SI: Five Most Overrated Players

[SpamKing]

Jesus. Dame has carried the team, not the other way around. Wes, Batum, and Aldridge couldn't do shit until Dame came around and got them to the second round for the first time in 14 years. Also, Draymond Green is not overrated. The guy moved to center in the NBA Finals and they won three straight with him getting a triple double in the clinching game. This list is a joke.

Meanwhile, aldridge against the Scums tonight (4th quarter, play-by-play):

8:57 80-71 LaMarcus Aldridge enters the game for David West
8:44 82-71 LaMarcus Aldridge misses 15-foot two point shot
7:31 84-73 LaMarcus Aldridge defensive rebound
5:00 89-77 LaMarcus Aldridge misses 5-foot jumper
4:39 89-77 LaMarcus Aldridge offensive foul (Mirza Teletovic draws the foul)
4:39 89-77 LaMarcus Aldridge turnover
3:56 91-77 LaMarcus Aldridge lost ball turnover (Brandon Knight steals)

3:55 LMFAO

 

[WillG]

I LOVE Lillard (especially the person), but, unfortunately, I think SI is on the money with this (about the player).

What the hell has happened to Lillards shot?
Personally, I think it stems from Dame over-estimating his ability, and, lately, lazy decision making..
[forced llloooonngg threes on TERRIBLE shot selection, turnovers, walking the ball up, crap defense anyone?]

The Dame we have nowadays seems to be trying too hard to get his - [to upkeep his reputation/Brand?] - and it's hurting himself and the team.

And let's face it, Dame, without his shot, and combined with his less than stellar defense, is only good/above average at best - not great. [In fact I'd rather McCollum at the point than Dame without his shot. McCollum is a better creator]

I'd like to see Dame get back to efficient basics (No forced threes!!!!!), and try to be more of a facilitator. Also less minutes on the court over the season - we have the depth now.
Perhaps, more refreshed, we'll see the re-emergence of the ' sub-Zero' Dame ( Yeah, I know, It's been a while right?)

I guess in the spirit of todays date; I would like to see Lillard go back(to his old ways) to improve his future. . .

 

[BBert]

I felt that Dames reputation was based primarily on how crazy clutch he was. When he got hurt and mangled his finger it didn't help his consistency or his clutch stats. Also starting with the Clips last year teams were running out and doubling him at the three point line, basically cutting off our head. I predict better things and more help making teams pay for that tactic this year. Dame looks quicker this year and teams are going to have to pay attention to CJ and our slashers, allowing Dame to pick his spots.

 

[rasheedfan2005]

Misses top 5 list but is still over rated. Thanks SI for pouring gas on the fire.

 

[blue32]

The shoes? The finger? Hit a wall? I hope his shooting slump fixes itself and hes iceman again. We need the deep ball to go down from him this year like it did the first two.

 

[KeepOnRollin]

From preseason (and I know it is early) his 3 shot seems to be back guys. Let's hope that continues!

 

[BBert]

Dame is deadly when he can lull you to sleep then BAM! pick his spots.

He'll be back!!

 

[blue9]

And let's face it, Dame, without his shot, and combined with his less than stellar defense, is only good/above average at best - not great.

Agreed. The only thing that makes Dame special is his ability to hit clutch shots and take over games in the final minutes. Without that he's an average starting PG. It's why I hope he spends this entire season working on facilitating - that's the part of his game that needs the most work and will have the largest impact on team success. If he can become a good/great distributor then this team can quickly get back to where we were before the rebuild, and then go even further. I wouldn't mind seeing his combined APG/TOPG exceed his FGA, as long as the APG trend upwards and the TOPG trend downwards over the course of the season.

 

[jlprk]

What the hell has happened to Lillards shot?

I felt that Dames reputation was based primarily on how crazy clutch he was.

Lillard, if you're reading this, you gotta make your shots. You're too short to succeed at taking it to the hoop. Your 3 has been off since your second year, so your only option is to take more mid-range shots.

