The future's not what it was

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What we have is HOPE.
We’re going to need grit.
Sharpe, Ayton, Scoot … and a high lottery pick. And probably another one in 2025.

The biggest decision, IMHO, the Blazers have with player-personnel is whether Grant will be what he is now in 3-4 years AND whether he will be the right veteran when the young team hits. He’s in good health. His game can age well.
BUT …
What if the young guys don’t hit — Sharpe, Ayton, Scoot — by then? Then keeping Grant will hurt getting lottery picks and the road to eventually contending. The team and its fans have to “eat the pain” to get better.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I don't understand how you can feel this way.

We have a ton of young prospects that have shown promise. Shaedon, Scoot, Rupert, Murray, Camara, Jabari Walker, Banton, etc.

We have brought in some promising picks from the Bucks and Warriors. Considering what our cupboards looked like a couple years ago, I think Joe has done a damn fine job of restocking them in just a short period of time.
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the young guys are two possible all-stars...if things break right, and some role players. I find myself worried about Sharpe and whether he has an alpha genes; and Scoot has major holes in his game

in other words, I don't see any near certain all-stars among the youth. Just a couple of maybe's

as for the picks, that Warriors pick could be 13-20; in a weak draft. The other picks he restocked are in 2028 and 2029. That's a damn long ways from 2023 when Dame was traded. And we don't know how promising the picks will be from Milwaukee and Boston
 
I imagine OKC forums were probably pretty pessimistic a couple of years ago too. Your FRP out for the season? I am sure plenty OKC fans shit their pants. The UTA-MIN trade? Everyone was down on that. Turned out pretty well for Minny. Does POR need some luck? Yes mos def. But nobody knows the future.
 
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The good news to me is we have to keep sitting people to keep from winning. There has not been an injury we haven't milked.

I am actually more positive about the future of this team than most. Scoot will be a perennial All-Star, Shae will be borderline, Ayton has shown he can be a big contributor on a playoff team. We also have found some nice bench pieces for a future run. We have a ton of draft picks and some tradable assets. We still need a few significant pieces, but we're well on our way.

We're trying to lose. Don't get discouraged. This year and the next few are about sorting out our roster.
 
wizenheimer said:
the young guys are two possible all-stars...if things break right, and some role players. I find myself worried about Sharpe and whether he has an alpha genes; and Scoot has major holes in his game

in other words, I don't see any near certain all-stars among the youth. Just a couple of maybe's

as for the picks, that Warriors pick could be 13-20; in a weak draft. The other picks he restocked are in 2028 and 2029. That's a damn long ways from 2023 when Dame was traded. And we don't know how promising the picks will be from Milwaukee and Boston
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So to be clear... the cupboard is bare unless everyone is an allstar? Or has all-star potential?

To me, the cupboard reflects assets. We have more assets right now than we did two years ago.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I don't understand how you can feel this way.

We have a ton of young prospects that have shown promise. Shaedon, Scoot, Rupert, Murray, Camara, Jabari Walker, Banton, etc.

We have brought in some promising picks from the Bucks and Warriors. Considering what our cupboards looked like a couple years ago, I think Joe has done a damn fine job of restocking them in just a short period of time.
Click to expand...

I think people forget, maybe purposely, just how bad Neil was at stocking the team with talent for the future.

And I think people also forget that these aren't just young players, they're *REALLY YOUNG* players.

Dame was a 4 year college kid, same with CJ. People remember LaMarcus when he was a couple years into his play and forget that he wasn't exactly lighting up the league as a rookie.

They also forget that the team, outside of 2 seasons, under performed in the playoffs. The only player that the team "grew" organically in the last 20 years? Anfernee Simons. Now they're trying to do that to basically 5 or so players (Scoot, Rupert, Jabari, Toumani, Ibou just of the top of my head).

Things definitely suck now, but it's not like they're a roster full of seasoned vets who suck ass. They're relying on (either due to injuries or *wink wink* injuries) a team made up of 8 players who are either in their 1st, 2nd or 3rd years. And it's no coincidence that the guy who is in his 3rd year (Banton) is playing the best of the bunch (with Tou playing good too...tho age hasn't helped Murray that much).

Scoot and Rupert really needed a year of development before this season started. Shaedon needed this year to really develop too.

But every new post or thread on here regarding how the season has gone, or how Chauncey should be canned or Jody is a Satan worshiping bone collector and should sell the team, just further cements how correct Danny Marang is, in that we're a fan base who has no fucking clue how to handle this.
 
maxiep said:
The good news to me is we have to keep sitting people to keep from winning. There has not been an injury we haven't milked.

I am actually more positive about the future of this team than most. Scoot will be a perennial All-Star, Shae will be borderline, Ayton has shown he can be a big contributor on a playoff team. We also have found some nice bench pieces for a future run. We have a ton of draft picks and some tradable assets. We still need a few significant pieces, but we're well on our way.

