Shooting at Umpqua Community College: 10 dead

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magnifier661 said:
Oh sweet! Thanks man!
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magnifier661 said:
Well shit man!!! Out of the 240 mass shootings this year, 50 were in Chicago, where gun control is most strict.
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If they would stop calling shootings of 2 people a "mass shooting," maybe the numbers would be a little more accurate.

They're going off of the FBI definition of a "mass shooting," which is a minimum of 2 victims AND the shooter himself. That's a mass shooting, and that's the definition that is being used. Now I'm not diminishing the loss of two human lives, but two people is not the number that immediately comes to mind when someone says "mass."

Similarly, if they would stop calling all shootings that happen on school grounds a "school shooting," we might also get more accurate numbers in that regard as well. When you say "school shooting," people immediately think of what happened today. That's not how people are defining it though. They're defining it as any shooting that happenings on school grounds. This could include a gang shooting that happens at 2 am in a school parking lot, or on a playground, and that's some of the shootings that are being included in those numbers that are being publicized.
 
3RA1N1AC said:
so you are saying chicago doesnt have a lot of guns?

wait, so you are saying chicago needs MORE guns?
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I'm saying that they have the strictest gun restrictions, yet they are the most violent and deadly city in the US.
 
Natebishop3 said:
If they would stop calling shootings of 2 people a "mass shooting," maybe the numbers would be a little more accurate.

They're going off of the FBI definition of a "mass shooting," which is a minimum of 2 victims AND the shooter himself. That's a mass shooting, and that's the definition that is being used. Now I'm not diminishing the loss of two human lives, but two people is not the number that immediately comes to mind when someone says "mass."

Similarly, if they would stop calling all shootings that happen on school grounds a "school shooting," we might also get more accurate numbers in that regard as well. When you say "school shooting," people immediately think of what happened today. That's not how people are defining it though. They're defining it as any shooting that happenings on school grounds. This could include a gang shooting that happens at 2 am in a school parking lot, or on a playground, and that's some of the shootings that are being included in those numbers that are being publicized.
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To add to that, people using some common sense and realizing that strict gun control in Chicago does not = strict gun control in the rest of Illinois or other states. The majority of guns used in Chicago gun crimes come from out of state. And a good chunk of the rest come from suburbs outside of the city, which don't have similar gun control laws as the city does. But people will continue to just spout off look at chicago, and haha, they have strict laws against them.
 
Natebishop3 said:
If they would stop calling shootings of 2 people a "mass shooting," maybe the numbers would be a little more accurate.

They're going off of the FBI definition of a "mass shooting," which is a minimum of 2 victims AND the shooter himself. That's a mass shooting, and that's the definition that is being used. Now I'm not diminishing the loss of two human lives, but two people is not the number that immediately comes to mind when someone says "mass."

Similarly, if they would stop calling all shootings that happen on school grounds a "school shooting," we might also get more accurate numbers in that regard as well. When you say "school shooting," people immediately think of what happened today. That's not how people are defining it though. They're defining it as any shooting that happenings on school grounds. This could include a gang shooting that happens at 2 am in a school parking lot, or on a playground, and that's some of the shootings that are being included in those numbers that are being publicized.
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So how many of the 240 "mass shootings" are just 2 people this year? I've only seen two so far this year that was more than 5.
 
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RR7 said:
To add to that, people using some common sense and realizing that strict gun control in Chicago does not = strict gun control in the rest of Illinois or other states. The majority of guns used in Chicago gun crimes come from out of state. And a good chunk of the rest come from suburbs outside of the city, which don't have similar gun control laws as the city does. But people will continue to just spout off look at chicago, and haha, they have strict laws against them.
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They had a prohibition of alcohol, yet people could still buy alcohol. They made cocaine illegal, yet it's an epidemic in the US. They made meth illegal, yet people still find it.

Criminals will find the guns regardless and the law abiding citizens can't.
 
magnifier661 said:
So how many of the 240 "mass shootings" are just 2 people this year? I've only seen one so far this year that was more than 5.
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I don't know. You'd have to go through and review the information, but I'm tired of people using hyperbole and trigger words to push their agenda. They know that the terms "mass shooting" and "school shooting" are both phrases that immediately illicit a visceral response from the public, so they use the loosest possible definition of those phrases to create "click bait" titles that get spread around like wildfire.

All shootings are bad. Not going to argue that. I just wish people would be honest about how they're representing this information. When they say there have been 240 mass shootings this year, firstly it diminishes how horrible the shooting that occurred today truly was, and secondly it makes it sound like the Umpqua shooting is a daily occurrence around the US.
 
magnifier661 said:
They had a prohibition of alcohol, yet people could still buy alcohol. They made cocaine illegal, yet it's an epidemic in the US. They made meth illegal, yet people still find it.

Criminals will find the guns regardless and the law abiding citizens can't.
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Nowhere in my post did I say anything about prohibition on guns.
 
Mental illness is the crux of the matter here. Yet, as usual, it'll turn into a fucking debate about gun control. As if the crazy fuck (or future fucks) would have any trouble getting guns illegally as well. Crazy people will be crazy.... We must address this (mental health)in America...but nobody gives a fuck. Just keep on pushin' pills big pharma.
 
