The Greatest Rapper of All Time Died on March 9th

[Natebishop3]

If Biggie got you into rap, and you're a basketball fan, then you're probably from the era where you saw Above the Rim, right? I watched that movie when I was a kid, was my favorite movie for a while, and this song was also my favorite song because of it. (btw - playing that crackhead was probably the first time I ever saw Bernie Mac, so I have that movie to thank for that as well.)

Probably the most underrated/unknown Pac song of all-time:

[video=youtube;Jgg8OZLfeSM]

Yeah, that was a good one. I had that soundtrack. I love 2pac. I think his legend was diminished by some of the god awful music that was never meant to be released.

One of my favorites right here... I love when the bass kicks in.

[video=youtube;c3UXFYnFYkU]

 

[crowTrobot]

[video=youtube;9iSVgAZ6bSM]

 

[ABM]

video

Thanks, that was funny!

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Sports is less subjective than music though. Music isn't strictly about a musicians technical abilities, whereas basketball is. If you qualify music in terms of technical ability, then someone like Yngwie Malmsteen might be considered one of the greatest ever.

In music, it's not always about the notes you play but rather, the notes you don't play. It's often about being able to create a song, and in terms of hip-hop, a lot of times it's about being able to create a certain cadence and create a lyrical story. It's entirely something subjective.

It is entirely subjective, but people do attempt to quantify, to certain extents, "ability." Some of the best hip hop heads out there say that Eminem is one of the best. He "bends" a lot of vowels to make his rhymes uniquely his. His poetry is usually very vivid with good imagery. His style and flow and word choice all help to make it so his songs are top notch. Those are some ways that you can quantify hip hop "ability" and try to bring it into the realm of "better" or "worse."

And thinking about things like rhyme scheme complexity, word play and poetic imagery.,. I just can't see how someone can say that Biggie was the GOAT. He's got good flow and style, but his rhymes are simplistic and the word-choice and subject matter are underdeveloped (which may be a symptom of the genre, not of Biggie.)

 

[Natebishop3]

It is entirely subjective, but people do attempt to quantify, to certain extents, "ability." Some of the best hip hop heads out there say that Eminem is one of the best. He "bends" a lot of vowels to make his rhymes uniquely his. His poetry is usually very vivid with good imagery. His style and flow and word choice all help to make it so his songs are top notch. Those are some ways that you can quantify hip hop "ability" and try to bring it into the realm of "better" or "worse."

And thinking about things like rhyme scheme complexity, word play and poetic imagery.,. I just can't see how someone can say that Biggie was the GOAT. He's got good flow and style, but his rhymes are simplistic and the word-choice and subject matter are underdeveloped (which may be a symptom of the genre, not of Biggie.)

Personally, I've always thought Eminem was the best, simply because his rhymes were just crazy. Completely unique. I don't think his current music is as fresh, and he sold out a bit, but his first two albums were amazing.

 

[NOVoodoo]

It is entirely subjective, but people do attempt to quantify, to certain extents, "ability." Some of the best hip hop heads out there say that Eminem is one of the best. He "bends" a lot of vowels to make his rhymes uniquely his. His poetry is usually very vivid with good imagery. His style and flow and word choice all help to make it so his songs are top notch. Those are some ways that you can quantify hip hop "ability" and try to bring it into the realm of "better" or "worse."

And thinking about things like rhyme scheme complexity, word play and poetic imagery.,. I just can't see how someone can say that Biggie was the GOAT. He's got good flow and style, but his rhymes are simplistic and the word-choice and subject matter are underdeveloped (which may be a symptom of the genre, not of Biggie.)

But how would you start to even compare him to someone like Q-Tip, whose rhymes are more poetic in nature, and who actually produces a good amount of the music he puts out? It's like apples and oranges, and all that you can use to compare the two is your own personal taste.

 

[BigGameDamian]

[video=youtube;QWfbGGZE07M]

 

[NOVoodoo]

[video=youtube;QWfbGGZE07M]

Classic.

