Teams "inquiring" about JJ Hickson

[BBert]

I'd rather trade him for expirings, youth and picks. Then bid on him this summer if we decide to, like everyone else, same as we did last summer.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

youth and picks will be relatively useless. we have too many young guys as it is we can't get ride of.

My preference is to keep JJ, but as a backup PF...pay the guy. I don't think we'll be real players in the FA market anyway and anyone we get we're going to overpay for anyway.

 

[magnifier661]

Now if we had to give up Matthews; then I would like a trade liek this.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bkp2oq7

PDX sends: Matthews, Hickson, E will, Jeffries, Freeland and Nolan Smith
PDX Receives: Nené and Devin Harris.

Washington sends: Nené
Washingston receives: Zaza, Freeland, Jeffries, and E Will

Atlanta Sends: Harris and Zaza
Atlanta receives: Matthews, JJ and Nolan Smith.

Why would Washington do this?
Well they shed 10 mil off their books immediately and get around max money to toss on the free-agent market. Jeffries, ZaZa and E Will are all expiring, or if they want to keep them, they should be had for really cheap. Freeland is just another big that's tossed in the mix.

Why would PDX do this?
They get the 7 footer that would totally compliment Aldridge perfectly; while buying us enough time (2-3 years) for Leonard to develop. They can see how Harris does as the back-up PG/SG combo off the bench. Batum moves to SG; while we move Claver to SF. Babbitt be back-up PF, Leonard will back-up Center, Harris will back-up the guards, Price will ride the pine.

Atlanta do this?
Hickson should compliment Horford perfectly. Harris hasn't been a decent back-up for them; so losing him isn't as big of a deal as it would have been a few years ago. Matthews is the perfect compliment for that team. He has the perimeter game that they solely missed. AND if it doesn't work; they have max money to toss at someone during the summer.

Portland rotation:
PG: Lillard/Harris/Rice
SG: Batum/Barton/Pavlovic
SF: Claver/Pavlovic/Babbitt
PF: Aldridge/Babbitt/Leonard
Center: Nené/Leonard

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

No way ATL trades out expiring contracts as they're going to make a big FA run this summer.

 

[magnifier661]

No way ATL trades out expiring contracts as they're going to make a big FA run this summer.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/atlanta.htm

They will only have 18.4 mil on the books if they don't make this deal. With the deal; they will have a guaranteed 24 mil. If the cap is 60 mil this summer; that still leaves them 36 mil of cap space to toss 2 max contracts at players. How much cap do they need? They can even keep JJ's cap hold too.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

JJ Reddick or Spencer Hawes I can be down with here.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/atlanta.htm

They will only have 18.4 mil on the books if they don't make this deal. With the deal; they will have a guaranteed 24 mil. If the cap is 60 mil this summer; that still leaves them 36 mil of cap space to toss 2 max contracts at players. How much cap do they need? They can even keep JJ's cap hold too.

They're going to make a run at D12. If you're going to clear cap space, do it all the way through. half-assin' it is going to get you fucked over.

 

[magnifier661]

They're going to make a run at D12. If you're going to clear cap space, do it all the way through. half-assin' it is going to get you fucked over.

Having 36 mil is hardly half-assing it. Also, you need a team for D12 to want to come to. If he had Hickson, Horford, Matthews, Teague and possibly Smith (If Smith decides to stay since D12 comes). That's a sexy team to jump to.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Having 36 mil is hardly half-assing it. Also, you need a team for D12 to want to come to. If he had Hickson, Horford, Matthews, Teague and possibly Smith (If Smith decides to stay since D12 comes). That's a sexy team to jump to.

Sorry, you don't build a team with the role players first then try to get big names to come. Get as many stars as you can and figure the rest out later.

 

[Denny Crane]

I think you'd want a reverse consolidation deal. Something like Hickson for a backup PG/SG and a starting C.

You don't want to go from 5 very good starters and pray for something off the bench to 4 very good starters and a decent guy off the bench.

Unless you're getting a guy better than Lillard or LMA.

 

[glazeduck]

This might be asking a bit much, but if OKC is looking for a deal that could put them over the top, would JJ for Perry Jones, Maynor and Toronto's guaranteed lotto pick work?

Covers a lot of ground for us, Maynor is no longer getting minutes with them but is still young and has a history of being clutch. Could be a great longterm backup for Dame. Jones, at his salary is nothing but upside and with his size and skill, could develop into a matchup problem at multiple positions, then you throw in Toronto's lotto pick and the increased likelihood of us keeping ours, seems like a winner for us... sends JJ to a team with a chance to win it all where he could actively contribute, seems like it could be a winner for him. OKC gets a tough, hustling big and really doesn't give up any core pieces, could be a winner for them as well...

