Exclusive Removal of Historical Confederate Monuments

[rasheedfan2005]

Firstly, let me say that I am glad to see a lot of reasoned, mature, and rational answers in this thread about this subject. I'm seriously impressed.



There you go. Well said.



Yep. It would seem hypocritical to be selective with what we want to remove from our past. It's no secret that most of our country's past has dealt with a lot of racism and white supremacy over the past 240 years. Why now are we suddenly becoming offended by symbols of the Confederacy?



Well said. I'm not sure how removing statues of Stonewall Jackson and General Lee (who was an officer with the Union, whom declined an offer of Generalship with the North because he genuinely felt that state's rights were being violated; not because he supported Slavery) will be better for our country.

Lee is widely considered to be one of the greatest Generals and military minds who ever lived, and he was much loved by not just the South, but the North as well. And Jackson was also a brilliant military strategist who played a MAJOR role in the Civil War. Both of these men's strategies are still taught today in military colleges.



Exactly. Most people who fly the Confederate Flag today don't view it as a symbol of racism. They view it as being synonymous with freedom, independence, and rebellion.



Well said. It goes back to what I was saying above. Just like not every German soldier was loyal to Nazi Supremacy and the eradication of Jews during WWII, so not every Southern Soldier fought for the continuation of Slavery. And there are many Confederate markings, plaques, sites, and symbols that tell of bravery, sadness, courage, daring, and brilliant leadership in times of war when it comes to soldiers from the South. Trying to white-wash history because it offends our sensitivities doesn't change history. Trying to nitpick every little thing that is offensive to people isn't going to change history either.

History has already happened; it's time to acknowledge it. Not attempt to ignore it.

I disagree. History needs to be rewritten constantly so that society can continue to be brainwashed. I think history class should start with episode 1 of real world and end with kanye fucking a Kardashian.

I read this book "1984" it talked about rewritting history and the importance of it. Really an incredible read when you compare to today's society.

 

[ripcityboy]

Those who win the war gets to blow up the monuments.

 

[MarAzul]

Those who win the war gets to blow up the monuments.

They usually don't do it a 150 years later though.

 

[HomerLovesKoolAid]

Washington owned slaves, right? And Jefferson?

We should take down all the monuments and rename all of the many "Washington" tributes across our country.

Yes, and let's put Draymond Green on the dolla bill.

 

[Jade Falcon]

So we are going to blow up Stone Mountain, Georgia? We should get rid of Lee's house? (Of course the military might have a problem with that.) You cannot deny certain things happened in a nation with such a violent bloody history. You cannot erase an entire culture no matter how much it doesn't fit with your revisionist history. If Tom Sawyer, what some consider America's first true modern novel, offends you with it's very language.... well maybe ummm you shouldn't read it. The whole point of having a history is reminding those who come later of the inherent flaws and mistakes of past generations. If we can have reminders of our major sins then maybe they won't have them. I wouldn't however name our public high schools after Woodrow Wilson though. Naming public buildings and institutions after such people seems to be in very bad taste.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." -Jorge Agustín Nicolás Ruiz de Santayana

 

[MarAzul]

I disagree. History needs to be rewritten constantly so that society can continue to be brainwashed. I think history class should start with episode 1 of real world and end with kanye fucking a Kardashian.

I read this book "1984" it talked about rewritting history and the importance of it. Really an incredible read when you compare to today's society.

True. Quite of bit of history written is still waiting to be written in truth rather than the victors view or even some level of wash.

 

[riverman]

Those who win the war gets to blow up the monuments.

They did burn the south to the ground pretty much by the end of the war....yanks blew up all kinds of confederate symbols and architecture

 

[Jade Falcon]

They did burn the south to the ground pretty much by the end of the war....yanks blew up all kinds of confederate symbols and architecture

And committed atrocious crimes against the civilian populace. Let's not forget that either.

 

[rasheedfan2005]

Jefferson was black. Y'all need to read some real history.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

They did burn the south to the ground pretty much by the end of the war....yanks blew up all kinds of confederate symbols and architecture

That's from Germany.

