Steph Loves New Weapons

[TnNeG]

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Stephon Marbury is confident that the Knicks' offseason additions that Isiah Thomas will make for a better team in the upcoming season.

"This is a new style and we're all going to be together from the beginning," Marbury said. "We're not going to be learning on the fly, like before."

Marbury was particularly enthused about new teammate Jamal Crawford. "I think he's going to be great," Marbury said. "He's another weapon for us."

One that Marbury feels he can deploy in a much different offense than the one the Knicks played last year.</div>

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[S.Livingston14]

The Knicks have one of the best teams on paper. But paper doesn't mean anything once the season starts. I have always been a Knick fan, and I hope to see them fianlly turn it around. I think this might be the year. Steph has so many running mates, which is exactly what he needs to be succesfull.

 

[GjonC]

yeah i think this might be the year also, especially if vince is coming to ny!

 

[Moo2K4]

They may have a good team on paper, but, so did the Lakers last year. What did they do? Nothing. I don't care how good they LOOK, until they're on the court playing together, we won't know how good they actually are.

 

[GjonC]

common ! the lakers made it to the finals!
all the good teams look good on paper!minesota,houston,detroit etc. why do the knicks have to be any different.

 

[Smoke]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Moo2K4:</div><div class="quote_post">They may have a good team on paper, but, so did the Lakers last year. What did they do? Nothing. I don't care how good they LOOK, until they're on the court playing together, we won't know how good they actually are.</div>
thats a true statement about the lakers but the lakers also had a nother problem that i dont think the knicks have.

And that problem was egos by all of there superstarsthey had.
the only guy that i think just plain played no matter what was malone and i respect him for that.

on topic i thinkt he knicks have a very nice core of players.

 

[GjonC]

thank you for giving such compliments to the knicks, but this is not the western conference so i think the knicks have an easier chance going to the finals.

 

[S.Livingston14]

Moo2K4 you basically said exactly what I said, except for you worded it differently.

 

[Moo2K4]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting GjonC:</div><div class="quote_post">common ! the lakers made it to the finals!
all the good teams look good on paper!minesota,houston,detroit etc. why do the knicks have to be any different.</div>

They made the Finals. Wow, who cares. Did they win? No. Therefore, they accomplished nothing. That team was built to win and it didn't. Simple as that. Sorry for that off topic comment, but I felt it should be made. And the Knicks, yea, they do have a good looking team, they might have the best backcourt in all of basketball next year with Crawford and Starbury, but only time can tell if they're going to be good or not.

 

[paulan81]

Out with Layden, in with Isiah. This new generation of management will bring new excitement to the Garden and it seems like everyone is on the Isiah bandwagon right now. Although I did like his overall makeover with the team, I hope Isiah does resolve some issues. I do like his moves, with the exception of the tim thomas deal (In my honest opinion Van Horn was so much more efficient with his minutes, ie: points, rebs and fg %) Hopefully, next year, the deal will prove me wrong if Tim actually steps up everynight and delivers on a consistent basis. I also don't like how Moochie Norris hasn't been respected at all by Isiah, or so it seems to be. Moochie has a ton of talent still and he is very effective in his limited playing time. He can break down the D with his killer crossover and he can knock down outside shots with efficiency. I'd say let him play more. I don't understand why he would bother bringing in Jamison, unless they decide to get rid of Moochie somehow, which i really don't see happenning. But my biggest concern of the knicks right now, is THEIR DEFENSE.

 

[paulan81]