I don't know the specific details with JJ's contract but at the very least, it appears that the $ works out...

 

[KeepOnRollin]

This might be asking a bit much, but if OKC is looking for a deal that could put them over the top, would JJ for Perry Jones, Maynor and Toronto's guaranteed lotto pick work?

Covers a lot of ground for us, Maynor is no longer getting minutes with them but is still young and has a history of being clutch. Could be a great longterm backup for Dame. Jones, at his salary is nothing but upside and with his size and skill, could develop into a matchup problem at multiple positions, then you throw in Toronto's lotto pick and the increased likelihood of us keeping ours, seems like a winner for us... sends JJ to a team with a chance to win it all where he could actively contribute, seems like it could be a winner for him. OKC gets a tough, hustling big and really doesn't give up any core pieces, could be a winner for them as well...

I don't know the specific details with JJ's contract but at the very least, it appears that the $ works out...

No way would you get the pick. I might do that deal even without the pick and this is the first deal I have liked for JJ.

With that said they might just say no thanks even without asking for the pick.

 

[glazeduck]

No way would you get the pick. I might do that deal even without the pick and this is the first deal I have liked for JJ.

With that said they might just say no thanks even without asking for the pick.

Yeah I agree that asking for the pick is a bit much, but I feel like those types of assets should be the target of a JJ trade... Perry Jones and Maynor are better than getting nothing for him, but they're far from a sweet deal in my mind...

Perhaps since OKC is so loaded with top-line talent and needing to continue having strong role players our 3 2nd round picks and Greek dudes could balance that out?

 

[The_Lillard_King]

Not clear on rules about trade and salary. But it seems Hickson might have more value at the end of the season in a sign and trade move, given that we have his bird rights. Also, if Hickson allows a trade now, his bird rights are gone (?) and that could stop a team over the cap to go out and get Hickson.

So I don't think Hickson wants a trade and doubt the Blazers will get anything of interest out there.

I could see Hickson being useful in OKC. But can OKC even offer anything above the MLE after the season. They basically would be trading just for this year . . . but if any team would do it, it would be a team like that is going to make a championship run this year.

 

[BoBoBREWSKI]

 

[Mediocre Man]

Not clear on rules about trade and salary. But it seems Hickson might have more value at the end of the season in a sign and trade move, given that we have his bird rights. Also, if Hickson allows a trade now, his bird rights are gone (?) and that could stop a team over the cap to go out and get Hickson.

So I don't think Hickson wants a trade and doubt the Blazers will get anything of interest out there.

I could see Hickson being useful in OKC. But can OKC even offer anything above the MLE after the season. They basically would be trading just for this year . . . but if any team would do it, it would be a team like that is going to make a championship run this year.

I believe he can be S&T at the end of the season. That doesn't benefit a team trying to win it all this season though

 

[Mediocre Man]

The look on Gee's face was priceless when he was getting up

 

[Nikolokolus]

Not clear on rules about trade and salary. But it seems Hickson might have more value at the end of the season in a sign and trade move, given that we have his bird rights. Also, if Hickson allows a trade now, his bird rights are gone (?) and that could stop a team over the cap to go out and get Hickson.

So I don't think Hickson wants a trade and doubt the Blazers will get anything of interest out there.

I could see Hickson being useful in OKC. But can OKC even offer anything above the MLE after the season. They basically would be trading just for this year . . . but if any team would do it, it would be a team like that is going to make a championship run this year.

It always seems like in a sign and trade the team trading the player usually has some kind of leverage in the deal, that usually means the player is restricted in some way or the original team has Bird rights. We have Bird rights, but I don't think it's going to matter since JJ isn't in line for a 5 year big money deal.

I don't see much reason for an acquiring team to deal with us at all.

 

[Denny Crane]

It always seems like in a sign and trade the team trading the player usually has some kind of leverage in the deal, that usually means the player is restricted in some way or the original team has Bird rights. We have Bird rights, but I don't think it's going to matter since JJ isn't in line for a 5 year big money deal.

I don't see much reason for an acquiring team to deal with us at all.

It may matter if the team he wants to play for could only offer him an MLE sized deal as a FA. S&T should get him a bigger contract. You'd think the other team would want assurance he'd sign in the first place.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

It always seems like in a sign and trade the team trading the player usually has some kind of leverage in the deal, that usually means the player is restricted in some way or the original team has Bird rights. We have Bird rights, but I don't think it's going to matter since JJ isn't in line for a 5 year big money deal.