We're trying to lose. Don't get discouraged. This year and the next few are about sorting out our roster.
Click to expand...

I would swap those two, tbh. Shaedon already is a significantly better shooter, better defender, and honestly has a much higher ceiling.
 
Natebishop3 said:
So to be clear... the cupboard is bare unless everyone is an allstar? Or has all-star potential?

To me, the cupboard reflects assets. We have more assets right now than we did two years ago.
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the quantity/quality equation doesn't necessarily = 'more'

when Cronin took over he had Dame, CJ, Nurkic, Powell, Simons, RoCo, Nance, Eubanks, Winslow, Watford

he blew that team up and traded a bunch of vets. When a GM blows a team up and trades a bunch of vets while making a shitty team that leverages their own lottery pick, he's going to collect a lot of assets. He shouldn't get much credit for collecting a baseline bucket of assets that just about any GM would collect in the same circumstances. And often, those GM's don't have a top 10-15 player to throw into the pot like Cronin did

you'll need to forgive my pessimism as I just saw Cronin's cupboard make NBA history with their 2nd 60 point loss in a season while the prize rookie Cronin drafted to replace the franchise player set an NBA record with a -58 plus/minus
 
wizenheimer said:
the quantity/quality equation doesn't necessarily = 'more'

when Cronin took over he had Dame, CJ, Nurkic, Powell, Simons, RoCo, Nance, Eubanks, Winslow, Watford
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Wait....only Dame, CJ and Simons were important. Powell was a desperation move by Olshey. The rest don't matter

Especially since winslow, Watford and Eubanks werent players he had when he was hired as the GM.

Nance wasn't and isn't anything special. Roco now sucks.
 
e_blazer said:
Yeah, I've read similar information elsewhere. I don't remember exactly where, but it makes total sense. Obviously, we don't know what she gets out of the sale as an heir, but assuming it's not much, then stringing this out for years is a smart play on her part. Just sucks for Blazers fans.
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She gets nothing out of the sale. All of her incentive is to hold on to the team as long as possible.

*Edit* This has been reported (by Canzano, I believe), though it is not listed in Paul Allen's actual will.

Read Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen’s last will and testament
 
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julius said:
I think people forget, maybe purposely, just how bad Neil was at stocking the team with talent for the future.

And I think people also forget that these aren't just young players, they're *REALLY YOUNG* players.

Dame was a 4 year college kid, same with CJ. People remember LaMarcus when he was a couple years into his play and forget that he wasn't exactly lighting up the league as a rookie.

They also forget that the team, outside of 2 seasons, under performed in the playoffs. The only player that the team "grew" organically in the last 20 years? Anfernee Simons. Now they're trying to do that to basically 5 or so players (Scoot, Rupert, Jabari, Toumani, Ibou just of the top of my head).

Things definitely suck now, but it's not like they're a roster full of seasoned vets who suck ass. They're relying on (either due to injuries or *wink wink* injuries) a team made up of 8 players who are either in their 1st, 2nd or 3rd years. And it's no coincidence that the guy who is in his 3rd year (Banton) is playing the best of the bunch (with Tou playing good too...tho age hasn't helped Murray that much).

Scoot and Rupert really needed a year of development before this season started. Shaedon needed this year to really develop too.

But every new post or thread on here regarding how the season has gone, or how Chauncey should be canned or Jody is a Satan worshiping bone collector and should sell the team, just further cements how correct Danny Marang is, in that we're a fan base who has no fucking clue how to handle this.
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That's why we should have done more to build around Dame.

Losing sucks.
 
Let's look at the really young teams in the league:

Houston - on an 11-game win streak (coached by an ex-Blazer)
Orlando - last I looked they had homecourt for the playoffs
OKC - could finish #1 in the West
Blazers - let's just say we're a little behind. But hey, it's because we're so young!
 
POR should consider every player "available" at this point. Every player should be on the trading portfolio. There is nobody to build around. There is no core. DA has the most talent displayed this season from anyone on the younger side of things. But deal him if the offer is right too.

You could assemble any other 5 rookies and do no worse than this. Ant Mal and Grant and Timelord simply have to be dealt in the offseason. They have value and Cronin has to get what he can for them. If I see any of those three in Moda next year they better not be fucking Blazers. I will never pay to see this team unless there are big big changes.

To me the idea of being a contender is simply not attainable, unless ownership is extremely motivated. Jody ain't. She is not a fan. She is just the sister of a genius.

Just try to build a team that can go 500 and make the playoffs once in a while. That is all POR can realistcally do at present. The new hot young teams are already set and POR cannot match those.

This organization is a laughing stock. The worst in the league neck and neck with WAS.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Let's look at the really young teams in the league:

Houston - on an 11-game win streak (coached by an ex-Blazer)
Orlando - last I looked they had homecourt for the playoffs
OKC - could finish #1 in the West
Blazers - let's just say we're a little behind. But hey, it's because we're so young!
Click to expand...