 

[Tunchi]

Honestly, the only thing overrated about Lillard is his 3 point shooting. Other than that hes a damn good player. But his 3 point shooting for the last half a year has been terrible. It hasn't been that great this preseason either, Im at peace at this point he probably wont be that great of a 3 point shooter anymore. I'll take average if anything from him though.. better than nothing

 

[Nikolokolus]

I LOVE Lillard (especially the person), but, unfortunately, I think SI is on the money with this (about the player).

What the hell has happened to Lillards shot?
Personally, I think it stems from Dame over-estimating his ability, and, lately, lazy decision making..
[forced llloooonngg threes on TERRIBLE shot selection, turnovers, walking the ball up, crap defense anyone?]

The Dame we have nowadays seems to be trying too hard to get his - [to upkeep his reputation/Brand?] - and it's hurting himself and the team.

And let's face it, Dame, without his shot, and combined with his less than stellar defense, is only good/above average at best - not great. [In fact I'd rather McCollum at the point than Dame without his shot. McCollum is a better creator]

I'd like to see Dame get back to efficient basics (No forced threes!!!!!), and try to be more of a facilitator. Also less minutes on the court over the season - we have the depth now.
Perhaps, more refreshed, we'll see the re-emergence of the ' sub-Zero' Dame ( Yeah, I know, It's been a while right?)

I guess in the spirit of todays date; I would like to see Lillard go back(to his old ways) to improve his future. . .

Not to derail things too much, but this is my central argument (in several other threads) for why this team should be trying to tank hard this year and get a top 5 pick. If Damian doesn't have the "minerals" (so to speak) to be a truly great player (like near-MVP level minimum) then they need to find that guy and I don't believe that guy is already on the roster.

I really love Damian's competitive spirit and his willingness to take big shots and be "the man" is beyond reproach, but I have serious doubts where his career arc is headed. He just strikes me as one of those "good but not great" players that are always teasing you with flashes of brilliance, just don't have that next gear to separate themselves - the league's history is littered with Steve Francis and Stephon Marbury types (comparing play style and general talent level here, not attitude).

What I'm saying is that I think Damian can be the second best player on a championship level team, but I doubt he can be the linchpin. Regardless of what I think, it seems like we're about to figure out if he's a "good stats on a bad team" guy, or that franchise center-piece.

 

[blue9]

Not to derail things too much, but this is my central argument (in several other threads) for why this team should be trying to tank hard this year and get a top 5 pick. If Damian doesn't have the "minerals" (so to speak) to be a truly great player (like near-MVP level minimum) then they need to find that guy and I don't believe that guy is already on the roster.

I really love Damian's competitive spirit and his willingness to take big shots and be "the man" is beyond reproach, but I have serious doubts where his career arc is headed. He just strikes me as one of those "good but not great" players that are always teasing you with flashes of brilliance, just don't have that next gear to separate themselves - the league's history is littered with Steve Francis and Stephon Marbury types (comparing play style and general talent level here, not attitude).

What I'm saying is that I think Damian can be the second best player on a championship level team, but I doubt he can be the linchpin, but regardless of what I think, it seems like we're about to figure out if he's a "good stats on a bad team" guy, or that franchise center-piece.

Completely agree. I'm still of the opinion that we need to find the next great wing player to be our #1 option - that's where championships are born.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Not to derail things too much, but this is my central argument (in several other threads) for why this team should be trying to tank hard this year and get a top 5 pick. If Damian doesn't have the "minerals" (so to speak) to be a truly great player (like near-MVP level minimum) then they need to find that guy and I don't believe that guy is already on the roster.

I really love Damian's competitive spirit and his willingness to take big shots and be "the man" is beyond reproach, but I have serious doubts where his career arc is headed. He just strikes me as one of those "good but not great" players that are always teasing you with flashes of brilliance, just don't have that next gear to separate themselves - the league's history is littered with Steve Francis and Stephon Marbury types (comparing play style and general talent level here, not attitude).

What I'm saying is that I think Damian can be the second best player on a championship level team, but I doubt he can be the linchpin, but regardless of what I think, it seems like we're about to figure out if he's a "good stats on a bad team" guy, or that franchise center-piece.

