Trade Aldridge?

[Boob-No-More]

Repped for bringing some sense to this thread. LMA has a long window.

Yes, he does. He's just entering his prime. And, even though he may peak around 30, I think his decline will be gradual and graceful. His game relies more on length and skill than athleticism. Good teams rely on a combination of youth and veterans. By the time our young guys enter their primes, Aldridge will be the savvy veteran and still a very productive big. Productive bigs are always in short supply. I don't think we'd get equal value in return, at best it would be a huge gamble. I'd rather stick with the sure thing, continue to build around him an hope some of our many young guys pan out.

With five rookies likely in our top 9 or 10, we don't really need more youth. Guys like Barton, Freeland and Claver are already going to be fighting for minutes. If we had even more young guys, when would they get a chance to play? This year will be tough, and will most likely net us another lottery pick, but I see this team improving rapidly. Even with no other additions (other than next year's lottery pick), I see this team making the playoffs next season. Aldridge will be an all-star big, Lillard will have a year running the point under his belt, Leonard should be ready to start by then (he will still be inconsistent, but there aren't a lot of great center in the West right now) and Barton will be a solid 6th/7th man - plus we'll have another lottery pick, possibly a SG, at that point.

Unless things go terribly wrong, I wouldn't even consider trading Aldridge until the 2014 trade deadline - and then only if he demands it, or it's clear none of our young guys are as good as projected.

Let it bake!

BNM

 

[mook]

With five rookies likely in our top 9 or 10, we don't really need more youth. G

Well said. I'd add that Batum is 23, Hickson 24, Elliot Williams is 24, and Nolan Smith is 24. All these guys are younger than Freeland! And Matthews is only 26. So it's not like we have a lot of elder veterans either.

Just look at our roster and tell me we need to focus on getting younger.

It's pretty stunning to see how young we've suddenly become.

 

[mook]

Looking over that roster, I would say Olshay needs to focus on getting in some more quality role playing old guys. I just don't see the point in washouts like Ammo, Karl and Sasha. They're all 28 or older, so it's not like they've got worlds of upside. And they are essentially castoffs trying to cling to the league, so they aren't going to provide locker room stability like a quality role player like Jeffries. The are the worst kind of veteran--the sad sack who has no way to lead and no hope of improvement.

Ronnie Price is pretty borderline between Jeffries and the other old scrubs, but I give him a pass because Lillard likes him and we aren't going to get a lot better choices while rebuilding around Lillard.

 

[Blaze01]

Yeah, but POR youth for the most part...sucks...

 

[mook]

Yeah, but POR youth for the most part...sucks...

I think it's a mixed bag. I think Hickson, Batum, Matthews, Freeland, Barton and even Smith have long-term careers in the NBA.

Leonard and Lillard are really the only two that I think have real All Star potential. Lillard is the only one with superstar potential.

Obviously, on a rebuilding team you'd like to see more potential All Stars/Superstars.

 

[Blazinaway]

Well said. I'd add that Batum is 23, Hickson 24, Elliot Williams is 24, and Nolan Smith is 24. All these guys are younger than Freeland! And Matthews is only 26. So it's not like we have a lot of elder veterans either.

Just look at our roster and tell me we need to focus on getting younger.

It's pretty stunning to see how young we've suddenly become.

Problem is we may be young but IMO that youth is not that good and that's a problem. Batum is the best of the group, just signed a big contract and has questions to answer about his consistency. Hickson may be a career backup, Williams is another injury enigma and we can't realistically count on him at all, Wes really should be a 6th man and Freeland is likely a backup as well.
So we have one "capable" starter of that group, Nolan has shown me nothing. We need MORE TALENT

 

[Rhal]

Problem is we may be young but IMO that youth is not that good and that's a problem. Batum is the best of the group, just signed a big contract and has questions to answer about his consistency. Hickson may be a career backup, Williams is another injury enigma and we can't realistically count on him at all, Wes really should be a 6th man and Freeland is likely a backup as well.
So we have one "capable" starter of that group, Nolan has shown me nothing. We need MORE TALENT

Here is the problem I have with this whole "we have no talent" arguement. We dont know what we have, making assumptions on rookies who havent played an actual nba game just not a good idea because we dont know how they will play.
We can count out williams due to injury but Hickson was a stud in cleveland but he was rumored to want a 10m a year contract so they traded him and he sucked on a team with 4 of there starting 5 being "me first players" he has shown starter level talent on cleveland. Wes is a sixth man talent and Batum is inconistant to the point of madness but its yet to be seen if he just doesnt have it in him to be consistant for 30m a night or if a coaching change was just what he needed.
With players like claver/barton/freeland/leonard/even lillard we dont know what we have in them until we see them vs other nba teams. We dont exactly lack talent we lack proven talent and we wont really know what we will need until half way through this season.

