OT: WMDs

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Yep- those chem weapons were always there....The U.S. Govt/Military probably weren't too anxious to publicize it because "we" are the ones who gave them to Saddam and backed him with his war with Iran.

Also....later on...wasn't it reported that Saddam was offering 25K to the families of any suicide bomber attacking Israel..remember those horrible suicide bombers on civilian Israeli buses? Mike Bloomberg was one of the very first prominent U.S. politicians/high profile elected leader to actually go to Israel and ride on those buses to show his and NYC's support.
 
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Hey Rob....you see this new report from the NYT

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...casualties-of-iraq-chemical-weapons.html?_r=0

Anyone want to guess if ISIS/ISIL has found new toys?

Thanks for the article Tom-

I always appreciate in depth articles with real meat for details, esp, those uncovered from secrecy.

Lord knows Iraq; and many other locations in numerous nations, have become dirty bomb dumps. Worse yet, how our troops hazardous Units, have to do all the clean up, more or less.

Mustard Gas, SCUDS, by product of WWI, supposedly banned, yet to many to count. NTM-those effected by removal/clean up efforts. I can never forget knowing 1 to many good men, who were victims of Napalm in Nam, as well as other hush hush clean up efforts, in other War torn Nations.

It's nothing new to me, yet always a deep concern. As you pointed out well Tom, ISIS, or any other terrorist organizations, (I don't doubt for a moment); have their hands on many 'kicked by the roadside' Shells ie, Launch Platforms.

The perfect tool to incite/distribute a new age of chemical/bio-logical War Fare.

I heard a year or so ago, the H1N1 is but 1 mutation away from using as a bio-logical WMD. I bet that mutation is now complete too, what data have you seen on the H1N1 mutation?

I have no doubt you have a better pulse on current sources of data/details, beyond what I have seen in this last decade of retirement.


I'm sure you'd agree, the antique germ-Ebola can now be used as a WMD, without even adding Ebola to a Launch Platform. Since our ignorant Prez, turns blind eyes to simply letting those infected Ebola human hosts to enter the Nation on a Commercial Jet, ie, Launch Platform in its own rites....

wouldn't you agree, such ancient germ warfare, such as Bubonic, Yersinia Pestis, Ebola, or more current: Anthrax, AIDS, and a ton of other nasty deadly germs, as well as Chemical agents, such as Mustard Gas, are probably the next round of International Terror. I have no doubt this is our current condition, of which so much, to much is kept hush hush. Which is IMO not good policy at any level. We all have the need to know of upcoming threats, albeit even with old germ/chemical agents, being delivered 1st hand by our own citizens, into our Nation, let alone Jihadist....!

I've long thought most of my life, its a damn good thing Jihadist don't have Hyrdrazine, plutonium, uranium, beryllium, and/or Nuclear Components, but in fact they do; I believe. Iran's Nuclear capability if you've noticed under Obuma, has been kept quiet, since the last American/Israeli covert destruction of nuclear enrichment facilities; by simply re-programming equipment. I haven't heard a Public Statement on as much in too long now. I'd not be surprised with anything these days. In fact, I've been awaiting for a Nuke or Chemical/bio-logical strike/delivery to Western Nations.

With The Islamic Republic of Pakistan, the break up of the U.S.S.R., Iran, Al Qaeda, Taliban, ISIS/ISIL, N. Korea, and numerous others. Who's to tell Americans the truth of the matter, publicly? It sure as Hell isn't our Politicians, these days; to make transparent any and all results, of missing Materials and/or Launch Platforms from such Groups.

I would not be surprised to hear "publicly"; in years to come, how such weapons have indeed fallen into Jihadist or anti-Western terrorists hands, quit some time ago....! If not, its only a matter of time, IMO....! The threat(s) are real; for any one to assume anything less, at this point would be naivete, IMO. Perhaps, with no paranoia, beyond my wildest imagination(s).....

"Yukon; Great North-woods or Bust"

Hell, I'd settle for a 1 way ticket, cabin or cave in the Hudson Bay......! Who said "Doomsday Preppers" were Paranoid, or simply know more than some are letting on? Makes 1 wonder to say the least...!

http://www.americanthinker.com/2014/10/is_ebola_the_same_virus_as_the_black_death.html
 
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Again Thanx Tom, sorry for the long response time, and response itself.....good stuff, now where did I bury the door to this Mojave Bunker .... ? :smile:
 
Definitely not the last of this story.
 
It took 13 years?

