Seat belt laws

[The Sebastian Express]

I could be knocked unconscious regardless. Seat belt or no. I could die on impact. I could be squashed by two semi's. Seat belt isn't going to help too much there.

And the health code thing is to protect you from unsanitary conditions which you are probably unaware of. If you eat at a place and you are fully aware that they don't wash their hands, properly handle the meats, or clean their kitchen, that's on you. It's the unknowingly that the health codes protect you from. Just as wearing a seat belt or not wearing it is me making the decision to take the risk. I know the potential dangers. It's my call. Not the governments.

Don't lecture me on my belief system. Do you have any vices? Smoke? Drink? Eat red meat? Are you over weight? I'm willing to bet you do something that isn't helping your overall health. People do a lot of things that shorten their life span. My point is, once they reach a certain age they are allowed to make that decision. Like you said before, at 18 I can smoke if I so choose. At 21 I can buy and consume alcohol. The government determined an age at which we are adult enough to make our own decisions in regards to our bodies, why/how is this any different?

How is beating your wife similar to abortion? We're talking about a person's right to choose what happens to their own bodies. Seriously, do you think abortion should be legal or not? And if you do, how in your opinion is it any different than forcing someone to protect their bodies?

Also I'm curious if you are pro or against firearms, because that's another preventative measure that might save your life some day, but then again you might not ever need it either.

You are still missing the point. Wearing the seatbelt is driving sober, driving without the seatbelt is like driving while intoxicated.

A person could be a little over the limit and they may or may not hit someone, but if they're caught they're still going to be fined. The government allows you to purchase and consume alcohol over a certain age, JUST as they allow you to own and operate a vehicle over a certain age. However, in both cases the government expects you to show proper maturity and monitor yourself in regards to your own safety and that of others. If you do not comply within their safety rules, you will be fined, ticketed, or jailed.

People are allowed to smoke in their homes because you are allowed to do to yourself, in most cases, what you wish. Most people are no longer allowed to smoke in public places because of the potential harm it does to others.

People are allowed to drink in their homes and at bars over a certain age, but the government expects you to show responsibility and not drive or harm other people while intoxicated. If you cannot monitor your alcohol level and lose control of your actions you are still responsible for them.

People are allowed to eat red meat even if it may cause you health problems - you are not, however, allowed to go and shove red meat (or anything) down another person's throat and force them to eat it.

You are allowed to skydive at risk of your own health, but you are not allowed to force someone else to skydive with you. If you hit someone else while skydiving, you're probably dead, and it is likely your estate will be sued.

Likewise, once again, the government allows you to drive a car - but if you cannot do so without the maturity to wear a seatbelt you will be fined. However unlikely you may find it that it would prevent you from harming others.

 

[Natebishop3]

You are still missing the point. Wearing the seatbelt is driving sober, driving without the seatbelt is like driving while intoxicated.

A person could be a little over the limit and they may or may not hit someone, but if they're caught they're still going to be fined. The government allows you to purchase and consume alcohol over a certain age, JUST as they allow you to own and operate a vehicle over a certain age. However, in both cases the government expects you to show proper maturity and monitor yourself in regards to your own safety and that of others. If you do not comply within their safety rules, you will be fined, ticketed, or jailed.

People are allowed to smoke in their homes because you are allowed to do to yourself, in most cases, what you wish. Most people are no longer allowed to smoke in public places because of the potential harm it does to others.

People are allowed to drink in their homes and at bars over a certain age, but the government expects you to show responsibility and not drive or harm other people while intoxicated. If you cannot monitor your alcohol level and lose control of your actions you are still responsible for them.

People are allowed to eat red meat even if it may cause you health problems - you are not, however, allowed to go and shove red meat (or anything) down another person's throat and force them to eat it.

You are allowed to skydive at risk of your own health, but you are not allowed to force someone else to skydive with you. If you hit someone else while skydiving, you're probably dead, and it is likely your estate will be sued.

Likewise, once again, the government allows you to drive a car - but if you cannot do so without the maturity to wear a seatbelt you will be fined. However unlikely you may find it that it would prevent you from harming others.

No disrespect intended, but I feel as though you are missing the point.