It also has an Isley Brothers sample, just like one of Biggie's greatest.

"It Was a Good Day" = "Footsteps in the Dark"/"Big Poppa" = "Between the Sheets"

Gotta respect the Isleys for providing the samples for two of the greatest beats of all time. The crazy thing is, the producers didn't even really water down the originals too much in sampling them. They were pretty much both straight rips.

 

[MickZagger]

I like anything Ice Cube. Easy a top 5 favorite even though the genre has passed me by.

 

[Natebishop3]

Cube was awesome back in the day as well. I guess I just miss the old days of hip hop. It's a different genre now. More about the music and less about the lyrics.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

2pac was the definition of a studio gangsta
[video=youtube;G3OuC7-MHD4]

 

[NOVoodoo]

2pac was the definition of a studio gangsta
[video=youtube;G3OuC7-MHD4]

Wasn't bout to watch that whole 10 min video, but was there anything to that other than him acting fruity? I mean, I don't care about that as long as his lyrical content came from a place of truth. Just went to read the wiki section on his "early life," and that kinda nullifies the fruity demeanor in that interview, if that's mostly true.

 

[Natebishop3]

2pac was the definition of a studio gangsta
[video=youtube;G3OuC7-MHD4]

I like my gansta's to be cultivated on the streetz yo.

 

[THE HCP]

I like my gansta's to be cultivated on the streetz yo.

YOU RANG SON?

 

[Nate Dogg]

Its strange how 2Pac and B.I.G both get shot but yet Ice Cube isn't. There must be some gang ties or something with the other two and Ice Cube is respected and the others aren't?

 

[Natebishop3]

Its strange how 2Pac and B.I.G both get shot but yet Ice Cube isn't. There must be some gang ties or something with the other two and Ice Cube is respected and the others aren't?

2pac isn't dead... he's on a beach somewhere.

 

[tlongII]

Tupac was the best ever and it's not close. How Do You Want It and California Love are the best rap songs ever.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Personally, I've always thought Eminem was the best, simply because his rhymes were just crazy. Completely unique. I don't think his current music is as fresh, and he sold out a bit, but his first two albums were amazing.

I gotta agree. He's still a pretty good rhymer, but his new songs are just... I don't know.. boring?

But how would you start to even compare him to someone like Q-Tip, whose rhymes are more poetic in nature, and who actually produces a good amount of the music he puts out? It's like apples and oranges, and all that you can use to compare the two is your own personal taste.

That is true, it really does come down to personal taste. There are some people who would disagree, I've read a couple of linguistics articles that classify rhyme scheme complexity in a systematic way. But I don't really agree with trying to quantify art.

Cube was awesome back in the day as well. I guess I just miss the old days of hip hop. It's a different genre now. More about the music and less about the lyrics.

Radio hip hop, maybe. The indie scene on the other hand...

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

I would compare Biggie to Robert Johnson, an early star in a fledgling genre who was at the top of the game when he died. Later generations look back and remember him for being better than his contemporaries, but he just doesn't compare to many of those who came after him.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I gotta agree. He's still a pretty good rhymer, but his new songs are just... I don't know.. boring?

Hm. To each his own, I guess. I think some of his Recovery and Bad Meets Evil stuff is the best he's had in almost a decade. Fast Lane's an example of how he mixes dexterity with rhyme and his own flow--5'9" can barely keep up.

 

[MickZagger]

I gotta agree. He's still a pretty good rhymer, but his new songs are just... I don't know.. boring?



That is true, it really does come down to personal taste. There are some people who would disagree, I've read a couple of linguistics articles that classify rhyme scheme complexity in a systematic way. But I don't really agree with trying to quantify art.



Radio hip hop, maybe. The indie scene on the other hand...

I agree the Indie scene is really good. I just don't have the time to go searching it. My brother downloaded a bunch of good shit on my ipod for me that is Indie.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

I agree the Indie scene is really good. I just don't have the time to go searching it. My brother downloaded a bunch of good shit on my ipod for me that is Indie.

