of the recovery, and it hits us in the checkout aisle, but inflation hasn't been as bad here as it is in all the countries that compare to us.

Why do you think that is? Is it having a more competent person, or just a more stable person at the helm than we had four years ago. Almost certainly.

The market seems to think so, too.

Anyway, again, it's such a strange flex to admit your guy wasn't up to the task and then make all these excuses and saying we should let him fail again. You ADMIT he failed, but you keep excusing it. He failed. He had one job to do and he didn't do it. And you think that's OK. I think that's hilarious.
 
Trump said Obama is going to vote for him because Harris is a "low IQ person".

He is deeper and deeper in dementia. Seriously needs hospitalization.

Except there is no room in hospitals because all the space is given to migrants.
 
PCmor7 said:
Again with the equivocation. I'll try to explain a couple of the simpler points for you.

Biden brought jobs back because Trump lost them. Trump. Not just COVID restrictions, but Trump's handling of COVID.

I'm not sure how to make you get this, but our country lost more per capita during COVID than our allies, our peers, you know, mostly the Western European countries that operate like we do. Why did that happen? If you blame it on states doing different things, well, that's on Trump because he, you and the GOP continually use the excuse that should have died with the end of the Civil War that states' rights take precedent over federal laws.

So, that's on Trump.

It also means Trump couldn't unify the country to combat the pandemic, which is largely because he sent so many mixed messages. For heaven's sake, the guy fought his own immunology expert, essentially tried to sell quack cures, downplayed masking and mitigation efforts, focused on the virus coming from China instead of what we needed to do to save lives ... everything he did was divisive, because that's what he always does.

And that's what a president absolutely can't do in a crisis.

That's why he'd be an abject failure even if he wasn't such a joke in general and a danger in that he convinces rubes like you to try to overthrow the government because his feelings got hurt by the results of a free and fair election.

Now, back to your inane point about Biden bringing jobs back that Trump lost as some kind of win for Trump.

YOU'RE WRONG.

Maybe actually look up the statistics before you post.

We lost 2.7 million jobs under Trump because of his pathetic handling of COVID. Trump inherited an economy that had added more than 10 million jobs under Obama.

More than 16 million jobs have been added during the Biden administration.

This is simple math, if you can understand it. Sixteen million is more than 13 million more than what Trump lost.

In other words, Biden not only recovered the jobs Trump lost, an additional FOUR TIMES what Trump lost were created.

If you look at the stats even pre-pandemic, Trump only was at the helm for about half as many created jobs as were created under Biden.

And, again, comparison -- under Trump, we struggled worse than the rest of the world, under Biden, we are doing better than the rest of the world. Inflation is happening everywhere as a result of the recovery, and it hits us in the checkout aisle, but inflation hasn't been as bad here as it is in all the countries that compare to us.

Why do you think that is? Is it having a more competent person, or just a more stable person at the helm than we had four years ago. Almost certainly.

The market seems to think so, too.

Anyway, again, it's such a strange flex to admit your guy wasn't up to the task and then make all these excuses and saying we should let him fail again. You ADMIT he failed, but you keep excusing it. He failed. He had one job to do and he didn't do it. And you think that's OK. I think that's hilarious.
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You're really getting out there buddy. The fact is, it's the governors who have the authority over schools and businesses in their states. Not Trump. Yet you're trying to argue that's Trump's fault when he was actually advocating for less restrictions?

You people have this insane need to blame everything on Trump. Just listen to yourself, you're totally irrational.

And what's more ironic, is you folks talk about how afraid you are Trump was going to be a dictator, yet complain that he wasn't dicatorial enough during covid.

It's like setting your house on fire on election night then putting it out once Biden is elected, then thanking Biden for rescuing your house. Only the reality is worse, because more fires, more covid, happened under Biden. I don't even blame him for that, because I understand the real underlying causes.
 
beast blazer said:
You're really getting out there buddy. The fact is, it's the governors who have the authority over schools and businesses in their states. Not Trump. Yet you're trying to argue that's Trump's fault when he was actually advocating for less restrictions?

You people have this insane need to blame everything on Trump. Just listen to yourself, you're totally irrational.

And what's more ironic, is you folks talk about how afraid you are Trump was going to be a dictator, yet complain that he wasn't dicatorial enough during covid.

It's like setting your house on fire on election night then putting it out once Biden is elected, then thanking Biden for rescuing your house. Only the reality is worse, because more fires, more covid, happened under Biden. I don't even blame him for that, because I understand the real underlying causes.
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Lol
 
beast blazer said:
You're really getting out there buddy. The fact is, it's the governors who have the authority over schools and businesses in their states. Not Trump. Yet you're trying to argue that's Trump's fault when he was actually advocating for less restrictions?

You people have this insane need to blame everything on Trump. Just listen to yourself, you're totally irrational.

And what's more ironic, is you folks talk about how afraid you are Trump was going to be a dictator, yet complain that he wasn't dicatorial enough during covid.

It's like setting your house on fire on election night then putting it out once Biden is elected, then thanking Biden for rescuing your house. Only the reality is worse, because more fires, more covid, happened under Biden. I don't even blame him for that, because I understand the real underlying causes.
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Pffft. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

"The states are in control of things when it benefits us but not when it doesn't. If states' rights reveal my guy as an utter nitwit, then it doesn't count." What kind of argument is that.

