Some GREAT info from Quick (What Billups investigation took place, where Dame stands with the Team)

[Natebishop3]

Names:

Zach LaVine
Bradley Beal
Pascal Siakam (scares me because his surgery won't have him ready by training camp)
DeMar Derozan
Ben Simmons
Karl Anthony-Towns
Tobias Harris
Kevin Love
Gordon Hayward
Brandon Ingram

It's my uneducated opinion that at least one of these players will be on our team next year.

Out of those names, the players that might be available to move (in my opinion) would be:

Beal
Siakam
DeRozan
Simmons
Harris
Love
Ingram

I don't have a good read on Towns or Hayward. I don't think the Bulls would trade LaVine. He's young, he's really good, and it seems like they're trying to build around him. It would have to be a really obvious trade up for them. So out of the list of players that might be available, I'd be trying to focus in on:

Siakam
Simmons
Ingram

Those are the guys that would fit our timeline and our needs. Beal is a star, and a definite upgrade from CJ, but I'm concerned that he still presents the same problems that CJ does. He duplicates a lot of Dame's strengths and I think still has a lot of the same weaknesses (short, not a great defender, needs the ball in his hands).

Towns is definitely an interesting target, but I'm not sure Minnesota is ready to move on from him and I'm also super reluctant to go after another big man.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

View attachment 39331

This only works because the Pistons are under the cap. Can replace Jones with Nurkic since I'm not sure what to do with Nurk after this deal. Maybe route him somewhere else and give some value back to one of the teams. Re-sign Powell.

Dame/Simons
Powell/Simons
RoCo/Nas
Grant/Simmons?
Simmons/Nurk

THAT is a team.

I keep saying that I can't imagine the Pistons giving up Grant, but if people like you keep putting it out there, I'm going to start believing that it's possible.

Wanna send Nurk and more picks down to Houston to get Wood? That's even less likely, but I'm all in on the pipe-dream train today!

 

[riverman]

I totally forgot Jerami Grant was on the Olympic team.

Would Detroit do two firsts for Grant?

Jones + S&T Kanter as a salary filler will get you to that number...

He's my top target...I suggest CJ for Grant and Mason Plumlee...saves 2 million in a 2 for one swap

 

[Natebishop3]

I keep saying that I can't imagine the Pistons giving up Grant, but if people like you keep putting it out there, I'm going to start believing that it's possible.

Wanna send Nurk and more picks down to Houston to get Wood? That's even less likely, but I'm all in on the pipe-dream train today!

Yeah, I'm not sure Detroit would move Grant without a really nice return.

 

[B-Roy]

Some modifications for what I think it will take for Philly to take the deal.

Dame/Simons
Powell/FA?
Grant/Nas
RoCo/Simmons/Melo?
Simmons/Zeller

 

[B-Roy]

Yeah, I'm not sure Detroit would move Grant without a really nice return.

Two top 5 protected picks DOWN THE LINE for this team is SUPER valuable. You don't think this team has a chance to implode by 2024 and 2026? Those are huge upside picks. Grant doesn't fit Detroit's timeline. Those picks do.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Names:

Zach LaVine
Bradley Beal
Pascal Siakam (scares me because his surgery won't have him ready by training camp)
DeMar Derozan
Ben Simmons
Karl Anthony-Towns
Tobias Harris
Kevin Love
Gordon Hayward
Brandon Ingram

It's my uneducated opinion that at least one of these players will be on our team next year.

Looking at those names, can any of them besides Siakam be described as two-way players?

 

[barfo]

The great news here is the CJ asked Chauncey about DEFENSE.......

"It is ok with you if I opt out of playing defense, right? I'm concerned that there might be long-term effects that aren't yet known."

barfo

 

[B-Roy]

He's my top target...I suggest CJ for Grant and Mason Plumlee...saves 2 million in a 2 for one swap

Doesn't make sense for Detroit. The picks do.

 

[tester551]

And not CJs value around the league? Olshey overvalues him, but he’s also overpaid. I think it’s gonna take more than just CJ to get a clear upgrade. We’re probably gonna have to add picks or a young asset like Simons or Nas, unless we do a trade for Simmons, where a straight up deal would probably make sense for both sides.

