Simons: This year is going to be big

[KSF-ERIC]

Jason Quick thought Meyers Leonard was a starting caliber big man

He started in the 2019 WCF and the 2020 NBA Finals. Started most of last season so... I’m not convinced we would’ve been worse if we had kept Meyers/Mo instead of Whiteside considering how bad we were last season. Does Dame/CJ/Mo/Melo/Meyers do worse than 29-37?

 

[wizenheimer]

He started in the 2019 WCF and the 2020 NBA Finals. Started most of last season so... I’m not convinced we would’ve been worse if we had kept Meyers/Mo instead of Whiteside considering how bad we were last season. Does Dame/CJ/Mo/Melo/Meyers do worse than 29-37?

I'm sorry, but you come up with just about the weirdest blazer-homer arguments I've seen. The point was that Quick is not some oracle when predicting a player's future

and yes, Blazers would have been worse with Meyers as the starter instead of Whiteside

PER: Meyers 10.6....Whiteside 25.0
TS%: Meyers .627....Whiteside .644
FT Rate: Meyers .120....Whiteside .340
Reb Rate: Meyers 14.1%....Whiteside 23.6%
Off Reb Rate: Meyers 3.4%....Whiteside 13.6%
Block Rate: Meyers 1.4%....Whiteside 8.4%
Winshares/48: Meyers .096....Whiteside .204
BPM: Meyers -0.9....Whiteside +3.2

I know it's become the thing around here to shit on Whiteside. He's a flawed player for sure, but his in-paint impact for Portland this year would have not been replaced by Meyers

and there's a difference in the NBA between players who are starting caliber and players who are default starters because a team has terrible options. Meyers is the latter, but Quick believed for years he was the former

 

[blazerkor]

He started in the 2019 WCF and the 2020 NBA Finals. Started most of last season so... I’m not convinced we would’ve been worse if we had kept Meyers/Mo instead of Whiteside considering how bad we were last season. Does Dame/CJ/Mo/Melo/Meyers do worse than 29-37?

Hey, lets not overstate Meyers' role on the Heat. During the regular season he did start most games but he was still 8th in minutes played on the team, 8th in scoring, 3rd in rebounds, 7th in blocks and the rest of the stats are even worse unless you're @swish3 ... also these are season totals because this team had so many mid season and late season additions he's way further down on per game lists on all of these numbers. He only played in three games during their entire playoff run and only got 10 minutes per game in those games and we won't even get into his playoff stats because they were completely insignificant.

Moe fell off big time this season too. His numbers were horrible obviously that can be attributed to playing behind the two best wings any team had but he did get a ton of starts at PF, so his numbers were just kind of again inconsequential. The shocker is that his numbers on the Knicks... a horrible team that he should have been the first or second option on, were still terrible.

So nope I don't think those two guys would have made us better... I know it's all subjective because they were playing in new systems and here they would have known the system but still my opinion is we would have been even worse with those guys than we were with Hassan. Just look at the numbers Hassan put up and that will give you a good idea of who was more impactful this season. I will give you this, we would have been better off in the bubble with those two because Hassan and Nurk were even more redundant and uncomplimentary to each other's games than Dame and CJ are. Then their's the fact that we were so thin at the wing. Both Meyers and Mo would have been better options than we had at PF after Zach got hurt. All of that said, given Nurk's injury, the Hassan trade was not only the right move at the time but still is in hindsight.

 

[calvin natt]

If Anfernee Simons played last year at Duke he would have averaged about 16/4/4, been a household name (among basketball homes), a highlight reel like Duke hasnt seen except Zion. People would be so pumped to have a shot at this young guard with athleticism and potential. Hes the 28th youngest player in the league still, and plays on a team with two very good guards in front of him. He isn't in Orlando, Sac, or Detroit etc.

 

[Hoopguru]

If Anfernee Simons played last year at Duke he would have averaged about 16/4/4, been a household name (among basketball homes), a highlight reel like Duke hasnt seen except Zion. People would be so pumped to have a shot at this young guard with athleticism and potential. Hes the 28th youngest player in the league still, and plays on a team with two very good guards in front of him. He isn't in Orlando, Sac, or Detroit etc.

Man, I listen to CJ, Dame and others during last years training camp talk like Anfernee was the next superstar.

 

[blazerkor]

If Anfernee Simons played last year at Duke he would have averaged about 16/4/4, been a household name (among basketball homes), a highlight reel like Duke hasnt seen except Zion. People would be so pumped to have a shot at this young guard with athleticism and potential. Hes the 28th youngest player in the league still, and plays on a team with two very good guards in front of him. He isn't in Orlando, Sac, or Detroit etc.

