Roy calling out Nate? Rift between coach and players?

[illmatic99]

Finally, some fireworks from Quick: http://blog.oregonlive.com/behindblazersbeat/2009/11/utah_108_portland_92_another_d.html

This season, with Oden becoming a formidable and effective option, the offense more often revolves around entry passes to Oden.

McMillan says it is up to the players to figure out how to make that dynamic work. The players say the system now isn't working because both Roy and Aldridge are struggling.

That was the central topic on the bench near the end of the game, when Roy spoke to Aldridge with his shirt over his lips. "Me and L.A. talked about how things were different," Roy said. "And more than anything why the change from last year, when we were a good team. I think we have somewhat changed our focus. Instead of keeping that focus and just improving around it, we have adjusted."

Roy was reminded that Oden has been effective, entering the game second in the NBA at 63.2 percent, and when asked how all three offensive options can work together, he chuckled. "I don't know. That's why coaches coach," Roy said. "I just go out there, you know? He's the coach."

I can't tell which is more concerning. Nate expecting the players to "figure it out" a completely new dynamic without any guidance, or Roy having to require someone to remind him of Oden's effectiveness. Regardless of that, the last quote by Roy is most revealing about Nate's inadequacies. There's only so many times a coach can call out his players for more effort before they stop responding. It's clear that the preparation is not there. Can Nate update the offense and define the roles? What about defense?

And, apparently, the players are bonding around Miller in response to his benching today, and that might be leading to a rift between the players and coach:

And, of course, there was Miller's benching, which caught everyone by surprise, none more so than Miller. It appears Miller has the team's full support, as he engaged in lengthy conversations with Przybilla and Blake on the bench, and then drew the concern of Roy. Then, after Miller gave a noncontroversial interview, during which he answered every question professionally, Oden tapped him on the knee and offered a fist, which Miller bumped.

What were once smoldering hot spots on this team have suddenly taken spark, presenting McMillan with his biggest challenge in this new era of successful Blazers basketball. And for the first time, it doesn't appear McMillan has the unquestioned support from key players.

More confirmation that the players and coach are not on the same page.

 

[illmatic99]

Reading that "that's why coaches coach" comment by BRoy again has me feeling a bit sympathetic towards Nate. Just a bit.

 

[cloudydays]

Nate's partially correct in that it is up to the players to figure out how to play well with each other. With more time playing together they will eventually strike a balance between Roy, LMA, and Oden. The success of these three playing well together at a high level is the key to Portland making any kind of big run in the playoffs. The problem is that right now this team looks totally discombobulated because they are still "figuring it out". The coach's job should be to help accelerate this growth, but right now it appears that Nate isn't help this at all.

 

[Driew]

I think our problem is that we've played the MOST games so far and haven't had time to practice and iron out the kinks. I think with the upcoming longer breaks between games things will get ironed out.

I was expecting a blow out tonight. Nothing surprised me really. If the Blazers played like crap on Friday why wouldn't they play the same the next night with no time to fix the bugs?

 

[barfo]

Nate's partially correct in that it is up to the players to figure out how to play well with each other. With more time playing together they will eventually strike a balance between Roy, LMA, and Oden. The success of these three playing well together at a high level is the key to Portland making any kind of big run in the playoffs. The problem is that right now this team looks totally discombobulated because they are still "figuring it out". The coach's job should be to help accelerate this growth, but right now it appears that Nate isn't help this at all.

It raises the question, what the hell did they do in training camp? Wouldn't that have been a good time to address these basic issues?

I can't really cut Nate as much slack as you do. It's Nate's job to design the offense, not the players. If Nate had a reputation of a hands-off, let-the-players-play ratball coach, that would be one thing, but he's a control freak. As such, it's hard to see anyone to blame but him when the train goes off the tracks and into the gorge.

barfo

 

[Natebishop3]

And the truth comes out. Roy doesn't get it.

