Police use of military equipment. Isn't that strictly a State issue? (1 Viewer)

[barfo]

I always forget about the sovereign right of cities to arm themselves and maintain a standing army.

Do you own a business?

Also, do you have a 3/4" socket, a blow-up doll, and an eggplant? We are having a treasure hunt...

barfo

 

[Minstrel]

Do you own a business?

Explain the relevance to this topic.

 

[MarAzul]

Also, do you have a 3/4" socket, a blow-up doll, and an eggplant? We are having a treasure hunt...

barfo

You will be hunting a long while I imagine.

 

[MarAzul]

Explain the relevance to this topic.

Think on it.

 

[Minstrel]

Think on it.

Unless given a reason to do so, I'm not going to be doing that.

Do you like corn? Think about how that relates to this topic and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

 

[MarAzul]

Unless given a reason to do so, I'm not going to be doing that.

Do you like corn? Think about how that relates to this topic and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Funny, you are damn near there. "unless given a reason, I'm not going to do that"! I know you will .

 

[Minstrel]

"unless given a reason, I'm not going to do that"! I know you will .

Your psychological warfare is truly dizzying. I will now be obsessed with figuring this out, and it will very likely ruin my life.

 

[MarAzul]

Your psychological warfare is truly dizzying. I will now be obsessed with figuring this out, and it will very likely ruin my life.

You don't need any police do you? Your point of view is cheap to come by. Own nothing Risk nothing

 

[MarAzul]

It all sound very cool doesn't it. Bandon has had a K9 unit for quite some time without the federal government paying the bill.
The COOS County Sheriffs department is a bit on the other side of the coin. They get a large part of their funding from the Feds, doing various federal funded projects.
The problem is they have little time to just be the local cops. They are often too busy to be on call for the a normal citizen.
However, they usually have the patrols out issuing seat belt violations, writing enough to keep their federal funding.

Do you see the connection? It's damn near sickening to watch the subversion, the tentacles attaching one by one. They are johnny spot on for that Fed money but the
neighborhood watch can't get a responder for burglary. The locally elected Sheriff sort of lacks the ability to be local instead of a puppet for the feds. Although he insists he will
when the issue is important.

Notice the Sheriff now has an individual on his payroll assigned to patrol the BLM land. There is a hell of a lot of it in Coos County and it provide zero revenue to the County but they got a Cop!!!

 

[Minstrel]

You don't need any police do you?

I think we all need police. Do we need militarized police (that is, police with military vehicles and armaments)? I don't think so.

 

[MarAzul]

I think we all need police. Do we need militarized police (that is, police with military vehicles and armaments)? I don't think so.

And I think that decision if fair game for the officials in Providence, Anchorage, Phoenix, Detroit and all other Cities in America. Your vote, if you give one, should count in one if you live in one. Same with Obama and Holder.

I expect you will always find me wanting the Cops better armed than the thugs. The will get my support first too, until proven they are wrong. I don't think they are there for fun and games.

 

[BlazerWookee]

Sharpton is right some of the time. This time, in fact.

You need to walk a mile in a black man from Ferguson's shoes. It might be an eye opener for you.

Fuck Al Sharpton. He's a race hustling poverty pimp.

 

[Denny Crane]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

It seems pretty clear to me that the cops shouldn't be wielding military weapons. If a military force is needed, the governor can call up the national guard. I suspect that would be rare.

 

[Denny Crane]

Fuck Al Sharpton. He's a race hustling poverty pimp.

True, but he's right on this one.

 

[MarAzul]

Fuck Al Sharpton. He's a race hustling poverty pimp.

Spot on Wookee!!

 

[MarAzul]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

It seems pretty clear to me that the cops shouldn't be wielding military weapons. If a military force is needed, the governor can call up the national guard. I suspect that would be rare.

I didn't see an M2 in any video, no Bofors either. What freaked you out?

 

[BlazerWookee]

This is gruesome. Watch if you dare.

[video=youtube;j-P54MZVxMU]

Shot 12 times for shoplifting two energy drinks and a pack of donuts from a convenience store.

http://www.newsweek.com/new-video-police-shooting-2nd-man-st-louis-emerges-266041

Bullshit. He was shot for walking towards two armed cops with weapons drawn, carrying a knife, shouting "shoot me, shoot me now!"