Every point you just listed, I feel, supports my own. I do not believe that wearing a seat belt is a threat to other people, whereas everything you listed was fine until it became a risk to others. That's my point exactly. The government has no claim to the issue until your actions present a clear risk to those around you. I fail to see how my wearing or not wearing a seat belt poses any risks to others around me, just as eating red meat, smoking in my home, drinking in a bar, or sky diving does not pose a threat to anyone but those who choose to partake in them.

Also, wearing the seatbelt is not driving sober. That's a bad analogy. Whether I wear the belt or not, my driving is not impaired in any way. I had never received a ticket up until this point. I am a good driver. I obey the rules of the road. To not wear a seat belt is nothing like driving intoxicated. You may consider it foolish, and you may be right, but that's my choice to make.

 

[BrianFromWA]

Nate, I love ya bro, but I'm in the "do the crime, pay the penalty" corner on this one. The time to protest laws is before you're caught breaking them.

 

[MickZagger]

How do some of you have the time and energy to go on post for post battles about something as dumb as wearing seatbelts.

I guess I just don't get it.

 

[Natebishop3]

Nate, I love ya bro, but I'm in the "do the crime, pay the penalty" corner on this one. The time to protest laws is before you're caught breaking them.

Honestly, if I had the money right now I would have requested a trial. I have never liked the law and I'd gladly go to the mat for it. I plead guilty and I didn't try to deny that I had broken the law because I did, in fact, break it. That's not the point. I don't think the law should exist. I never have. Just because I was given a ticket has no bearing.

 

[BoBoBREWSKI]

I think there shouldnt be a seat belt law for people over 18. If you are dumb enough to not wear it and you get in a wreck and die... fine with me... survival of the fittest!

 

[barfo]

The Sam Adams thing was a joke. I thought that was obvious to everybody but you.

Well, obviously it was. All of your posts are jokes.

Kind of like you have become. A JOKE. You're really referencing OT posts on the main board now? Are you mentally OK?

Huh? Sorry, don't know what post you are talking about.

You quite being a mod, and you seem to be stalking me at this point.

Well, better ban yourself again then. I might have a picture of myself with a gun, "Consultant".

barfo

 

[maxiep]

I think there shouldnt be a seat belt law for people over 18. If you are dumb enough to not wear it and you get in a wreck and die... fine with me... survival of the fittest!

Exactly. There's nothing wrong with Social Darwinism. My issue isn't with the specifics of a seat belt law or a helmet law, but the idea that someone believes they better know how to live my life than I do. Fuck the nanny state; be responsible for yourself and your own decisions.

 

[Rodolfo]

Alright, I'll be sure to reference this back when the state has outlawed red meat, cigarettes, alcohol, and anything else that might cause you harm. The government needs to protect you from yourself.

Don't talk to me like I was driving drunk, ran a red light, or was going 60 in a 30. The only person I could have harmed was myself and it's my right to do so. I don't hear you arguing against abortion or Dr. assisted suicide, but guess what.... those both fall under the same umbrella in my book. Your body and you can do what you want with it.

Didn't see your post last night and wanted to respond to you.

I wasn't intending on talking to you like you were drunk driving or that you're a bad person. Not sure how you could get that out of my post. I personally believe in seatbelt laws, because if we didn't have them, people would be dying in huge numbers on the roads(They were before seatbelts were around). While I still believe it in, I have softened my stance a little after reading everyone's ideas on here and having a big discussion about with a friend.

Here are couple of facts I looked up about seat belts:
•For survivors, average medical costs are 50% higher for those not wearing a seatbelt.
•Only 1% of passengers who were restrained were ejected from car seats during a car crash. Of those ejected (restrained and unrestrained), 73% were killed.
•As many as 17,000 people could be saved every year by wearing a seatbelt.
http://www.anapolschwartz.com/practices/seat-belt-failure/seatbelt-statistics.asp

I don't argue against Dr. Assisted suicide because I very much believe in it as a way for someone, who is terminally ill and in a great deal of pain, to end their suffering. I also believe that abortion is ok, under the right circumstances. You cannot compare either one of those to seat belt laws.

 

[THE HCP]

I think there shouldnt be a seat belt law for people over 18. If you are dumb enough to not wear it and you get in a wreck and die... fine with me... survival of the fittest!