The better question though is, outside of Simmons, who would we target? Quick mentioned Boston. Would swapping CJ for Smart be a clear upgrade?

CJ is overpaid BECAUSE Olshey overvalues him. There have been plenty of opportunities over the last 4-6 years, but Olshey has never offered him up.

It's fine to include some picks/young guys if needed to upgrade the forward positions.

 

[illmatic99]

View attachment 39332

Some modifications for what I think it will take for Philly to take the deal.

Dame/Simons
Powell/FA?
Grant/Nas
RoCo/Simmons/Melo?
Simmons/Zeller

you had me until.... melo?

 

[B-Roy]

I'm trying to gauge Grant's value elsewhere since I don't have a good sense on it, but my thought is:

2024 and 2026 fit Detroit's timeline. Grant is 27 already. They just got the 1st pick. Grant won't even be there by 2024 and 2026 (his contract goes out two more years).

This team is not going to be good by 2024 and 2026. Dame's contract doesn't even go through 2026 and he'll be 36 by then anyways. I think those picks have super high upside depending on how protected they are.

 

[B-Roy]

you had me until.... melo?

You know I hate Melo as much as anyone lol, but I think Dame would want him back. He won't play much with that group so hopefully he takes himself out of our team by going elsewhere.

Everything I'm suggesting is for Dame. I don't wanna lose Dame. I want Dame to retire here, even if we never win a title with him.

 

[MickZagger]

I you keep Norm and Chauncey turns CJ into a Lindsay Hunter type 6 man you have a stronger defensive starting unit and a better scoring bench mob

That would speak volumes about how shitty of a GM that Neil really is if we have that much money tied up into a 6th man off the bench

 

[Wizard Mentor]

You know I hate Melo as much as anyone lol, but I think Dame would want him back. He won't play much with that group so hopefully he takes himself out of our team by going elsewhere.

Everything I'm suggesting is for Dame. I don't wanna lose Dame. I want Dame to retire here, even if we never win a title with him.

Understandable, but you're really making Dame out to be a Prima Donna.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

I'm trying to gauge Grant's value elsewhere since I don't have a good sense on it, but my thought is:

2024 and 2026 fit Detroit's timeline. Grant is 27 already. They just got the 1st pick. Grant won't even be there by 2024 and 2026 (his contract goes out two more years).

This team is not going to be good by 2024 and 2026. Dame's contract doesn't even go through 2026 and he'll be 36 by then anyways. I think those picks have super high upside depending on how protected they are.

I see the logic, but I have to believe that if they wanted to deal Grant, they'd be able to get other young prospects that can play now and grow with Hayes and Cunningham, rather than picks that may or may not have any real value.

 

[B-Roy]

if that's all it took to get Grant, I'd keep CJ and use our other pick to see if we can package with a S&T'd Powell for an upgrade at SF

BYC for Powell makes it almost impossible to S&T. He's 10 million outgoing and 20 million incoming.

 

[B-Roy]

This was terrific insight. Worth the listen: https://www.audacy.com/1080thefan/podcasts/primetime-with-isaac-and-suke-20359

This was great and basically echoed all of my speculation in this thread....

 

[Labinot41]

What blows my mind is that this one question makes all the headline and everyone forgets that the Blazers answered plenty of questions about the case, and those reporters kept asking the same questions over and over again. I feel bad for Billups, his dream came true and that should have been his day in front of his family, but he must have felt like he is in a court triale or something, the reporters clearly didn’t like him and they let him know about it. Shame on you all trash ass reporters except for Jaynes who clearly didn’t want to ruin that mans day

 

[illmatic99]

You know I hate Melo as much as anyone lol, but I think Dame would want him back. He won't play much with that group so hopefully he takes himself out of our team by going elsewhere.

Everything I'm suggesting is for Dame. I don't wanna lose Dame. I want Dame to retire here, even if we never win a title with him.

neither do i, but you'd think the biofreeze sponsorship and the signing of his scrub cousin is enough of ass kissing. i do not want Melo back, even if billups is OK with benching him. unnecessary distraction

 

[B-Roy]

Understandable, but you're really making Dame out to be a Prima Donna.

