OT: Evan Turner

[PapaG]

It's no secret that Evan Turner has been a huge bust this season. For a guy who was debated as going #1 overall, he's putting up a PER of 9.0, is coming off of the bench, and is shooting under 40%, and he's "old" at 22.

Acknowledging that, his closest NBA comparison just may be Brandon Roy. With Brandon being possibly never the same player again, would it be worth taking in a bad contract like Elton Brand for a shot at Roy getting to tutor Evan Turner, and show him how to take his collegiate game and incorporate them into the NBA? Philly already has Iggy, who at best is a very good, but won't be a great, player, locked up for another 3 years after this season, playing basically the same position. Taking on Brand means taking on the last two years at ~$35 million.

Would "rebuilding" include taking a chance on a guy like Evan Turner, who seemingly doesn't have much of a future in Philly, and hoping that Roy can help him develop his game? Perhaps all it would take is a change of scenery for Turner to get his confidence back, and at least perform up to his capabilities. It may take a Nic Batum being part of a package to get Turner, so keep that in mind.

 

[andalusian]

We have seen what happened to Brandon Roy without the ability to explode past his defender. Evan Turner's Combine numbers show you that he never had that explosion/athletic ability.

Nice prospect to have, but not at the cost of Elton Brand's extra $30m...

 

[PapaG]

We have seen what happened to Brandon Roy without the ability to explode past his defender. Evan Turner's Combine numbers show you that he never had that explosion/athletic ability.

Nice prospect to have, but not at the cost of Elton Brand's extra $30m...

That's a good point. I'm just brainstorming ways to 'rebuild', and doing so will likely mean taking risks on some players. I say this because Portland won't be able to attract elite players in FA, even if the is cap space in a few years. Pritchard took his shot with three young players, two of which have showed or are now showing they can be elite NBA players, and a third who is slowly becoming one of the more talented, yet tragic, players in franchise history.

From a purely selfish standpoint, I'd have almost have had Roy be hobbled the summer prior of '08, since that would mean no max extension. An extension I believe that he earned on the court, but an extension that is a major liability in terms of replacing his on-court value in a replacement player.

 

[andalusian]

That's a good point. I'm just brainstorming ways to 'rebuild', and doing so will likely mean taking risks on some players.

I am OK with taking risks, but the price of Brand's contract is too big, imho. He would be a nice PF to put next to LMA (with LMA playing center) - but paying him $33m over the next 2 years (in addition to what he is owed this year) seems rather steep.

Here is one that is worth the risk imho:

Miller + Rudy for Turner and Hawes

Philly get Miller (expiring) and a cheap SG to fill in for Turner, The Blazers turn the expiring into a prospect that might turn into a role player at best and another mediocre center that might blow his knee.

I doubt Philly does that, however...

 

[PapaG]

I am OK with taking risks, but the price of Brand's contract is too big, imho. He would be a nice PF to put next to LMA (with LMA playing center) - but paying him $33m over the next 2 years (in addition to what he is owed this year) seems rather steep.

Here is one that is worth the risk imho:

Miller + Rudy for Turner and Hawes

Philly get Miller (expiring) and a cheap SG to fill in for Turner, The Blazers turn the expiring into a prospect that might turn into a role player at best and another mediocre center that might blow his knee.

I doubt Philly does that, however...

I'm guessing they would do it with Batum replacing Rudy. Of course, that may be a very bad trade for Portland, since they end up with no starting PG and no starting SF.

 

[PapaG]

Expanding on this thought, Camby may be more attractive to Philly, at least in exchange for Brand, along with the NO pick.

Brand is still effective enough to put up a 19 PER this season. If LMA can be moved to center, and with Oden being a wild card off of the bench, I could probably live with that trade.

Out: Camby/Miller/Batum/NO #1 (if needed)

In: Brand/Turner

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4soapfm

 

[Minstrel]

I prefer Batum to Turner straight up. With Turner's lack of athleticism, I think he's going to really struggle to carry over the skills he showed in college. I don't think Turner's rookie struggles are just an illusion based on being inexperienced.

So also taking on Brand's contract and losing two solid veterans (not to mention a possible first round pick) pushes the deal to horrific, in my opinion.

I don't think it's impossible that Turner turns into something, I just wouldn't bet much on it and, therefore, give up much of value to see.

 

[andalusian]

Yikes. Nic going out? For an over the hill over paid PF and a bust of a prospect? At least get us T-Young back to get in the tall and skinny SF prospect... I am also not sure why Philly wants Batum - to add to Iggy and T-Young in their SF log-jam...

 

[PapaG]

Yikes. Nic going out? For an over the hill over paid PF and a bust of a prospect? At least get us T-Young back to get in the tall and skinny SF prospect... I am also not sure why Philly wants Batum - to add to Iggy and T-Young in their SF log-jam...

Brand is still good enough to put up a 19 PER on a bad team. Plus, if they do want to shed Brand, then replace Batum with Rudy and see if they bite.

Getting Brand/Turner in exchange for a PG who won't be here next year, along with a 37 year-old center who just had knee surgery, isn't a terrible move, IMO. Philly clears a bunch of cap space and makes their FA play; Portland, who can't attract FA's, tries to turn Turner into something, gets a solid PF, moves LMA to center, and is screwed at PG! I'm talking myself into, and then out of, this hypothetical by the minute.

 

[Denny Crane]

Xavier Henry is a similar player with a lot of upside. He has a PER of 7.5.

A guy like Adam Morrison might be worth a flyer. If you've got nothing to lose, you put the guy out there and see if he has some of that game that he had at Gonzaga that made him worthy of the #3 pick in the draft. It'd cost the vet minimum to sign him. Surely he's better than Luke Babbit and his 0.1 PER.

