Plan B

[Mediocre Man]

for those that want to save cap space for "next time"...what if the same thing happens. should we once again save the cap space again until the next next summer? then the next next next summer if the "perfect storm" doesn't come along?

The one thing saving cap space does is get us more assets through the draft, and allows us to enact your all star plan. For example, maybe if Hibbert and Batum are gone, Portland adds 1 years guys and keeps 15 ish or so million for next year. Let's also say we land in the top 5 of the lottery. There is probably a pretty good chance that some team out there would want to move up to that spot, or if Freeland or Claver show signs, maybe want them in a cost cutting move. Having that cap space would benefit us in being able to take back a big salary

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

We have plenty of "assets" from the draft and stashed in europe right now. And we have cap space now and can take back big salaries. We are at the position you want to be hypothetically at NEXT summer, all at the cost of a wasted season of tanking, misery, low ticket sales, fan apathy, etc.

if you can't get something done now with what we have now...having a plan to do the same thing over in the future while losing guys like Aldridge in the process isn't the best plan of action IMO.

 

[Mediocre Man]

We have plenty of "assets" from the draft and stashed in europe right now. And we have cap space now and can take back big salaries. We are at the position you want to be hypothetically at NEXT summer, all at the cost of a wasted season of tanking, misery, low ticket sales, fan apathy, etc.

if you can't get something done now with what we have now...having a plan to do the same thing over in the future while losing guys like Aldridge in the process isn't the best plan of action IMO.

We don't have assets because no one knows if they can play. There isn't anyone out there now to go after. Also, having the lottery pick is a huge asset

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

We don't have assets because no one knows if they can play. There isn't anyone out there now to go after. Also, having the lottery pick is a huge asset

There will never be anyone to go after in your scenario. Do you see what you're doing here, this is the problem with the "imaginary cap space" phenomenon, you're waiting for the "perfect" fit guy when he doesn't exist. So you don't make any moves to preserve some sort of "plan", you tank and you're scared to make any trades because it damages your chance to get that "perfect fit guy" that doesn't exist. Rinse. Repeat. Waste time. Stars leave town. etc.

You basically don't have a plan other than to keep on amassing draft picks and waiting until Kevin Durant wants to be traded to Portland and we can offer imaginary draft picks for him.

 

[Mediocre Man]

There will never be anyone to go after in your scenario. Do you see what you're doing here, this is the problem with the "imaginary cap space" phenomenon, you're waiting for the "perfect" fit guy when he doesn't exist. So you don't make any moves to preserve some sort of "plan", you tank and you're scared to make any trades because it damages your chance to get that "perfect fit guy" that doesn't exist. Rinse. Repeat. Waste time. Stars leave town. etc.

You basically don't have a plan other than to keep on amassing draft picks and waiting until Kevin Durant wants to be traded to Portland and we can offer imaginary draft picks for him.

I do see what I am doing here. It's you that seems to be having trouble

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I do see what I am doing here. It's you that seems to be having trouble

Yes, you are wasting time and not having a competitive basketball team to basically recreate the same situation we have in the future. You'll continue repeating this same scenario ad infinitum since it won't work out because you'll be too scared to leap and make a decision.

 

[Nikolokolus]

just keep saying "imaginary capspace" because that is definitely making your point.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

just keep saying "imaginary capspace" because that is definitely making your point.

it does. I was right about it the first time, it was worthless.

:MARIS61:

 

[Sedatedfork]

We don't have assets because no one knows if they can play. There isn't anyone out there now to go after. Also, having the lottery pick is a huge asset

This is how I feel too. Why waste cap space (imaginary or not) to keep Batum when you probably aren't going to be very competitive even with Batum. If Batum had blown up in a contract year, then yeah maybe you keep him, but he didn't do that. He regressed if anything. If Hibbert gets matched, throw the young guys out there and see what you have. Then next year (even if you don't get a premier player via FA) you know where the holes are that need to be filled. You can overpay then if you think you have a chance to be competitive, but if not, why handcuff yourself with a bloated contract for a mediocre player?

EDIT: Oh and if LMA wants to leave then you trade him too. I don't exactly see LMA making noise about how the Blazers better lock up Batum.

 

[Minstrel]

it does. I was right about it the first time, it was worthless.

No, it wasn't...the Blazers landed Andre Miller, who was one of the best players over his time in Portland. In fact, the Blazers screwed up when they got rid of him.

I actually agree with your point that trying to hoard cap space for the perfect free agent is a bad way to think, but the cap space opened up by RLEC certainly paid dividends and you only undercut yourself by pretending it didn't. You lose credibility.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

No, it wasn't...the Blazers landed Andre Miller, who was one of the best players over his time in Portland. In fact, the Blazers screwed up when they got rid of him.

