Rudy: first PG off the bench?

[Rastapopoulos]

Watching the game last night it appeared to me that Rudy was playing PG to Bayless's SG. This actually suits their temperaments better - it's always been obvious that Bayless is much more comfortable looking to score and just not good at running the team, while Rudy is unselfish and a creative passer - but does this work longer term? And Rudy still can't penetrate, and has shaky handles.

There was a moment there where Bayless got the ball, went coast to coast, didn't let anyone else touch the ball, then lofted a bad jumper early in the clock. The next possession Rudy got the ball off the inbounds, Bayless signaled to him with his hands out ("gimme the rock") and Rudy basically gave him a scornful look and brought it up himself. I liked that. Can it work? This is one way to get both Rudy AND Bayless minutes. I see Webster getting squeezed if this happens, though.

 

[magnifier661]

Watching the game last night it appeared to me that Rudy was playing PG to Bayless's SG. This actually suits their temperaments better - it's always been obvious that Bayless is much more comfortable looking to score and just not good at running the team, while Rudy is unselfish and a creative passer - but does this work longer term? And Rudy still can't penetrate, and has shaky handles.

There was a moment there where Bayless got the ball, went coast to coast, didn't let anyone else touch the ball, then lofted a bad jumper early in the clock. The next possession Rudy got the ball off the inbounds, Bayless signaled to him with his hands out ("gimme the rock") and Rudy basically gave him a scornful look and brought it up himself. I liked that. Can it work? This is one way to get both Rudy AND Bayless minutes. I see Webster getting squeezed if this happens, though.

And who knows. Could Rudy be the starting PG in years to come? I think he could.

 

[hasoos]

I thought they pretty much shared the load at PG. Sorry didn't see it as Rudy primarily as PG.

 

[Nikolokolus]

I thought they pretty much shared the load at PG. Sorry didn't see it as Rudy primarily as PG.

Same. I saw Bayless call a couple of sets, I saw Rudy call a couple. They both looked like they were pretty comfortable sharing the load and the ball.

 

[Ed O]

I thought they pretty much shared the load at PG. Sorry didn't see it as Rudy primarily as PG.

I agree. I would bet, although I only watched it once, that Bayless brought the ball up more than Rudy when they were both in the game.

Ed O.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

I would bet, although I only watched it once, that Bayless brought the ball up more than Rudy when they were both in the game.

That makes perfect sense, because Bayless is probably harder to press than Rudy, and certainly appears to have better handles. The downside is he'll be tempted to jack it up when he gets to the opponent's end.

The other downside to Rudy being PG is that he's one of the best on the team at running his many silly off screens, whereas Bayless at SG is much more likely to just stand there and motion for the ball. Once again I wish I had a machine to combine two players into one. Then I'd use it on Rudy and Bayless and Miller and Roy and have the best backcourt ever.

 

[Wheels]

3 Guard Rotation in 2 years with Jerryd, Roy, and Rudy... I have foreseen this.

 

[RR7]

3 Guard Rotation in 2 years with Jerryd, Roy, and Rudy... I have foreseen this.

This is what I'm hoping for, as well. And have been.

 

[Wheels]

This is what I'm hoping for, as well. And have been.

I think we'll see it honestly.. I think Blake will walk at the end of the season... and then Bayless will be ready for consistent backup minutes next year... then After Miller walks in 2 years.. Bayless will be primed and ready for 28-32 minutes a night.

 

[hasoos]

3 Guard Rotation in 2 years with Jerryd, Roy, and Rudy... I have foreseen this.

Yea I have been hoping that is how it turns out. Its best to have 3 guys who get the bulk of the minutes so they are happy, and used to playing together.

 

[RR7]

I'm just curious how much improved play out of Bayless, and Rudy running some point with the second unit could potentially impact a trade of Blake later this season.

 

[andalusian]

I'm just curious how much improved play out of Bayless, and Rudy running some point with the second unit could potentially impact a trade of Blake later this season.

Only if you get an upgrade against fast PGs imho.

I still think that the reason Nate keeps Blake in the starting unit with Miller is for defense, not offense - which is a really sad comment on the rest of our perimeter defenders.

 

[hasoos]

Only if you get an upgrade against fast PGs imho.

I still think that the reason Nate keeps Blake in the starting unit with Miller is for defense, not offense - which is a really sad comment on the rest of our perimeter defenders.

I think you are correct on that. Blake has the ability to keep a SG in front of him, much easier than a PG. I think Nate is just trying to keep the lane penetration down, and will live with the size mismatch for now.

 

[Reep]

I'm not feeling Rudy or Blake in the PG rotation at this point.

Similarities

Both can shoot the three well
Both are lightweights
Neither can finish in the paint unless wide open
Neither are solid perimeter defenders

I like Rudy's vision, but if he can't penetrate, then most of that is useless. He can't even get himself open for balanced mid-range jump shots, let alone getting to the rim. Right now, Rudy and Blake are the same player to me. I'm not excited about seeing either one in the rotation. And I don't see either one making a big step in ability in the near future.

