OT: Penny Hardaway.......

[THE HCP]

I'm just watching a '95 Eastern Conf. Finals game on ESPN Classic and Penny was COLD! He was unstoppable for his first 4 years in the league! I know this is waaaay off topic, but he was damn good before injuries. Kinda like watching Grant Hill before his injuries.

 

[MickZagger]

He had his couple years of glory. The Lil Penny commercials were classic.

I remember media types always comparing him to Magic.

 

[THE HCP]

I loved watching him play! It would be like Nic Batum with handles!

 

[MickZagger]

Remember when Shaun Livingston was being pimped as Penny Hardaway 2.0?

 

[Minstrel]

He had his couple years of glory. The Lil Penny commercials were classic.

I remember media types always comparing him to Magic.

Penny and Grant Hill were poor man's versions of Magic Johnson in the same way that Kobe and (prior to his injuries) McGrady were poor man's versions of Michael Jordan.

I guess Kobe wins by not suffering catastrophic injury. Shame the other three didn't have full, healthy careers.

 

[MickZagger]

Penny and Grant Hill were poor man's versions of Magic Johnson in the same way that Kobe and (prior to his injuries) McGrady were poor man's versions of Michael Jordan.

I guess Kobe wins by not suffering catastrophic injury. Shame the other three didn't have full, healthy careers.

Without a doubt.

Grant Hill made the late-90's his bitch. Then he signed with Orlando and everything went to hell.

 

[jlprk]

I thought Hill was at least as good as Magic. Grant Hill could do everything at a blue chip level and moved around faster than Magic. Penny was about at the McGrady level, comparing both uninjured.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Penny and Grant Hill were poor man's versions of Magic Johnson in the same way that Kobe and (prior to his injuries) McGrady were poor man's versions of Michael Jordan.

No they weren't! Neither Hill nor Penny had Magic's passing, but both were much better athletes. No, Penny, Hill, McGrady and Bryant were all pretty much on a spectrum between Jordan and Pippen. Hill was the closest to Pippen (although I do remember a magazine - Slam, I think - proclaiming Hill the next Jordan before the start of his rookie season) and with the other three closer to Jordan (in style).

Nobody's really been Magic II. You can't imagine any of those three starting at center as a rookie in a finals game and scoring and rebounding like Magic did. Actually, if I had to pick a player closest to Magic in combining unusual size for the position, incredible "how did he see that!?" passing, and only average athleticism, I think I'd pick Sabonis.

I guess Kobe wins by not suffering catastrophic injury.

But what about his arthritic finger?

Shame the other three didn't have full, healthy careers.

Who else will we be saying this about?

 

[jlprk]

Hill made surprising passes. Magic made predictable safe ones. Grant Hill was great at everything, while Magic set unnecessary limits on himself.

I used to look at Magic and think, "This guy has twice the potential of Bird. Why is he half the player?" Answer: Jabbar, the real best player on the team, made it too easy for pretender Magic.

 

[THE HCP]

 

[Natebishop3]

Without a doubt.

Grant Hill made the late-90's his bitch. Then he signed with Orlando and everything went to hell.

Actually, he was already injured when he signed with the Magic... but that Orlando training staff finished him off. That staff killed off Penny AND Hill.

 

[MickZagger]

Actually, he was already injured when he signed with the Magic... but that Orlando training staff finished him off. That staff killed off Penny AND Hill.

Hill played in 74 games in his final year in Detroit. He played in 4 games in his first year with Orlando.

 

[handiman]

I remember media types always comparing him to Magic.

Magic himself made that comparison, before Penny was even in the league. As I recall, it was from the Dream Team's scrimmage against the college select team, and Magic said something like, "playing against him is like looking in the mirror."

 

[Minstrel]

No they weren't! Neither Hill nor Penny had Magic's passing, but both were much better athletes. No, Penny, Hill, McGrady and Bryant were all pretty much on a spectrum between Jordan and Pippen. Hill was the closest to Pippen (although I do remember a magazine - Slam, I think - proclaiming Hill the next Jordan before the start of his rookie season) and with the other three closer to Jordan (in style).

That spectrum works for me, as well, though I think the similarities between Penny/Hill and Magic are greater than you do.

I think you underrate Magic's athleticism. His athleticism was like LeBron's (though not as remarkable as LeBron's) in that he was large and almost seemed to lumber slightly in getting that size going. James isn't a sleek slasher like a Jordan or Pippen or Erving...he's like an NFL linebacker in that he fuses speed and size. Magic was somewhat the same way, though less so. I felt Magic was a very good athlete on the court.

Penny and Hill reminded me of Magic in that they played an all-around game, could play the point despite being very tall for the position and had more of a pass-first mentality than a score-first mentality. They differ from Magic in not having as remarkable court vision as he did (I'm not sure anyone has ever had the court vision of Magic)...but they differ even more from Pippen in terms of not being elite defenders.

 

[Natebishop3]

Hill played in 74 games in his final year in Detroit. He played in 4 games in his first year with Orlando.

He was injured in the playoffs for Detroit. He signed with the ankle injury.

http://hoopedia.nba.com/index.php?title=Grant_Hill

On April 15, 2000, 7 days before the start of the playoffs, Hill sprained his left ankle in a game against the Philadelphia 76ers. Despite his hurting ankle, Hill was bothered by being labeled "soft" by some Pistons fans and thus decided to play against the first round opponent, Miami Heat. However, his injured ankle got worse and Hill was forced to leave halfway through game 2. Eventually, the Heat swept the Pistons 3-0. Hill was initially selected for the 2000 Summer Olympics U.S. team, but couldn't play due to his ankle injury, which would prove to be a major liability for many years to come.

 

[MickZagger]

So he sprained it in Detroit? He messed it up worse leading to only playing 4 games that year in Orlando.

 

[Natebishop3]

So he sprained it in Detroit? He messed it up worse leading to only playing 4 games that year in Orlando.

It was so bad that he didn't even play in the 2000 Olympics.

 

[Webster's Dictionary]

We never know what Penny could have been. He was a super star on the rise when he had a team around him. After Shaq left he was surrounded by Nick Anderson (post breakdown), Dennis Scott, Horace Grant and Ike Austin. Not much of a team. Penny was one of the most talented players I've ever seen, and I'd put him on a level way higher than McGrady as an all around player.