Steve Nash: Trade to Portland would be a "terrific situation"

[Rhal]

You think we're contenders with Nash? No freaking way. We'll get eaten by Miami assuming we can pass the west (which we can't).

Really depends on what we give up to get Nash. At the moment we match up well with almost every playoff team in the west and most teams in the east. We have 5 good defenders in LA/Wes/Batum/Camby/Crash. Our offensive problems lie with our horrible PG rotation so depending on what we would have to give up to fix that we could defiantly give any team a run for their money. Our D seems to lie with our offense too. When were making plays on the Offensive end we come out with really good D pressure, but when were not then our D can be just as bad as our O.
Best case scenario is Felton starts playing like a borderline all star he was last year but since the chances of that seem rather slim some of our defenders are going to have to go which then makes the defensive matchups intresting depending on who we have left.
Second best case scenario is http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7455smr We get Nash/Fry, Clips get a SG they need in Mathews, and Phx gets Felton/Bledso/Foyd. Phx would also get a pick from either us or the clips
Phx dumps a bad contract while taking on an interesting prospect in Bledsoe gets over 10m in exp contracts and gets a first rounder from either us or the clips. We can even expand it to take in Hakeem Warris by sending out Babbit/Smith. I say both of those instead of Ewill because we are overpaying for Nash anyway might as well not get fully R@%#$ in the process. Clips defiantly want in on this because they need a SG who can shoot and defend desperately which is about all that Mathews can do. Putting Mathews next to an elite PG means he doesn't have to handle the ball much and make those bone headed plays.

Seeing as I don't think that trade is going to happen we either overpay for Nash and hope for the best or we stand pat and probably are a one and done team.

 

[B-Roy]

Best case scenario is Felton starts playing like a borderline all star he was last year but since the chances of that seem rather slim some of our defenders are going to have to go which then makes the defensive matchups intresting depending on who we have left.

Felton was never a borderline all-star. Above average? Sure, but that's it.

17.3 PER and inflated stats playing under D'Antoni do not equal borderline all-star.

 

[MickZagger]

Felton was never a borderline all-star. Above average? Sure, but that's it.

17.3 PER and inflated stats playing under D'Antoni do not equal borderline all-star.

I remember many pundits last year talking about the possibility of Felton as an all-star.

 

[Rhal]

Felton was never a borderline all-star. Above average? Sure, but that's it.

17.3 PER and inflated stats playing under D'Antoni do not equal borderline all-star.

He almost made it onto the allstar team (a lot of analysts predicted him as a wild card slot)last year with those inflated stats which makes his play last year borderline all starish with the knicks.

 

[KingSpeed]

That's a joke, right?

Nash isn't the "missing link" for this year. We're not a very talented team and replacing Batum with Nash doesn't make us much better- if at all.

Yes he is and yes he does. He is arguably the best pure PG in the NBA and he's leading the league in assists. He would make all of our players better and we'd finially have a PG who can shoot. We have a chance to make it to the second round without Nash. WITH Nash, we can get to WCF and even if we lose there, that will still be the most fun we've had in 12 years.

Why mortgage our future for 3 months of Nash? I love him, but not more then a bright future for my Blazers! The Heat are winning the next 10 championships anyway!

We'd get a high level Nash for two to three years if we wanted. He has shown no sign of decline this season. If the Heat are winning the next ten titles, then there is no bright future for the Blazers. Nash wants one more shot at a title and he would give us his A+ game to make it happen. Remember, he was in the WCF just two years ago. He's jealous his best friend just won a title. He wants one now.

Keep Batum and settle for years of mediocrity. Get Nash and possibly reach the western conference finals and maybe more? High risk, high return, I'm all for Nash on this one. Though, if we could somehow trade Wallace instead of Batum, I'd rather do that. Maybe Wallace, Felton, & nolan for Nash? And maybe get the Celtics to bite on a Ray Allen for Matthews trade? That would be fun to watch.

Exactly. Hanging onto Batum instead of Nash takes us nowhere. Batum is a fine player but he's not lifting us ou of mediocrity right now.

Fuck it.... let's go senior citizen.

I'm 37. I'm not a senior citizen. He's not that old.

You think we're contenders with Nash? No freaking way. We'll get eaten by Miami assuming we can pass the west (which we can't).