As raw as Bayless is, and as unskilled a decision-maker as he is, at least he has the physical ability to stay in front of his man and also penetrate and finish (or get fouled).

 

[Rastapopoulos]

It's funny: I'd much rather have EITHER Blake or Rudy out there than Bayless, unless Bayless is the primary scorer (in which case there's been a terrible accident). Yes, Bayless has better handles and can penetrate better than either Blake or Rudy (although Blake seems improved this year), but Bayless still doesn't do anything that helps anyone but him on offense. His "Bball IQ" is low. Now we've got a three-guard lineup, I'm liking Blake a lot more. Essentially he's our SF on offense, and he's good at that. And he's actually a better defender than Bayless even though he shouldn't be, because Bayless is pretty clueless at that, too.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

It's funny: I'd much rather have EITHER Blake or Rudy out there than Bayless, unless Bayless is the primary scorer (in which case there's been a terrible accident). Yes, Bayless has better handles and can penetrate better than either Blake or Rudy (although Blake seems improved this year), but Bayless still doesn't do anything that helps anyone but him on offense. His "Bball IQ" is low. Now we've got a three-guard lineup, I'm liking Blake a lot more. Essentially he's our SF on offense, and he's good at that. And he's actually a better defender than Bayless even though he shouldn't be, because Bayless is pretty clueless at that, too.

I dunno--Bayless has 5 assists in just 23 minutes, and I saw him make several very intelligent passes last night (not the least of which was the "hockey assist" to Rudy leading to Webster's corner 3). Small sample size so far, I know, but I think it's a bit of a stretch to say that he is all about himself on offense.

 

[Pontius]

That makes perfect sense, because Bayless is probably harder to press than Rudy, and certainly appears to have better handles. The downside is he'll be tempted to jack it up when he gets to the opponent's end.

The other downside to Rudy being PG is that he's one of the best on the team at running his many silly off screens, whereas Bayless at SG is much more likely to just stand there and motion for the ball. Once again I wish I had a machine to combine two players into one. Then I'd use it on Rudy and Bayless and Miller and Roy and have the best backcourt ever.

How is it a downside if Bayless can get to the line or convert his FG attempts off of a press?

And what evidence do you have to suggest that Bayless will simply stand around and motion for the ball?

 

[Pontius]

It's funny: I'd much rather have EITHER Blake or Rudy out there than Bayless, unless Bayless is the primary scorer (in which case there's been a terrible accident). Yes, Bayless has better handles and can penetrate better than either Blake or Rudy (although Blake seems improved this year), but Bayless still doesn't do anything that helps anyone but him on offense. His "Bball IQ" is low. Now we've got a three-guard lineup, I'm liking Blake a lot more. Essentially he's our SF on offense, and he's good at that. And he's actually a better defender than Bayless even though he shouldn't be, because Bayless is pretty clueless at that, too.

Bayless doesn't have a low "Bball IQ". There I proved your assertion wrong.

Blake has done nothing this season to provide any evidence that he's become better at penetrating. What are you watching?

 

[Nikolokolus]

It's funny: I'd much rather have EITHER Blake or Rudy out there than Bayless, unless Bayless is the primary scorer (in which case there's been a terrible accident). Yes, Bayless has better handles and can penetrate better than either Blake or Rudy (although Blake seems improved this year), but Bayless still doesn't do anything that helps anyone but him on offense. His "Bball IQ" is low. Now we've got a three-guard lineup, I'm liking Blake a lot more. Essentially he's our SF on offense, and he's good at that. And he's actually a better defender than Bayless even though he shouldn't be, because Bayless is pretty clueless at that, too.

So far we've got exactly 23 minutes of play that we can judge him off of. and you got all of that out of 5 minutes in one game and 18 in another? You must be some kind of damn genius to be able to extrapolate so much from so little.

 

[Idog1976]

I have to agree with Platypus here. Bayless looked infinitely better at looking to help his team mates score. I was extremely impressed. He pushed it a few times and tried to score when he shouldn't have, but by and large he picked his shots and also racked up a few assists and would have had two more if not for unselfishness (rudy hockey assist) and a missed wide open shot by Martell or someone.

I think your previous viewing of Bayless has colored your current perceptions. The 2009 pre- and regular season have shown quite alot of improvement in Bayless shifting gears into a scoring PG instead of a scoring SG in my opinion. He is a combo guard, but more then anyone else, he has the potential to be Roy's ideal back court mate.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Bayless > Fernandez

In my opinion.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

You must be some kind of damn genius to be able to extrapolate so much from so little.

Why thank you.

 

[bintim]

Right now on the three guard starting plan, Rudy should start in place of Blake. He can play the 1,2,or3. I like his hustle and how he looks for the open man.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Right now on the three guard starting plan, Rudy should start in place of Blake. He can play the 1,2,or3. I like his hustle and how he looks for the open man.

The only trouble is that he's "Jerryd Bayless, rookie season" bad from the floor ... until he regains his shooting touch I don't know that I'd be in any great hurry to insert him into the starting lineup, he's probably got a better shot at getting hot against other reserves.