Poll: If Dame Doesn't Ask Out

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What Should Portland Do If Dame Wants to Stay?

  • Don't trade Dame if he doesn't ask to be traded

    Votes: 59 83.1%

  • Trade Him Whether He Wants it or Not

    Votes: 12 16.9%
  • Total voters
    71

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 1 (members: 0, guests: 1)
Let's just see what happens both on May 16th and June 22nd before we decide what the future of our franchise is. Regardless of the outcome it should be Dame leading the best roster we can muster as far as it can go but we'll see what happens.
 
wizenheimer said:
Blazers don't have good assets because of shitty management over a decade. Dame had nothing to do with that. But sure, lets make it his fault now to try and rationalize trading him away
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Who is saying it is Dame's fault? I've seen a number of posters reason why perhaps Dame should be traded, but apparently have missed on who said it was "his fault". Personally, I have posted that despite his amazing offensive production, it hasn't translated into Playoff success. That isn't saying it's his fault, but rather just a matter of reality. And since it isn't having an impact on the franchise in terms of being a contender, due to my career, I'm a 'sell high' person. He is coming off the best numbers of his career. Perhaps his greatest value to the franchise is what could be returned as this roster needs a LOT of help....more than just one player can provide.

It sucks that it has come to this, but waiting much longer, will bring on more age and diminish his value. You would want to make the best of a bad situation and get as much as you could as a franchise. Would it make a difference? Who knows. What we do know, is he was offensively brilliant.....and we are still 3rd from the absolute bottom in the West. 3 of the last 4 years we are sub .500. Players have change, coaches have change, and management has changed. There is only one thing left outside of ownership, which can't be controlled.

Saying good-bye is difficult, but at what point do you move on? Or do you just keep doing the same thing. Sometimes it's not anyone's fault, it just doesn't work out and you have to move on. That is the case in business, marriage, sports, and almost any other example. You have the discussion, and make every attempt to move Dame to a place where he can win, but it almost has to be explored. To give Dame the opportunity to win a ring and to help the Blazer franchise have an opportunity to reset.

IF the Blazers somehow luck into Wemby, AND can trade Ant and a pick for another bigger, lengthier piece, AND some vets are willing to sign here on the cheap thinking Portland has a shot to win a tittle.....that is about the only way I see Dame having a shot here. That is a lot of "candy and nuts".
 
Portland does not have to put together the best team to win a title. Just good enough to win a title. There is a difference. A lot can happen during a season. Look at BKN and PHO. If KD isnt healthy then they blew their wad for nothing. Dallas: shit show with arguably the best player in the world. LAC: shit show. LAL: done.
 
I would try my best to convince him that trading him for the twilight of his career is best for him and the franchise.

If I failed, I wouldn’t trade him, so I can’t say #2. But man would I make a strong, strong case.
 
Cugel said:
Portland does not have to put together the best team to win a title. Just good enough to win a title. There is a difference. A lot can happen during a season. Look at BKN and PHO. If KD isnt healthy then they blew their wad for nothing. Dallas: shit show with arguably the best player in the world. LAC: shit show. LAL: done.
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We need to put together a team that doesn't totally collapse if Dame misses 10 games in a season. The teams we've had over the last... two decades?? have been extremely brittle. We have no depth whatsoever, and we haven't had proper depth since Batum made a 0.5 second tip-in to win the game. So that's... what... 15 years?

All that said, I agree we won't get there by trading Dame. But we won't get there by not trading Dame, either, so we should be looking to stat record books to solidify Dame's legacy now. Let him retire a Blazer, and then rebuild. Jodi or no, we won't be contenders until the 2030's.
 
BassPlaya said:
Lol. Top producer in the history of the franchise.
Smart.
BBIQ top notch.
Community guy off the charts
Loyalty unprecedented



Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. Trade him
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All amazing traits. But no where in that list in anything about TEAM success. And I think that is the reason some people are at least considering looking at moving him while you should be able to get amazing assets back for him. Unless we aren't trying to win, which in that case, just continue to roll along in lower mediocrity.
 
