Politics Should schools teach Critical Race Theory?

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Should Public Schools teach Critical Race Theory?

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crandc said:
In Oberlin, Louisiana, Darrell Semien served as police officer for 15 years before dying of cancer at 55. A representative of the local cemetery told his widow that a clause in their burial contract mandated the right of burial there only to white people. This happened in 2021.

No such thing as racism....
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Pretty sure that's unconstitutional. She should now (or in the near future) own that cemetery.
 
Shaboid said:
Shouldn't calling any adult male boy be unacceptable?
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I mean, not really. I go up to friends i have had since elementary school and say "what's up boys!" When I haven't seen them in ages. Nobody cares or finds it offensive. If someone did find it offensive i would apologize and try to check myself so I didn't say it again. I see the context dviss provides. If he just called me out and said dude don't do that. I'd put forth every effort not to do that anymore and would apologize if I slipped up as soon as i said it. Definitely would make me think twice about ever saying it to a black person too based on what Dviss is saying in this thread.

I get that context matters. But peoples feelings overrule that. If its going to cause problems and potentially hurt someones feelings, i'd rather just train myself not to say it.

Of course there is always the possibility someone would get offended at something else too that you said. But providing some empathy goes a long way.
 
Phatguysrule said:
Pretty sure that's unconstitutional. She should now (or in the near future) own that cemetery.
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ACLU sued but the widow didn't want her husband buried there after having to do a legal battle.
 
PS I HATE it when grown women are called "girls". For that matter I hate it when breasts are referred to as "girls". What's wrong with just saying breast?
Stopped being a girl decades ago.
 
Good column in NY Times by Charles Blow
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/26/opinion/homophobia-lgbt-hip-hop.html

I have always contended that all of the -isms and -phobias are cousins, that in a society that creates a hierarchy of humanity with white, straight, cisgender men at the apex, every person who is not white or straight or cisgender or male gets assigned a lower order of being.

In that sense, racism and sexism, homophobia and transphobia all branch from the same tree.

And one bias can influence and amplify another.

In a society that treats racism as a sport, in which each racial group is jockeying against the others, all of them shadowed by a culture of white supremacy laced with misogyny, anything that reduces your percentage of straight males, or “feminizes” them, is seen as weakening the race.
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Racists will often point to their friends of color as evidence that they are not racist themselves. Donald Trump’s defenders often pointed out that he had many Black friends — or at least associates — in hip-hop before he ran for president. This is the same kind of defense homophobes often use. On Tuesday, Boosie Badazz introduced the world to his gay manager in an Instagram post in an attempt to demonstrate that he could not be homophobic.

Wrong. You can be racist with Black friends and homophobic with gay ones.
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crandc said:
PS I HATE it when grown women are called "girls". For that matter I hate it when breasts are referred to as "girls". What's wrong with just saying breast?
Stopped being a girl decades ago.
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I had a womans studies class in college as an elective. The professor said to stop going into rooms and referring to everyone in the room as guys. Like a "what's up guys" when females are present. It has been a long time since I have taken the course, but the reasoning had to do with society being male dominant and how offensive it could be perceived. I'll admit, sometimes I still say what's up guys and immediately feel guilty that I may have upset someone.

Long story short, if someone goes into a room with you and multiple other people, does it bother you if someone entered the room and said "what's up guys" to the entire group?
 
SlyPokerCat said:
I mean, not really. I go up to friends i have had since elementary school and say "what's up boys!" When I haven't seen them in ages. Nobody cares or finds it offensive. If someone did find it offensive i would apologize and try to check myself so I didn't say it again. I see the context dviss provides. If he just called me out and said dude don't do that. I'd put forth every effort not to do that anymore and would apologize if I slipped up as soon as i said it. Definitely would make me think twice about ever saying it to a black person too based on what Dviss is saying in this thread.

I get that context matters. But peoples feelings overrule that. If its going to cause problems and potentially hurt someones feelings, i'd rather just train myself not to say it.

Of course there is always the possibility someone would get offended at something else too that you said. But providing some empathy goes a long way.
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I guess I don't understand. Aren't we supposed to be breaking down the construct of race? Shouldn't calling all adult males "boy" or all adult females "girl" be frowned upon if this is the goal?

Calling an adult female girl=sexist
Calling an black adult male boy=racist
Calling an adult male boy=?