I either hope Olshey trades CJ and believe me from my point of view that is my single greatest hope for our team right now in terms of optimizing the value on our roster. If and when Olshey doesn't trade CJ, I hope GMs around the league see Ant the same way you do and we can get some real value for him that isn't redundant to what we already have. Do you want to be giving starting minutes to Dame and CJ and then give significant (lets say 17) bench minutes to Ant? That would be so ridiculous. They all have different games but they all boil down to being small guards who look to score first and are not good defenders... maybe some would say Dame is good but I barely see him as a plus defender and don't think that is good, while CJ and Ant (to this point) have been serious serious defensive liabilities. Our perimeter D is already the worst in the league, we can't bare to give minutes to another guy who only contributes on offense.

 

[calvin natt]

I either hope Olshey trades CJ and believe me from my point of view that is my single greatest hope for our team right now in terms of optimizing the value on our roster. If and when Olshey doesn't trade CJ, I hope GMs around the league see Ant the same way you do and we can get some real value for him that isn't redundant to what we already have. Do you want to be giving starting minutes to Dame and CJ and then give significant (lets say 17) bench minutes to Ant? That would be so ridiculous. They all have different games but they all boil down to being small guards who look to score first and are not good defenders... maybe some would say Dame is good but I barely see him as a plus defender and don't think that is good, while CJ and Ant (to this point) have been serious serious defensive liabilities. Our perimeter D is already the worst in the league, we can't bare to give minutes to another guy who only contributes on offense.

If Anfernee ends up getting traded, fine, but not until we know how good he could be. He reminds me of a Monta Ellis type, but Ellis had a ton of mins in GS before he got traded to Milwaukee. He might not be a cornerstone guy, but I could see him as a ultra-quick, athletic guy off the bench or starting for some teams, who can give you instant points and runs the floor. I have no idea if he can guard anyone, but his role might not be that anyway, just put the ball in the basket. He is nowhere near a finished product, whereas Meyers has been a finished product for years. There was such a low ceiling. He didnt and still cant play basketball. Like, intellectually his IQ for hoops is low. Anfernee seems to have more instinct and once he learns how to be more complete like defending and passing the ball, he will be a very productive player.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

I agree with whomever it was said that Olshey probably really values Simons and will not trade him unless it's for a someone of real immediate value. Olshey has been shown to be patient and CJ and Dame are good mentors for him. That said, I can also see another team deciding to gamble on him and offering us someone - much like Isiah Thomas gambled on Jermaine and gave up an All-Star. (That trade is not looked back on fondly by Blazerdom, of course, but at the time it seemed like a no-brainer: O'Neal was stalled with us and Davis was seen as a step-below-elite PF/C.)

 

[blazerkor]

If Anfernee ends up getting traded, fine, but not until we know how good he could be. He reminds me of a Monta Ellis type, but Ellis had a ton of mins in GS before he got traded to Milwaukee. He might not be a cornerstone guy, but I could see him as a ultra-quick, athletic guy off the bench or starting for some teams, who can give you instant points and runs the floor. I have no idea if he can guard anyone, but his role might not be that anyway, just put the ball in the basket. He is nowhere near a finished product, whereas Meyers has been a finished product for years. There was such a low ceiling. He didnt and still cant play basketball. Like, intellectually his IQ for hoops is low. Anfernee seems to have more instinct and once he learns how to be more complete like defending and passing the ball, he will be a very productive player.

OK wait, so Ant is untouchable because his upside is Monta Ellis? Am I getting that straight?

By the way, you never know how good a guy can be and we're never going to have a really solid idea of how good or bad Ant is when he's playing in a back court with Dame and CJ who get 36 minutes per game and Gary who is going to get a lot of minutes too. If another GM sees Ant as having a similar upside to what you do, it would be managerial malpractice to not move him for that value given the makeup of this roster.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

OK wait, so Ant is untouchable because his upside is Monta Ellis? Am I getting that straight?

 

[lawai'a]

OK wait, so Ant is untouchable because his upside is Monta Ellis? Am I getting that straight?

By the way, you never know how good a guy can be and we're never going to have a really solid idea of how good or bad Ant is when he's playing in a back court with Dame and CJ who get 36 minutes per game and Gary who is going to get a lot of minutes too. If another GM sees Ant as having a similar upside to what you do, it would be managerial malpractice to not move him for that value given the makeup of this roster.

sure, as long as we are getting an all-star back for our future all-star

 

[Rastapopoulos]

If Anfernee Simons played last year at Duke he would have averaged about 16/4/4, been a household name (among basketball homes), a highlight reel like Duke hasnt seen except Zion.

 

[calvin natt]

OK wait, so Ant is untouchable because his upside is Monta Ellis? Am I getting that straight?