TBpup said:
All amazing traits. But no where in that list in anything about TEAM success. And I think that is the reason some people are at least considering looking at moving him while you should be able to get amazing assets back for him. Unless we aren't trying to win, which in that case, just continue to roll along in lower mediocrity.
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Unless we amass some real talent in the front office, trading dame would be a complete and utter waste. At least here he's still an asset.

EDIT: to add, sports above the junior high level is absolutely not about winning. It's about making money. Teams are businesses, and no business is trying to win games; they're trying to be profitable. If he retires here, the team gets a ton of good press (and avoids fan backlash), a ton of ticket sales from the years they kept him, and they save hundreds of millions of dollars by not taking back contracts in trade.
 
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TBpup said:
All amazing traits. But no where in that list in anything about TEAM success. And I think that is the reason some people are at least considering looking at moving him while you should be able to get amazing assets back for him. Unless we aren't trying to win, which in that case, just continue to roll along in lower mediocrity.
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Can we just agree that everyone here wants the Blazers to win? I get why some folks want to trade Dame while the Blazers can still get a haul of assets for him, but I think it's also pretty clear that management are committed to trying to build a contender around Dame. The way I see it, Cronin is doing everything possible to max out the value of his trade assets going into this summer. That's his window to make a significant deal that acquires a player capable of bumping the Blazers into contending status. If he pulls it off, then obviously any thought of trading Dame is out the window for now. I can't imagine that there are many folks here who would advocate trading Dame if there's a legitimate shot at contending for a title with him in a Blazers uniform. It would be the sports story of the century in Portland.

But I also think that there's a chance that Cronin whiffs. Other teams aren't obligated to help the Blazers out. They're only going to make a deal if it's to their benefit. If Cronin can't find a trade that brings a big enough star back to establish a true "Big 3", then I think it's very likely that both Dame and the Blazers agree that it's time to move on. If that happens, then looking for the best deal for both parties is the obvious play. I don't' see anyone here who, in the event where he's not going to win a title here, would seriously object to helping Dame find a place where he can get a ring and the Blazers receive a bunch of assets to fuel the rebuild. I just hope it doesn't come to that.
 
wizenheimer said:
"he makes too much"

how much should a top-10ish player make?

Dame makes 34% of the current salary cap. The projection for the cap next year still has him at 34% of the cap. 10 NBA players make as much as Dame or more; 10 other players make within 6M of Dame which is still over 30% of the cap. 20 players paid at least 30% of the salary cap while Jokic and Embiid will join them next season

as for cap-room....LOL...when has that ever mattered for Portland. The last time Portland had cap-space they spent it on Evan Turner, Allen Crabbe, and Festus Ezeli....after striking out on Chandler Parsons

Blazers don't have good assets because of shitty management over a decade. Dame had nothing to do with that. But sure, lets make it his fault now to try and rationalize trading him away
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I apologize. It’s tricky for me to convey my thoughts sometime, especially in writing. Dame should make all the money. He is a phenomenal superstar on and off the floor. What I meant was for our team to build a contender around Dame, given our current roster, he makes too much. IMO.

A small portion of our issues are because of Dame. That being said, since the team has fucked this up so much, trading Dame and starting over with Sharpe makes some sense
 
I want to trade Dame and I don't care about getting some massive haul back. I want to send him somewhere he can actually be part of some good teams.

Thinking about where this is all heading just depresses me. If things continue on the path they are on Damian will not be remembered how fans want him to be. The closest comparison I can think of is Reggie Miller and the Blazers haven't had even 1/3 the team success that the Pacers had in those years. Reggie went to the conference finals 6 times, including a trip to the finals.
 