Out with Layden, in with Isiah. This new generation of management will bring new excitement to the Garden and it seems like everyone is on the Isiah bandwagon right now. Although I did like his overall makeover with the team, I hope Isiah does resolve some issues. I do like his moves, with the exception of the tim thomas deal (In my honest opinion Van Horn was so much more efficient with his minutes, ie: points, rebs and fg %) Hopefully, next year, the deal will prove me wrong if Tim actually steps up everynight and delivers on a consistent basis. I also don't like how Moochie Norris hasn't been respected at all by Isiah, or so it seems to be. Moochie has a ton of talent still and he is very effective in his limited playing time. He can break down the D with his killer crossover and he can knock down outside shots with efficiency. I'd say let him play more. I don't understand why he would bother bringing in Jamison, unless they decide to get rid of Moochie somehow, which i really don't see happenning. But my biggest concern of the knicks right now, is THEIR DEFENSE. The reason why they lost so many games last year was because of their horrible team defense. At times they just totally broke down, players not rotating in time to catch shooters on the outside. It was horrible to watch especially being used to the old knicks' style of tough defensive play. They also need a big man to clog the middle of the paint, (which will be their biggest weakness this year). With big Mount Mutombo gone, I can't really see the Knicks putting any kind of fear in any team if they try to take the ball to the hole. Nazi and Kurt, just won't cut it. I think Isiah needs to put more concentration on bringing in hustle guys who do the little things really well, guys who are defensive/ hustle specialists with size. If not I don't see much success for them going into the playoffs......
(as you can see I was a big Oakley fan)

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">They made the Finals. Wow, who cares. Did they win? No. Therefore, they accomplished nothing. That team was built to win and it didn't. Simple as that. Sorry for that off topic comment, but I felt it should be made. And the Knicks, yea, they do have a good looking team, they might have the best backcourt in all of basketball next year with Crawford and Starbury, but only time can tell if they're going to be good or not.</div>

If the Knicks made it to the Finals everybodywould care. From their playoff sweep in the 2004 in the 1st round. And if you make it to the finals and lose you have to give props to the team for making it that far. Besides the Knicks are not the Lakers with 4 hall of famers/hall of famers to be so if they made it to the finals it would be a HUGE succes even if they got swept and blown out in all four games. In my oppinion the new Knicks have more depth and would have put up a better match than the Lakers!

 

[02civic]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting GjonC:</div><div class="quote_post">common ! the lakers made it to the finals!
all the good teams look good on paper!minesota,houston,detroit etc. why do the knicks have to be any different.</div>


sure they have alot of big names on their roster...but the problem is most of them dont do anything. Tim Thomas has never lived up to hype..he's inconsistent at best. Houston can play but he's getting older and injury prone. Crawfords good but not exactly a team player....a bit selfish in my eyes. Penny's over the hill and in the same boat has Houston. Who are the knicks bing men?? Nazr?? Kurt Thomas...not exactly the cream of the crop. I dont think you can compare Minnesota, Detroit and the Lakers of last year to this Knick team. I predict the Knicks struggle for the 8th seed.
Just me .2cents

 

[GjonC]

we were talking about the knicks offense,and that it was good on paper, and it is real good actually.name a team that has better backcourt offense.

and thx mrj18 for backing me up on the finals deal!

 

[02civic]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting GjonC:</div><div class="quote_post">we were talking about the knicks offense,and that it was good on paper, and it is real good actually.name a team that has better backcourt offense.

and thx mj18 for backing me up on the finals deal!</div>


well their offense wont be bad. Let me think who do they have in the backcourt compared to other East teams.

Knicks cavs raps Magic
SG-houson SG-LBJ SG-J.Rose SG-Mobley
PG-marbury PG-Snow PG-Alston PG-Franchise
backup backup backup backup
SG-crawford SG-Wagner SG-Mo Pete SG-D. Stevenson
PG-penny PG-Macinnis PG-A. Williams PG-J. Nelson


Wizards Miami Detroit Indiana
SG-Hughes SG-Eddie Jones SG-Rip Hamilton SG-S. Jackson
PG-Arenas PG-Wade PG-Chauncy Billups PG-Tinsley
backup backup backup backup
SG-J. Hayes SG-Dooling SG-Carlos Delfino SG-Miller
PG-? PG-D. Jones PG-Linsey Hunter PG-A. Johnson


I'd say that the cavs and magic have as good a backcourt...possibly even Detroit and Miami. When you factor in overall skill though...on the defensive end...and the players chances of injury i'd pick all of them except washingtons over the NYK backcourt. Just my .2cents

 

[GjonC]

what u talkin about, there is nobody on sg that can throw in baskets like houston, no pg that could score or assist better than marbury, and where do u find a backup bench like better than penny and jc!