This was suicide by cop. Every move that dude made was deliberate and pre-planned. He hesitates long enough to make sure the cops see the knife in his hand, then begins his approach shouting "Shoot me now, shoot me now." He even pauses to check behind him, realizes people are in the line of fire, and changes his approach angle so he's the only one in the line of fire.

 

[Denny Crane]

Bullshit. He was shot for walking towards two armed cops with weapons drawn, carrying a knife, shouting "shoot me, shoot me now!"

This was suicide by cop. Every move that dude made was deliberate and pre-planned. He hesitates long enough to make sure the cops see the knife in his hand, then begins his approach shouting "Shoot me now, shoot me now." He even pauses to check behind him, realizes people are in the line of fire, and changes his approach angle so he's the only one in the line of fire.

I dare you to walk towards two cops.

SMH

The cops could have tazered him and should have. They murdered the guy.

 

[MarAzul]

I dare you to walk towards two cops.

SMH

The cops could have tazered him and should have. They murdered the guy.

Nope the police are not there to play fucking games.
I hope we never see that sort of crap begin.

You could triple the police force and they would be busy all over town playing those games.

 

[Denny Crane]

Nope the police are not there to play fucking games.
I hope we never see that sort of crap begin.

You could triple the police force and they would be busy all over town playing those games.

The cops aren't there to murder people. Their job is to serve and protect. Protect even the guy with the knife. They aren't military, whose job it is to kill people.

 

[Minstrel]

And I think that decision if fair game for the officials in Providence, Anchorage, Phoenix, Detroit and all other Cities in America.

Right, and I don't think that that decision is fair game for cities to make. That's basically our fundamental disagreement. The Constitution doesn't apply here because we're talking about items that belong to the federal government, so they can choose whether or not to allow them to local police forces. This isn't the federal government altering state laws or any other "sovereignty" issue.

 

[MarAzul]

The cops aren't there to murder people. Their job is to serve and protect. Protect even the guy with the knife. They aren't military, whose job it is to kill people.

Well go right on up to LA and tell the l Chief how you will volunteer to show the nation how to get it done, set the style.
We will all watch to see how you do.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

What ever happened to those beanbag shot guns the police were using? I think those are better than tazers.

 

[MarAzul]

Right, and I don't think that that decision is fair game for cities to make. That's basically our fundamental disagreement. The Constitution doesn't apply here because we're talking about items that belong to the federal government, so they can choose whether or not to allow them to local police forces. This isn't the federal government altering state laws or any other "sovereignty" issue.

It is now because Surplus is a plethora a things and I don't think you object to parkas. I don't exactly know what the hell you object to but I know we aren't talking about M2s, I might agree at that point.

 

[Natebishop3]

How in the hell can you suggest how the people in any city other than your own run their business? The Constitution lays down the basis right we all have but beyond that the Federal government has no role nor should it.
The people elect the Mayor and the City council who hire the police including the Chief and the buy the equipment. What the hell else do you want???
Step back a notice that only 12% of the people in Ferguson seem to give a shit about this process! I sure as hell don't think OBama can come save their asses with a fucking review! Do you think that will work?
Is the Federal government going to now start paying and directing the Police??? Holy Cow, things will go to shit in rapid fashion.

The weapons that are being provided to the police were not commissioned, designed, or paid for with Federal dollars so they could be used against the people of this country. It is completely within the realm of control for the Feds to decide if military surplus will be (essentially) given to the local law enforcement for next to nothing. If the local PD wants to pay their own money to design and build armored vehicles, and they can find the room in their budget, and the local voters are okay with it, so be it. Otherwise, keep my federally funded weapons of war out of the hands of the people who are supposed to be protecting me. This hardware is being given to the local LE without any concession by the voters. In most cases it is done without the knowledge of the voters. We don't vote on whether we want cops to have military grade weaponry.

The military are the military. The police are the police. They are two completely separate groups with two completely different missions. If we have gotten to a point socially where our law enforcement need military grade vehicles, weapons, and body armor, then maybe it's time to take a closer look at our country.