I don't see much reason for an acquiring team to deal with us at all.

Edit: I was thinking of the same senario as Denny.


Also if some big multi-player deal goes down with the Blazers, JJ's flexibility in his contract situation could come into play

 

[RR7]

Edit: I was thinking of the same senario as Denny.


Also if some big multi-player deal goes down with the Blazers, JJ's flexibility in his contract situation could come into play

Could, but then you're trying to look at teams who would give him more than the MLE, AND have a deal big enough that we'd actually want.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

Could, but then you're trying to look at teams who would give him more than the MLE, AND have a deal big enough that we'd actually want.

The big multi player deal would be complicated and rarely happens. But maybe some team is willing to pay Hickson 8 million/yr and trades us a package of servicable players or expiring contracts and draft pick(s). I acutually like the idea of OKC. They are wasting some talent on the bench, they don't need draft picks sitting on the bench or barely making the team at the stage they are at. Hickson could have a role there.

Something like that . ..

 

[BBert]

youth and picks will be relatively useless. we have too many young guys as it is we can't get ride of.

My preference is to keep JJ, but as a backup PF...pay the guy. I don't think we'll be real players in the FA market anyway and anyone we get we're going to overpay for anyway.

At this point that perspective is certainly valid.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Good points about a team that can't offer more than the MLE, but OKC seems an unlikely trade partner. Does Hickson strike anybody as a Presti kind of guy? I don't know ...

 

[RR7]

Does anyone know of instances where a player rejected a deal with veto rights like this? I know Hickson likely wants to keep his bird rights. But at the same time, are he and his agent really expecting that they'll stay here, get to the offseason, and then come to Portland and say oh, Boston wants to offer us 8 a year, can you take back a chunk of their crap contracts so I can get that please? It's basically asking us to bend to the will of his offseason, and it seems really unlikely to me.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Hickson has a pretty good reason to veto a trade. In his current situation he's getting a ton of minutes, despite his deficiencies on defense, so if he were to be traded to a team with an entrenched starting front-court, his minutes (and raw stats) will take a hit and that can hurt his ability to get a bigger deal in free agency.

 

[RR7]

Hickson has a pretty good reason to veto a trade. In his current situation he's getting a ton of minutes, despite his deficiencies on defense, so if he were to be traded to a team with an entrenched starting front-court, his minutes (and raw stats) will take a hit and that can hurt his ability to get a bigger deal in free agency.

While I know it's easy to laugh, mock, criticize, judge harshly, etc. GMs around the league for stupid moves, they can see what he is doing, what he can do. Him dipping to 20 minuts a night on a contender, with a subsequent similar dip in raw stats isn't going to somehow harm his value. Unless you think GMs pull up nba.com, go to the stats page and say well, we need rebounding, this guys at the top and a free agent, let's get him.
If anything, it'll show he can play the same way and style on a winning team, versus putting up double doubles on a lottery team.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

Does anyone know of instances where a player rejected a deal with veto rights like this? I know Hickson likely wants to keep his bird rights. But at the same time, are he and his agent really expecting that they'll stay here, get to the offseason, and then come to Portland and say oh, Boston wants to offer us 8 a year, can you take back a chunk of their crap contracts so I can get that please? It's basically asking us to bend to the will of his offseason, and it seems really unlikely to me.

I think Ptd is in the power position there.

Yes Boston we can help you circumvent the salary cap by getting a FA you normally would not be able to get. But we want a productive player and/or picks and/or an expiring contract.

And then maybe a team wants to shuffle pieces . . . Hibbert isn't putting up big numbers. Indy probably happy with him given their record, but what if they have buyer's remore or trying to cut salary. Hickson and expiring contracts for Hibbert. Again Indy probably happy with Hibbert but are there teams looking to get rid of a hig salary but good player, Hickson could come into play.

 

[Nikolokolus]

While I know it's easy to laugh, mock, criticize, judge harshly, etc. GMs around the league for stupid moves, they can see what he is doing, what he can do. Him dipping to 20 minuts a night on a contender, with a subsequent similar dip in raw stats isn't going to somehow harm his value. Unless you think GMs pull up nba.com, go to the stats page and say well, we need rebounding, this guys at the top and a free agent, let's get him.
If anything, it'll show he can play the same way and style on a winning team, versus putting up double doubles on a lottery team.

I'm talking about Hickson's motivation to veto a trade, not whether or not a GM wants him.

 

[RR7]

I'm talking about Hickson's motivation to veto a trade, not whether or not a GM wants him.

yes, but his agent isn't an idiot either, and knows that him going to a contender and having his minutes cut isn't going to significantly impact what he gets in the offseason.