STELLAR TANKING JOB, JOE!

[SharpesTriumph]

This team curently has the 14th highest payroll and finished 28th in record. Jody is actually paying 1.3 mil in luxury tax this year.

If we did not have an absentee owner, there is 0 chance that either Joe or Chauncey would be employed with this track record of mismanagement.

Incorrect, Blazers have 1.3 million of space UNDER the luxury tax.

 

[illmatic99]

Incorrect, Blazers have 1.3 million of space UNDER the luxury tax.

Lol. Yes. You are the third person to correct me and the 2nd person to fail to see that i correct myself just a few posts after.

Good lord.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

Thybulle still has value, and it's better to retain him at a reasonable price rather than lose him for nothing. We also had no idea that Camara would be as good as he was.

Thybulle apparently had some value to Dallas last summer.

Now after a disappointing year earning $10 million? I'd imagine he clearly has negative value.

 

[Everything Beagle]

We can probably try our hardest and end up 1-5 so we don't need to do anything to "tank"

Exactly, we don't need to tank or rest stars... let them get out and play; we will lose plenty of games regardless. This season gave us some interesting surprises; Banton's a keeper imho, and finally will make a three-guard lineup worthwhile. Trade Ant and some picks and make moves for the future that way. I want to see the kids play next season.

 

[Everything Beagle]

Lol. Yes. You are the third person to correct me and the 2nd person to fail to see that i correct myself just a few posts after.

Good lord.

If you're so sensitive about this, edit your original post!

Good lord.

 

[Pinwheel1]

. Cronin needs to focus on getting his youngsters up to par before turning to veterans and talking about wanting to be like Houston.

I am done with the intentional tank....and I am not even a season ticket holder. We have the vets now to compete. The youngsters can still get their minutes and continue to develop. But I say make them earn their starting positions, don't just give it to them. I think Scoot will be ready to start but if someone like Brogdon is playing better then start Malcolm.

This team can be competitive next year and still develop their youngster for one simple reason.....injuries....they are a reality in a long season. Minutes will be available for 3rd string players who will need to play at some point in the season.

Brogdon or Scoot
Ant or Sharpe
Grant- Camara (or Thybulle)
Walker- Camara
Ayton-Williams

Drafting Sarr would help as he could back up the 4 and the 5 until he is ready to start
Getting an SF like Cody Williams or Risacher would be for the near future, not next year.

That leaves Rupert. Banter, Murray

I am ok with trading Ant or Grant but it needs to be for someone like Franz Wagner. Otherwise, keep them.
Get a 1st for Brogdon or keep him.
Thybulle I am not sure about.

 

[Ed O]

Thybulle apparently had some value to Dallas last summer.

Now after a disappointing year earning $10 million? I'd imagine he clearly has negative value.

I agree. He had value to Dallas since they had the ability to sign him for just money.

He had no value to Philadelphia (a good team) before he was traded in terms of earning significant minutes. He has had no value to Portland (a bad team) in terms of him helping win games.

I don't understand why any team would look at the dude and think he's worth giving up value to get when he's not worth the money he's being paid.

 

[BonesJones]

If we were competing, sure, but Thybulle is even more irrelevant now that we have Camara, a second-round rookie who outplayed him most the season. And you have Murray and Rupert who I'm assuming we're trying to develop. On top of all that, we're likely to draft another wing who would need his minutes in this year's draft. Now we're 8 mil over the tax. I'm just hoping we don't have to attach an asset just to get rid of him.

Should've never matched Thybulle

 

[Natebishop3]

Thybulle apparently had some value to Dallas last summer.

Now after a disappointing year earning $10 million? I'd imagine he clearly has negative value.

10 million is nothing in this CBA. That's a steal for a rotation player.

 

[Ed O]

I am done with the intentional tank....and I am not even a season ticket holder. We have the vets now to compete.

Complete for a play-in spot, or maybe even a playoff spot? Yeah.

Compete for a title? No way.

And Sharpe/Scoot/this year's lottery pick is not a good enough core to EVER compete for a title.

We need more pieces because it's basically all we have, and that means being bad for a couple of more years IMO. It means taking on bad contracts for picks. It means to stop spending money and roster spots on injury-prone guys that will probably shut it down whether the team is terrible or not.

 

[BonesJones]

10 million is nothing in this CBA. That's a steal for a rotation player.

Except hes 6th in the pecking order when you count PG/SG/SF and might be 7th if the Blazrrs draft a wing. 8th if they want to play Grant at some 3.

And that money is something when you're $8M over the tax with a rebuilding team.

 

[Everything Beagle]

Complete for a play-in spot, or maybe even a playoff spot? Yeah.

Compete for a title? No way.

And Sharpe/Scoot/this year's lottery pick is not a good enough core to EVER compete for a title.