As a side, I often find myself saying "hey what's up guys?" to my friends that are girls and I always second guess after the fact if I'm being sexist or something. So same questions as the cat haha
 
SlyPokerCat said:
I had a womans studies class in college as an elective. The professor said to stop going into rooms and referring to everyone in the room as guys. Like a "what's up guys" when females are present. It has been a long time since I have taken the course, but the reasoning had to do with society being male dominant and how offensive it could be perceived. I'll admit, sometimes I still say what's up guys and immediately feel guilty that I may have upset someone.

Long story short, if someone goes into a room with you and multiple other people, does it bother you if someone entered the room and said "what's up guys" to the entire group?
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Yes, although still not as much as being called girl.
 
Shaboid said:
I guess I don't understand. Aren't we supposed to be breaking down the construct of race? Shouldn't calling all adult males "boy" or all adult females "girl" be frowned upon if this is the goal?

Calling an adult female girl=sexist
Calling an black adult male boy=racist
Calling an adult male boy=?

As a side, I often find myself saying "hey what's up guys?" to my friends that are girls and I always second guess after the fact if I'm being sexist or something. So same questions as the cat haha
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In my mind calling an adult white male a boy doesn't have the same history behind it that calling an adult black male does. So two completely different things. I'd be happy to hear Dviss thoughts in this though.
 
SlyPokerCat said:
In my mind calling an adult white male a boy doesn't have the same history behind it that calling an adult black male does. So two completely different things. I'd be happy to hear Dviss thoughts in this though.
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Gee I wonder what he’ll say about it
 
crandc said:
Yes, although still not as much as being called girl.
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It is really kind of a weird concept. Not sure why we say "what's up guys" instead of "What's up everybody." My professors explanation made sense.

Thanks for your reply.
 
SlyPokerCat said:
It is really kind of a weird concept. Not sure why we say "what's up guys" instead of "What's up everybody." My professors explanation made sense.

Thanks for your reply.
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And some people don't care if you says "guys." I'm just going to start saying "ya'll," Southerners get off easy.
 
SlyPokerCat said:
It is really kind of a weird concept. Not sure why we say "what's up guys" instead of "What's up everybody." My professors explanation made sense.

Thanks for your reply.
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Because “guys” is non-gender specific in that context.
 
tlongII said:
Because “guys” is non-gender specific in that context.
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I mean, maybe that's your interpretation. Crandc posted above it can be offensive to her. I've heard that from a professor too. Starting to add up in who feels that way. So why not just say, what's up everyone?
 
crandc said:
PS I HATE it when grown women are called "girls". For that matter I hate it when breasts are referred to as "girls". What's wrong with just saying breast?
Stopped being a girl decades ago.
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Ladys
 
SlyPokerCat said:
It is really kind of a weird concept. Not sure why we say "what's up guys" instead of "What's up everybody." My professors explanation made sense.

Thanks for your reply.
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Because of laziness. We are used to speaking informally. What's up guys has become a non gender variation of what's up everyone.

What's up everyone is probably the best variation. What's up guys and gals is perhaps better, but it can disclude Trans and non gender people.
 
Chris Craig said:
Ladys
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Can't say it without feeling like a total sleezeball.

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Phatguysrule said:
That's fine. The lawsuit should ideally bankrupt that company.
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After the cemetery formally rescinded their whites only policy and fired the employee who refused to sell a plot to the officer's widow, ACLU received a letter from a white man threatening to sue them for depriving him of his right to be buried in a whites only cemetery per the contract he had signed. He said he is not a racist but has preferences, including an all white resting place. Because a non racist really cares about the color of the person he rots next to.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Because it's insulting. Calling white people colonists. Telling us we need to decolonize our minds. It's a way to dismiss someone's opinion without even addressing it.
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What kind of colonist are you referring to? I don't think he's talking about the same thing you are, but I don't want to speak for him or put words in his text.

I took it to mean that the term white (or the classification) is a made up construct, and to refer to oneself as that (or whatever) is holding yourself to a weird standard that those in power created to classify us/divide us, etc.

Decolonize, to me, just meant to not believe or accept the standard that other people created for us as a people. I.e., Someone using a definition that was created to artificially separate us as people.

Someone saying that "white people" do this or what, doesn't offend me. In a lot of cases, it's true, but even if I find it untrue (or it's not true about myself), it doesn't mean the other person is wrong.

I think a better way to say it is (and I admit this might totally not be what dviss1 is getting at, so forgive me if it is wrong).

