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hoopsjock said:
Awful compared to expectations, yes, but nowhere close to being awful enough for a bottom 5 record.
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Portland is 4 wins too many away from the #5 spot....which is quite a bit given the bottom 5 teams have between 4-6 wins. Take away that 3-game wining streak against the hapless Bulls and the going nowhere Thunder (which we just lost to) and Portland would be knocking on the door of that #5 Lottery spot.

1-9 against teams over .500 but the 9-6 record against teams that won't sniff the Playoffs is just keeping them from being quite that bad. Maybe they can turn that around a bit as they still have a favorable schedule till the end of the month. Outside of Denver, the Lakers on the 28th is the only other really good team they will face. Over the next 9 games still the end of 2019, only 3 have winning records and the Jazz barely so.

Are there more than 4-5 wins in that 9 game stretch? So far, this season would indicate that to be a big 'no'. So maybe 14-20 or 15-19 at the end of 2019? With the Warriors and Spurs out of their historically much higher win rate, the West is not at the level of requiring a high 40's win total to make the Playoffs. So some bad teams will be in the hunt for the cannon fodder Playoff spots much like the east has been for years.
 
TBpup said:
Portland is 4 wins too many away from the #5 spot....which is quite a bit given the bottom 5 teams have between 4-6 wins. Take away that 3-game wining streak against the hapless Bulls and the going nowhere Thunder (which we just lost to) and Portland would be knocking on the door of that #5 Lottery spot.

1-9 against teams over .500 but the 9-6 record against teams that won't sniff the Playoffs is just keeping them from being quite that bad. Maybe they can turn that around a bit as they still have a favorable schedule till the end of the month. Outside of Denver, the Lakers on the 28th is the only other really good team they will face. Over the next 9 games still the end of 2019, only 3 have winning records and the Jazz barely so.

Are there more than 4-5 wins in that 9 game stretch? So far, this season would indicate that to be a big 'no'. So maybe 14-20 or 15-19 at the end of 2019? With the Warriors and Spurs out of their historically much higher win rate, the West is not at the level of requiring a high 40's win total to make the Playoffs. So some bad teams will be in the hunt for the cannon fodder Playoff spots much like the east has been for years.
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The question is - can we make some trades to make the season worth it?
 
Despite the belief that some of you have, there is no way this team is going to tank as long as Dame has a pulse and there’s still a chance to make the playoffs. Only a couple of games out at this point? Forget about it.
 
tlongII said:
It is TIME! We are one of the worst teams in the league now. We might as well go for the gusto and get a top 3 pick. It will make Summer League much more interesting!
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Losers tank.

Competitors never tank.

Which do you think any NBA player worth his salt fits into?

Poll our players on that subject and then tell them how you feel. After that you'd better look for a fast avenue of escape.
 
CupWizier said:
Tanking is a losers mentality. Fortunately the team doesn't have that mentality that some posters have.
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Serious amateur or professional athletes would never consider tanking as it goes against everything that competition stands for. If a player or a team gets caught shaving points or throwing a game because they don't give a damn about the integrity of the game, it's a career ending offense, if caught. If an organization asked players not to concern themselves about making playoffs or winning games as a strategic tactic, that too, violates the integrity of players. If a player like Dame thought this organization was manipulating tanking he'd be asking for a trade in quick fashion.
Dame would look at anyone who advocates tanking, including fan's, as totally contrary to what he's made of and beliefs and he would let you know too.
He's been looked at as loyalty in the highest because the team and fans have backed him from day one and attempting to tank would ruin that relationship.
 
Hoopguru said:
Serious amateur or professional athletes would never consider tanking as it goes against everything that competition stands for.
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Kawhi tanked 22 games last year. The mentality that says "I'll not compete in several earlier games so that I can be more effective in later ones" is the same mentality that says, "We should not compete this season so that we can be more effective in future seasons".
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Kawhi tanked 22 games last year. The mentality that says "I'll not compete in several earlier games so that I can be more effective in later ones" is the same mentality that says, "We should not compete this season so that we can be more effective in future seasons".
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Sorry, but that's a pretty flawed interpretation.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
You are, of course, welcome to think that. I'd expect nothing less.
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Interesting response. I on the other hand expected more from you. :bgrin:

What was Toronto's record when Kawhi (tanked) sat out?
 
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Hoopguru said:
Serious amateur or professional athletes would never consider tanking as it goes against everything that competition stands for. If a player or a team gets caught shaving points or throwing a game because they don't give a damn about the integrity of the game, it's a career ending offense, if caught. If an organization asked players not to concern themselves about making playoffs or winning games as a strategic tactic, that too, violates the integrity of players. If a player like Dame thought this organization was manipulating tanking he'd be asking for a trade in quick fashion.
Dame would look at anyone who advocates tanking, including fan's, as totally contrary to what he's made of and beliefs and he would let you know too.
He's been looked at as loyalty in the highest because the team and fans have backed him from day one and attempting to tank would ruin that relationship.
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It doesn't matter what the athletes think. We're missing 60% of our starting lineup. You must do what is right for the organization. In this case it's tanking.
 
tlongII said:
It doesn't matter what the athletes think. We're missing 60% of our starting lineup. You must do what is right for the organization. In this case it's tanking.
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It most certainly does matter. They are the ones on the floor playing. Tanking is also against the rules.
 
e_blazer said:
Despite the belief that some of you have, there is no way this team is going to tank as long as Dame has a pulse and there’s still a chance to make the playoffs. Only a couple of games out at this point? Forget about it.
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I don't know of anyone who thinks they will Tank with Dame here. It's more a discussion of what could be better for the franchise in the long run....which could be as soon as next year.