We need more pieces because it's basically all we have, and that means being bad for a couple of more years IMO. It means taking on bad contracts for picks. It means to stop spending money and roster spots on injury-prone guys that will probably shut it down whether the team is terrible or not.

Safe to say we won’t get the pieces, and will not compete for a title. I just want to see us win 42 again lol

 

[Natebishop3]

Except hes 6th in the pecking order when you count PG/SG/SF and might be 7th if the Blazrrs draft a wing. 8th if they want to play Grant at some 3.

And that money is something when you're $8M over the tax with a rebuilding team.

I don't think we're keeping him. This is asset stockpiling. Even if we only get a second rounder for him, it's still better than letting him walk for nothing.

 

[BonesJones]

I don't think we're keeping him. This is asset stockpiling. Even if we only get a second rounder for him, it's still better than letting him walk for nothing.

So we're gonna trade him for matching salary and still be in the tax? What do you expect to get out of him while simultaneously dumping his money for little to nothing in return to duck the tax?

 

[C_note]

By that standard, we can never judge anything unless we work in the organization's front office.

Lol, yes that's right. How can you make an accurate judgement when you don't have all the information?
You might be able to at the surface-level, but don't get defensive when others point out the flaw.

Making a judgement about player performance, team or coach performance, that's totally different. You have all the evidence available to you and are entitled to your own analysis.

 

[Everything Beagle]

Lol, yes that's right. How can you make an accurate judgement when you don't have all the information?
You might be able to at the surface-level, but don't get defensive when others point out the flaw.

Making a judgement about player performance, team or coach performance, that's totally different. You have all the evidence available to you and are entitled to your own analysis.

The secret knowledge is that forums like this (and perhaps the internet in general) are anxiety machines that do nothing but make the experience worse by focusing on things we have no control over.

 

[Natebishop3]

So we're gonna trade him for matching salary and still be in the tax? What do you expect to get out of him while simultaneously dumping his money for little to nothing in return to duck the tax?

Would it be bad if we did keep him? He's a great locker room guy. He can play multiple positions in a pinch. Why do we care what his hit is on the cap? We're not going out and signing anyone big in free agency. What's the negative here?

 

[Everything Beagle]

Would it be bad if we did keep him? He's a great locker room guy. He can play multiple positions in a pinch. Why do we care what his hit is on the cap? We're not going out and signing anyone big in free agency. What's the negative here?

I dunno, Thybulle feels too much like Ime Udoka to me; sure he’s all the things you mention but why do we need that guy, when that guy is the cherry on a cupcake and we need flour more than a cherry?

 

[Natebishop3]

I dunno, Thybulle feels too much like Ime Udoka to me; sure he’s all the things you mention but why do we need that guy, when that guy is the cherry on a cupcake and we need flour more than a cherry?

Right now it seems like Joe is just stacking up all his ingredients on the counter trying to figure out what recipe he can make.

We have some win now guys:
Simons
Ayton
Grant
Brogdon
Timelord
Thybulle

We have some young potential stars:
Scoot
Sharpe

We have some young role players:
Walker
Camara
Murray

We have some young projects:
Rupert
Badji

Maybe we turn some of those win now guys into another piece? Maybe our draft pick this year ends up being really good? There's so many unknowns right now. Maybe there is some combination of young and old that could surprise the league next year? I have no idea, but at this point, I only want to see how it all plays out. I'm really curious what we do this summer.

 

[Ed O]

Safe to say we won’t get the pieces, and will not compete for a title. I just want to see us win 42 again lol

I don't care about 42 wins. I want 52+.

This season sucked, but it would have been worse if we won more games and finished outside of the playoffs but with, like, the 10th pick. Or if we somehow won a play-in game or two and ended up with the 15th pick (having to send it to Chicago) while getting our butts kicked in the playoffs.

We need to get worse--or, rather, stay bad, since we can't get much worse--in order to add more pieces to make up for the fact that this franchise hasn't added much of anyone other than Ant, Scoot, and Sharpe in the last decade.

(Crap. I was using "last decade" as hyperbole, but...



I left McCollum in there to show/remind us that we got no one in 2014.

While I know this list is not perfect (it doesn't include Collins, and includes guys that we traded on draft night... hat a load of hot garbage we've drafted (not as human beings. I'm sure they are nice people. But they're not good NBA players)

We need to use draft picks. We need time to get better. We can't keep RoCoing and Nanceing and Granting in an effort to get good. It hasn't and won't work. And we can't look at our roster, IMO, and think it's good enough to mature into a team that will be a title contender.

 

[e_blazer]

LMAO. We're tanking next year bro. Just accept it.

SELL THE FUCKING TEAM JODY!!!

OK. Glad you have it all figured out. How many rookies do you think the team can develop at one time?

 

[SharpesTriumph]

10 million is nothing in this CBA. That's a steal for a rotation player.