Wait, let me take this apart piece by piece. This will be fun.

COVID already was spreading though the country when Biden took over. Surely you can't be saying that if Biden took office someone that already had COVID or lived in an environment where COVID was running rampant and died that that was on Biden?

Actually, I could see you doing that, but it'd be the ultimate childish argument.

Mark ... is your name "Mark," BTW? You seem like a mark. Do you know what states suffered the most during COVID? It was RED STATES. More per capita infections. More per capita deaths.

I'd tell you they suffered more economically, but the red states already are by and large economic takers in the United States economically. The blue states support them more through the federal government and taxation.

And states' rights only applies to schools and businesses? Where the heck do you get that? Project 2025? Have you ever heard of the Department of Education?

For the record, the big motivator for the American right regarding states' rights always has been personhood. You know, slavery? Reproductive care? Those are the biggest states' rights issues.

This is the second time I've seen you used the burning house analogy, and it still has never been applicable. In both the case of the Afghan withdraw and COVID, our problems didn't start with the election. Our problems started with Trump.

Trump abandoned the Afghan government, negotiated solely with the Taliban, drew down our troops to unmanageable levels and never met with Biden during the transition of power to tell them what to expect ... because Trump was too busy fighting the transition of power and planning to incite an attack on the Capitol.

In the case of COVID, Trump pushed quack remedies. He undermined the attempts of his own immunologist to give people the best ways to mitigate.

For heaven's sake, he had people not wearing masks because they thought it was a sign or either being weak or being a liberal and making fun of people that did wear masks. Of course, again, I take you back to the unequal death rate of red states and Republicans from COVID as opposed to blue states and Democrats to show you how that worked out.

Instead of ever developing a good plan for the entire country and pulling us together, Trump had everyone doubting the experts and each other. Consequently, our country sustained a higher percentage of deaths and its economy contracted more than similar nations.

When Biden took over, that all swung hard the other way. By your reasoning, BTW, that shouldn't have happened. Biden was dealing with the exact same issues that Trump was, that Trump handed him ... and yet here's our economy, better than the rest of the world.

You really need to sit out these conversations, Mark. You aren't well-equipped for adult discussions.
 
The way he's so rumpled up, it looks like a fascist Lewis Black.

 
Weekend Update: Trump Agrees to Fox News Town Hall with All-Women Audience

 
Fear is the most ancient emotion. Fear predates humans, primates, even mammals. Fear is adaptive in the wild; an animal notes a threat, feels fear, runs or flies away. Animals that respond to threats with fear are more likely to survive and leave offspring than those who don't.*

Fear is also harmful. In human societies it causes hatred of anyone seen as other. It excuses anything done to those others up to and including mass murder.

Stupid and demented, Trump has a feral understanding of the power of fear. He doesn't talk about economy much. It's all fear of immigrants. They are coming to your community, even your home. They are diseased, have bad genes, take over schools and hospitals so no room for real Americans, they attack young girls in Walmart (stores full of people with cell phones but no one captured such an attack). They steal, rape, murder and eat your pets. He has nothing to sell but fear and sadly it's working. He has erased Harris lead.

*Irrelevant evolutionary fact. Toxoplasma gondii can only reproduce in cats' intestinal tracts. When cats pass waste outdoors they shed Toxoplasma and then cover their waste. Seedlings sprout. Mice eat seedlings and become infected. Toxoplasma infection alters mice brain chemistry so they lose their fear of cats. Instead of running away when they scent a cat, they sit there. Cat eats mouse, Toxoplasma take up residence in intestinal tract and cycle resumes. Cat is unaffected. They are just carriers. Fear saves mice lives. Fear can destroy the country.
 
Kamala's really bad at answering questions ... oh, wait, that's Trump.

 
What sucks about how presidential elections are held is not just that, in a country of 300 million, electoral college is decided by less than 50,000, but that they also tend to be least engaged. Those who have been following election and keep up with news aren't undecided. It's this who wonder, should I stick with familiar guy? Could I vote for a woman? Who will decide.
 
Hoopguru said:
Not sure how can be a dead heat?
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According to some (and I personally believe it), MAGAts are "flooding the zone" with bogus or ginned up polls (as "political Prisoner" Steve Bannon promised they would) to make the undecideds and under engaged Democrats believe that Trump is going to win so there is no use in voting, especially in the swing states. And too many people are buying this shit. The only poll I'm going to believe is the one that comes out after all the votes have been counted. And even then Republican shenanigans will still cloud the issue.
 
UncleCliffy'sDaddy said:
According to some (and I personally believe it), MAGAts are "flooding the zone" with bogus or ginned up polls (as "political Prisoner" Steve Bannon promised they would) to make the undecideds and under engaged Democrats believe that Trump is going to win so there is no use in voting, especially in the swing states. And too many people are buying this shit. The only poll I'm going to believe is the one that comes out after all the votes have been counted. And even then Republican shenanigans will still cloud the issue.
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Everyone just needs to vote
 
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