Since Blake has the highest winning %.....

[OSUBlazerfan]

Here ya go KingSpeed

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/teams/hollinger?team=Por

Id like to point out where he falls in terms of PER This Year

Keep in mind, he plays with the best player on our team most of anyone not named aldridge

Oden - 23.37
Roy - 19.84
Bayless - 18.01
LMA - 17.26
Miller - 15.15
Outlaw - 15.08
Rudy - 14.86
Pryz - 10.73
BLAKE - 9.93
Howard - 7.87

Ouch.....

 

[BenDavis503]

Checkmate

 

[SpanishFly]

Checkmate

lets see how he twists this one? Can't wait LOL

 

[Nate Dogg]

Wow blake has really underperformed. Look at your rising star Bayless!

We need a sign for the next home game that reads. "Blakey PER 9 Not Fine" "Bayless PER 18 Hole in One"

 

[blue32]

Bayless is going to be good. You can just tell by his determination and charisma out there on the court. Specially being his 2nd year in the league, I'm hoping he breaks his way into so HEAVY minutes this year.

 

[oldmangrouch]

Please explain something to me.

The Blake defenders argue that he needs to play because he "makes Roy better."

Roy is a notoriously slow starter. He rarely plays well in the first quarter. If Roy isn't going to score anyway - why is Blake starting?

Wouldn't it make more sense to start someone like Bayless, who can generate a little offense, and limit Blake to the 2nd and 3rd quarters, when Roy needs to start warming up?

 

[OSUBlazerfan]

Please explain something to me.

The Blake defenders argue that he needs to play because he "makes Roy better."

Roy is a notoriously slow starter. He rarely plays well in the first quarter. If Roy isn't going to score anyway - why is Blake starting?

Wouldn't it make more sense to start someone like Bayless, who can generate a little offense, and limit Blake to the 2nd and 3rd quarters, when Roy needs to start warming up?

No, no no grouch

Please dont make sensible arguments, THEY ARE NOT WELCOME HERE

 

[hasoos]

Wow and Webster doesn't even show up on the list.......what does that mean?

 

[hasoos]

Bayless is going to be good. You can just tell by his determination and charisma out there on the court. Specially being his 2nd year in the league, I'm hoping he breaks his way into so HEAVY minutes this year.

Unfortunately it will be somewhere else.

 

[KingSpeed]

PER is all about tangible stats and tells us very little about the player's defensive skills. I'm more about Ws than I am about PER. After all, Marresse Speights has a better PER than Brandon Roy and an 11 game losing streak to go with it. I'd rather have Roy and a 14-9 record.

 

[hasoos]

PER is all about tangible stats and tells us very little about the player's defensive skills. I'm more about Ws than I am about PER. After all, Marresse Speights has a better PER than Brandon Roy and an 11 game losing streak to go with it. I'd rather have Roy and a 14-9 record.

Yep and at the same time a lot of guys with good winning percentages on good teams are bad players. Stats don't tell the whole story. They only seem to tell the whole story when you are arguing their case.

 

[KingSpeed]

Bayless is going to be good. You can just tell by his determination and charisma out there on the court. Specially being his 2nd year in the league, I'm hoping he breaks his way into so HEAVY minutes this year.

All we have to do is trade Miller and Bayless will finally get his chance and maybe even overtake Blake by next season making Blake the best backup PG in the league.

I will say this--- I had a conversation with someone VERY VERY close to the team back when I was on the road with the guys. This person said "We need a PG." I said "Blake's been playing okay." He said "Blake's a good back up. We need a PG."

 

[hasoos]

All we have to do is trade Miller and Bayless will finally get his chance and maybe even overtake Blake by next season making Blake the best backup PG in the league.

I will say this--- I had a conversation with someone VERY VERY close to the team back when I was on the road with the guys. This person said "We need a PG." I said "Blake's been playing okay." He said "Blake's a good back up. We need a PG."

You know that's not going to happen though. First of all, it would be KP admitting he made a mistake in getting Miller. Second of all, Nate is going to vouch for the veterans. My money is on they will move Bayless, and we will lament over it for years.

 

[Minstrel]

All we have to do is trade Miller and Bayless will finally get his chance and maybe even overtake Blake by next season

Alternatively, all we have to do is trade BLANKY, and Miller can start, allowing Bayless to get his shot by backing up both Miller and Roy. That would give Bayless plenty of minutes.

 

[hasoos]

Alternatively, all we have to do is trade BLANKY, and Miller can start, allowing Bayless to get his shot by backing up both Miller and Roy. That would give Bayless plenty of minutes.

Ha ha ha ha ha, um yea right. You know that's not happening.

 

[roydezlaw]

Wow and Webster doesn't even show up on the list.......what does that mean?

It's not pretty.

Martell ranked 268th per 11.22

But it beats Blake ranked at 294th

 

[roydezlaw]

That means 24 twelve man rosters have better PERs than Blake. Ouch!

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Please explain something to me.

The Blake defenders argue that he needs to play because he "makes Roy better."

Roy is a notoriously slow starter. He rarely plays well in the first quarter. If Roy isn't going to score anyway - why is Blake starting?