Even if we lost to the Heat in the Finals, I'd rather that than being out in the first round or gasp not even making the playoffs (still a high possibility)

 

[KingSpeed]

He almost made it onto the allstar team (a lot of analysts predicted him as a wild card slot)last year with those inflated stats which makes his play last year borderline all starish with the knicks.

In the East where there weren't a lot of good PGs at the time. Not like the West with Nash, Parker, Paul, and Williams.

 

[Natebishop3]

Yes he is and yes he does. He is arguably the best pure PG in the NBA and he's leading the league in assists. He would make all of our players better and we'd finially have a PG who can shoot. We have a chance to make it to the second round without Nash. WITH Nash, we can get to WCF and even if we lose there, that will still be the most fun we've had in 12 years.



We'd get a high level Nash for two to three years if we wanted. He has shown no sign of decline this season. If the Heat are winning the next ten titles, then there is no bright future for the Blazers. Nash wants one more shot at a title and he would give us his A+ game to make it happen. Remember, he was in the WCF just two years ago. He's jealous his best friend just won a title. He wants one now.


Exactly. Hanging onto Batum instead of Nash takes us nowhere. Batum is a fine player but he's not lifting us ou of mediocrity right now.


I'm 37. I'm not a senior citizen. He's not that old.


Even if we lost to the Heat in the Finals, I'd rather that than being out in the first round or gasp not even making the playoffs (still a high possibility)

In the NBA, 37 is a senior citizen. Sorry Eric.

 

[Rhal]

In the East where there weren't a lot of good PGs at the time. Not like the West with Nash, Parker, Paul, and Williams.

Just because one side has a better quality of player doesn't make the other sides guys any less of an allstar.

 

[KingSpeed]

In the NBA, 37 is a senior citizen. Sorry Eric.

I just don't like the term senior citizen even in NBA years. These are still young guys. It's not like Nash can't move or something. He's playing great and his level of play would go up when he got here and realized he had another chance at a title.

 

[KingSpeed]

Just because one side has a better quality of player doesn't make the other sides guys any less of an allstar.

But Felton WASN'T an All Star even in the weak conference.

 

[Rhal]

But Felton WASN'T an All Star even in the weak conference.

I never said he was, I simply said "borderline allstar" which he was even with only 2 real elite PG's in the east of Rondo/Rose. Just like LA was a borderline allstar last year in the west.

 

[Natebishop3]

I just don't like the term senior citizen even in NBA years. These are still young guys. It's not like Nash can't move or something. He's playing great and his level of play would go up when he got here and realized he had another chance at a title.

Nash is not a young guy. He's almost 40. That's not young. Like I said, he's old enough to be the father of some of the youngest guys in the league. You want to trade some of our young talent for a guy who is almost 40?

 

[KingSpeed]

In the West where there are a ton of good PFs.

 

[KingSpeed]

Nash is not a young guy. He's almost 40. That's not young. Like I said, he's old enough to be the father of some of the youngest guys in the league. You want to trade some of our young talent for a guy who is almost 40?

Who cares what he almost is. He is 38 now and can play. I will take one WCF this year over no playoffs/out in first round over the next 10 years.

 

[KingSpeed]

By the way, how old is the PG on the defending champs? I'll get that. He's 39 and very nearly 40. If Kidd's not too old, then neither is Nash.

 

[Natebishop3]

By the way, how old is the PG on the defending champs? I'll get that. He's 39 and very nearly 40. If Kidd's not too old, then neither is Nash.

Yeah, and Kidd wasn't even close to being the best player on the Mavs. You're expecting Nash to be our best player and our savior.

 

[B-Roy]

I remember many pundits last year talking about the possibility of Felton as an all-star.

There's a difference between playing like an all-star and "pundits" saying you should be one.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

You think we're contenders with Nash? No freaking way. We'll get eaten by Miami assuming we can pass the west (which we can't).

Are you suggesting that if we can't be obviously equal to or better than Miami then we shouldn't even try? Weak sauce.

 

[Natebishop3]

Are you suggesting that if we can't be obviously equal to or better than Miami then we shouldn't even try? Weak sauce.

I would like to at least be able to say that I think we'd compete with them. At this point I don't think we'd even compete with Miami in a seven game series.

 

[Minstrel]

We're all assuming that Nate actually gives Nash the reigns and doesn't force him to run nateball.