 

[jlprk]

From the thread title, I expected a face to face argument between Roy and McMillan. Instead I get a mild comment from Roy to a reporter. He just said that it's not his role to tell the media the details of "how all three offensive options can work together." Big deal.

As for "McMillan says it is up to the players to figure out how to make that dynamic work."--He means players have to look to pass to Oden. Miller has no trouble doing so, why does Roy need McMillan to tell him how?

As for Miller being benched in favor of Webster, "It appears Miller has the team's full support." So Webster has the team's unanimous opposition?

 

[oldmangrouch]

Seems Roy is just admitting what some of us have suspected all along - he doesn't like playing with Oden.

The notion that a player of Roy's caliber can't figure out his role, or figure out how to play with a guy like Oden, is just silly. He doesn't *want* to adjust.

 

[Mediocre Man]

This has been going on for a while now. Nothing new here, other than the players are finally going to the media.

Roy wonders why they changed from what worked last year? Does he really not get that no one took us seriously last year? This year we are the hunters, and this year teams have their crosshairs on us. He doesn't seem to realize that good teams, that have the ability to go deep into the playoffs have an inside post game. That might not be a center, but you have to be able to score in the paint to be successful.

Nate saying it's up to the players to figure it out is true, but it's up to Nate to put them in the best possition possible to do that. IMO, we pissed away our training camp and preseason by trying so many different lineups. Knowing Greg had improved his offensive game over the summer should have been the first clue that Nate needed to expand the offense to include him. Instead, Nate decided to run more ISO's for Roy?

Roy, Aldridge and Oden should all take 15 shots a game, and whatever is left for the others is what's left. A very simple motion offense, that my 9th graders can run should do the trick.

 

[Blaze01]

Greg Oden's ability to be an offensive weapon in the post, is crucial IMO to POR future success. POR cannot just be a jump shooting team, and LA apparently refuses to play post, often settling for jump shots....not good from your 6'11 power forward....

I'll add when Aldridge DOES play in the post he can be remarkably effective...

As for Roy, this isn't last year....teams know his trick...they are not going to let Roy get the ball at the top of the key and go 1v1....why would they? He has got to give up the damm ball and MOVE to get open...that is why you get the ball out of his hands, so you can run him off a cut\screen to get open, receive a pass and THEN make a move in a much more advantageous position...not 2v1....

Someone needs to sit Roy down and explain that to him...It is not rocket science...simple basketball strategy....

 

[e_blazer]

It raises the question, what the hell did they do in training camp? Wouldn't that have been a good time to address these basic issues?

The Blazers started training camp with Batum and Outlaw in the mix. Losing those guys and having to improvise on the fly while in the midst of the busiest schedule of any team in the NBA would be tough for any coach. This week the Blazers finally get a little bit of a breather in the schedule, which should equate to some time to work things out in practice. Seems to me that the way the Blazers look by Saturday's game against the Raptors will tell us a lot about Nate's abilities to adapt to changes in the roster.

 

[MIXUM]

its been a disaster.

this team isnt making the playoffs.

 

[ABM]

The Blazers started training camp with Batum and Outlaw in the mix. Losing those guys and having to improvise on the fly while in the midst of the busiest schedule of any team in the NBA would be tough for any coach. This week the Blazers finally get a little bit of a breather in the schedule, which should equate to some time to work things out in practice. Seems to me that the way the Blazers look by Saturday's game against the Raptors will tell us a lot about Nate's abilities to adapt to changes in the roster.

+1

My sentiments exactly.

 

[Public Defender]

Seems to me that the way the Blazers look by Saturday's game against the Raptors will tell us a lot about Nate's abilities to adapt to changes in the roster.

Right. Except they're playing the Rockets on Saturday.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I think our problem is that we've played the MOST games so far and haven't had time to practice and iron out the kinks. I think with the upcoming longer breaks between games things will get ironed out.