By the way, you never know how good a guy can be and we're never going to have a really solid idea of how good or bad Ant is when he's playing in a back court with Dame and CJ who get 36 minutes per game and Gary who is going to get a lot of minutes too. If another GM sees Ant as having a similar upside to what you do, it would be managerial malpractice to not move him for that value given the makeup of this roster.

Huh? Untouchable? Where did I say that? I said he reminds me of Monta Ellis, as a player, and the more time they give him to show what he can do the better. Trading him now is the ultimate selling low move.

 

[wizenheimer]

Huh? Untouchable? Where did I say that? I said he reminds me of Monta Ellis, as a player, and the more time they give him to show what he can do the better. Trading him now is the ultimate selling low move.

one quibble: I'd argue a player has to first have some decent value before he can be sold low. Simons is a 24th pick who had done nothing consistently notable in 2 years. Olshey did everything he could to amp up the Simons hype, but I doubt that any other GM's were falling for it

that's not to say that Portland should just dump him for next to nothing. Rather, I'm saying the Blazer front office might have to do a better job of setting player value separate from the Olshey hype-machine he uses for his favorite players. I really don't know how good Simons will end up, but at this point, based upon his 2 years in the league, his upside is mostly mirage. There might actually be an oasis on the horizon, but the image is getting blurrier by the day.

 

[Hoopguru]

one quibble: I'd argue a player has to first have some decent value before he can be sold low. Simons is a 24th pick who had done nothing consistently notable in 2 years. Olshey did everything he could to amp up the Simons hype, but I doubt that any other GM's were falling for it

that's not to say that Portland should just dump him for next to nothing. Rather, I'm saying the Blazer front office might have to do a better job of setting player value separate from the Olshey hype-machine he uses for his favorite players. I really don't know how good Simons will end up, but at this point, based upon his 2 years in the league, his upside is mostly mirage. There might actually be an oasis on the horizon, but the image is getting blurrier by the day.

Dame & CJ were hyping him as well. I cant see either just saying that unless they meant it?

 

[julius]

I think it's good to give Simons another year to show he can make it. As I've said before, he would have benefited from going to college for at least a year. CJ's first 2 years didn't reflect what he would become. I'm not sure if I'm willing to commit to that kind of connection to Simons either.

 

[wizenheimer]

Dame & CJ were hyping him as well. I cant see either just saying that unless they meant it?

they didn't hype Simons anywhere near the level that Olshey hyped him. And in their case were just giving props to a teammate, which is especially what Dame does. There are always 'unknown' players that get that kind of training camp hype from other players. Meyers got some; TRob got plenty; Zach's got a ton of 'if-you-saw-what-we-see' hype; even Hezonja got some hype chatter last summer and we know what that was worth.

maybe Simons will turn the same kind of corner in his 3rd season that Trent turned in his 2nd. But it's probably valid to ratchet down the projected upside of Simons until he actually starts delivering some consistent good play

 

[Hoopguru]

they didn't hype Simons anywhere near the level that Olshey hyped him. And in their case were just giving props to a teammate, which is especially what Dame does. There are always 'unknown' players that get that kind of training camp hype from other players. Meyers got some; TRob got plenty; Zach's got a ton of 'if-you-saw-what-we-see' hype; even Hezonja got some hype chatter last summer and we know what that was worth.

maybe Simons will turn the same kind of corner in his 3rd season that Trent turned in his 2nd. But it's probably valid to ratchet down the projected upside of Simons until he actually starts delivering some consistent good play

agree....just saying

 

[e_blazer]

they didn't hype Simons anywhere near the level that Olshey hyped him. And in their case were just giving props to a teammate, which is especially what Dame does. There are always 'unknown' players that get that kind of training camp hype from other players. Meyers got some; TRob got plenty; Zach's got a ton of 'if-you-saw-what-we-see' hype; even Hezonja got some hype chatter last summer and we know what that was worth.

maybe Simons will turn the same kind of corner in his 3rd season that Trent turned in his 2nd. But it's probably valid to ratchet down the projected upside of Simons until he actually starts delivering some consistent good play

I think that Simons has shown that he has the athletic tools to be a solid NBA player. To me, the question is whether he can develop the mental focus and confidence to turn the corner.

 

[Hoopguru]

I think that Simons has shown that he has the athletic tools to be a solid NBA player. To me, the question is whether he can develop the mental focus and confidence to turn the corner.

Dame has coronated him as his replacement practically. lol

Blazers news: Damian Lillard thinks Anfernee Simons has ...
clutchpoints.com › blazers-news-damian-lillard-thinks-a...

 

[blazerkor]

Dame & CJ were hyping him as well. I cant see either just saying that unless they meant it?