TBpup said:
Who is saying it is Dame's fault? I've seen a number of posters reason why perhaps Dame should be traded, but apparently have missed on who said it was "his fault". Personally, I have posted that despite his amazing offensive production, it hasn't translated into Playoff success. That isn't saying it's his fault, but rather just a matter of reality. And since it isn't having an impact on the franchise in terms of being a contender, due to my career, I'm a 'sell high' person. He is coming off the best numbers of his career. Perhaps his greatest value to the franchise is what could be returned as this roster needs a LOT of help....more than just one player can provide.

It sucks that it has come to this, but waiting much longer, will bring on more age and diminish his value. You would want to make the best of a bad situation and get as much as you could as a franchise. Would it make a difference? Who knows. What we do know, is he was offensively brilliant.....and we are still 3rd from the absolute bottom in the West. 3 of the last 4 years we are sub .500. Players have change, coaches have change, and management has changed. There is only one thing left outside of ownership, which can't be controlled.

Saying good-bye is difficult, but at what point do you move on? Or do you just keep doing the same thing. Sometimes it's not anyone's fault, it just doesn't work out and you have to move on. That is the case in business, marriage, sports, and almost any other example. You have the discussion, and make every attempt to move Dame to a place where he can win, but it almost has to be explored. To give Dame the opportunity to win a ring and to help the Blazer franchise have an opportunity to reset.

IF the Blazers somehow luck into Wemby, AND can trade Ant and a pick for another bigger, lengthier piece, AND some vets are willing to sign here on the cheap thinking Portland has a shot to win a tittle.....that is about the only way I see Dame having a shot here. That is a lot of "candy and nuts".
Click to expand...

A lot of “candy and nuts” you say? Sounds like Trail mix. A young scoring guard + a lottery pick + freed up 1st rounders …
 
1st off, should the Blazers be dumb enough to trade Dame, they likely would get crap in return if they at least traded him to a contender to do right by him. The only way the Blazers would get any value, is by trading him to a bad franchise who isn't going anywhere soon, and continues to be high in the Lottery, PERIOD! That would be doing Dame dirty in the highest. Trading Dame is buffoonery if he doesn't want to go. If he was traded to a contender, the return would be CRAPTASTIC. Late round 1sr rounders are glorified 2nd rounders, especially in the one & done era. Most of the picks would end up being two way type guys. I want to enjoy the awesome talent that Dame is till he retires. You don't get generational talent in return when you trade a player like Dame. The thought is cringe worthy. I want to put off watching a bunch of silly puddy guys as long as possible. I'm at least entertained by watching the greatness of Dame. But STOP! with this, "we'll get a haul B.S. ". OKC had to trade for their great player in Shai. All thoses picks have netted some nice pieces, but only Shai is looking special. Giddy, and Williams look to be Ant type level players going forward. Who know if the Chetster can even stay healthy. We all hope that Sharpe is special, but it's not like he's started awesome out of the shute like LeBron, Carmelo, or D Wade. Dame was special from DAY ONE. Enjoy the ride.
 
Knowing their luck, they'd end up with a Clyde Drexler to the Rockets for Otis Thorpe (for 34 games) kinda trade.
 
Mediocre Man said:
A small portion of our issues are because of Dame. That being said, since the team has fucked this up so much, trading Dame and starting over with Sharpe makes some sense
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I just wanted to find out how people gauged the situation if Dame didn't ask to be traded

obviously, it's a completely different situation if Dame asks to be traded. If that happens then the leverage is all with Portland. I don't think the Blazers would be obligated to trade Dame to a sure-fire contender. Their obligation would be to get the best return possible.