They just came off a 4-game home stand where they had a day off between each of the games. Yet, they got blown out of the gym by MEMPHIS at home. What were they doing on those off days between the games? Seriously, they had training camp, 8 preseason games and now 19 regular season games (almost 1/4 of the season) to iron out the kinks. Yet, I'm not seeing progress. If anything, the team is regressing.

I blame the coach. His indecisiveness with the starting line-up has the players confused and not knowing their roles. That's what the preseason is for. Andre Miller was not brought here to be Steve Blake's back-up. He should have started (at PG) every preseason game and every regular season game next to Roy (at SG). THEN, if there was a problem, a change should be made. Instead, we are 1/4 of the way through the season, and we have yet to see Roy and Miller start together at their natural PG and SG positions.

Nate doesn't have a clue how to use the talent he's been given and his cluelessness has started to rub off on the players.

BNM

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

its been a disaster.

this team isnt making the playoffs.

thanks for the insight, i'm sure everyone really gives a shit right now

 

[hasoos]

You know things can really look bad when a team doesn't put effort into playing hard. Everything looks like hell, when the only problem is the effort, because effort effects everything. What does coaching have to do with getting beat on defense for fast break buckets because you didn't get back? Even if things are not well chemistry wise, they could play with more effort.

 

[Boob-No-More]

The Blazers started training camp with Batum and Outlaw in the mix. Losing those guys and having to improvise on the fly while in the midst of the busiest schedule of any team in the NBA would be tough for any coach. This week the Blazers finally get a little bit of a breather in the schedule, which should equate to some time to work things out in practice. Seems to me that the way the Blazers look by Saturday's game against the Raptors will tell us a lot about Nate's abilities to adapt to changes in the roster.

I'd almost buy that if the SF spot was the cause of this team's problems. It's not. The backcourt is. Roy, Blake and Miller are all healthy. None of them have missed a day of training camp, a preseason game, a regular season game or a practice. Yet, they still can't play together. Why, because the coach keeps changing their roles. One week Roy is a starting SG, next he's a starting SF, then a SG. Miller is coming off the bench, then he's starting then he's coming off the bench. Blake is a starting PG, then he's a starting SG, then he's s starting PG.

All these changes, and yet we still haven't seen, not even ONE FREAKING TIME a line-up that features these players in the roles they were born to play:

Brandon Roy - Starting SG
Andre Miller - Starting PG
Steve Blake - Back-up PG

Why is that so hard to figure out? 19 games into the season, we've seen all sorts of other goofy ass combinations, but not once have we seen THE most obvious lineup. It's like Nate has deliberately avoided using his guards in their most natural roles.

And people are wonder why the players seem confused and the team looks lost.

BNM

 

[Natebishop3]

You know, this is just vindication for some of us who have been saying this shit since preseason. We haven't been "complaining" or "monday morning quarterbacking". We have been stating the truth and discussing the obvious. Now that it's finally caught up with the team, and it is clear that the Blazers have some real issues to work through.

 

[Natebishop3]

I'd almost buy that if the SF spot was the cause of this team's problems. It's not. The backcourt is. Roy, Blake and Miller are all healthy. None of them have missed a day of training camp, a preseason game, a regular season game or a practice. Yet, they still can't play together. Why, because the coach keeps changing their roles. One week Roy is a starting SG, next he's a starting SF, then a SG. Miller is coming off the bench, then he's starting then he's coming off the bench. Blake is a starting PG, then he's a starting SG, then he's s starting PG.

All these changes, and yet we still haven't seen, not even ONE FREAKING TIME a line-up that features these players in the roles they were born to play:

Brandon Roy - Starting SG
Andre Miller - Starting PG
Steve Blake - Back-up PG

Why is that so hard to figure out? 19 games into the season, we've seen all sorts of other goofy ass combinations, but not once have we seen THE most obvious lineup. It's like Nate has deliberately avoided using his guards in their most natural roles.

And people are wonder why the players seem confused and the team looks lost.

BNM

And don't forget the newest plan, bench Miller and play Bayless. Nate is a fucking moron if he thinks our problems are the result of Miller.