I can agree with all of this really. I see Dame as always being the leader but the leader isn't always the best player on a team.
If Dame is part of the core three for the next decade, we need one more guy that is more impactful than Dame. Dame as the number 2 is where I hope the Blazers are looking at long term. Get a Paul George as our number one, maybe a Meyers and or cj break out to be a 3 and/or 4. all of them fringe all stars at minimum and that's a core to build around that can contend in my opinion.

I think this is the first opinion you have had that I can agree with. However I don't think tanking for a draft pick gets us that number 1 and even if we did get a top 5, that means that none of the other guys are panning out, so that blows both of our thoughts out of the water I think.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Completely agree. I'm still of the opinion that we need to find the next great wing player to be our #1 option - that's where championships are born.

you know, the more I think about it, I really think Riverman is on to something. Paul George is that answer if we can get him.

 

[Nikolokolus]

I can agree with all of this really. I see Dame as always being the leader but the leader isn't always the best player on a team.
If Dame is part of the core three for the next decade, we need one more guy that is more impactful than Dame. Dame as the number 2 is where I hope the Blazers are looking at long term. Get a Paul George as our number one, maybe a Meyers and or cj break out to be a 3 and/or 4. all of them fringe all stars at minimum and that's a core to build around that can contend in my opinion.

I think this is the first opinion you have had that I can agree with. However I don't think tanking for a draft pick gets us that number 1 and even if we did get a top 5, that means that none of the other guys are panning out, so that blows both of our thoughts out of the water I think.

My central argument for tanking has always been because I don't think we have a true number 1, and trading for that guy almost never happens (and Portland is never going to be able to sign that kind of guy in free agency).

 

[Orion Bailey]

My central argument for tanking has always been because I don't think we have a true number 1, and trading for that guy almost never happens (and Portland is never going to be able to sign that kind of guy in free agency).

I feel ya and agree for the most part. I just think tanking for the draft is as much of a crapshoot as one of CJ or Meyers becoming an all star , or trading /signing.
The draft, ESPECIALLY since (Someone else pointed this out) that players don't stay in college long anymore. 1 and done guys are all over the place now and they don't seem to be having as much of an immediate impact compared to lottery picks of the past. Lottery pick talent has definitely declined over the last decade with a few obvious exceptions. Deep drafts are going to be a thing of the past I think because of this.
With this said, I think trying to draft that place has no better percentage for us than nailing him in a trade or free agency...
Players are attracted to winning cultures. Look at SA. Not a big market, but stars want to go there. If NO and Dame can create a winning culture ( A winning culture is not a record or stats sheet, its a state of mind), then I think we will be more attractive to free agents more so than at anytime in the last decade.

I do think Dame needs to work on his distributing more to help make that happen, but if he can be an 7-10 assist guy a night, guys like PA will see that and know they have opportunities here.

 

[blue9]

The way I see it is:

1 - Free Agents will only sign here once we've made it to the WCF. That's not happening this year, so whether we win 20 games or 45 games we aren't going to sign a Free Agent that's anything more than a role player (Aminu / Davis).

2 - Since signing a meaningful Free Agent is off the table for at least the next 3 years we need to get our meaningful player either through the Draft or through a trade.

3 - A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. If a great trade (Paul George) presents itself, take it and don't worry about missing out on a Top 5 draft pick.

4 - Since winning doesn't matter this season, use the entire season as a training camp for the following season. This means that Dame spends the season passing rather than shooting. Meyers spends the season preparing to be our starting C next season - this means lots of shots, lots of picks, lots of passing out of the high-post, and working on his post-up game. IMO Meyers should be the central focus of our offense this season, 90/50/40 club be damned. CJ spends the season passing and scoring as Dame's back-up. All of this should equate to fewer wins than if we trot out Dame as our #1 scoring option and CJ as our #2 scoring option, which will result in (a) a better draft pick AND (b) being better prepared for the following season. It's a WIN/WIN scenario through losing. It's not tanking because we'll actively be trying to win each game, but with the primary focus being on improving skill sets.

 

[Orion Bailey]

The way I see it is:

1 - Free Agents will only sign here once we've made it to the WCF. That's not happening this year, so whether we win 20 games or 45 games we aren't going to sign a Free Agent that's anything more than a role player (Aminu / Davis).