Would have stayed quiet if ISIS/ISIL didn't pop off a few Chem rounds at the Kurds. Chemical weapons and long range missiles and rockets weren't the top tier wmds the west wanted to get. Bioweapons and nuke program were the hot buttons. Bioweapons were destroyed sometime between 91 and 03 as we now know. The nuke program was shipped off to Sunni buds in Syria.... Later destroyed by Israeli. That full story won't come out for another 20 years.
 
Would have stayed quiet if ISIS/ISIL didn't pop off a few Chem rounds at the Kurds. Chemical weapons and long range missiles and rockets weren't the top tier wmds the west wanted to get. Bioweapons and nuke program were the hot buttons. Bioweapons were destroyed sometime between 91 and 03 as we now know. The nuke program was shipped off to Sunni buds in Syria.... Later destroyed by Israeli. That full story won't come out for another 20 years.


How can they tell if those weapons have been sitting there for 5 years or 20 years?
 
How can they tell if those weapons have been sitting there for 5 years or 20 years?

That's a very broad question....there are dozens of ways to know how long weapons, were created, where, when, how long they've been sitting; especially Shells, ie Platform Delivery Casings, and contents.
 
The Freedom of Information Act allowed certain documents to be viewed detailing they were found.... A while ago... Just made available I guess...
 
The Freedom of Information Act allowed certain documents to be viewed detailing they were found.... A while ago... Just made available I guess...

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those chem weapons were always there....The U.S. Govt/Military probably weren't too anxious to publicize it because "we" are the ones who gave them to Saddam and backed him with his war with Iran.

Saddam was offering 25K to the families of any suicide bomber attacking Israel..remember those horrible suicide bombers on civilian Israeli buses?
Oh...and another detail...didn't Kuwait (?) discover and prevent an assassination attempt by Saddam's people on Bush Sr. when he (Bush Sr) was scheduled to make an appearance/speech there?

So, we had WMDs, a known head of State (Saddam) and Country endorsing, helping and rewarding suicide bomber/terrorists....attempting to kill a former U.S. President....help me out here...

Some may disagree with the Iraqi War- some may believe it wasn't worth losing American Troops.
I can certainly understand it........but........
 
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The Freedom of Information Act allowed certain documents to be viewed detailing they were found.... A while ago... Just made available I guess...

_________________________________

those chem weapons were always there....The U.S. Govt/Military probably weren't too anxious to publicize it because "we" are the ones who gave them to Saddam and backed him with his war with Iran.

Saddam was offering 25K to the families of any suicide bomber attacking Israel..remember those horrible suicide bombers on civilian Israeli buses?
Oh...and another detail...didn't Kuwait (?) discover and prevent an assassination attempt by Saddam's people on Bush Sr. when he (Bush Sr) was scheduled to make an appearance/speech there?

So, we had WMDs, a known head of State (Saddam) and Country endorsing, helping and rewarding suicide bomber/terrorists....attempting to kill a former U.S. President....help me out here...

Some may disagree with the Iraqi War- some may believe it wasn't worth losing American Troops.
I can certainly understand it........but........

I do not disagree with you... What I said was the document saying they were there was just made available thanks to the Freedom of Information Act...
 
Shells have serial numbers as do sub components. Contents degrade over time in predictable fashion knowing the original material purity at the time of fill...which we should know from the records collection and knowledge of the processes...which the west installed. Iraq was the enemy of our enemy Iran.
 
...do we really know where these munitions were manufactured?...I mean can't empty shells be bastardized and reloaded with lord knows what?
 
...do we really know where these munitions were manufactured?...I mean can't empty shells be bastardized and reloaded with lord knows what?

If you know what you are doing...sure. Doubt you need that much sophistication to produce and fill. Blister agents like mustard gas and nerve agents like satin can be produced in most pesticide operations, or university lab. Most of these shells were made before the 80's as I understand it.
 
If you know what you are doing...sure. Doubt you need that much sophistication to produce and fill. Blister agents like mustard gas and nerve agents like satin can be produced in most pesticide operations, or university lab. Most of these shells were made before the 80's as I understand it.

ditto, that's my take as well. Some contents can be traceable to specific facilities, Labs, et al. In some cases, a manufacturer albeit legit or otherwise, can also be identified by specific chemical processing signatures, (from what little I know)....!!!
 
Priorities. Equivalent of a couple million dollar investment per victim, where those victims don't earn a 1000 bucks in their lifetime. Very simple math....from an actuarial perspective.
 
Priorities. Equivalent of a couple million dollar investment per victim, where those victims don't earn a 1000 bucks in their lifetime. Very simple math....from an actuarial perspective.

Wow, makes sense though....Thanks...!
 

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