I don't think McMillan has the cache to force Nash, an established star and probably Hall of Famer, to play a way he doesn't want to. There's no way McMillan could bench Nash, without losing his players and probably management, so he'd have no leverage.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Look: here's why we target Nash. SO WE DON'T HAVE TO WATCH OUR PGs DRIBBLE THE BALL OFF THEIR FEET. That's it. To ease the pain, to actually stand a chance of enjoying Blazer Basketball again.

BUT: it would indeed be incredibly stupid to give up Batum, just as he's kicking into gear. It would also be dangerous to give up Camby or Gerald, but if we're to take nasty Suns contracts off their hands, it would take that.
They're not going to want Wesley, whose contract is long and not very cheap, so give up on that idea.

I'd be happy to take on Childress, Warrick and/or Frye (be nice to have him back, even if he's not worth the money) off their hands, and even give them Oden just so that they can have their career-extending medical staff have a look at him, but you don't give up Batum. I would also give up Elliot Williams or Nolan Smith, because I have a hunch neither will amount to much (Nolan because he's too slow, Elliot because he's Gerald Green II [yeah, I know, Green just got signed by NJ after being MVP of the D-League all-star game - that's probably Elliot's ceiling]).

BUT BUT BUT: it's almost certainly not going to happen anyway.

 

[Minstrel]

He almost made it onto the allstar team (a lot of analysts predicted him as a wild card slot)last year with those inflated stats which makes his play last year borderline all starish with the knicks.

I remember many pundits last year talking about the possibility of Felton as an all-star.

Basically just semantics, along the lines of "We acquired an All Star in Jamaal Magloire."

The fact that he maybe almost made the All Star team based on New York hype is not terribly relevant. The point is that Felton has never been All Star-caliber, or all that close to it. The best he's ever been was a little above average. For his career, a tiny bit below average.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

I don't think McMillan has the cache to force Nash, an established star and probably Hall of Famer, to play a way he doesn't want to. There's no way McMillan could bench Nash, without losing his players and probably management, so he'd have no leverage.

Remember the short-lived Terry Porter coached Suns? Remember how Nash's game tanked until they canned Terry and got Alvin Gentry to be D'Antoni-lite? It could be ugly. Thing about Nash is he's just too nice to make that much of a fuss. BUT: if Nate sticks to the push-the-ball mantra he was preaching at the beginning of the season (before it became evident how unreliable Felton was) it...might....just...work!!!!

(Nice use of cashay there, by the way. Way to raise the tone.)

 

[Nikolokolus]

Nash is certainly playing at a high level still, but this idea that he's going to revolutionize the way the Blazers play in 30 games seems a little far fetched to me ... especially in a year when there is so little practice time and opportunities to work out the kinks. Maybe he's enough to push us into the second round, but if you add him and remove Batum are really going to be good enough to overcome the Lakers' size, OKC's athleticism and Dallas' defense?

Fuck it, I guess if you're going to push all of your chips in there are worse players you could do it on, but this just feels so much more like desperation vs. shrewd planning to me ... all for the chance to probably top out at as a second round team for one lockout shortened season and then ... well, it's gonna get ugly when the only guy in his prime is LaMarcus surrounded by the group of geriatrics we'll have left (and that's assuming Nash even re-ups here next season).

 

[Masbee]

I would like to at least be able to say that I think we'd compete with them. At this point I don't think we'd even compete with Miami in a seven game series.

That is a ridiculous bar.

That is your problem.

"If I can't be President, why bother going to college? Waste of time and waste of money."

 

[Masbee]

I don't think McMillan has the cache to force Nash, an established star and probably Hall of Famer, to play a way he doesn't want to. There's no way McMillan could bench Nash, without losing his players and probably management, so he'd have no leverage.

I agree. McMillan will say and do all the right things at the start. As he "regressed" to his set ways, Nash will ignore him and play Nash ball. It is the only way Nash knows how to play anyway - and he has the ball in his hands. No stopping it.

