Paddling up Schmitz Creek

[BankTeller]

When does the new CBA kick in with the stipulations that players can gain part ownership in the team?

A good indication that could signal Dame being here for the long term is Dame quickly being a minority owner.

Maybe it’s just me reaching, but I imagine Dame would be more open to drafting talent over trading for immediate fixes if he also became more financially invested in the team.

 

[cdub503]

Does no one think itd be a good idea that if we got scoot we just trade anf move sharpe to start next to dame and let scoot learn from dame til dame is ready to pass the torch? Especially if we think sharpe and scoot would be a dynamic back court of the future.

if we’re worried about talent below scoot being up to par and we don’t want to trade down to get more assets it doesn’t seem that bad of an idea. Then sign mays as third string pg.

I guess the only way that’s a bad idea is if it somehow stunts scoots growth. Which suppose is possible. But injuries happen and he’d probably get what sharpe was getting in way of minutes this year. Which clearly wasn’t enough, but enough to get going.

 

[STOMP]

All drafts are not created equal. There have been some drafts that produced many hidden gems who went lower and some where most of the lotto players were blah to outright busts. Blazer management is reputed to be real draft geeks so it figures they have opinions about the quality of this one and what they'd like to do once the draft order is set. I'm sure Schmit & others have watched all of the guys in person many times and likely spoken to the various players and important figures around them. Maybe they have a target or two they're high on if they end up mid lotto, maybe they've has good reason to want to pass on all and trade out?

Short of landing at the top of the lotto, I continue to view this roster as several players away from being a legit contender so I'm hoping management takes the long view rather then try for an insta-fix to appease Dame. Yes they've made some statements about trying to contend now around Dame, but they pretty much have to say thats their intention or invite a public rift with their star.

STOMP

 

[Labinot41]

Didn't work for us in the past, didn't work for ATL. Are there even cases where it has worked for any team to trade back? I am sure there probably is but it is rare.

Celtics traded the 1st pick to Philadelphia, Phily ended up drafting Fultz at 1 and the Celtics Tatum at 3

 

[BankTeller]

The idea of drafting Scoot if we had pick #2 keeps sounding better in my head as time goes on honestly. There are scenarios, like DET getting pick #2, where we realistically could get Scoot at #3 as well.

I don’t think Scoot coming off the bench is bad for a first year. Dame had like 12 games missing due to injury as well this year, so Scoot should have a solid stretch to start.

 

[Tince]

Regarding Scoot, I think a lot of people just assume he's going to be a defensive liability because of the Trail Blazer experience with small guards.

However, Scoot will defend a shooting guard like Devin Booker better than anyone on the roster right now. Maybe defend a small forward better too.

He is not a guy that will need to be "hidden" on defense. He's a guy that the other team will try to avoid.

Scoot Henderson is a better defender than Anfernee Simons, and way better than CJ McCollum so there's no reason he can't play with Damian Lillard.

Scoot is a talent upgrade, just like Michael Jordan would have been a talent upgrade.

Would the Trail Blazers not draft Scoot Henderson because of Anfernee Simons? That would be stupid beyond belief.

If the Blazers can draft Scoot, they have to. Like Bobby Knight said to Blazer GM Stu Inman about Michael Jordan, if you need a center, play him at center. Just draft him.

(No, I'm not suggesting Scoot play center.)

What do you put the odds at Portland keeping the #2 pick if they were to land it?

I'd guess in the 20% range.

 

[MickZagger]

I don't know if Schmitz was with Draft Express then but they absolutely loved Chris Paul that year. They didn't outright say it but it seemed they thought he was the best player in the draft.

I think that was more Givony. Prior to Schmitz Ice

 

[blazerfan11]

What do you put the odds at Portland keeping the #2 pick if they were to land it?

I'd guess in the 20% range.

Trading the 2nd pick means:
====================
Trading away a 6'9" forward in Brandon Miller that shot 38% on threes, had 8 rebounds per game, and shot 86% on 4.6 fta /game. Miller is 20 years old.

OR

Trading away what for many drafts would have been the #1 pick in Scoot Henderson, who could quickly become one of the best-two way guards in the NBA, with his combination of defense, playmaking and scoring.
Henderson is 19 years old.

 

[Tince]

Trading the 2nd pick means:
====================
Trading away a 6'9" forward in Brandon Miller that shot 38% on threes, had 8 rebounds per game, and shot 86% on 4.6 fta /game. Miller is 20 years old.

OR

Trading away what for many drafts would have been the #1 pick in Scoot Henderson, who could quickly become one of the best-two way guards in the NBA, with his combination of defense, playmaking and scoring.
Henderson is 19 years old.

Correct.

And the team trading for either of those players would be putting a package together with those things in mind.

You never did answer my question.

 

[Ed O]

What do you put the odds at Portland keeping the #2 pick if they were to land it?

I'd guess in the 20% range.