This discussion has been done before. The other teams are young, but have *EXPERIENCE*.

But yes, let's look at those players.

Houston:
Green, 3rd season.
Sengun, 3rd season 7 foot tall.
Smith, 2nd season (and his rookie year, as an almost 7 footer, he shot 40% from the floor)
Their vets (Brooks and FVV) haven't missed many games.

OKC:

Has an MVP candidate on their roster.
Giddy, when he's not busy screwing underage girls, is in his 3rd year (and his rookie year didn't exactly set the world ablaze)
Williams had 3 years of college ball and is almost 23.
Dort is in like his 5th year and still can't shoot.
Chet is a unicorn lite.

Orlando:

They have 2 players (Paolo and Wagner) who are in their rotation and in their 2nd and 3rd years. Wagner has 5 years of organized ball under his belt too (2 in college and this is his 3rd NBA season)
Suggs is in his 3rd year (and still can't shoot).


Maybe, oooh, I don't know, we don't compare teams that have had players who have played more games, vs the players on the Blazers currently?

And yeah, I know, Grant, Ayton, Malcolm and Simons have all had experience, but it's not like this team has had a full season together, let alone now (overly) relying on players who have a combined 590 games to their names (Scoot, Sharpe, Banton, Jabari and Duop).

For comparisons sake, Malcolm has played in 435 games. By himself.

But for shits and giggles.

Shaedon: 112 games
Scoot: first season
Jabari: about 120 games
Toumani: 70 games
Duop: under 70 games
Murray: under 60 games

Maybe, oh I don't know, not compare teams that have a few years together vs a team that is just now getting started?

What was the Rockets record the last 3 seasons?
22-60. 20-62 and 17-55.

Or Orlandos record the last 3 seasons?

34-48, 22-60 and 21-51.

OKC?
40-42, 24-58, 22-50

But yeah, eVeRyThInG iS tHe SaMe!
 
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Cugel said:
POR should consider every player "available" at this point. Every player should be on the trading portfolio. There is nobody to build around. There is no core.
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This appears to have been their existing approach the last two trade windows, so you’re likely seeing eye-to-eye with management here.
 
Samuel said:
I can’t believe they did this.
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I can! First they trade Dame, then they sell the Moda to the city for a buck, and now this!?

If we needed more proof they're planning on moving the team to Seattle, I don't know where it is!
 
Phatguysrule said:
She gets nothing out of the sale. All of her incentive is to hold on to the team as long as possible.
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her incentive is to sell at the most fiscally prudent time. Waiting is either evil and malicious or grew the value of the franchise by like 50%.
 
julius said:
I can! First they trade Dame, then they sell the Moda to the city for a buck, and now this!?

If we needed more proof they're planning on moving the team to Seattle, I don't know where it is!
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I can understand kolde breaking Camara’s ribs—fair. but when he lacerated his kidney? That’s where I draw the line!
 
julius said:
Wait....only Dame, CJ and Simons were important. Powell was a desperation move by Olshey. The rest don't matter

Especially since winslow, Watford and Eubanks werent players he had when he was hired as the GM.

Nance wasn't and isn't anything special. Roco now sucks.
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you kind of ignored my first sentence....I was trying to show, poorly I guess, that "more" assets didn't necessarily mean a full cupboard
 
julius said:
yes they should have. But they didn't, and life goes on.
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This is true. And for many in the region it will go on without the Blazers.

Anybody who wanted to deal Dame so we could rebuild was insane.
 
Be careful what you wish for

Might not end up looking how you want it to

But the Rancho Cucamonga Blazers does have a nice ring to it
 
I try to stay out of negative Blazer discussions. Lately, that is all of them.

I am also very disappointed in the very limited progress made to player development. But...

What has me worried for the future is.. We have one of the worst NBA teams, with a salary load that is scratching the luxury tax line. Worse yet. Next seasons salary load is in the same range.

Unless a major trade is made in the off season. Next season's results will be similiar to this season.

There is very little, if any, salary room to work with untill the 25/26 season.
 
I know eventually the goal is to give away most of Paul's estate, presumably, in some fashion or another. And there's concern about her collecting a paycheck, so not wanting to sell the franchise. I'm ignorant of these things, so am unsure how exactly this works. Working off of generic #s...

Current estate valued at 20 billion. Lets say that includes the Seahawks valued at 5, the Blazers at 3. So rest of estate in whatever holdings is 12. Let's say her salary is 1% of estate. So what, 100 million annually?

If she sells the Seahawks for their estimated worth in a straight cash deal with Bezos, the estate would still be worth 20 billion no? And she would still collect the same salary? Until that 5 billion is given away. So selling both franchises doesn't eliminate her high presumed salary annually until the entire trust is donated away, right?
 
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