A lot of the talented "indie" guys get a lot of love from MTV and what not. Some of the guys have been around for decades, and many are far more talented than mainstream. It's worth spending some time to check out, if you're a hip-hop fan.

Brother Ali, Atmosphere, Felt, Murs, Cage, People Under the Stairs, CunninLynguists, St. Paul Slim, Sage Francis, Non-Prophets, Living Legends, Evidence, P.O.S., El-P, DOOM, Grayskul, Eyedea, etc. Most of these guys are associated with bigger names and members of other groups (i.e. like Evidence is from Dilated Peoples, Murs is a Living Legend, and also part of Felt). I know I'm leaving a bunch of other worthy names out, but I could go on for a bit...

 

[porkchopexpress]

A lot of the talented "indie" guys get a lot of love from MTV and what not. Some of the guys have been around for decades, and many are far more talented than mainstream. It's worth spending some time to check out, if you're a hip-hop fan.

Brother Ali, Atmosphere, Felt, Murs, Cage, People Under the Stairs, CunninLynguists, St. Paul Slim, Sage Francis, Non-Prophets, Living Legends, Evidence, P.O.S., El-P, DOOM, Grayskul, Eyedea, etc. Most of these guys are associated with bigger names and members of other groups (i.e. like Evidence is from Dilated Peoples, Murs is a Living Legend, and also part of Felt). I know I'm leaving a bunch of other worthy names out, but I could go on for a bit...

Great list. My HS and college years were spent trying to find new music from those guys, mainly the Rhymesayers, Def Jux guys (your list is missing my favorite, Aesop Rock) I would also add the Anticon crew from back then. They aren't as...accessible as some of the others, but Sole, Buck 65, Dose One, Jel, Themselves (Jel + Dose One) and Alias all kill it. The mid 2000s were great for the backpacker scene. Some of them have faded away, but it's good to see that most of them are still making music. Hell, El-P was part of 2 of the best hip hop records last year.

For newer guys, I don't know of much. I think moving to the middle of nowhere kind of killed my discovery of new music. Macklemore is killing it commercially, though I wouldn't rate his music any higher than the guys mentioned before. He's just figure out to take what they did (capitalize on the internet) and take it to a whole new level. It's funny that the music industry was scared to death of the internet, while a whole generation of underground hip hop can credit a lot of their success to it.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

Yeah, I actually thought of Aesop Rock, and then in the midst of my list (which I didn't review), I realized I missed posting him. But he's worthy of mention, and has done a ton of work with all the guys I did list.

Your point on the internet..... It's true, but it's because the guys making the most have lost a piece of the cut. Everyone can have some success now, even the little guys. So the little guys are finding their way to get attention and notoriety. The people on top are losing potential revenue to free downloads, and people are seeing that many of the little guys have as much, or more, talent than the artists in mainstream.

Macklemore is a talented dude. I've known of him for 5-6 years now. He makes some beauitful, honest music. He has a lot of fun with what he does. Ryan Lewis' production and beats are so well put together - he is EXTREMELY talented. I think people appreciate what the have to say because they are honest and fun.

BTW, I left off another worthy indie mention: Blue Scholars. Another group from Seattle, and friends of Macklemore. I listen to a lot of their stuff.

 

[porkchopexpress]

Yeah, I actually thought of Aesop Rock, and then in the midst of my list (which I didn't review), I realized I missed posting him. But he's worthy of mention, and has done a ton of work with all the guys I did list.

Your point on the internet..... It's true, but it's because the guys making the most have lost a piece of the cut. Everyone can have some success now, even the little guys. So the little guys are finding their way to get attention and notoriety. The people on top are losing potential revenue to free downloads, and people are seeing that many of the little guys have as much, or more, talent than the artists in mainstream.