Every time this happens the President and other people call for more gun control.

Propose something. I'm tired of the blanket statement, "We need more gun control!" Great! Fantastic! Like what?

What's the grand plan that will put a stop to this?
 
blue32 said:
Mental illness is the crux of the matter here. Yet, as usual, it'll turn into a fucking debate about gun control. As if the crazy fuck (or future fucks) would have any trouble getting guns illegally as well. Crazy people will be crazy.... We must address this (mental health)in America...but nobody gives a fuck. Just keep on pushin' pills big pharma.
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And yet 'crazy people' have no problem getting their hands on guns.

That's the problem. It's too easy to get a gun.
 
magnifier661 said:
I'm saying that they have the strictest gun restrictions, yet they are the most violent and deadly city in the US.
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or alternately, they are they most violent and deadly city in the US, SO they have the strictest gun restrictions...see what i did there?
 
Fez Hammersticks said:
And yet 'crazy people' have no problem getting their hands on guns.

That's the problem. It's too easy to get a gun.
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This kid was 20 years old. He legally cannot buy a handgun in Oregon. Supposedly they found THREE handguns at the scene. So how did he get his hands on them, and how would more laws prevent it from happening? Didn't we just pass a law in Oregon that he legally shouldn't be able to get his hands on these guns from family/friends without doing a background check?
 
Natebishop3 said:
This kid was 20 years old. He legally cannot buy a handgun in Oregon. Supposedly they found THREE handguns at the scene. So how did he get his hands on them, and how would more laws prevent it from happening? Didn't we just pass a law in Oregon that he legally shouldn't be able to get his hands on these guns from family/friends without doing a background check?
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The shooter is from the mid-west -- first to Seattle then to ....Roseburg.
 
RR7 said:
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Nowhere in my post did I say anything about prohibition on guns.
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Well what does it matter then? So guns exist, just stricter to obtain them legally. You stated that people in Chicago could have gotten them out of state. Maybe they got them in state? It's not like guns are banned right?

So how do you stop gun violence when criminals can still get them anyway?
 
You guys are arguing over policies. Remember that people died. This is real shit. I spent 3 years of my life going to the exact building that the shooting happened in. I have friends and family that still go to school there. I have spent my day texting them and trying to find out if anyone I know and love has been a victim. Let's not make this about politics right now. This just hits way too close to home for me. Give it some time before this turns into some dumb political argument.
 
Fez Hammersticks said:
And yet 'crazy people' have no problem getting their hands on guns.

That's the problem. It's too easy to get a gun.
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...do you think that it will magically be harder for so-called crazy people to get a gun if they really wanted one? If you're intentions for using a gun are evil/against the law, then why would you even attempt to obtain a gun legally by the "rules" in the first place (however strict they may be)? Seems to me that blue32 was onto something regarding mental health!
 
handclap problematic said:
You guys are arguing over policies. Remember that people died. This is real shit. I spent 3 years of my life going to the exact building that the shooting happened in. I have friends and family that still go to school there. I have spent my day texting them and trying to find out if anyone I know and love has been a victim. Let's not make this about politics right now. This just hits way too close to home for me. Give it some time before this turns into some dumb political argument.
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Well it all started when Obama used this tragedy for his pursuit to ban guns.
 
magnifier661 said:
Well what does it matter then? So guns exist, just stricter to obtain them legally. You stated that people in Chicago could have gotten them out of state. Maybe they got them in state? It's not like guns are banned right?

So how do you stop gun violence when criminals can still get them anyway?
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I stated the majority came from out of state. Feel free to look it up. And a vast majority of the rest come from outside of Chicago city limits, where the law changes. What it shows is criminals going to the easiest place possible to find guns. But shows they're not as a whole getting them in chicago, with their strict gun laws. So if the entire state, and surrounding states had similar laws as Chicago, it has the potential for making it even that much more difficult for them to obtain these guns, since they're not being sold right next door.
 
handclap problematic said:
You guys are arguing over policies. Remember that people died. This is real shit. I spent 3 years of my life going to the exact building that the shooting happened in. I have friends and family that still go to school there. I have spent my day texting them and trying to find out if anyone I know and love has been a victim. Let's not make this about politics right now. This just hits way too close to home for me. Give it some time before this turns into some dumb political argument.
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People make it into a political argument within seconds of hearing about it. I understand you're upset, and I feel horrible that this happened, but this is a discussion forum. If we didn't discuss the who, the what, the where, the when, and the why, what else would we discuss? The thread would say, "shooting at Umpqua CC" and then there would be a handful of posts saying that it was a tragic event and that would be it. We come here to vent, to discuss the issues, and to find out information. I apologize if it sounds crass, or cold, but that's what we do here. We talk politics. We talk current events.
 
RR7 said:
I stated the majority came from out of state. Feel free to look it up. And a vast majority of the rest come from outside of Chicago city limits, where the law changes. What it shows is criminals going to the easiest place possible to find guns. But shows they're not as a whole getting them in chicago, with their strict gun laws. So if the entire state, and surrounding states had similar laws as Chicago, it has the potential for making it even that much more difficult for them to obtain these guns, since they're not being sold right next door.
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Like Coke or meth... That shit is really hard to get man!
 
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