PtldPlatypus said:
Kawhi tanked 22 games last year. The mentality that says "I'll not compete in several earlier games so that I can be more effective in later ones" is the same mentality that says, "We should not compete this season so that we can be more effective in future seasons".
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THIS
 
TBpup said:
Take away that 3-game wining streak against the hapless Bulls and the going nowhere Thunder (which we just lost to) and Portland would be knocking on the door of that #5 Lottery spot.
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I'm totally in favor of tanking in the right situations so I'm not arguing that the team shouldn't ever tank but the post of yours that I quote above is exactly why anyone who thinks a team can just tank on purpose is wrong in this case. The Blazers are too good to lose all the games necessary to fully tank. You can't just go out there and lose to bad teams like the Bulls and Knicks. I totally understand that they're gonna finish either just in or out of the playoffs and you're absolutely right that this particular season that is probably not the ideal landing spot for future success but that doesn't make them easily able to just start losing games like last night that they can't lose, even on purpose.

You can argue that they could make moves to make the team lose more. Maybe they shouldn't have signed Melo. It's too late to change that now though so it's weird to keep bringing up the tanking like the team will actually do it this early in the season.

You keep telling me why they should tank and I get it but you still fail to present a realistic way of how to tank in this current situation. Asking Dame to sit out or not try as hard isn't an option and you know it. So unless there is an injury please explain how they would make this happen. You could trade Whiteside for a bad contract and a pick or young asset. Then promote Hoard and Brown from the G-League which would basically leave Skal and Brown as our only centers. Have Little (or Hoard) start at the 3 and give all the young guys at least 20 minutes a game. Even doing all that I think they are good enough to finish in the back half of the lottery so it wouldn't really work to the point where they'd be in the bottom 5. What specifically would you do?
 
Great, so we're stuck, as usual, in mediocrity hell. Awesome.

40 wins and a first-round exit and a shitty draft pick, here we come! :doh:
 
Jade Falcon said:
Great, so we're stuck, as usual, in mediocrity hell. Awesome.

40 wins and a first-round exit and a shitty draft pick, here we come! :doh:
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I mean to suggest they are stuck in mediocrity hell is a complete dismissal of what actually happened on the court last year or what could happen once the roster is healthy again, but whatever.
 
hoopsjock said:
I mean to suggest they are stuck in mediocrity hell is a complete dismissal of what actually happened on the court last year or what could happen once the roster is healthy again, but whatever.
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....and swept by GS. For the second time. And what of the 6 years prior to that, or are we just going to pretend like they never happened?

How about we build a team that can....gee, I dunno....beat GS. But perhaps you're happy with drafting 6'1" PGs who play no defense and PFs who are foul magnets.
 
Jade Falcon said:
....and swept by GS. For the second time. And what of the 6 years prior to that, or are we just going to pretend like they never happened?

How about we build a team that can....gee, I dunno....beat GS. But perhaps you're happy with drafting 6'1" PGs who play no defense and PFs who are foul magnets.
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You've admitted to not watching many games lately so it seems pointless to get involved with a factual argument at this time but posts like this offer no solution as to actually changing the course of the franchise.
 
Jade Falcon said:
....and swept by GS. For the second time. And what of the 6 years prior to that, or are we just going to pretend like they never happened?

How about we build a team that can....gee, I dunno....beat GS. But perhaps you're happy with drafting 6'1" PGs who play no defense and PFs who are foul magnets.
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Jade, you mention 6 years. Has the roster been the same for 6 years? Who's to say with a healthy Nurk we wouldn't have beat them? You don't know, I don't know, no one knows. It certainly looked possible though based on how he/we were playing before he went down.

There are factors as to why each year went the way it did and most of those factors are NOT the same, so repeating the same thing as if it was duplicated year after year is not valid.


Now if you were discussing coaching techniques, you would have a valid argument. In 6 years this team has gone through 2 roster overhauls. To say nothing is being done is again... invalid.

You brought up drafting PG's instead of PF's. That has NOTHING to do with tanking, so i'm not sure where your statement is going with that.



This Tanking thread cracks me up. Its like Trump.

"Lets make America great again"

OKay..... HOW?

*Crickets*
 
Jade, you mention 6 years. Has the roster been the same for 6 years?
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No it hasn't. But it's also difficult to compete for a title when you have one superstar and a bunch of role players, with the exception of a healthy Nurk. Whose fault is that?

Who's to say with a healthy Nurk we wouldn't have beat them? You don't know, I don't know, no one knows. It certainly looked possible though based on how he/we were playing before he went down.
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Unfortunately, there is also a good argument to be made that we wouldn't have beaten Denver had Nurk been playing, so it's all irrelevant.

