Ruffin to Portland (Merged)

[Ed O]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

it does work!!! http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bp5e5g

Yeah I don't see how or why that would work as a straight-across deal. I am thinking it's a glitch in the Trade Machine on ESPN, because both teams are over the cap and the two salaries aren't close enough.

As part of a bigger deal, though, involving Sacramento? Yes, then it could work.

Ed O.

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

Yeah, this deal makes no sense unless something else is happening. Otherwise, it's an idiot's trade.

 

[PapaG]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

There would be no other reason to send Ike and cash to Sacto without a much, MUCH larger deal about to be announced involving a third team.

 

[Stepping Razor]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

OK!

Now it makes some sense.

The Blazers save money, presumably, by sending Diogu to Sacramento, even if they send money to the Kings to cover (some of?) the difference.

Because it was part of a larger deal, the Kings are taking in within the allowed difference of what they're sending out, and a team can ALWAYS take back less than it sends out... and that creates a trade exception.

Honestly, though? This looks like a pure dollar-saving move. Which, if Ike is never going to be used, makes sense.

Ed O.

I'm not sure we actually save any money. The difference between Ike's "sticker price" and Ruffin's is about 2 million. But the season is more than half over, so we only get to save a bit less than half of that; if we're also giving the Kings $1M in cash, I think it ends up being a wash in terms of dollars and cents. All we get is a crappy backup big man (more or less crappy than Ike? who knows?) and a $2M trade exception... which might help us do something more interesting.

 

[Ed O]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

How do we get a trade exception out of this? Can someone explain that?

We send out more than we receive. That's how trade exceptions are created.

The two ways they can be made are:

1. Dealing with a team that has cap space to absorb the difference, or
2. Being part of a big deal where the allowed margin is significant because the overall contracts are so large (like with the exception we got in the Zach/Francis deal)

Ed O.

 

[Ed O]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

I'm not sure we actually save any money. The difference between Ike's "sticker price" and Ruffin's is about 2 million. But the season is more than half over, so we only get to save a bit less than half of that; if we're also giving the Kings $1M in cash, I think it ends up being a wash in terms of dollars and cents. All we get is a crappy backup big man (more or less crappy than Ike? who knows?) and a $2M trade exception... which might help us do something more interesting.

Are we going to be over the luxury tax threshold?

If we are, remember you have to double the difference. Plus, while Ruffin makes over a million, I believe he is a veteran so only counts as $800k.

Ed O.

 

[PapaG]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

OK!

Now it makes some sense.

The Blazers save money, presumably, by sending Diogu to Sacramento, even if they send money to the Kings to cover (some of?) the difference.

Because it was part of a larger deal, the Kings are taking in within the allowed difference of what they're sending out, and a team can ALWAYS take back less than it sends out... and that creates a trade exception.

Honestly, though? This looks like a pure dollar-saving move. Which, if Ike is never going to be used, makes sense.

Ed O.

How does sending $1 million to the Kings save money? I ask because I don't know the answer.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

it does work!!! http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bp5e5g

Ike would be going to the Kings, so it doesn't work without a TE coming to Portland

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

Honestly, though? This looks like a pure dollar-saving move. Which, if Ike is never going to be used, makes sense.

On whose part? Not the Blazers, because
(a) they sent out cash to the Kings/Bulls whomever got Ruffin
(b) THIS IS THE BLAZERS - it's never just about money.

That report seemed to be wrong: it said that Ruffin came from the KINGS. But he was a Bull. Does this mean that the Bulls sent him to the Kings first? That would explain why it's a separate deal that sends him to Portland, rather than just part of a three-way, and would also support the trade exception thesis. But it would throw cold water on any other Chicago players denging our way.

 

[alex42083]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

We send out more than we receive. That's how trade exceptions are created.

The two ways they can be made are:

1. Dealing with a team that has cap space to absorb the difference, or
2. Being part of a big deal where the allowed margin is significant because the overall contracts are so large (like with the exception we got in the Zach/Francis deal)

Ed O.

Thanks. We must be planning on using that trade exception for something better.

 

[Stepping Razor]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

Are we going to be over the luxury tax threshold?

If we are, remember you have to double the difference. Plus, while Ruffin makes over a million, I believe he is a veteran so only counts as $800k.

Ed O.

Ooh good call... forgot about the lux tax ramifications. Maybe we do save a bit of cash after all...

 

[alex42083]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

Canzano speculated on the sports update that we did this as a money-saving move as well in terms of our salary cap to make a splash instead in free agency this summer.
Maybe the trade offers we were getting were underwhelming.

 

[Norman Dale]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

LaFrentz and Outlaw for Deng and Hinrich works due to Deng's BYC status. Maybe the Ruffin/Diogu trade does something for the roster space.

 

[GoBlazersGo]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

 

[Ed O]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

Ike would be going to the Kings, so it doesn't work without a TE coming to Portland

Here's the deal... I think.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=azwn2n

Ed O.