Something tells me Miller is being labeled the scapegoat by some of the players (Roy), and others are backing him up (Oden).

 

[LittleAlex]

Right. Except they're playing the Rockets on Saturday.

Tuesday's game against Miami is huge right now. If they come out as listless against Miami as they have in the last three games they are going to get destroyed.

I know this has been mentioned before but December is a season in hell for Portland this year. A large number of road games against decent to excellent teams. Home games against teams they have a lot of trouble against.

Frankly I would be glad if Portland went .500 for the month.

For that to happen they need to start to right the ship on Tuesday.

If they don't it would not be surprising for Portland to come out of December with a loosing record.

 

[hasoos]

You have to take some of the comments by players after games with a grain of salt. It has to be frustrating when things aren't going well. What it appears to me is that the communication right now isn't flowing. Both sides appears to think the other should do something in order to right the ship. Finger pointing is not good for a franchise. It kind of reminds me about when New Orleans found out they weren't as good as they were the year before. They let the whole year and part of the next one roll on before they moved Scott.

 

[Boob-No-More]

And don't forget the newest plan, bench Miller and play Bayless. Nate is a fucking moron if he thinks our problems are the result of Miller.

Something tells me Miller is being labeled the scapegoat by some of the players (Roy), and others are backing him up (Oden).

Actually, given his 6 minutes of PT, it looks like the coach that's painting him as the scapegoat. Blake plays like absolute shit against Memphis and the first half against Utah - and Miller is the one who gets benched. Miller may not have played well in his 6 minutes against the Jazz, but he certainly outplayed Blake in the 2nd half against Memphis. Miller's ability to get to the FT line and score points with the clock stopped was one of the main reasons the Blazers were able to cut the Memphis lead to single digits in the 4th quarter - well until Blake bricked his only two FT attempts of the game.

Blake's PER is 9.9 and Millers is 14.5. Yet, it's Miller who gets benched. Yeah, that makes sense. Nate's boneheaded devotion to Steve Blake boggles the mind. How a guy playing that badly gets a free pass while a guy who produces 50% more gets benched makes no logical sense.

BNM

 

[Natebishop3]

Actually, given his 6 minutes of PT, it looks like the coach that's painting him as the scapegoat. Blake plays like absolute shit against Memphis and the first half against Utah - and Miller is the one who gets benched. Miller may not have played well in his 6 minutes against the Jazz, but he certainly outplayed Blake in the 2nd half against Memphis. Miller's ability to get to the FT line and score points with the clock stopped was one of the main reasons the Blazers were able to cut the Memphis lead to single digits in the 4th quarter - well until Blake bricked his only two FT attempts of the game.

Blake's PER is 9.9 and Millers is 14.5. Yet, it's Miller who gets benched. Yeah, that makes sense. Nate's boneheaded devotion to Steve Blake boggles the mind. How a guy playing that badly gets a free pass while a guy who produces 50% more gets benched makes no logical sense.

BNM

Yeah, but we've been saying this since preseason. Now that we're 19 games into the season, it's just the same story. Miller is the better point guard, Steve Blake sucks, and McMillan won't go away from his Blanky. Nothing has changed.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Yeah, but we've been saying this since preseason. Now that we're 19 games into the season, it's just the same story. Miller is the better point guard, Steve Blake sucks, and McMillan won't go away from his Blanky. Nothing has changed.

Which is EXACTLY the problem. If the coach is too stupid and boneheaded to even try playing his best players together at their best positions, it's time to look for a coach who will.

BNM

 

[Natebishop3]

Which is EXACTLY the problem. If the coach is too stupid and boneheaded to even try playing his best players together at their best positions, it's time to look for a coach who will.

BNM

Who are you thinking BNM?

 

[Nikolokolus]

This has been going on for a while now. Nothing new here, other than the players are finally going to the media.