He wants to win. He doesn't want to keep losing in the first round. I think that's reasonable. I think it's reasonable for him to look at the roster and think if we just run it back with the same roster the same thing is going to happen. Keep in mind, he's stayed loyal to this franchise through years and years of terrible moves. We botched our window to improve so badly between 16-18 that he has a right to be asking these questions.

And truthfully speaking as a fan, I want to win too. When are we ever going to have another top 10 player IN PORTLAND? Dame is 31, he's not going to be in his prime forever. If you don't think you can win with Dame you should blow it up now. I don't want to go through another season with minor changes and end up getting bounced in the first round again. That does no good for no one.

 

[riverman]

That would speak volumes about how shitty of a GM that Neil really is if we have that much money tied up into a 6th man off the bench

the money doesn't change the minutes...just the role and as I said..Kevin McHale was the second highest paid celtic and a 6 man ....the 6 man is important to a winning team...Chauncey had Lindsay Hunter....Dirk had Jason Terry...we have CJ

 

[MickZagger]

Now other GM’s know that Lillard wants upgrades and is unhappy. They know that Neil will be desperate. We aren’t going to get any trades heavily in our favor.

 

[Hoopguru]

What blows my mind is that this one question makes all the headline and everyone forgets that the Blazers answered plenty of questions about the case, and those reporters kept asking the same questions over and over again. I feel bad for Billups, his dream came true and that should have been his day in front of his family, but he must have felt like he is in a court triale or something, the reporters clearly didn’t like him and they let him know about it. Shame on you all trash ass reporters except for Jaynes who clearly didn’t want to ruin that mans day

I remember the big hoopla for Nates intro at WA park.

 

[B-Roy]

I see the logic, but I have to believe that if they wanted to deal Grant, they'd be able to get other young prospects that can play now and grow with Hayes and Cunningham, rather than picks that may or may not have any real value.

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2098661&p=92174693#p92174693

Here, I posted in realgm for an unbiased view. Texas Chuck is really good with trade value and has even predicted some deals before. This is his evaluation:

Yeah I really salute the effort here. Don't want to get into Simmons/CJ again too much but I want to say Philly should get 2 of the lightly protected Portland picks and Detroit should take the lotto protected Hornets pick. I have you overpaying for Grant and I appreciate that because you realize you need to talk Detroit into dealing him period. But 2 firsts is still an overpayment.

Like the final team for Portland for sure and you didn't hold back paying to get what you wanted to get done. Salute. Well done.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2098661&p=92174693#p92174693

Here, I posted in realgm for an unbiased view. Texas Chuck is really good with trade value and has even predicted some deals before. This is his evaluation:

Interesting to see other fans' perspectives there. Like that the Hornets fan is all about dealing a first for Nurk. The question about hard-capping due to the Zeller S/T is valid though.

 

[illmatic99]

Idea based purely on these other teams saving a ton of $.

Dame
Powell
Hayward
Ingram
Adams

 

[tester551]

Maybe Dame thinks Jody should pay luxury tax to go after FA's.

Regardless of what Dame wants or thinks Blazers ought to do - they are hamstrung by the CBA. Olshey put the team in a position where there just are not a lot of options to improve the team.

 

[Natebishop3]

It was interesting listening to them talk about whether Quick thinks the team is intentionally shutting him down. Honestly, if that's the case, he kinda made his bed. The guy has had an adversarial relationship with the team since back when I covered them. I think he has massively improved since then, but you kinda reap what you sow.

 

[B-Roy]

Interesting to see other fans' perspectives there. Like that the Hornets fan is all about dealing a first for Nurk. The question about hard-capping due to the Zeller S/T is valid though.

Yes, but he also said they don't need to S&T Zeller, they can take Nurk into space. Which would mean using our TPMLE to find a center that could reasonably start in certain matchups. I would need to see who is available. I don't think you can go into next season without a traditional center.