WWII

 

[riverman]

I know...

That's from Germany.

WWII

duh........yet the American Nazi party still trots out the swastika for special occasions

 

[rasheedfan2005]

I drove through a town not too long ago that was burned to the ground by yanks. When i went to buy my sweet symbol of freedom. Was pretty cool to see this big ass old church. Was only building in town that didnt burn.

 

[rasheedfan2005]

I know...
duh........yet the American Nazi party still trots out the swastika for special occasions

I like the symbol. As soon as i see a tat, i know i want nothing to do with the person. Saves a lot of time that migbt be wasted trying to get to know someone.

 

[barfo]

We? I didn't take a hand in it.

Sure, they only took men under 50 years old to fight in those days.

barfo

 

[3RA1N1AC]

Seriously guys, it's a statue. Sometimes statues get moved. Sometimes they get melted down for bullet casings. Fuck, sometimes they get toilet papered. It's not the end of the white race.

And somehow, against all odds, I think that after an inanimate object is moved a few miles, we will still manage to remember that slavery happened. Probably.

We are definitely doomed to repeat history though. Except the whites will be the slaves next time.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Seriously guys, it's a statue. Sometimes statues get moved. Sometimes they get melted down for bullet casings. Fuck, sometimes they get toilet papered. It's not the end of the white race.

And somehow, against all odds, I think that after an inanimate object is moved a few miles, we will still manage to remember that slavery happened. Probably.

We are definitely doomed to repeat history though. Except the whites will be the slaves next time.

 

[barfo]

Seriously guys, it's a statue. Sometimes statues get moved. Sometimes they get melted down for bullet casings. Fuck, sometimes they get toilet papered. It's not the end of the white race.

And somehow, against all odds, I think that after an inanimate object is moved a few miles, we will still manage to remember that slavery happened. Probably.

We are definitely doomed to repeat history though. Except the whites will be the slaves next time.

I thought all humans were the slaves next time. The slavemasters are the robots and/or apes.

barfo

 

[barfo]

I thought all humans were the slaves next time. The slavemasters are the robots and/or apes.

barfo

Or dogs. Could be dogs.

barfo

 

[rasheedfan2005]

Seriously guys, it's a statue. Sometimes statues get moved. Sometimes they get melted down for bullet casings. Fuck, sometimes they get toilet papered. It's not the end of the white race.

And somehow, against all odds, I think that after an inanimate object is moved a few miles, we will still manage to remember that slavery happened. Probably.

We are definitely doomed to repeat history though. Except the whites will be the slaves next time.

A very informative movie called "Boondock Saints" assured us that it will be the white midgets vs. The black midgets.

 

[Natebishop3]

Seriously guys, it's a statue. Sometimes statues get moved. Sometimes they get melted down for bullet casings. Fuck, sometimes they get toilet papered. It's not the end of the white race.

And somehow, against all odds, I think that after an inanimate object is moved a few miles, we will still manage to remember that slavery happened. Probably.

We are definitely doomed to repeat history though. Except the whites will be the slaves next time.

How could we possibly forget that slavery happened...... we have Dviss to constantly remind us





I keed! I keed!

 

[Rastapopoulos]

So we are going to blow up Stone Mountain, Georgia? We should get rid of Lee's house? (Of course the military might have a problem with that.) You cannot deny certain things happened in a nation with such a violent bloody history. You cannot erase an entire culture no matter how much it doesn't fit with your revisionist history. If Tom Sawyer, what some consider America's first true modern novel, offends you with it's very language.... well maybe ummm you shouldn't read it. The whole point of having a history is reminding those who come later of the inherent flaws and mistakes of past generations. If we can have reminders of our major sins then maybe they won't have them. I wouldn't however name our public high schools after Woodrow Wilson though. Naming public buildings and institutions after such people seems to be in very bad taste.

This is a bit specious. Do you know what it said on that monument? Tom Sawyer? Are you talking about Huckleberry Finn? Which is a clear INDICTMENT of slavery? And is, and this is important, NOT A FUCKING STATUE?