Roy wonders why they changed from what worked last year? Does he really not get that no one took us seriously last year? This year we are the hunters, and this year teams have their crosshairs on us. He doesn't seem to realize that good teams, that have the ability to go deep into the playoffs have an inside post game. That might not be a center, but you have to be able to score in the paint to be successful.

Nate saying it's up to the players to figure it out is true, but it's up to Nate to put them in the best possition possible to do that. IMO, we pissed away our training camp and preseason by trying so many different lineups. Knowing Greg had improved his offensive game over the summer should have been the first clue that Nate needed to expand the offense to include him. Instead, Nate decided to run more ISO's for Roy?

Roy, Aldridge and Oden should all take 15 shots a game, and whatever is left for the others is what's left. A very simple motion offense, that my 9th graders can run should do the trick.

A-effing-men.

Trouble is, KP has these guys surrounded by rhythm jump shooters with no real defensive specialists, or real garbage/hustle type players. JB kind of does this when he comes in (all 5 minutes a game anyway), Dante kind of gets this, but he's a rook, other than that we have Rudy and Martell dribbling around the perimeter for 4-8 seconds before taking fadeaway 23 footers at the end of the clock, no ball movement, guys standing around and an 11 year veteran, uptempo point guard, shackled into a half-court iso offense that has him spotting up on the wings or in the corner as often as not.

I think Nate is partially to blame, but I think the lion's share of this mess belongs to KP, he's been mostly paralyzed when it comes to trades (for whatever reason?) and hasn't taken the necessary steps to fit pieces around his core that fill holes, instead he keeps drafting jump shooting finesse players (Claver, Cunningham to a certain extent) and can't seem to get it that you can't really sustain a roster that features 7 players on rookie scale deals. 2 of our 3 "core" players are mostly finesse guys that don't exactly intimidate people on defense. It's time to cashier some of these offensive minded players and stashed assets into guys whose pride is tied up in their defense and hard nosed play.

 

[BenDavis503]

This is great! I hope it leads to Nates firing.

 

[Natebishop3]

A-effing-men.

Trouble is, KP has these guys surrounded by rhythm jump shooters with no real defensive specialists, or real garbage/hustle type players. JB kind of does this when he comes in (all 5 minutes a game anyway), Dante kind of gets this, but he's a rook, other than that we have Rudy and Martell dribbling around the perimeter for 4-8 seconds before taking fadeaway 23 footers at the end of the clock, no ball movement, guys standing around and an 11 year veteran, uptempo point guard, shackled into a half-court iso offense that has him spotting up on the wings or in the corner as often as not.

I think Nate is partially to blame, but I think the lion's share of this mess belongs to KP, he's been mostly paralyzed when it comes to trades (for whatever reason?) and hasn't taken the necessary steps to fit pieces around his core that fill holes, instead he keeps drafting jump shooting finesse players (Claver, Cunningham to a certain extent) and can't seem to get it that you can't really sustain a roster that features 7 players on rookie scale deals. 2 of our 3 "core" players are mostly finesse guys that don't exactly intimidate people on defense. It's time to cashier some of these offensive minded players and stashed assets into guys whose pride is tied up in their defense and hard nosed play.

Okay, so who do we target?

 

[alex42083]

All these changes, and yet we still haven't seen, not even ONE FREAKING TIME a line-up that features these players in the roles they were born to play:

Brandon Roy - Starting SG
Andre Miller - Starting PG
Steve Blake - Back-up PG

Why is that so hard to figure out?

Yes, yes and yes. Blake had a career year last season, but has done squat this season to earn the PT he's gotten. He's not shooting well (which is why he's on the floor) and he's getting burned continually on defense, while turning the ball over.

Meanwhile, Andre was given a Sergio-style leash last night for someone who is clearly our best PG on the roster. While Andre certainly hasn't been playing at an elite level either, he just hasn't been given the fair chance that Blake has been given.

If I have to see Blakey trotted out there as the starter for at most the next 10 games, I'm going to puke.