I actually agree with your point that trying to hoard cap space for the perfect free agent is a bad way to think, but the cap space opened up by RLEC certainly paid dividends and you only undercut yourself by pretending it didn't. You lose credibility.

We should have traded RLEC. Portland management was too scared to do so though to save this cap space they were building up. And they didn't "land" miller, he only fell into our lap because the original target didn't like the nightlife here.

 

[Nikolokolus]

it does. I was right about it the first time, it was worthless.

:MARIS61:

Just because the Blazers went hard for Hedo and then panicked into signing Miller so they could say they got something doesn't mean that maintaining cap flexibility is a flawed strategy for all teams and front offices.

 

[Minstrel]

We should have traded RLEC.

Easy to claim they should have made trades that you make up in your head. The actual facts are that they got a very good player with the RLEC cap space.

Imaginary trades! :MARIS61:

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Just because the Blazers went hard for Hedo and then panicked into signing Miller so they could say they got something doesn't mean that maintaining cap flexibility is a flawed strategy for all teams and front offices.

It isn't a flawed strategy to clear cap space. Just not two years into the future.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Easy to claim they should have made trades that you make up in your head. The actual facts are that they got a very good player with the RLEC cap space.

Imaginary trades! :MARIS61:

2 years of clearing cap space, promises of multiple max players....and we get Andre Miller. yay. no getting past first round of playoffs. glad it worked out.

 

[Nikolokolus]

It isn't a flawed strategy to clear cap space. Just not two years into the future.

It all boils down to pain tolerance and how much pain you can sell to your fans.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

It all boils down to pain tolerance and how much pain you can sell to your fans.

pain and tolerance? throw away 2 years of basketball to get an aging veteran PG that wouldn't put us over the top?

 

[Minstrel]

2 years of clearing cap space, promises of multiple max players....and we get Andre Miller. yay.

A high level point guard is a lot more than you're likely to get for a player who possesses no more value than an expiring contract. If you bought the hype that RLEC was going to mean "multiple superstars" and now feel silly for thinking that, I guess I can see your anger.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

A high level point guard is a lot more than you're likely to get for a player who possesses no more value than an expiring contract. If you bought the hype that RLEC was going to mean "multiple superstars" and now feel silly for thinking that, I guess I can see your anger.

that's what people were selling. and it wasn't just RLEC, it was the ZBO trade that started the whole imaginary cap space scenario. just that whole train of thought was ridiculous. and people want to put their eggs in that basket again?

we have the cap space now and young assets/lotto picks and what can we do with it? getting more draft picks and "saving cap space" (probably going to have less than we have now) is going to be another waste of time, we'll be at the same spot in a year.

 

[Minstrel]

that's what people were selling. and it wasn't just RLEC, it was the ZBO trade that started the whole imaginary cap space scenario. just that whole train of thought was ridiculous. and people want to put their eggs in that basket again?

The Randolph trade wasn't entirely about cap flexibility. Unfortunately, a big chunk of that seemed to be about "character," which I didn't like. They indirectly got Rudy Fernandez out of it (which seemed good at the time) and cap flexibility was supposed to be an ancillary benefit. I don't really agree that Pritchard's main plan was to open up cap space. I think his main plan was to build through the draft, with the right "character" guys. So I don't agree that he basically punted on two years of team-building for the sake of cap space.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

The cap plan was all orchestrated by Tom Penn, Cap Genius and they were trying to sell it as something to put us over the top with some great first tier players.

 

[Nikolokolus]

The cap plan was all orchestrated by Tom Penn, Cap Genius and they were trying to sell it as something to put us over the top with some great first tier players.

That's the trouble with KP when I look back. He and his management team were great at the sell to fans, but didn't seem to have much of a vision for how to execute the tricky parts after tearing things down.

Ultimately though, the failures of that regime have much less to do with messing up RLEC, and Miller and how they managed the cap and pivots on the failures of Oden and Roy to stay healthy.

 

[jlprk]

Yes, we got Miller for Raef, but we should have gotten so much more. Pritchard turned down trades at the midseason trade deadline, expecting GMs to crawl back, begging to give him more. The Pritchslap method was a monumental failure. We paid LaFrentz many more millions than a different player holding his 15th spot would have made, intending to invest in the trade Pritchard proved too arrogant to pull off.

When people criticize RLEC, it is no defense to answer that we got 1 year of Andre Miller. We should have gotten many years of someone better, or a full career from a high draft pick.