Cops regularly wear plate carriers on a regular patrol session. PLATE CARRIERS. There's no fucking reason for a police officer to wear body armor designed for the military. If they want to wear kevlar, so be it, but plate carriers? I don't think so. I'm not even talking about in a riot scenario. I'm talking about in their patrol car on a every-day beat. It's completely uncalled for.

 

[MarAzul]

What ever happened to those beanbag shot guns the police were using? I think those are better than tazers.

I think they found out when you get one that shoots hard enough to knock a man down you might well kill him anyway. Then they were use too frivolously too often resulting in bad results.

 

[MarAzul]

The weapons that are being provided to the police were not commissioned, designed, or paid for with Federal dollars so they could be used against the people of this country. It is completely within the realm of control for the Feds to decide if military surplus will be (essentially) given to the local law enforcement for next to nothing. If the local PD wants to pay their own money to design and build armored vehicles, and they can find the room in their budget, and the local voters are okay with it, so be it. Otherwise, keep my federally funded weapons of war out of the hands of the people who are supposed to be protecting me. This hardware is being given to the local LE without any concession by the voters. In most cases it is done without the knowledge of the voters. We don't vote on whether we want cops to have military grade weaponry.

The military are the military. The police are the police. They are two completely separate groups with two completely different missions. If we have gotten to a point socially where our law enforcement need military grade vehicles, weapons, and body armor, then maybe it's time to take a closer look at our country.

Cops regularly wear plate carriers on a regular patrol session. PLATE CARRIERS. There's no fucking reason for a police officer to wear body armor designed for the military. If they want to wear kevlar, so be it, but plate carriers? I don't think so. I'm not even talking about in a riot scenario. I'm talking about in their patrol car on a every-day beat. It's completely uncalled for.

Holy Mackerel! I can not believe the people in this forum that want the cops to go out a face a mob burning down the fucking town bare chested with a bad ass look.
Not a fucking one of you willing to lead from the front.

 

[Natebishop3]

Holy Mackerel! I can not believe the people in this forum that want the cops to go out a face a mob burning down the fucking town bare chested with a bad ass look.
Not a fucking one of you willing to lead from the front.

Don't take the job. It's that simple. Don't take the job if you don't think you can do it. Shooting unarmed civilians is not okay. This is not a war zone. The ROE is different. They are being paid fairly well to put themselves in harms way. Firefighters don't carry guns. EMT's don't carry guns. They're getting paid for a hazardous job. They either accept that and do the job, or they don't and they can find something else to do with their lives. I get that you have cops in your family, but quite frankly I don't give a shit. They are hired to protect the people, not kill them.

 

[MarAzul]

Don't take the job. It's that simple. Don't take the job if you don't think you can do it. Shooting unarmed civilians is not okay. This is not a war zone. The ROE is different. They are being paid fairly well to put themselves in harms way. Firefighters don't carry guns. EMT's don't carry guns. They're getting paid for a hazardous job. They either accept that and do the job, or they don't and they can find something else to do with their lives. I get that you have cops in your family, but quite frankly I don't give a shit. They are hired to protect the people, not kill them.

You are fundamental in error. They are not hired to protect people, there are hired to enforce the law, with enforcement meaning by force if required. They are not there to risk it all and we sure as hell don't pay them enough for the risk you would fail to take yourself.

But I will keep in mind that you do not give a shit.

 

[magnifier661]

Don't take the job. It's that simple. Don't take the job if you don't think you can do it. Shooting unarmed civilians is not okay. This is not a war zone. The ROE is different. They are being paid fairly well to put themselves in harms way. Firefighters don't carry guns. EMT's don't carry guns. They're getting paid for a hazardous job. They either accept that and do the job, or they don't and they can find something else to do with their lives. I get that you have cops in your family, but quite frankly I don't give a shit. They are hired to protect the people, not kill them.

I'm going to have to disagree with that statement. The crime in England is terrible, which is a country where the police don't have guns. And in the end, when something like what's happened happens in England, their military come in without prejudice and fucks people up. Just ask the Irish