 

[Kaydow]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

Yeah, this deal makes no sense unless something else is happening. Otherwise, it's an idiot's trade.

Unless KP thinks Ruffin is ready to have a break out year . . . at 32 years old.

Career 1.8 PPG/4 Rbs

 

[ehizzy3]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

LaFrentz and Outlaw for Deng and Hinrich works due to Deng's BYC status. Maybe the Ruffin/Diogu trade does something for the roster space.

that would be a steal. no way we could get that done.

 

[RoyToy]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

The Bulls currently have two SF in Deng and Salmons that are starting quality. Do they keep both?

 

[alex42083]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

The Bulls currently have two SF in Deng and Salmons that are starting quality. Do they keep both?

Hope not... though they do have two starting quality PGs as well..

 

[PapaG]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

Canzano speculated on the sports update that we did this as a money-saving move as well in terms of our salary cap to make a splash instead in free agency this summer.
Maybe the trade offers we were getting were underwhelming.

How does it save cap space this summer? Wasn't Diagu at the end of his deal? Couldn't he just be renounced? Same with Frye, I suppose.

 

[Ed O]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

My attempt at the math... to see if Portland would save money.

I'm going to use "half" of the season, even though there is less than that remaining.

Ike Costs:
$1.45m (half of 2.9)
$2.9m (luxury tax hit since we are over it by about $8 before this deal)
Total Ike Costs: $4.35m

Ruffin Costs:
$1m (acquisition cost; sent to Sacramento in the trade)
$0.57m (half of 1.14, his "real" salary)
$0.8m (his "cap" salary as a veteran at the minimum)
Total Ruffin Costs: $2.37m

TOTAL SAVINGS: $1.98m

The cost savings are significant (although less significant than when I did the math wrong )... if we do, say, 40% or 33% the same basic result should occur...

Ed O.

 

[The Professional Fan]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

So confused......

 

[CaptNapalm]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

How does it save cap space this summer? Wasn't Diagu at the end of his deal? Couldn't he just be renounced? Same with Frye, I suppose.

Ruffin hasn't played this season because of an achilles injury. Maybe we are hoping to use him as another injury insurance payout.

 

[The Professional Fan]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

My attempt at the math... to see if Portland would save money.

I'm going to use "half" of the season, even though there is less than that remaining.

Ike Costs:
$1.45m (half of 2.9)
$5.8m (twice 2.9; luxury tax hit since we are over it by about $8 before this deal)
Total Ike Costs: $7.25m

Ruffin Costs:
$1m (acquisition cost; sent to Sacramento in the trade)
$0.57m (half of 1.14, his "real" salary)
$1.6m (twice 0.8)
Total Ruffin Costs: $3.15m

TOTAL SAVINGS: $4.1m

The cost savings are significant... if we do, say, 40% or 33% the same basic result should occur...

Ed O.

Again, confused. Would this be savings against the cap next season?

 

[Chuck Taylor]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

I have to believe this either:

1.) creates a trade exception we are about to use

or

2.) is occurring because it is part of a bigger trade with the Bulls or Kings

If it creates a trade exception we are about to use, it makes me wonder if the deal isn't already lined up. If it is part of a bigger trade with the Bulls or Kings, I would think it would have all been announced at the same time.

In short, I am thinking it is for a trade exception on a deal we already have lined up.

 

[Stepping Razor]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

My attempt at the math... to see if Portland would save money.

I'm going to use "half" of the season, even though there is less than that remaining.

Ike Costs:
$1.45m (half of 2.9)
$5.8m (twice 2.9; luxury tax hit since we are over it by about $8 before this deal)
Total Ike Costs: $7.25m

Ruffin Costs:
$1m (acquisition cost; sent to Sacramento in the trade)
$0.57m (half of 1.14, his "real" salary)
$1.6m (twice 0.8, his "cap" salary as a veteran at the minimum)
Total Ruffin Costs: $3.15m

TOTAL SAVINGS: $4.1m

The cost savings are significant... if we do, say, 40% or 33% the same basic result should occur...

Ed O.

Wait a second, I thought the luxury tax was imposed at 1:1... it's at 2:1? Or am I just proving myself to be a math dunce?

 

[MAS RipCity]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

argh there aren'teven any good free agents to go after this summer anyways!

 

[Haakzilla]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=apk2kv

 

[Stepping Razor]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

Also, Ruffin has been out all season with an injury. If insurance is paying his salary, we might save that $500k too.

Maybe we really did just do this to save money? I guess we'll find out soon.

 

[Ed O]

Re: Ruffin to Portland

Wait a second, I thought the luxury tax was imposed at 1:1... it's at 2:1? Or am I just proving myself to be a math dunce?

Oops. Nope. I must have low blood sugar level. Let me edit it.

Ed O.