Wouldn't it make more sense to start someone like Bayless, who can generate a little offense, and limit Blake to the 2nd and 3rd quarters, when Roy needs to start warming up?

Nobody's saying Blake makes Roy better. I am saying that 5-man lineups including both Blake and Roy generally outperform those with Roy but without Blake. Two totally different things.

 

[maxiep]

It's not pretty.

Martell ranked 268th per 11.22

But it beats Blake ranked at 294th

I don't have ESPN Insider, but is it possible to figure out who plays equivalent or higher minutes than Blake and has a lower PER?

 

[RR7]

I don't have ESPN Insider, but is it possible to figure out who plays equivalent or higher minutes than Blake and has a lower PER?

Quite a few. Pietrus, Brewer, Duhon, Anthony Parker, Sefolosha, Mbah a Moute, Alston, Charlie Bell, Rasual Butler, Hinrich, Trenton Hassel, Brandon Rush all below him.

Thing is, out of those, majority are in their team's lineup for their very good man defense. Pietrus, Sefolosha, Parker, AMoute.

 

[roydezlaw]

I don't have ESPN Insider, but is it possible to figure out who plays equivalent or higher minutes than Blake and has a lower PER?

What RR7 said.

It's interesting that Hinrich who so many in here want, has a PER of 8.03 and ranked 341st

 

[BlazerCaravan]

Quite a few. Pietrus, Brewer, Duhon, Anthony Parker, Sefolosha, Mbah a Moute, Alston, Charlie Bell, Rasual Butler, Hinrich, Trenton Hassel, Brandon Rush all below him.

Thing is, out of those, majority are in their team's lineup for their very good man defense. Pietrus, Sefolosha, Parker, AMoute.

One of the biggest criticisms of PER is that it over-emphasizes offense (which is easily tracked in the stats) and underemphasizes defense (which has fewer stats to express).

A good defensive guard is kind of fucked in PER unless they are great at getting steals. Blocks are kind of out at the guard level. Simply holding your opponent's FG% lower or what have you (the opponent's points per possession advanced stat is too tough to gather to be a "public" stat) isn't really expressed in the PER equation. So if you're a "cooler" who just happens to bother their opposing counterpart into bad shots without getting steals or blocks on them, your PER will look worse than your on-the-court performance.

This may be why everyone wants a ride on Kirk's jock, even though his PER is worse than Blake's.

 

[LittleAlex]

Alternatively, all we have to do is trade BLANKY, and Miller can start, allowing Bayless to get his shot by backing up both Miller and Roy. That would give Bayless plenty of minutes.

Miller has been worse then Blake defensively and worse then Bayless offensively.

Unless he is one of those guys that plays better the more minutes they get (a possibility) Miller should be odd man out. Play Blake or Bayless depending on the situation and have done with it.

Bringing Miller in was a mistake. Keeping him on the team for the whole year would just compound that error.

As an added bonus, KP hasn't developed a man crush on Miller yet so he may very well be traded.

 

[KingSpeed]

\Play Blake or Bayless depending on the situation and have done with it.

Bringing Miller in was a mistake. Keeping him on the team for the whole year would just compound that error.

As an added bonus, KP hasn't developed a man crush on Miller yet so he may very well be traded.

Exactly.

If we can get a forward for Miller, we get better in so many ways. When Rudy comes back, we have 5 guards who are worthy of minutes and only 1 forward who is worthy of minutes.

 

[roydezlaw]

Miller has been worse then Blake defensively and worse then Bayless offensively.

Unless he is one of those guys that plays better the more minutes they get (a possibility) Miller should be odd man out. Play Blake or Bayless depending on the situation and have done with it.

Bringing Miller in was a mistake. Keeping him on the team for the whole year would just compound that error.

As an added bonus, KP hasn't developed a man crush on Miller yet so he may very well be traded.

Bringing in Miller was a HUGE mistake. It's laughable that we sign Miller and don't give him the reins of the team. Pritchard and McMillan need to get on the same page and then call Brandon to run it by him first on all future moves.

 

[Minstrel]

Miller has been worse then Blake defensively and worse then Bayless offensively.

Saying Bayless is better than Miller offensively is really jumping the gun. Miller has a proven level that Bayless is only reaching this level in limited minutes. Miller is below that level this year, granted, but he's only been played in rather strange substitution patterns relative to his career norm role.

Also, the Synergy Sports numbers, as I recall, were only for this season, which makes it a pretty small sample itself. It makes me think Blake may be a better defender than I thought, but it's not enough to convince me that he's clearly a superior defender to Miller.

I think Miller is still the best overall point guard on the team (factoring in both offense and defense), unless his game has collapsed. In any case, to trade him, the Blazers need to rule out the collapse possibility anyway. So there's really no need to bench him now, even if you want to trade him. I want the team to play him based on his career performance. If he has collapsed, fine...let Bayless or Blake take over in a month or two and call it a failure. Calling it a failure when a Miller/Roy backcourt still remains untested is silly, IMO.

 

[MARIS61]

Shows how useless and meaningless PER is.