 

[PapaG]

]Xavier Henry is a similar player with a lot of upside[/B]. He has a PER of 7.5.

A guy like Adam Morrison might be worth a flyer. If you've got nothing to lose, you put the guy out there and see if he has some of that game that he had at Gonzaga that made him worthy of the #3 pick in the draft. It'd cost the vet minimum to sign him. Surely he's better than Luke Babbit and his 0.1 PER.

Xavier Henry has never shown the all-around game of Evan Turner, though.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I'm still on the Turner Wagon. I don't like sending Batum for him, but taking bad high contracts and Turner for our expirings and picks would be a decent gamble.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Turner is like a less athletic version of a prime Roy ... in other words his ceiling is about where an unathletic gimpy Roy is. I'll pass.

 

[BrianFromWA]

hold on...you're saying that gimpy Roy's athleticism = Turner's healthy athleticism? Or that any improvements of Turner's athleticism over Roy's is negated by Roy's skillset?

Disagree on both counts. Don't know whether or not you put stock in DraftExpress...

Evan Turner has short arms relative to his height, coming out at a solid 6-5 3/4 without shoes, with a 6-8 wingspan. His wingspan is in fact shorter than that of John Wall, despite being 3 inches taller. That didn’t seem to affect Turner at the college level as a rebounder (9.2 per game) or as a defender (he’s one of the best perimeter stoppers in this draft), but it will be interesting to see how this affects his finishing ability in the NBA. Turner is considered average from an explosiveness standpoint.

Interestingly enough, Turner’s measurements are quite similar to those of (pre- bone-on-bone) Brandon Roy (6-5 ¼ without shoes, 6-8 wingspan), the player he’s most often compared to.
From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Evan-Turner-1115/#ixzz1BYJN8Hv0
http://www.draftexpress.com

Bolded my edited addition. As for skillset:

Regardless, any team looking for a dynamic shot-creator to give their half-court offense a huge shot in the arm would benefit greatly from Turner’s presence. This study does not even take into account his passing, rebounding or defensive skills, three of his best attributes, and which make him arguably the most versatile prospect in this draft.

http://www.draftexpress.com

 

[cdub503]

i wouldnt mind trying to trade for him... although i think itd take too much IE batum to get him

 

[illmatic99]

Turner is like a less athletic version of a prime Roy ... in other words his ceiling is about where an unathletic gimpy Roy is. I'll pass.

This is way off base.

I get to watch Turner on many occasions and your assessment is flat out wrong.

 

[RoyToy]

Yeah, I watched a little of Evans today on NBA LP before I left. He may be struggling right now but I think he'll still be a player. He's much bigger than Roy is and imo is at least as athletic as Roy as well.

Needs to work on the jumper. It's not even in the same stratosphere as Roy's. That thing is ugly.

 

[Nikolokolus]

This is way off base.

I get to watch Turner on many occasions and your assessment is flat out wrong.

I was trying to be funny, but then I remembered that nobody around has a sense of humor ... so my bad.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Yeah, I watched a little of Evans today on NBA LP before I left. He may be struggling right now but I think he'll still be a player. He's much bigger than Roy is and imo is at least as athletic as Roy as well.

Needs to work on the jumper. It's not even in the same stratosphere as Roy's. That thing is ugly.

In what way is he much bigger than Roy?

 

[maxiep]

In what way is he much bigger than Roy?

Well, his meniscus cartilage are much bigger than Roy's are...

 

[hasoos]

What? Did some players send another round of photographs in front of the bathroom mirror out via their phone again?

 

[RR7]

Here is one that is worth the risk imho:

Miller + Rudy for Turner and Hawes

Really? Just "worth the risk"? Yeah, I can see Philly after half a season giving up the #2 pick for Rudy and Andre Miller. SURE. Come on.

If we're rebuilding and/or retooling, seems like there's a few ways to go about it, but I'd be more than happy to take on Elton Brand to also get Evan Turner. Worth the risk. You overpay Brand for two years, when we won't have cap space anyways, and hope he gives you what he is currently giving Philly. Start him at PF alongside Aldridge, and bring him off the bench at the 4/5 if/when Camby is healthy.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Really? Just "worth the risk"? Yeah, I can see Philly after half a season giving up the #2 pick for Rudy and Andre Miller. SURE. Come on.

If we're rebuilding and/or retooling, seems like there's a few ways to go about it, but I'd be more than happy to take on Elton Brand to also get Evan Turner. Worth the risk. You overpay Brand for two years, when we won't have cap space anyways, and hope he gives you what he is currently giving Philly. Start him at PF alongside Aldridge, and bring him off the bench at the 4/5 if/when Camby is healthy.

Except that we don't really have the contracts to make that deal unless Oden or Camby is included, neither of which I see happening.

 

[andalusian]

Really? Just "worth the risk"? Yeah, I can see Philly after half a season giving up the #2 pick for Rudy and Andre Miller. SURE. Come on.

I believe my original post said something about doubting Philly goes for it. As for "Just" worth the risk - Turner's rookie season so far looks very much like Adam Morrison's rookie season... #2 or #3 - the dude is more a risk, so far, than a sure thing - and like Ammo - he was a great college player with some real athletic concerns at a "skill" position. Dude is a risk, no doubt about it.

 

[RR7]

Except that we don't really have the contracts to make that deal unless Oden or Camby is included, neither of which I see happening.

Przy, Miller, Babbitt and Dante or Armon for Turner, Brand and Battie works financially. I think there's no chance they'd do it. But the money fits.