Like if you know a Lakers fan who is knowledgeable, affable and not an arrogant clown, but you say "man, "Laker fans" are idiots", he or she would probably go "you're right. Many Laker fans ruin it for those of us who can name players outside of Kobe, Shaq, LeBron and Anthony Davis".

So if you're *not* an annoying Laker fan, someone referring to a subgroup as a Laker fan, isn't about you.

So if someone says "that's such a white man thing to do" to someone else, it doesn't mean I'm that. Mostly because I don't consider myself 'white' because it's a made up classification.
 
tlongII said:
No. I always call my friends boys. One of my best friends is black and we are boys. Context matters.
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This musical timeout from our sponsors:

 
julius said:
What kind of colonist are you referring to?
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I've had a couple of colonoscopys, so I'm covered. Actually, they took out some cysts, so you might say I have a semi-colon.
 
I should clean that up a bit.

I know that in this country, I benefit from the fact my skin is "white". I'm not saying "I see no color" or whatever though.
 
julius said:
What kind of colonist are you referring to? I don't think he's talking about the same thing you are, but I don't want to speak for him or put words in his text.

I took it to mean that the term white (or the classification) is a made up construct, and to refer to oneself as that (or whatever) is holding yourself to a weird standard that those in power created to classify us/divide us, etc.

Decolonize, to me, just meant to not believe or accept the standard that other people created for us as a people. I.e., Someone using a definition that was created to artificially separate us as people.

Someone saying that "white people" do this or what, doesn't offend me. In a lot of cases, it's true, but even if I find it untrue (or it's not true about myself), it doesn't mean the other person is wrong.

I think a better way to say it is (and I admit this might totally not be what dviss1 is getting at, so forgive me if it is wrong).

Like if you know a Lakers fan who is knowledgeable, affable and not an arrogant clown, but you say "man, "Laker fans" are idiots", he or she would probably go "you're right. Many Laker fans ruin it for those of us who can name players outside of Kobe, Shaq, LeBron and Anthony Davis".

So if you're *not* an annoying Laker fan, someone referring to a subgroup as a Laker fan, isn't about you.

So if someone says "that's such a white man thing to do" to someone else, it doesn't mean I'm that. Mostly because I don't consider myself 'white' because it's a made up classification.
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Thank you for amplifying melanated voices. He won't listen to me but maybe he will listen to you.
 
julius said:
What kind of colonist are you referring to? I don't think he's talking about the same thing you are, but I don't want to speak for him or put words in his text.

I took it to mean that the term white (or the classification) is a made up construct, and to refer to oneself as that (or whatever) is holding yourself to a weird standard that those in power created to classify us/divide us, etc.

Decolonize, to me, just meant to not believe or accept the standard that other people created for us as a people. I.e., Someone using a definition that was created to artificially separate us as people.

Someone saying that "white people" do this or what, doesn't offend me. In a lot of cases, it's true, but even if I find it untrue (or it's not true about myself), it doesn't mean the other person is wrong.

I think a better way to say it is (and I admit this might totally not be what dviss1 is getting at, so forgive me if it is wrong).

Like if you know a Lakers fan who is knowledgeable, affable and not an arrogant clown, but you say "man, "Laker fans" are idiots", he or she would probably go "you're right. Many Laker fans ruin it for those of us who can name players outside of Kobe, Shaq, LeBron and Anthony Davis".

So if you're *not* an annoying Laker fan, someone referring to a subgroup as a Laker fan, isn't about you.

So if someone says "that's such a white man thing to do" to someone else, it doesn't mean I'm that. Mostly because I don't consider myself 'white' because it's a made up classification.
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You can choose not to be a Laker fan. It's not a permanent characteristic. I was born with my skin color. Most of the time I don't even give a shit if someone makes a joke about white people or says something about white people.... what I don't like is hypocrites. I don't like it when people go HAM about perceived slights based on race, and then turn around make a lot of generalized statements about other races.

The whole "boy" vs "eat a bag of dicks" thing is a perfect example of what pisses me off about Dviss. He comes out and says that Calvin shouldn't say "boy" when referring to grown black men, while also simultaneously pushing back and getting angry because people pointed out that saying "eat a bag of dicks" can be perceived as homophobic. He didn't immediately say "oh my bad. I didn't think of that way." He pushed back and got angry. So........ he's a hypocrite. I can't stand hypocrites.
 
ABM said:
I've had a couple of colonoscopys, so I'm covered. Actually, they took out some cysts, so you might say I have a semi-colon.
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TMI
 
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