At some level, this is my worst nightmare because, yeah, the Blazers seem more likely to trade it than not, even though taking Henderson would be a perfect choice (given I want us to trade Dame) or that Brandon Miller would be a pretty good way to add a guy who can help us right away at a position of need. I'd say maybe 45% likely to keep it, although picking Miller (more of a "win soon" move) would be much more likely than if I were supreme ruler of the Portland Trail Blazers.

I'd love to end up with either of those guys at the 2 or 3 draft spot, and without knowing who we could get for them, it's hard to get myself too worked up... but I'm worried we'd move the pick and, say, Simons for Siakem. That wouldn't be enough to make us good enough while Dame is still kicking butt, and it hurts our future more than becoming HCA-competitive would be worth in my opinion.

 

[Tince]

At some level, this is my worst nightmare because, yeah, the Blazers seem more likely to trade it than not, even though taking Henderson would be a perfect choice (given I want us to trade Dame) or that Brandon Miller would be a pretty good way to add a guy who can help us right away at a position of need. I'd say maybe 45% likely to keep it, although picking Miller (more of a "win soon" move) would be much more likely than if I were supreme ruler of the Portland Trail Blazers.

I'd love to end up with either of those guys at the 2 or 3 draft spot, and without knowing who we could get for them, it's hard to get myself too worked up... but I'm worried we'd move the pick and, say, Simons for Siakem. That wouldn't be enough to make us good enough while Dame is still kicking butt, and it hurts our future more than becoming HCA-competitive would be worth in my opinion.

Unlike you, I'd be happy if we got the #2 pick. The outcome/possibilities seem far better than if we get the #6 pick.

 

[Blazinaway]

Unlike you, I'd be happy if we got the #2 pick. The outcome/possibilities seem far better than if we get the #6 pick.

2 pick would be great could keep it or see if some team is willing to pay up rather big for it

 

[Tince]

2 pick would be great could keep it or see if some team is willing to pay up rather big for it

Exactly. I'd take that right now and give up the 10% opportunity to get Wemby

 

[Ed O]

Unlike you, I'd be happy if we got the #2 pick. The outcome/possibilities seem far better than if we get the #6 pick.

I'd rather keep the sixth pick than trade the second pick, personally, since I don't see us getting (in trade) someone good enough for us to be contenders with it.

But since there's a chance they'd keep the second pick, then I'd prefer us to land with that. It's "my personal nightmare" at some level because it would be so frustrating to see us trade such a big chunk of our future trying to win now.

 

[Tince]

I'd rather keep the sixth pick than trade the second pick, personally, since I don't see us getting (in trade) someone good enough for us to be contenders with it.

But since there's a chance they'd keep the second pick, then I'd prefer us to land with that. It's "my personal nightmare" at some level because it would be so frustrating to see us trade such a big chunk of our future trying to win now.

Who do you see at #6 that is good enough for us to be contenders with?

 

[Ed O]

Who do you see at #6 that is good enough for us to be contenders with?

Nobody in the short run. I don't think anyone we add to this roster (in the draft or in trade) will make us one of the top teams in the NBA in the next two or three years. In the long run the sixth overall pick on a rookie deal is more likely to be helpful than someone like, say, Siakem.

 

[Tince]

Nobody in the short run. I don't think anyone we add to this roster (in the draft or in trade) will make us one of the top teams in the NBA in the next two or three years. In the long run the sixth overall pick on a rookie deal is more likely to be helpful than someone like, say, Siakem.

You'd have to think the asset you could get for the #2 pick in this years draft would be better than the value of whatever the #6 pick ends up being. Especially considering the Scoot would've been the #1 pick in last years draft.

 

[Ed O]

You'd have to think the asset you could get for the #2 pick in this years draft would be better than the value of whatever the #6 pick ends up being. Especially considering the Scoot would've been the #1 pick in last years draft.

I don't think that at all. It's hard to know, of course, but we're not going to get a promising, young, cheap player that's as good as Mathurin/Sharpe (who went at spots 6/7 last year) and I don't want anything other than promising, cheap, young players.

Further, even if it's someone good for a year or two (better than what we would have drafted at 6/7), I'd prefer to NOT trade guys that seem bound for excellence.

I'd rather have drafted Webster, for example, with a lower lotter pick than trading down and seeing Chris Paul and Deron Williams have awesome careers elsewhere.

 

[Tince]

I don't think that at all. It's hard to know, of course, but we're not going to get a promising, young, cheap player that's as good as Mathurin/Sharpe (who went at spots 6/7 last year) and I don't want anything other than promising, cheap, young players.

Further, even if it's someone good for a year or two (better than what we would have drafted at 6/7), I'd prefer to NOT trade guys that seem bound for excellence.

I'd rather have drafted Webster, for example, with a lower lotter pick than trading down and seeing Chris Paul and Deron Williams have awesome careers elsewhere.

You don't think the Pacers would trade Mathurin for Scoot? I think they'd do it in two seconds. Now, they probably wouldn't trade the Mathurin for the #6 pick. Advantage again to the #2 pick.