Now, the market for Dame would likely be contenders or near-contenders. And unfortunately, I don't think the Blazers will get a good return. Certainly not anywhere close to the godfather return I see some people fantasizing about. It's more likely to be maybe one decent young player, a prospect, or two, a couple of large contracts to meet CBA trade balance, and 2-4 mid-to-late first's and pick swaps. The chances of any lottery picks are very remote

and if that happens, then Portland just has to gut the team and commit to being a bottom feeder, maybe for 5-7 years, in order to land some high lottery picks. And when I say gut the team that means trading any veteran player like Nurkic & Grant; AND trading Simons because trying to build around him would be abject idiocy. He already has too much MeJ in his game which includes limited talent; I'd hate to see what happens if he had a green light to MeJ all night, every night. Sharpe is the only sure keeper on the roster in a trade-Dame situation. And I'm convinced the synergy between Shape and Ant will always be bad. Maybe keep Watford. But Portland would just have to gut the team in favor of draft assets. And they'd need to dump long-term contracts in order to be a dumping ground for expiring & short contracts in exchange for more draft assets

a complete and full rebuild
 
wizenheimer said:
I just wanted to find out how people gauged the situation if Dame didn't ask to be traded

obviously, it's a completely different situation if Dame asks to be traded. If that happens then the leverage is all with Portland. I don't think the Blazers would be obligated to trade Dame to a sure-fire contender. Their obligation would be to get the best return possible.

Now, the market for Dame would likely be contenders or near-contenders. And unfortunately, I don't think the Blazers will get a good return. Certainly not anywhere close to the godfather return I see some people fantasizing about. It's more likely to be maybe one decent young player, a prospect, or two, a couple of large contracts to meet CBA trade balance, and 2-4 mid-to-late first's and pick swaps. The chances of any lottery picks are very remote

and if that happens, then Portland just has to gut the team and commit to being a bottom feeder, maybe for 5-7 years, in order to land some high lottery picks. And when I say gut the team that means trading any veteran player like Nurkic & Grant; AND trading Simons because trying to build around him would be abject idiocy. He already has too much MeJ in his game which includes limited talent; I'd hate to see what happens if he had a green light to MeJ all night, every night. Sharpe is the only sure keeper on the roster in a trade-Dame situation. And I'm convinced the synergy between Shape and Ant will always be bad. Maybe keep Watford. But Portland would just have to gut the team in favor of draft assets. And they'd need to dump long-term contracts in order to be a dumping ground for expiring & short contracts in exchange for more draft assets

a complete and full rebuild
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I agree with almost everything you're saying but I'm not positive about Ant. I think he's being enabled to take on that MeJ role but he still seems like a young and pretty humble guy with a lot of talent. If he was tasked with being the point guard on a team with Shae and other young prospects and was told he needed to concentrate on being a facilitator first then I think he would try much harder at doing that than he has been. Now if we can trust Chauncey to execute that is a whole other story.

I'm just really hoping all of this is unnecessary. I'm hoping we ship out Ant and Nurk along with picks for a player that will help us win a lot with Dame, Jerami, Shaedon and even do so while being coached by Chauncey because while I'm skeptical I haven't given up hope on him. Obviously other pieces would have to be acquired but that's the framework I'm really hoping we are working with going forward.
 
One of the talk shows recommended Lillard should seek input from Kevin Garnett. Minnesota was terrible in KG's final 2 years there. Garnett didn't want to go through another rebuild, and got traded to Boston for the epic anything is possible championship run.

 
Whyachi said:
One of the talk shows recommended Lillard should seek input from Kevin Garnett. Minnesota was terrible in KG's final 2 years there. Garnett didn't want to go through another rebuild, and got traded to Boston for the epic anything is possible championship run.

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Whoever that Skip Baylee wannabe (god it’s sickening that is even a thing) is really hurting the overall argument. Dame doesn’t care what these guys want.

I think there are two ways this offseason goes and the crossroads is around draft day. Joe will either get one or more big trade(s) done that make us competitive or I think he just drafts with both firsts, tells Dame he couldn’t get it done then Dame is basically told to ask for a trade so Joe obliges and we will hopefully have a young team to watch as they grow. Joe will either attempt what I think is a manageable fourth down conversion or he’ll send out the ultimate punt team.
 
From a pure future talent perspective I believe the Blazers would have the most long term talent by trading Dame now. The Blazers don't have a path to contend in the short term. All of that would lead toward voting to trade Dame.