I'm fine with taking the statue and putting it in a museum that says "here's how stupid and shitty we used to be" but it doesn't have to be in the public square for stupid shitty people to rally round.

 

[ripcityboy]

This is a bit specious. Do you know what it said on that monument? Tom Sawyer? Are you talking about Huckleberry Finn? Which is a clear INDICTMENT of slavery? And is, and this is important, NOT A FUCKING STATUE?

I'm fine with taking the statue and putting it in a museum that says "here's how stupid and shitty we used to be" but it doesn't have to be in the public square for stupid shitty people to rally round.

Or like this guy? Someone responsible for some of the worst Colonialist excesses in American history. But thousands of people parade through that monument every year, some maybe separatist quacks and some probably Eagle scouts.
And thats my point, in history there is no good and bad, there is just WHO won and WHO lost. I'm sure the historians and rock carvers who build the Confederate monuments, wrote and celebrated them in glowing terms because they were taught that way (or they didn't want their heads kicked in.)
But now that work is a part or our history and our culure. If we are truly represent the best and worst of our forebears, we get the guilt as well. If some trust fund baby inherents money from the works of immigrants and slaves, he inherits the dirty feelings and need for atonement.
You can build the biggest museum in the world, filled with the latest scholars and historians with books to sell and revisionist BS ideas teaching at some liberal arts college.... But you can't get rid of all the symbols and propaganda (which as I am sure you know are very powerful) because the kids will get into the real world and listen to the past and read and interpret history as they see fit. They will use those historic icons as heroes or villans, regardless of a statue with pigeon shit all over it. Hell, a lot of Russians look to Stalin as a nationalist hero.... and he was from Georgia! People will overlook any atrocity for identity.

And people will try to censor books too (you were right) it was Huck Finn.... my bad.

 

[MARIS61]

When the south seceded from the Union and decided they needed their own money.

It is obvious the Confederacy held their slaves in high esteem, pushing aside even the father of our country to give them center stage on their currency.

 

[MARIS61]

This is a bit specious. Do you know what it said on that monument? Tom Sawyer? Are you talking about Huckleberry Finn? Which is a clear INDICTMENT of slavery? And is, and this is important, NOT A FUCKING STATUE?

Statues and fictional characters are both works of art, just not in the same mediums.

That is the extent to which they differ.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

guys, i woke up this morning and was like, "fuck, i dont see any statues... did slavery actually happen?"

 

[3RA1N1AC]

"its a part of their proud heritage!"

and

"its so we remember what horrible people they were!"

 

[MARIS61]

Just so there's no misunderstanding about my posts in this thread, I'm simply defending the idea of preserving these obviously historically significant statues as we do with all historically significant measures of mankind's advancement through the ages. That's what museums are for.

I am all for taking down any and every statue memorializing any statue wearing a Confederate or British or Japanese or German or Mexican or Spanish...military uniform.

They all were enemies of America and many Real Americans died at their hands.

As for those who like to display their Confederate flags (whether they have any personal connection or not), I regard them as I would Lindsey Graham, Nanny Pelosi, Rachel Maddow or Glenn Beck. Fake Americans.

 

[ripcityboy]

Just so there's no misunderstanding about my posts in this thread, I'm simply defending the idea of preserving these obviously historically significant statues as we do with all historically significant measures of mankind's advancement through the ages. That's what museums are for.

I am all for taking down any and every statue memorializing any statue wearing a Confederate or British or Japanese or German or Mexican or Spanish...military uniform.

They all were enemies of America and many Real Americans died at their hands.

As for those who like to display their Confederate flags (whether they have any personal connection or not), I regard them as I would Lindsey Graham, Nanny Pelosi, Rachel Maddow or Glenn Beck. Fake Americans.

Fuck that! I want to get rid of a certain Southern Colonel..... and he's part of the Illuminati. His companies products have been poisoning the fat youth of America for years! He's an enemy of the American People!

 

[Rastapopoulos]