Dame has coronated him as his replacement practically. lol

Blazers news: Damian Lillard thinks Anfernee Simons has ...
clutchpoints.com › blazers-news-damian-lillard-thinks-a...

Wait, so you're telling me you've never seen NBA stars over hype their teammates? Maybe they've done it to motivate them, maybe they've done it to promote team chemistry, maybe they've done it out of true solidarity and maybe when Dame says, "Crazy potential" he is hoping to unlock at least some of it or for Ant to believe that in order to optimize Ant's potential even if it's limited. Not only do almost all stars do it but especially very optimistic stars like Dame and CJ (if you consider CJ a star). Also it's important to keep in mind other guys Dame and CJ have hyped, Meyers being the optimal example but these guys have talked up every teammate they've had since they started viewing themselves as the two headed leader of this team. That's not a knock on either one of these guys (although I think the only leadership quality that is even a little off with Dame is accountability and CJ is just incredibly delusional about himself and probably everything else in his sphere of interest) it's good leadership to build your teammates up. Dame's and CJ's biases and bullish value of their teammates has real world, on the court benefits.

There is no benefit to Oshey doing the same shit. It clouds his vision when making decisions that are crucial to this team's success and tarnishes the value of his opinion of his players with other GM's. It's inexcusable and has been going on for far too long. It along with Stotts' lack of accountability and value for defense are the barriers that have kept this team from contending. Oh and Stotts' problems could be fixed by Olshey as president of basketball operations, it's as simple as Olshey putting in an assistant head coach that is a defensive expert and holds guys accountable... and if Stotts doesn't like it, he can walk and the team wouldn't have to pay him.

 

[Hoopguru]

Wait, so you're telling me you've never seen NBA stars over hype their teammates? Maybe they've done it to motivate them, maybe they've done it to promote team chemistry, maybe they've done it out of true solidarity and maybe when Dame says, "Crazy potential" he is hoping to unlock at least some of it or for Ant to believe that in order to optimize Ant's potential even if it's limited. Not only do almost all stars do it but especially very optimistic stars like Dame and CJ (if you consider CJ a star). Also it's important to keep in mind other guys Dame and CJ have hyped, Meyers being the optimal example but these guys have talked up every teammate they've had since they started viewing themselves as the two headed leader of this team. That's not a knock on either one of these guys (although I think the only leadership quality that is even a little off with Dame is accountability and CJ is just incredibly delusional about himself and probably everything else in his sphere of interest) it's good leadership to build your teammates up. Dame's and CJ's biases and bullish value of their teammates has real world, on the court benefits.

There is no benefit to Oshey doing the same shit. It clouds his vision when making decisions that are crucial to this team's success and tarnishes the value of his opinion of his players with other GM's. It's inexcusable and has been going on for far too long. It along with Stotts' lack of accountability and value for defense are the barriers that have kept this team from contending. Oh and Stotts' problems could be fixed by Olshey as president of basketball operations, it's as simple as Olshey putting in an assistant head coach that is a defensive expert and holds guys accountable... and if Stotts doesn't like it, he can walk and the team wouldn't have to pay him.

Agree 100%...just think its funny that Dame would anoint such an unproven player.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

yeah, he needs to work on his bread and butter first and foremost. Defense comes with experience anyway. Guys that come in and defend immediately are either specialists or stars.

No, he needs to be an effective offensive player first or he will be out of the league.

Defense can be schemed as a team or he improves later to expand his effectiveness/role.

 

[Scalma]

I like that Collison is coaching him up, especially when he talks to him about imposing himself on the court with dame/CJ. For the first time, to me at least, he also looks physically bigger. This is going to essentially be his sophomore season, so I think it’s way too premature to write him off completely. The biggest question is gonna be whether he can run the second unit. If he can, he’s gonna be a major contributor. If he can’t, he’s gonna be stuck behind multiple guys.

 

[James lamphear]

When he getting hype by his team mates it tells me he doing a lot thing in practice but it hasn't translate over to the game yet.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

I like that Collison is coaching him up, especially when he talks to him about imposing himself on the court with dame/CJ. For the first time, to me at least, he also looks physically bigger. This is going to essentially be his sophomore season, so I think it’s way too premature to write him off completely. The biggest question is gonna be whether he can run the second unit. If he can, he’s gonna be a major contributor. If he can’t, he’s gonna be stuck behind multiple guys.

Why did Darren Collison retire if THAT'S what he's going to do?

 

[Scalma]

Why did Darren Collison retire if THAT'S what he's going to do?

stick to fapping over plus minuses

 

[julius]

Anyone else notice they referred to him as "Simmons" at least twice?

 

[Labinot41]

I won't fall for Simons hype again. I wan't to see it on the court against nba players

 

[Rastapopoulos]

stick to fapping over plus minuses