 

[02civic]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting GjonC:</div><div class="quote_post">what u talkin about, there is nobody on sg that can throw in baskets like houston, no pg that could score or assist better than marbury, and where do u find a backup bench like better than penny and jc!</div>

Houston can shoot....thats no question...he's not the greatest defender, he's not the youngest guy and he's CERTAINLY not the healthiest. If they have him for 65 games i think they'll be lucky. I'd choose S. Jackson, LBJ, Rip Hamilton and Mobley over Houston for an all-star team...and i'd consider J.Rose but probably not.

Marbury's great...no doubt...one of the top gaurds on the East. He's streaky though...but overall he's a B+ or an A-. Steve Franchise, Dwayne Wade and Chauncey Billups arent far off.

Penny's day has come and gone...i was a huge Penny fan and i still like him alot...but he's always injured and his numbers are way down. Also very streaky. I think Macinnis is a better back up pg...alvin williams is probably equal.

JC can score....for sure. But can he exist coming off the bench? Can he play point like alot of people say he can and will? Can he play a team game or is he just gunna shoot shoot shoot. Certainly not a bad player...but not a great one IMO. Wagner and Miller are both good backup SG....maybe not as good as Crawford, but not bad. Watch for Jarvis to step up though, by the end of the season i bet he's better than JC.


so overall a good backcourt. But not the best...and certainly not untouchable...even by east standards.
Besides...who's playing up front for them. Sweetney...servicable, but not much more. Kurt Thomas..i like him...but nothing special...Tim Thomas....hurts the team as often as he helps it. Nazr..decent season last year..but what who knows what this year holds for him.

 

[GjonC]

Jarvis going to be better than JC??? U gotta b kidding rite???
up front is a different story, thats only because the knicks dont have enough big men, because i love having sweets, kurt and nazr on my team, they could really rebound, the stats say enough.

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Houston can shoot....thats no question...he's not the greatest defender, he's not the youngest guy and he's CERTAINLY not the healthiest. If they have him for 65 games i think they'll be lucky. I'd choose S. Jackson, LBJ, Rip Hamilton and Mobley over Houston for an all-star team...and i'd consider J.Rose but probably not.

Marbury's great...no doubt...one of the top gaurds on the East. He's streaky though...but overall he's a B+ or an A-. Steve Franchise, Dwayne Wade and Chauncey Billups arent far off.

Penny's day has come and gone...i was a huge Penny fan and i still like him alot...but he's always injured and his numbers are way down. Also very streaky. I think Macinnis is a better back up pg...alvin williams is probably equal.

JC can score....for sure. But can he exist coming off the bench? Can he play point like alot of people say he can and will? Can he play a team game or is he just gunna shoot shoot shoot. Certainly not a bad player...but not a great one IMO. Wagner and Miller are both good backup SG....maybe not as good as Crawford, but not bad. Watch for Jarvis to step up though, by the end of the season i bet he's better than JC.


so overall a good backcourt. But not the best...and certainly not untouchable...even by east standards.
Besides...who's playing up front for them. Sweetney...servicable, but not much more. Kurt Thomas..i like him...but nothing special...Tim Thomas....hurts the team as often as he helps it. Nazr..decent season last year..but what who knows what this year holds for him.

</div>If we are talking about points statistically Houston and Marbury are the best backcourt in the regular season. And all of the shooting guards that you mentioned do not have a better shooting game than Houston. Houston is arguably the best shooter in the league no less than top 5. The players you named can't touch Marbury and Houston. Francis career high in apg is 6.6 because him and Wade are natural shooting guards. Stephen Jackson and Lebron James dont have great point guards, and Hamilton is not a threat from 3. Marbury can penetrate and kick it to Houston who can shoot from everywhere and they have Crawford's slashing off the bench. What 3 guard rotation is better than that?

 

[GjonC]

yeah mrj18! u tell him boy!