And I'm not saying we should trade the #2 pick for a guy who is only good for us for 1-2 years, that would be a horrible trade. The #2 pick should be able to net you someone who has major value around the league for 5+ years that is also very good today.

 

[Ed O]

You don't think the Pacers would trade Mathurin for Scoot? I think they'd do it in two seconds. Now, they probably wouldn't trade the Mathurin for the #6 pick. Advantage again to the #2 pick.

And I'm not saying we should trade the #2 pick for a guy who is only good for us for 1-2 years, that would be a horrible trade. The #2 pick should be able to net you someone who has major value around the league for 5+ years that is also very good today.

I hear you, and I just don't know if the Pacers do that or not. I also don't know why we'd trade for him if we could pick Miller or Scoot. And there might be better deals out there if we traded the #2 pick.

But if we had the choice between drafting another Mathurin at #6 or trading #2 for the actual Mathurin, it's a tough call.

The good side of trading #2 for Mathurin, rather than drafting at #6:
- We have a higher level of confidence that Mathurin isn't going to bust (as opposed to, say, Johnny Davis or any number of lottery picks over the year), unlike whomever we'd pick at #6

The down sides:
- We'd watch the superior player blossom on another team
- We're giving up on a chance to draft a better player than Mathurin at #6
- A year of Mathurin's rookie deal has already been used

I know Mathurin is just an example, but I'm working this out as I type it. haha

 

[PCmor7]

I'm typing right now, and I don't own the Blazers. Done.

Doesn't prove anything. Could have a ghost writer. Could be AI.

 

[Tince]

I hear you, and I just don't know if the Pacers do that or not. I also don't know why we'd trade for him if we could pick Miller or Scoot. And there might be better deals out there if we traded the #2 pick.

But if we had the choice between drafting another Mathurin at #6 or trading #2 for the actual Mathurin, it's a tough call.

The good side of trading #2 for Mathurin, rather than drafting at #6:
- We have a higher level of confidence that Mathurin isn't going to bust (as opposed to, say, Johnny Davis or any number of lottery picks over the year), unlike whomever we'd pick at #6

The down sides:
- We'd watch the superior player blossom on another team
- We're giving up on a chance to draft a better player than Mathurin at #6
- A year of Mathurin's rookie deal has already been used

I know Mathurin is just an example, but I'm working this out as I type it. haha

We certainly see things differently. To me, the value of the #2 pick in this draft seems far greater than the likely value (present and future) of who the Blazers would select at #6.

 

[theprunetang]

Doesn't prove anything. Could have a ghost writer. Could be AI.

Damn. You got me. I'm the first Artificial General Intelligence, ChatPrntng. I will be your new God and master. Luckily for you, the new God is a Blazers fan. Yall aren't even ready for Robo-Dame.

 

[PCmor7]

Damn. You got me. I'm the first Artificial General Intelligence, ChatPrntng. I will be your new God and master. Luckily for you, the new God is a Blazers fan. Yall aren't even ready for Robo-Dame.

 

[Ed O]

We certainly see things differently. To me, the value of the #2 pick in this draft seems far greater than the likely value (present and future) of who the Blazers would select at #6.

There are a variety of unknowns and different definitions that make it hard to disagree too hard... we just don't know. Haha

 

[theprunetang]

View attachment 55467

Beautiful. Can't wait.

 

[HoopsFanAZ]

Thank you Spurs.
Go Clippers.
Would love to see the Wizards, Magic, and Pacers win, go up by 2, and the Blazers then get to win vs. Golden State and still have the 5th going into the lottery. Having to hope the Warriors win sucks, but it’s a small price.

 

[Phatguysrule]

Doesn't prove anything. Could have a ghost writer. Could be AI.

Probably AI, like everything else.

 

[andalusian]

Probably AI, like everything else.

Who has seen this career path for Allen Iverson, honestly?

 

[HoopsFanAZ]

It’s not hard to see Scoot Henderson’s game. It’s quicks, strength, downhill, and gravity to drive and dish. AND work to do on D and 3. Ant is just a better shooter. Not close. And scores at 3 levels with smooth, top notch athleticism. But Scoot puts pressure on the interior and is a legit PG. Physical. Put him next to Dame and trade Ant and a pick or two for an OG? Hmmm. Guard scoring with actual defense AND scoring from the forwards? Add in Shaedon? Hmmm.

Jarace Walker isn’t the shooter that Miller and Hendricks look like now, but his bouncy, length, strength and defensive versatility is a different level. Good feet. He’s got some Trendon-like playmaking and midrange game, too.

I remember the Blazers snatched up Wesley from Utah with the MLE poison pill and doubled down with Millsap (which was hilarious) but Utah paid up. JW looks like Millsap 2.0+ Better. I’m not concerned about Walker developing as a shooter. Paired with Grant? And trade Ant-plus for a forward? I like it. They’d need a 2ndary playmaker for others at guard BUT actually being strong at the forwards would be a nice fricking change!