There are factors as to why each year went the way it did and most of those factors are NOT the same, so repeating the same thing as if it was duplicated year after year is not valid.
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Oh I disagree, and how many times do we all fall over ourselves on this forum with speculation about who we could pick up in FA or trade deals....all of it reasonable.....and yet they either never happen, or we get the bottom of the barrel?

Now if you were discussing coaching techniques, you would have a valid argument.
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Been doing that for the past 3 years at least.

You brought up drafting PG's instead of PF's.
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NOPE, that's not what I said. I said that we shouldn't be happy drafting undersized PGs, and PFs who are foul magnets.

This Tanking thread cracks me up. Its like Trump.

"Lets make America great again"

OKay..... HOW?

*Crickets*
Click to expand...

Please don't vent your insecurities about Trump in the main forum. That kind of nonsense is for the OT. There are numerous things to be done to MAGA, but this isn't the thread for it.

hoopsjock said:
You've admitted to not watching many games lately so it seems pointless to get involved with a factual argument at this time but posts like this offer no solution as to actually changing the course of the franchise.
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And yet, you've offered nothing other than "business as usual".

You're right, I haven't watched many games this year, so I freely admit that there may be things on the court that I'm not seeing. However, here are the FACTS of NOT tanking:

-Getting a shitty draft pick
-Another first round exit....IF we even make it to the playoffs
-A very real possibility of one of our few star players getting hurt
-No change in the coaching staff or the front office........both of which suck and need changing if we are going to compete for a championship against a healthy contender without getting SWEPT.

So.....what are your solutions to overcoming this? "Wait until next year when we're healthy"?

Okay, I'm fine with that....and you don't think we should tank for the very good reason of getting a good draft pick in the mean time?
 
Jade Falcon said:
So.....what are your solutions to overcoming this? "Wait until next year when we're healthy"?

Okay, I'm fine with that....and you don't think we should tank for the very good reason of getting a good draft pick in the mean time?
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Here's my solution. Put out your best effort and let the chips fall where they fall. If eliminated from playoff contention (and not before) then some adjustments can be made to playing time and rotations, Advocating tanking (cheating) is a losers mentality. I have had this same philosophy forever.
 
Jade Falcon said:
....and swept by GS. For the second time. And what of the 6 years prior to that, or are we just going to pretend like they never happened?

How about we build a team that can....gee, I dunno....beat GS. But perhaps you're happy with drafting 6'1" PGs who play no defense and PFs who are foul magnets.
Click to expand...

You could also look at it this way, Golden State had to come back in three of those games playing balls to the walls (and using all of Curry's cheat codes) to win, this lead to them not having enough in the tank to win the title. I look at this season as a non try hard season so we can save some of Dame's tank for next season. I am not saying this is some fact or anything I just know they are all human and humans only have so much in them until it just fades away.

Look at the standings right now and 2 teams in the west with loosing records are 7th & 8th, not sure I can remember ever seeing something like that in the west in a very long time. So I think Dame/CJ wouldn't have to try hard to get us back to the playoffs anyway. The league is incredibly top heavy right now so those teams are getting most of the wins which means we might see 2 or 3 teams with losing records make it in the playoffs in both conferences. I mean 44/45 wins might get you home court in the west. I think trying to out tank the tankers this year is fruitless (just like that episode in South Park about summer little league, they screwed themselves by not training hard enough to suck and get away with it).

giphy.gif
 
Jade Falcon said:
No it hasn't. But it's also difficult to compete for a title when you have one superstar and a bunch of role players, with the exception of a healthy Nurk. Whose fault is that?



Unfortunately, there is also a good argument to be made that we wouldn't have beaten Denver had Nurk been playing, so it's all irrelevant.



Oh I disagree, and how many times do we all fall over ourselves on this forum with speculation about who we could pick up in FA or trade deals....all of it reasonable.....and yet they either never happen, or we get the bottom of the barrel?



Been doing that for the past 3 years at least.



NOPE, that's not what I said. I said that we shouldn't be happy drafting undersized PGs, and PFs who are foul magnets.



Please don't vent your insecurities about Trump in the main forum. That kind of nonsense is for the OT. There are numerous things to be done to MAGA, but this isn't the thread for it.



And yet, you've offered nothing other than "business as usual".

You're right, I haven't watched many games this year, so I freely admit that there may be things on the court that I'm not seeing. However, here are the FACTS of NOT tanking:

-Getting a shitty draft pick
-Another first round exit....IF we even make it to the playoffs
-A very real possibility of one of our few star players getting hurt
-No change in the coaching staff or the front office........both of which suck and need changing if we are going to compete for a championship against a healthy contender without getting SWEPT.

So.....what are your solutions to overcoming this? "Wait until next year when we're healthy"?

Okay, I'm fine with that....and you don't think we should tank for the very good reason of getting a good draft pick in the mean time?
Click to expand...

Sigh....

This is the tanking thread. Not the draft pick thread or the coaching thread. I addressed your post based on the thread we are in. You brought invalid, irrelevant points to your post I quoted ...
 
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