Great point. I am one of those dumbasses who does not wear a seatbelt. I do if my kids are in the car, but I don't even wear one on the plane. No real reason other then it is not a habit.

 

[Rodolfo]

Great point. I am one of those dumbasses who does not wear a seatbelt. I do if my kids are in the car, but I don't even wear one on the plane. No real reason other then it is not a habit.

HCP, How's the gym going dude?

 

[Natebishop3]

Didn't see your post last night and wanted to respond to you.

I wasn't intending on talking to you like you were drunk driving or that you're a bad person. Not sure how you could get that out of my post. I personally believe in seatbelt laws, because if we didn't have them, people would be dying in huge numbers on the roads(They were before seatbelts were around). While I still believe it in, I have softened my stance a little after reading everyone's ideas on here and having a big discussion about with a friend.

Here are couple of facts I looked up about seat belts:
•For survivors, average medical costs are 50% higher for those not wearing a seatbelt.
•Only 1% of passengers who were restrained were ejected from car seats during a car crash. Of those ejected (restrained and unrestrained), 73% were killed.
•As many as 17,000 people could be saved every year by wearing a seatbelt.
http://www.anapolschwartz.com/practices/seat-belt-failure/seatbelt-statistics.asp

I don't argue against Dr. Assisted suicide because I very much believe in it as a way for someone, who is terminally ill and in a great deal of pain, to end their suffering. I also believe that abortion is ok, under the right circumstances. You cannot compare either one of those to seat belt laws.

Rudy I'm not saying seat belts aren't a good thing. I'm not saying people shouldn't wear them. I'm merely saying that the government has no right to tell me, or anyone else, that they HAVE to wear them. This is merely a case of old school Republicanism or Democratic Republicanism is you will. Less government. Less control. Just as the government has no right to tell people who they can and can't marry, or whether a woman should be able to have an abortion, it also has no right to tell me that I have to wear a seat belt.

I'm in favor of seat belts. I usually wear one, but that's not the point here.

 

[PapaG]

Well, better ban yourself again then. I might have a picture of myself with a gun, "Consultant".

barfo

Why did you put consultant in quotes? It's my job. It's what I do. I share what I do, who I am, and my experiences in the OT forum.

Frankly, the only thing I know about you is that you're old and you never had kids. Your life experiences seem minimal, at least in terms of being a responsible adult.

 

[barfo]

Why did you put consultant in quotes? It's my job. It's what I do. I share what I do, who I am, and my experiences in the OT forum.

And we are all the richer for it, "Consultant".

Frankly, the only thing I know about you is that you're old and you never had kids. Your life experiences seem minimal, at least in terms of being a responsible adult.

Heh. Does being a responsible adult mean having kids, to you? If so, I agree I am irresponsible. Although it is possible I have kids I don't know about, and if I do, then I guess I'd be a responsible adult after all...

As for the quotes, you always put "Producer" in quotes back when I was a mod. I don't actually know what you meant by that, but I figure it must be a compliment, right "Consultant"?

barfo

 

[PapaG]

And we are all the richer for it, "Consultant".

That's for speaking for "all" of us.

Heh. Does being a responsible adult mean having kids, to you? If so, I agree I am irresponsible. Although it is possible I have kids I don't know about, and if I do, then I guess I'd be a responsible adult after all...

I judge people and their life experiences on many levels. Being able to have a successful career while also having a family weigh in on my decisions as I get older. Your posts, to me, indicate that you're basically a child who is forced at times to act like an adult. There is nothing wrong with that, but the snark and puns tell me a lot about you.

As for the quotes, you always put "Producer" in quotes back when I was a mod. I don't actually know what you meant by that, but I figure it must be a compliment, right "Consultant"?

barfo

I can see your internet title of "Producer" meant a lot to you. Probably more then your real life means to you. Do you ever get the itch to ask for it back?

 

[barfo]

I can see your internet title of "Producer" meant a lot to you. Probably more then your real life means to you. Do you ever get the itch to ask for it back?

You make a lot of assumptions, "Consultant". Is that what you do as a "Consultant"? Make a bunch of unfounded assumptions?

No, I don't want the title back. Maybe someday I will, but right now I don't have time for it, and I'm rather enjoying just being a poster.

barfo