You use the term rotational player very generously here. As Ed said, he wasn't in Philly rotation last year, he got DNPs. He's not young with upside. He fell out of the rotation of a 21 win last in conference team. By that metric Camara is probably a "starter".

 

[BonesJones]

Would it be bad if we did keep him? He's a great locker room guy. He can play multiple positions in a pinch. Why do we care what his hit is on the cap? We're not going out and signing anyone big in free agency. What's the negative here?

Pyaing $11M to someone who isn't a young player yet shouldn't be in the rotation next year when we're apx. $8M in the tax in the middle of a rebuild with a cheap owner doesn't add up to me.

The negative is that we're apx. $8M into the tax with a cheap owner in the middle of a rebuild, this limiting the ability to accumulate assets (like many rebuilding teams have successfully done) and will likely result in a sub-par cost-cutting move.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Complete for a play-in spot, or maybe even a playoff spot? Yeah.

Compete for a title? No way.

And Sharpe/Scoot/this year's lottery pick is not a good enough core to EVER compete for a title.

We need more pieces because it's basically all we have, and that means being bad for a couple of more years IMO. It means taking on bad contracts for picks. It means to stop spending money and roster spots on injury-prone guys that will probably shut it down whether the team is terrible or not.

Of course, we need more pieces, but a couple of years more of sucking so embarrassingly bad to get a small chance of landing a "difference maker" does not sound too appealing. How did you answer in the thread "How much of the season did you watch? Your answer was.......... "I don't think I've watched even one since the trade deadline." And you want two more years of that for a CHANCE to win the lottery? Tell that to the season ticket holders.

 

[BonesJones]

Right now it seems like Joe is just stacking up all his ingredients on the counter trying to figure out what recipe he can make.

We have some win now guys:
Simons
Ayton
Grant
Brogdon
Timelord
Thybulle

We have some young potential stars:
Scoot
Sharpe

We have some young role players:
Walker
Camara
Murray

We have some young projects:
Rupert
Badji

Maybe we turn some of those win now guys into another piece? Maybe our draft pick this year ends up being really good? There's so many unknowns right now. Maybe there is some combination of young and old that could surprise the league next year? I have no idea, but at this point, I only want to see how it all plays out. I'm really curious what we do this summer.

The last win-now team Thybulle played on didn't seem to view him as a win-now guy...

 

[BonesJones]

Of course, we need more pieces, but a couple of years more of sucking so embarrassingly bad to get a small chance of landing a "difference maker" does not sound too appealing. How did you answer in the thread "How much of the season did you watch? Your answer was.......... "I don't think I've watched even one since the trade deadline." And you want two more years of that for a CHANCE to win the lottery? Tell that to the season ticket holders.

If the Blazers suck this much next year they'll get a difference maker. That draft is loaded.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

Complete for a play-in spot, or maybe even a playoff spot? Yeah.

Compete for a title? No way.

And Sharpe/Scoot/this year's lottery pick is not a good enough core to EVER compete for a title.

We need more pieces because it's basically all we have, and that means being bad for a couple of more years IMO. It means taking on bad contracts for picks. It means to stop spending money and roster spots on injury-prone guys that will probably shut it down whether the team is terrible or not.

Well I agree with your types of moves the team should make. But I agree with others the Blazers should try to "compete". I don't mean trying to overpay vets long term or trade picks for vets. I just think this team should aim to try and win games for a whole season. Not these 3-20 types stretches after the all-star break the last 3 years. We don't need to have starting lineups with multiple scrubs that may be oversees in the off-season. Even doing all of that we'll still be losing a ton and getting high lottery picks.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

I agree. He had value to Dallas since they had the ability to sign him for just money.

He had no value to Philadelphia (a good team) before he was traded in terms of earning significant minutes. He has had no value to Portland (a bad team) in terms of him helping win games.

I don't understand why any team would look at the dude and think he's worth giving up value to get when he's not worth the money he's being paid.

Considering what Dallas did with our castoff Derrick Jones Jr., I have confidence that another team would love to have Matisse, particularly given his improved three point shooting.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

If the Blazers suck this much next year they'll get a difference maker. That draft is loaded.

And he'll be coached by Chauncey because he'll "deserve" another chance

 

[SharpesTriumph]

Would it be bad if we did keep him? He's a great locker room guy. He can play multiple positions in a pinch. Why do we care what his hit is on the cap? We're not going out and signing anyone big in free agency. What's the negative here?

If the Blazers had MLE space they could absorb salary with an asset or for a player. Or sign a player. Or not give up an asset to dodge the tax.

Adding an asset and talent is the only thing this team can do to improve. No Thybulle isn't the end all he all, but if he's wasting money it's wasting possible talent and eventually wins, even if its just a smaller part.

Your argument makes zero sense.