Tobías Harris a 76er

[wizenheimer]

well, some of you have been saying CJ is one of the worst shooting guards in the league.

that's bullshit

 

[CupWizier]

It was more "bad" luck that was really phenomenally "good" luck, than "process". But we've been over that before.

Yeah, kind of hard to call it a process to draft someone and then have them miss their first year and then get another high pick only to do it over again with the first pick sitting out a year. I highly doubt this forum would have been that patient and been okay with that much losing.

 

[CupWizier]

that's bullshit

your posts are bullshit.

 

[wizenheimer]

your posts are bullshit.

prove your statement...show people saying CJ is one of the worst SG's in the league

 

[BBert]

Yeah, kind of hard to call it a process to draft someone and then have them miss their first year and then get another high pick only to do it over again with the first pick sitting out a year. I highly doubt this forum would have been that patient and been okay with that much losing.

That chain of events will never be duplicated. It's luck beyond even getting Tim Duncan because David Robinson sat out a year. (Not saying any 76 is in their league, but "process".)

 

[Blazers Roy]

They haven't won anything, until they do the process hasn't worked.
I agree on paper they look good. Just think the whole tank for a decade and hope you eventually hit on players is an understandable strategy but Im not sold its the best one.

OKC didn't win a chip with KD,Harden and WB, does it mean their "blueprint" for rebuild wasn't good as well?

The Sixers were actually a competitive team on the court during The Process years, i think they even beat us twice.
The Process is about maximizing your chances to acquire assets while avoiding silly obligations for the sake of being mediocre, what's so bad about that?

Also, The Process went on for 5 seasons, not a decade.

 

[blue9]

speaking of the impact/production ratio

PER: CJ 16.9....Harris 18.7
TS%: CJ .553....Harris .605
FT Rate: CJ .155....Harris .256
Reb Rate: CJ 6.0%....Harris 12.0%
assist/36: CJ 2.9....Harris 2.8
winshares/48: CJ .106....Harris .135
box plus/minus: CJ -0.2....Harris +1.6
value over replacement: CJ 0.8....Harris 1.7

Harris is a better defender than CJ as well. Now, he may get overpaid, but if he gets less than 28M/year, he'll be making less than CJ



Harris sure appears to be better than CJ. At the minimum, he's on the same level. So then, if that caliber of play is why Harris has been traded 4 times, why hasn't CJ been traded once?

I like your takes. But I don't like this one. It's really tricky to compare stats across positions. Generally speaking PFs/Cs have higher shooting percentages than Gs because they generally take higher percentage shots.

The average FG% for SGs* is 44.26% - CJ shoots 46.6%, putting him 2.34% above average.
The average FG% for PFs* is 51.88% - Harris shoots 49.6%, putting him 2.28% below average.

Perhaps CJ and Harris are fairly equal players. But I know I'd rather have a good SG than a good PF. A good SG will almost always net better results than a good PF - even a "better" PF.

*Averages based on those who qualify according to ESPN.

 

[Jon]

this irritates me. i really wanted Tobias as a Blazer.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

OKC didn't win a chip with KD,Harden and WB, does it mean their "blueprint" for rebuild wasn't good as well?

The Sixers were actually a competitive team on the court during The Process years, i think they even beat us twice.
The Process is about maximizing your chances to acquire assets while avoiding silly obligations for the sake of being mediocre, what's so bad about that?

Also, The Process went on for 5 seasons, and not a decade.

From 2003-04 to 2016-2017 The 76ers made it to 41 wins twice. In 2010 they got to 41 wins and their following years were. 35 wins, 34 wins, 19 wins, 18 wins, 10 wins, and 28 wins. The Sam Hinkie "process" started in 2012 but besides just losing on purpose they were already bad for a long time before that. They also were not very competitive during that stretch the fact they beat the Blazers is more of a knock on the Blazers then anything...

After Harden was traded, OKC has still made the playoffs and even got the WCF, even with KD leaving they were able to rebuild by being aggressive going after PG13. They didn't have to go trade WB and purposefully lose for 5 years to try to be good again.

Philly has a great looking starting 5 no doubt, but they still got whooped pretty good in the playoffs last year, and we don't know what they'll do this year.

I don't think Blazer fans would be all that enthusiastic about having to go through a stretch like that in hopes that hopefully a few of your lottery picks actually work out.

 

[oldmangrouch]

For those saying the 76ers process didn't work - who do you think is going to win more play-off games this season, Philly or Portland?

For all their bad luck and mis-steps, their plan still worked better than Olshey's.

 

[wizenheimer]

I like your takes. But I don't like this one. It's really tricky to compare stats across positions. Generally speaking PFs/Cs have higher shooting percentages than Gs because they generally take higher percentage shots.

The average FG% for SGs* is 44.26% - CJ shoots 46.6%, putting him 2.34% above average.
The average FG% for PFs* is 51.88% - Harris shoots 49.6%, putting him 2.28% below average.

Perhaps CJ and Harris are fairly equal players. But I know I'd rather have a good SG than a good PF. A good SG will almost always net better results than a good PF - even a "better" PF.

some fair points, but I'd say Harris is a lot more wing than he is a PF. And, I don't know what you mean by "better results"

I didn't just post shooting stats...there were 'results' stats too. Winshares, box plus/minus, value over replacement. For some reason, I can't find Harris in the RPM stats or I would have posted those

the main point I was getting at was a sideways rebuttal of Harris having some sort of skewed production/impact ratio and that's why he has been traded a few times. Comparing him to CJ at least gave a gauge we're familiar with

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

For those saying the 76ers process didn't work - who do you think is going to win more play-off games this season, Philly or Portland?

For all their bad luck and mis-steps, their plan still worked better than Olshey's.

Compared to Olshey's sure? That doesn't mean it's the only way to rebuild though. Also if Portland was in the east they would win some Playoff games.

 

[ripcityboy]

I will never understand why this franchise didn't throw a bunch of money at Jerry West when he had the chance. You know that old Coors commercial where a guy sees this old man playing a guitar. He asks, "What's your name." And the old man says, "It's on your guitar." Well that man is basically Jerry West when it comes to basketball.

 

[DDolla]

Bobbi and Tobi... is that always a package when it comes to trades?