However being the best player in franchise history, as well as his ability to help as an old veteran, and the view that could put on the franchise forever, I lean towards just keeping Dame. Letting him build a legacy here might ultimately be much more than the draft picks or young potential the Blazers could receive in a trade.

I'm ok with the franchising do a late career Kobe style rebuild where they lose, let Dame score a bunch, and build with youth.

What I don't want to see is trading away our youth and picks for mediocre veterans in a doomed to fail attempt to win immediately.
 
Everything Beagle said:
We need to put together a team that doesn't totally collapse if Dame misses 10 games in a season. The teams we've had over the last... two decades?? have been extremely brittle. We have no depth whatsoever, and we haven't had proper depth since Batum made a 0.5 second tip-in to win the game. So that's... what... 15 years?

All that said, I agree we won't get there by trading Dame. But we won't get there by not trading Dame, either, so we should be looking to stat record books to solidify Dame's legacy now. Let him retire a Blazer, and then rebuild. Jodi or no, we won't be contenders until the 2030's.
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I think adding a near All Star PF instead of trading Hart would have made us a contender at least, talent wise).

If we can add a PF like that now, Sharpe may be good enough at the 2 to make it worthwhile for Dame. I don't think he wants a guaranteed title. He wants the opportunity. I think we're close enough to get him that.

And if you can improve the bench and catch lightning in a bottle...
 
Mediocre Man said:
I apologize. It’s tricky for me to convey my thoughts sometime, especially in writing. Dame should make all the money. He is a phenomenal superstar on and off the floor. What I meant was for our team to build a contender around Dame, given our current roster, he makes too much. IMO.

A small portion of our issues are because of Dame. That being said, since the team has fucked this up so much, trading Dame and starting over with Sharpe makes some sense
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Dame has said he'd be willing to take a paycut to contend.

Not sure of the details on how that could work, but if they can get close Dame will do his part to put them over the top.
 
Phatguysrule said:
Dame has said he'd be willing to take a paycut to contend.

Not sure of the details on how that could work, but if they can get close Dame will do his part to put them over the top.
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his contract appears locked for the next 3 seasons. CBA rules would prevent a re-negotiation. The final season of his extension, in 2026-27, is a player option. So he could opt out then re-sign for less
 
I wonder how many people change their mind on what's actually happened on and off the court.

As for me:
  • I was in favor of trading Dame before this season. I thought we were going to be mediocre again, and struggle to get into the playoffs. I thought that if we made it, we could advance a round (or maybe two!) because Dame and Simons are such good scorers that we could sneak up on teams.
  • I am still in favor of trading Dame. We were mediocre this year and missed the playoffs again. Dame is a year older and closer to his massive extension, but he's also a super-awesome player and should bring good value back in trade.
Some of you all:
  • Some people were opposed to trading Dame before this season. They either thought we could challenge for HCA and/or they thought we'd make a trade that would somehow balance the roster and make us more competitive.
  • Some people are still opposed to trading Dame. We did not challenge for HCA and/or make a trade that somehow balanced the roster and made us more competitive.
Some others:
  • Some people were opposed to trading Dame before this season. They don't care about winning as much as they care about his commitment to the city and the franchise and that he's fun to watch on any given night.
The latter group... that's cool. I get it. I don't have the same values as a fan as those people, but I get it.

The former group... it's insanity to me. It's like this year didn't happen, and the same arguments and sentiments are being expressed that were last offseason. Some of these folks would have traded the pick that became Sharpe, and/or they thought Grant would be a difference-maker. They had faith that Cronin's "work in progress" statements about building a winner with Dame had any substance. It didn't make much sense last summer, and it makes even less sense now that a whole season of real world evidence disproves it.
 
Ed O said:
Build a time machine and not sign such a massive extension? I think that's about the only way that works.
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I was legit asking too. Wasn’t sure if the league, players union, etc. would allow a player to break his contract
 
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