 

[Masbee]

How much Value does Batum really have to the suns? Im asking because they are rebuilding mode and want to get bad contracts off there books and pick up young talent on good contracts. Batum will be making almost 10m after his new contract this year, are the suns really ready to start shelling out big cash so quickly?
I also wonder how much they are going to value Felton. He has almost no trade value to a lot of teams but last year he showed in a run and gun system, much like the Suns have, he can be very effective. Felton might be the real piece they want if they think they can get him back into NYK shape. Same question about if they suns will want to pay him next season.
If i'm the suns I want exp contracts young talent and draft picks plus the ability to unload my bad contracts. Thats a lot to ask for nash, so I think they'd settle for 2 of the three. Idealy i'd like to see something like http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7sm7vdm with a pick thrown in but that won't top what the Suns get from orlando.

Nash was trying to address the "no defense wins a ring" stuff and giving it a go. When it became obvious it was a disaster, Nash complained to the coach. Porter said stick with it. Nash disagreed. Coach gone. I don't think at this stage Nash would even consider a repeat performance of that. If there were trade discussion, Nash would ask about this upfront. Of course, McMillan would say he want's to run and open it up, blah, blah, blah - as he has said before and as he actually put into practice to start this season. Once McMillan agreed, there wouldn't be anything he could do if Nash came here.

 

[Masbee]

Nash is certainly playing at a high level still, but this idea that he's going to revolutionize the way the Blazers play in 30 games seems a little far fetched to me ... especially in a year when there is so little practice time and opportunities to work out the kinks. Maybe he's enough to push us into the second round, but if you add him and remove Batum are really going to be good enough to overcome the Lakers' size, OKC's athleticism and Dallas' defense?

Fuck it, I guess if you're going to push all of your chips in there are worse players you could do it on, but this just feels so much more like desperation vs. shrewd planning to me ... all for the chance to probably top out at as a second round team for one lockout shortened season and then ... well, it's gonna get ugly when the only guy in his prime is LaMarcus surrounded by the group of geriatrics we'll have left (and that's assuming Nash even re-ups here next season).

I agree and thus would only do this deal if we don't give up LaMarcus (obviously), Batum or Camby (a surprise to some, but essential to any possible deep run).

The Suns can have: our cap space (via return of bad contracts); picks; Elliot Williams (young prospect on rookie deal); Felton (ending); Crawford (ending); Wes or Gerald (if they want either, they probably don't due to the money owed); Oden (if they want to take a flyer on that situation.

I don't think they put value on Wes or Gerald or Oden, so if we made a deal that works for us, Phoenix would get cap relief (something in the past they have put a very high value on as they have a good history of signing free agents); Elliot Williams and picks.

They can probably get better offers for Nash then that. Nash would have to insist, and as a pending free agent, he does have a lot of leverage. It is up to him.

Or, we can work 3-team deals, or multiple trades to try and get more value going to Phoenix. Need a hotshot GM for that kind of thing though.

 

[Minstrel]

I agree and thus would only do this deal if we don't give up LaMarcus (obviously), Batum or Camby (a surprise to some, but essential to any possible deep run).

The Suns can have: our cap space (via return of bad contracts); picks; Elliot Williams (young prospect on rookie deal); Felton (ending); Crawford (ending); Wes or Gerald (if they want either, they probably don't due to the money owed); Oden (if they want to take a flyer on that situation.

I don't think they put value on Wes or Gerald or Oden, so if we made a deal that works for us, Phoenix would get cap relief (something in the past they have put a very high value on as they have a good history of signing free agents); Elliot Williams and picks.

They can probably get better offers for Nash then that. Nash would have to insist, and as a pending free agent, he does have a lot of leverage. It is up to him.

This is basically my position too. Getting Nash unfortunately doesn't make a lot of sense if the team has to deal away pieces that would preclude a deep playoff run (Aldridge, Batum, Camby, maybe Wallace but he may not be quite as essential). The only way the deal can work is if the Suns really value dumping some bad contracts, draft picks and consider Williams to be intriguing. Oh, and the ubiquitous cash. They'd have to be giving up on the short-term.

I doubt Nash cares enough to demand to a trade to Portland, so this is all likely idle chatter. But idle chatter suffices when there's no basketball happening.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

How about this:



Phoenix loses $4M immediately and $18M more at the end of the year. Camby could probably be flipped to some contender, also. We hang on to Gerald and Batum, and we also clear out space to re-sign Patty. We could throw in $3M of PAM and maybe the rights to Claver. I'm not sure I would also include Freeland, but if that was the breaking point I'd be pretty tempted (in part because we would have fucked our cap room so badly we could never sign him...)