2 - Since signing a meaningful Free Agent is off the table for at least the next 3 years we need to get our meaningful player either through the Draft or through a trade.

3 - A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. If a great trade (Paul George) presents itself, take it and don't worry about missing out on a Top 5 draft pick.

4 - Since winning doesn't matter this season, use the entire season as a training camp for the following season. This means that Dame spends the season passing rather than shooting. Meyers spends the season preparing to be our starting C next season - this means lots of shots, lots of picks, lots of passing out of the high-post, and working on his post-up game. IMO Meyers should be the central focus of our offense this season, 90/50/40 club be damned. CJ spends the season passing and scoring as Dame's back-up. All of this should equate to fewer wins than if we trot out Dame as our #1 scoring option and CJ as our #2 scoring option, which will result in (a) a better draft pick AND (b) being better prepared for the following season. It's a WIN/WIN scenario through losing. It's not tanking because we'll actively be trying to win each game, but with the primary focus being on improving skill sets.

I agree with 2 and 3 but 1....
I think if we win 40 games with the roster we have, free agents are going to see us as a huge upside and know we will only be getting better and would want to sign now, rather than three years from now. IF that happens the three year window turns into 1 and a half. I think most free agents are smart enough to know this. And we aren't getting to the WFC without signing another star in my opinion.

on the 4. Agreed, but I still think even if its a training camp all season, we will get the wins. Teams wont know what to expect. If we do what you say, and Meyers and CJ do what we hope they will, then your scenario will prove to make us better THIS year, I think. Not three years from now. Again in the offseason a star sees the upside and wants to join in.

I know Im a homer though...

 

[rasheedfan2005]

Hey lillard, water sucks, gatorade's better. Use it on the field.

 

[blue9]

I think if we win 40 games with the roster we have, free agents are going to see us as a huge upside and know we will only be getting better and would want to sign now

That's fine that you think this, but that has literally never happened. The last big name player I recall wanting to become a Blazer was Barkley. If you, or anyone else, can provide another example of a Barkley-level player wanting to sign (or be traded here, as in Barkley's case) at any point in our modern history - let alone when we were a ~40 win team - I'd love to be reminded. Fact of the matter is we have never, and will never, attract a big time Free Agent until we're on the cusp of a championship.

 

[Nikolokolus]

That's fine that you think this, but that has literally never happened. The last big name player I recall wanting to become a Blazer was Barkley. If you, or anyone else, can provide another example of a Barkley-level player wanting to sign (or be traded here, as in Barkley's case) at any point in our modern history - let alone when we were a ~40 win team - I'd love to be reminded. Fact of the matter is we have never, and will never, attract a big time Free Agent until we're on the cusp of a championship.

Exactly right.

A 40 win team in the west is probably going to be a tenth seed. How in the holy hell is that going to be lucrative to a top-tier guy? What exactly would make Portland so attractive in that situation? Didn't make the playoffs, (likely) lots of fair to middling players, no telling if the team is close to maxed out in terms of potential or talent, a super small market with zero African-American culture, a boring ass club scene, high taxes, the worst travel schedule in the NBA, etc.

 

[riverman]

Before Nash signed with the Lakers he mentioned Portland several times as a place he'd love to play. He loved the fanbase and the city

 

[blue9]

Before Nash signed with the Lakers he mentioned Portland several times as a place he'd love to play. He loved the fanbase and the city

But not enough to sign with a middling team.
I'd also be curious to know the context in which he made these statements. Was he asked a question about Portland/Blazers, or was it a non-leading question and he brought us up on his own?

 

[VanillaGorilla]

That's fine that you think this, but that has literally never happened. The last big name player I recall wanting to become a Blazer was Barkley. If you, or anyone else, can provide another example of a Barkley-level player wanting to sign (or be traded here, as in Barkley's case) at any point in our modern history - let alone when we were a ~40 win team - I'd love to be reminded. Fact of the matter is we have never, and will never, attract a big time Free Agent until we're on the cusp of a championship.

I'm pretty sure this is a logical fallacy. Never is a long time.