 

[P.A.P.]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Moo2K4:</div><div class="quote_post">They made the Finals. Wow, who cares. Did they win? No. Therefore, they accomplished nothing. That team was built to win and it didn't. Simple as that. Sorry for that off topic comment, but I felt it should be made. And the Knicks, yea, they do have a good looking team, they might have the best backcourt in all of basketball next year with Crawford and Starbury, but only time can tell if they're going to be good or not.</div>

The Lakers didn't accomplish their goal, but they did win the Western Conference Finals and became the Western Conference Champs. It might not mean much to them, but that's still a pretty good accomplishment, just not by Laker standards. It's similar to what happened to the Yankees last year, when they were expected to win the World Series and lost to the Marlins.

So if the Knicks made the Finals and lost, would that mean that they accomplished nothing? Just because one team doesn't have the expectations of another team, doesn't make the case any different. Making the NBA Finals is an accomplishment. Winning the NBA Finals is a much bigger accomplishment. When it comes down to it, it's still an accomplishment.

 

[02civic]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">If we are talking about points statistically Houston and Marbury are the best backcourt in the regular season. And all of the shooting guards that you mentioned do not have a better shooting game than Houston. Houston is arguably the best shooter in the league no less than top 5. The players you named can't touch Marbury and Houston. Francis career high in apg is 6.6 because him and Wade are natural shooting guards. Stephen Jackson and Lebron James dont have great point guards, and Hamilton is not a threat from 3. Marbury can penetrate and kick it to Houston who can shoot from everywhere and they have Crawford's slashing off the bench. What 3 guard rotation is better than that?</div>


well like i said as far as points go they've got a good backcourt...but they arent the healthiest and i doubt they'll gel as well as some of the less skilled backcourts. Houston is a great shooter...but LBJ is a bigger offensive threat. I'd say Rip Hamilton is as good offensively too. And Mobley aint no sluch. Ok, ok, clevelends PG cant match Marbury...but Franchise isnt far off, same with Billups. So its not like these teams are getting dominated.
And besides...you can have all the great shooters you want but if you dont have any prescense inside the perimeter defenders dont have to sag off or double down...which means every shooter is gunna have a defender in his face all day long. New York's backcourt is also pretty lack on defense, AND susteptable to injuries. So saying NYK backcourt is one of the best is ridiculous...you cant just look at shooting after making the statement...because i dont think they have a top 3 backcourt..all round game...in the east.
But thats my opinion

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">
well like i said as far as points go they've got a good backcourt...but they arent the healthiest and i doubt they'll gel as well as some of the less skilled backcourts. Houston is a great shooter...but LBJ is a bigger offensive threat. I'd say Rip Hamilton is as good offensively too. And Mobley aint no sluch. Ok, ok, clevelends PG cant match Marbury...but Franchise isnt far off, same with Billups. So its not like these teams are getting dominated.
And besides...you can have all the great shooters you want but if you dont have any prescense inside the perimeter defenders dont have to sag off or double down...which means every shooter is gunna have a defender in his face all day long. New York's backcourt is also pretty lack on defense, AND susteptable to injuries. So saying NYK backcourt is one of the best is ridiculous...you cant just look at shooting after making the statement...because i dont think they have a top 3 backcourt..all round game...in the east.
But thats my opinion</div>

With the exception of Allan Houston the Knicks backcourt is not injury prone. And the Knicks backcourt deffensive stats are not too far off the players you named. The reason why I think the Knicks deffense was not too good last year was because the team never got the chance to gel like Detroit, Cleaveland and the Houston Rockets. None of those teams had changes as signifficant as the Knicks. The reason why those players deffense looks signifficantly better than the Knicks backcourt is because they are playing in overall better defensive teams. The Pistons deffense is the best in the league but that does not mean that Billups D is considerably better than Marbury. And also the teams that you named do not have a 6th man combo guard like Jamal Crawford. Talent wise/skill wise atleast

 

[BigBlueFan]

Knicks are putting a decent team together. I liked the aquasition of Crawford, he is going to help out a lot for this Knicks backcourt. I see Houston and Thomas having pretty big years. Better watch out for NY team.