Our Big 3

[Boob-No-More]

I'm not trolling. LOL.

The Bulls have Derrick Rose, 2 all-stars, and a 3rd guy who may well be (Noah). They're a superstar away from being a legit contender.

Which of this big 3 is your Rose? MVP candidate.

Yet another Strawman. Go back and read my original post and tell me where I said anything about winning a championship.

No, we don't have a legitimate MVP candidate or a legitimate shot at a title this year. I never claimed we did. Neither did your bulls during Rose's rookie year. And even with your recent MVP, you also have zero championships.


BNM

 

[crowTrobot]

Which of this big 3 is your Rose? MVP candidate.

MVP thief. Lebron should have 4 in a row.

 

[Denny Crane]

Well, Lillard could turn into a superstar, but I don't know if MVP candidate. A lot of MVP candidate is who is chosen as the "one" by the NBA. You can't tell me they don't sell certain players over others.

Rose won his MVP for 25 PPG / 8 APG on the winningest team in the league, taking the big shots whenever they occurred. He was the 3rd player in NBA history to score 2000 points and dish 600 assists (Jordan, LeBron the other two). Maybe he should have been 2nd to LeBron, but I don't think he was particularly chosen. Like, the fans chose him to start in the All-Star game.

 

[Denny Crane]

Yet another Strawman. Go back and read my original post and tell me where I said anything about winning a championship.

No, we don't have a legitimate MVP candidate or a legitimate shot at a title this year. I never claimed we did. Neither did your bulls during Rose's rookie year. And even with your recent MVP, you also have zero championships.


BNM

Right. Bulls have won no championships since Jordan. There's your formula - 30 PPG scorer and a 20+ PPG scorer wing man.

And I wrote the Bulls aren't real contenders even with a guy in the MVP discussion (and who's won one). I don't think it bodes well for the Bulls to have him and no second superstar. They already have all-stars, and all-stars aren't enough.

 

[Denny Crane]

MVP thief. Lebron should have 4 in a row.

Rose was 1st in MVP voting with 113 of 120 votes.

LeBron came in 3rd in MVP voting, behind D Howard.

Go figure

 

[julius]

Rose won his MVP for 25 PPG / 8 APG on the winningest team in the league, taking the big shots whenever they occurred. He was the 3rd player in NBA history to score 2000 points and dish 600 assists (Jordan, LeBron the other two). Maybe he should have been 2nd to LeBron, but I don't think he was particularly chosen. Like, the fans chose him to start in the All-Star game.

I think having crappy starters, or starters who don't play as starters te whole season, doesn't exactly prove your point. It just says that their players were so crappy they had to play anyone.

also, re: Rose MVP.

LeBron averaged more points, more rebounds, more steals, shot better from 2 AND 3.

 

[Denny Crane]

The whole thing is I disagree that 3x 20 PPG scorers bodes well for the future or anything else.

What bodes well is IF Lillard plays this well for his entire rookie season, you have a guy who outplayed guys like Rose in their rookie season. IF he makes the according upward steps in his game, you may well have that elite player. If it's LMA or someone else who ends up being his 2nd fiddle is an interesting question, but it won't matter if Lillard isn't the real deal.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Right. Bulls have won no championships since Jordan. There's your formula - 30 PPG scorer and a 20+ PPG scorer wing man.

Falling ass backwards into the greatest player of all time seems to be the best formula. Other than Jordan, it's actually pretty rare for a team with a player who averages more than 30ppg game (or to lead the league in scoring) to win the NBA championship.

BNM

 

[crowTrobot]

Rose was 1st in MVP voting with 113 of 120 votes.

LeBron came in 3rd in MVP voting, behind D Howard.

Go figure

In 10/11 lebron was penalized for the decision fiasco and for the heat not coming together right away. doesn't mean he wasn't still the MVP. he led the league in PER, win share, and win share /48 and had much better overall numbers than rose including 27.4 to 23.5 PER, .591 to .550 TS% (etc.) while having better defensive stats and almost as many assists. really it shouldn't have even been close between those two.

 

[Denny Crane]

Falling ass backwards into the greatest player of all time seems to be the best formula. Other than Jordan, it's actually pretty rare for a team with a player who averages more than 30ppg game (or to lead the league in scoring) to win the NBA championship.

BNM

How about 27 PPG - that was good enough for last season. LeBron has scored 30 PPG, so I'd call him a 30 PPG scorer.

The greatest player of all time got us 6 championships. 20 PPG scorers rarely get even one.

 

[Denny Crane]

In 10/11 lebron was penalized for the decision fiasco and for the heat not coming together right away. doesn't mean he wasn't still the MVP. he led the league in PER, win share, and win share /48 and had much better overall numbers than rose including 27.4 to 23.5 PER, .591 to .550 TS% (etc.) while having better defensive stats and almost as many assists. really it shouldn't have even been close between those two.

I didn't vote, did you?

 

[julius]

how do you guys keep these threads going? I fall asleep and tend to forget that I posted anything in threads.

I seriously will see a check mark by a thread and think "wait..I posted in that thread?"

 

[Boob-No-More]

How about 27 PPG - that was good enough for last season. LeBron has scored 30 PPG, so I'd call him a 30 PPG scorer.

The greatest player of all time got us 6 championships. 20 PPG scorers rarely get even one.

Not sure where you're going with this, but yes, if you change the criteria/definition, you change the results. No surprise there.

But like LeBron, Jordan's (and Kobe's and Wilt's, etc.) scoring average was lower when they won their championships than at their peak. Yes, a dominant scorer increases your chances at a championship, but you also need some balance. It's still a team sport played 5-on-5. It wasn't until Jordan got better teammates, and learned how to play with them, that he started winning titles. Same with LeBron, same with Wilt.

Michael Jordan's scoring average during his 6 championship seasons:

1990-91 - 31.5
1991-92 - 30.1
1992-93 - 32.6
1995-96 - 30.4
1996-97 - 29.6
1997-98 - 28.7

Compare that to the four seasons before he won his first ring:

1986-87 - 37.1
1987-88 - 35.0
1988-89 - 32.5
1989-90 - 33.6

LeBron's scoring average his two hears in Miami were the lowest since his rookie year - and he finally won a championship. Like Jordan, he needed help. He needed multiple all-star teammates and this requires sharing the ball, sacrificing his own scoring and playing as a team. The Heat didn't have three players averaging 20ppg last season, but they were close:

LeBron James - 27.1
Dwyane Wade - 22.1
Chris Bosh - 18.0

And, if you're going to use the argument that LeBron is a 30ppg scorer, because he did it in the past, then I'll use the same argument that Bosh is a 20ppg scorer because he did it in the past. Therefore, the Heat needed 3 20ppg scorers to win a championship.

But, this is all really irrelevant to my original post. I never claimed the Blazers were going to win a championship this season, or any time soon, because they now have three players that appear capable of averaging 20ppg. However, I will say, they are much closer to being a solid playoff team now than they were last year. They still have some holes to fill, especially the bench, but having three players performing at near all-star level is a lot better than only having one.

BNM

 

[Natebishop3]

The Ducks lost yesterday and Denny is here pissing on my parade