 

[riverman]

But not enough to sign with a middling team.
I'd also be curious to know the context in which he made these statements. Was he asked a question about Portland/Blazers, or was it a non-leading question and he brought us up on his own?

It was an interview..the media was asking him about Toronto or places he'd like to play and he brought up Portland..it started a msg board lobby to bring him here that offseason and in the end..glad he didn't come here. Barkley is not the only great player that sees an upside to playing here. Not a lot of players are going to feel that way, that's for sure.

 

[rasheedfan2005]

Exactly right.

A 40 win team in the west is probably going to be a tenth seed. How in the holy hell is that going to be lucrative to a top-tier guy? What exactly would make Portland so attractive in that situation? Didn't make the playoffs, (likely) lots of fair to middling players, no telling if the team is close to maxed out in terms of potential or talent, a super small market with zero African-American culture, a boring ass club scene, high taxes, the worst travel schedule in the NBA, etc.

How is there no "African american culture?" In all my travels I've never been to a state more accepting of all cultures than oregon. I mean there was a guy in my high school that literally thought he was a Jedi, he designed his own outfits and wore them with his fake light saber all the way through high school. Most places kids would have bullied him to suicide but we dressed in Darth maul outfits and let him slap us with his plastic saber. We even had an assembly where he choreographed a fight and used the force to choke us

 

[Nikolokolus]

How is there no "African american culture?" In all my travels I've never been to a state more accepting of all cultures than oregon. I mean there was a guy in my high school that literally thought he was a Jedi, he designed his own outfits and wore them with his fake light saber all the way through high school. Most places kids would have bullied him to suicide but we dressed in Darth maul outfits and let him slap us with his plastic saber. We even had an assembly where he choreographed a fight and used the force to choke us

Culture: the arts and other manifestations of human intellectual achievement regarded collectively.

Dafuq does a kid dressing up like a Jedi have to do with the presence (or lack thereof) of African American culture in Portland?

 

[riverman]

I think younger players crave that urban dazzle of NY or Miami but after they have kids and think about where to bring them up..Portland is a good choice

 

[Orion Bailey]

That's fine that you think this, but that has literally never happened. The last big name player I recall wanting to become a Blazer was Barkley. If you, or anyone else, can provide another example of a Barkley-level player wanting to sign (or be traded here, as in Barkley's case) at any point in our modern history - let alone when we were a ~40 win team - I'd love to be reminded. Fact of the matter is we have never, and will never, attract a big time Free Agent until we're on the cusp of a championship.

Exactly right.

A 40 win team in the west is probably going to be a tenth seed. How in the holy hell is that going to be lucrative to a top-tier guy? What exactly would make Portland so attractive in that situation? Didn't make the playoffs, (likely) lots of fair to middling players, no telling if the team is close to maxed out in terms of potential or talent, a super small market with zero African-American culture, a boring ass club scene, high taxes, the worst travel schedule in the NBA, etc.

You guys...you keep skipping over the obvious and blatant answer as if your either blind or oblivious to us.

Name the last 40 win team that had one allstar and a bunch of nobodys on this team? Every other 40 + win team that I can think of had very little upside left with older vet players.
Not trying to be a dick, but how is that not obvious?
This team is VERY different (if they win 40) than any other 40 win team we have seen.

Secondly, to say that nothing has ever happened, so therefore it never will, is a factual wrong. The world... this UNIVERSE is predicated on NOTHING remaining the same.
Only two know facts in life. We live, we die. Anything else is never 100%, so to say it will never ever happen is laughable. Sorry.

The only real factors I see deterring a top tier from signing if we do good this year, is the taxes. That's a tough one. By the end of the season we should know what we have and what we need. And if what we have won 40 games, then the needs wont be as great as earlier thought, so I believe a top tier guy will see that same point and not dismiss us as quickly as if we had last years roster with 50 wins, but no upside left.

If I am a star in this league and Portland wins 40 plus games this season, HELL YEAH id rather join this Blazers team than last years... or any other team in the league built like last years Blazers, axed out and no upside...

 

[Orion Bailey]

I'm pretty sure this is a logical fallacy. Never is a long time.

Thank you!