Macklemore is a talented dude. I've known of him for 5-6 years now. He makes some beauitful, honest music. He has a lot of fun with what he does. Ryan Lewis' production and beats are so well put together - he is EXTREMELY talented. I think people appreciate what the have to say because they are honest and fun.

BTW, I left off another worthy indie mention: Blue Scholars. Another group from Seattle, and friends of Macklemore. I listen to a lot of their stuff.

Oh yeah, I def think he's talented. And it's GREAT to see a NWer get some national pub. My friends back in Seattle have been telling me about him for a while, but the first I really heard from him was only a month or two before his album dropped. I just hope he doesn't get tagged as 'that guy who did that thrift shop song', cause that would be unfair. It's probably not in my top 5 on the album. I think Same Love and Neon Cathedrals (Allen Stone's hook makes that song) are the best, though neither would make a commercially great single. Blue Scholars were starting to get some success before I moved from Seattle, but for whatever reason I never got into them. The only song I can think of is The Ave.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

You two already pretty much mentioned my whole list. Def Jux, Rhymesayers, Anticon have been my favorite labels in the past decade. Float by Aesop Rock actually got me into hip hop.

I would also mention Busdriver, Lyrics Born and Blackalicious.

Also if you're into poppy, nerdy shit then there is a lot of Nerdcore hip hop that is worth a listen, mc chris and MC Frontalot go without saying. But I can see how that "shit" is "whack" for some of you guys.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

Blue Scholars have a ton of good shit. When I first bought The Long March EP, I listened to it straight through without skipping a track. And I NEVER do that. I usually lose attention. But that album was good. The last album, Cinemetroplis, was pretty dope, though there are a few songs I'm not big on (Macklemore makes an appearance on the album, too). The other albums all have some very good songs, too.

I like Same Love, Neon Cathedrals, Gold, Starting Over..... I don't think any of them have a lot of commercial appeal, though. Same Love obviously has gotten plays for the value and meaning behind the song. I guess Gold could have a small amount of commercial appeal, if for nothing other than the beat. Plus, the way Lewis flawlessly changes the beat for the last verse but ties it into the earlier beat is solid. I dig Jimmy Iovine for the message and the end of the song, but it doesn't otherwise impress me.

 

[porkchopexpress]

You two already pretty much mentioned my whole list. Def Jux, Rhymesayers, Anticon have been my favorite labels in the past decade. Float by Aesop Rock actually got me into hip hop.

I would also mention Busdriver, Lyrics Born and Blackalicious.

Also if you're into poppy, nerdy shit then there is a lot of Nerdcore hip hop that is worth a listen, mc chris and MC Frontalot go without saying. But I can see how that "shit" is "whack" for some of you guys.

Float and Labor Days are about the peak of that era as far as albums are concerned. I like his new stuff, but Aesop hasn't been the same w/o Blockhead. Anticon falls into that last sentence as well. People who like it, LOVE it. But the vast majority will listen and says WTF was that.

 

[THE HCP]

For you Quannum Label fans how about my NEP boys The LifeSavas?

[video=youtube;KYlagpRwKyo]

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

You two already pretty much mentioned my whole list. Def Jux, Rhymesayers, Anticon have been my favorite labels in the past decade. Float by Aesop Rock actually got me into hip hop.

I would also mention Busdriver, Lyrics Born and Blackalicious.

Also if you're into poppy, nerdy shit then there is a lot of Nerdcore hip hop that is worth a listen, mc chris and MC Frontalot go without saying. But I can see how that "shit" is "whack" for some of you guys.

Good mentions on Busdriver and Lyrics Born, hoojacks.

Love me some Blackalicious, but I didn't mention them because I don't really consider them still current (I think the last thing they did was like 2005/2006). Dunno if it's true, but a friend told me they are going to release a new album soon (I think he said it was up in the air enough that it may not be released until 2014). Dunno if it's true, but I hope it is.

Amazing phase your days your hazy ways my Blazing Arrow
The rays that range from Asia way to Rio De Janeiro