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[jlprk]

What you get for LMA is cap space, expiring contracts, maybe draft picks thrown in. You might get something like Noah and Deng for him from the Bulls, but I think you'd want LMA instead.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=d5h7zbe

Kevin Martin, Motiejunas, and Royce White for Aldridge. Maybe have them throw in a draft pick as well. Aldridge isn't Dwight Howard, but he's a guy from Texas and he's an All-Star bigman to with Jeremy Lin and Lamb. We would get cap relief from Kevin Martin (one year left) and a couple of talented young bigs.

Garbage. Like I said, every year or two a league star like Dwight Howard gets traded. Wait till then and trade up, not down. Meanwhile, we can see whether Aldridge improves under a non-McMillan coach.

 

[Denny Crane]

Howard has won how many titles with Orlando and a better roster than you'd have in Portland?

 

[jlprk]

Howard has won how many titles with Orlando and a better roster than you'd have in Portland?

That's not a sentence, so I had to translate.

Говард выиграл как много титулов с Орландо и список лучше, чем вы бы в Портленде?

 

[Denny Crane]

Howard has won how many titles with Orlando - and with a better roster than you'd have in Portland?

...

 

[jlprk]

Aldridge would have won how many titles with Orlando and their roster without Howard?

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

I think it'll really depend on the draft.

There are two bigs that we could have a chance at if we suck enough. Looking at this roster, we're definitely going to be in the mix for Zeller and Noel.

Scenario:

Draft: Cody Zeller
Trade: Aldridge for Paul George/+

 

[Denny Crane]

Aldridge would have won how many titles with Orlando and their roster without Howard?

None.

 

[RR7]

What you get for LMA is cap space, expiring contracts, maybe draft picks thrown in.
.

I'm sorry, MAYBE draft picks thrown in? You've shown it before, but I don't think you have much idea about the NBA. You run a great website. Good.
But jesus. MAYBE draft picks? You're delusional to think Aldridge is getting just space and maybe someone thinks about throwing in draft picks.

As for the thread as a whole...is it time? No. You listen on everyone, of course. Maybe this is the time, if someone pays fair value for a top 20 player with three years remaining on his contract. But it's absolutely not the time to move him just because we might suck. If that is the lone criteria ad thinking, then no, it is the wrong time. See how he plays this year with Lillard. See how Lillard is. See what you have in other people around him. Lillard, IMO, is a Brandon Roy like rookie who isn't some 4 year project who Aldridge' prime is ruined. If things look absolutely dire, not record wise, but talents wise, then maybe you do, if it looks like Lillard is trash, and you need to tank for 2 more years or something. But not just because we might be bad, and have some irrational fear Aldridge will not like us, leave us, demand a trade, etc.

 

[Denny Crane]

I'm sorry, MAYBE draft picks thrown in? You've shown it before, but I don't think you have much idea about the NBA. You run a great website. Good.
But jesus. MAYBE draft picks? You're delusional to think Aldridge is getting just space and maybe someone thinks about throwing in draft picks.

As for the thread as a whole...is it time? No. You listen on everyone, of course. Maybe this is the time, if someone pays fair value for a top 20 player with three years remaining on his contract. But it's absolutely not the time to move him just because we might suck. If that is the lone criteria ad thinking, then no, it is the wrong time. See how he plays this year with Lillard. See how Lillard is. See what you have in other people around him. Lillard, IMO, is a Brandon Roy like rookie who isn't some 4 year project who Aldridge' prime is ruined. If things look absolutely dire, not record wise, but talents wise, then maybe you do, if it looks like Lillard is trash, and you need to tank for 2 more years or something. But not just because we might be bad, and have some irrational fear Aldridge will not like us, leave us, demand a trade, etc.

I don't think Portland would want players back if they trade LMA. If they do, they want expirings. The idea would be to maximize free cap space.

The benefit of draft picks is they can be good enough players on rookie scale (cheap) contracts.

I pointed out that you could get an all-star and a near all-star for LMA, but I also pointed out that I seriously doubt the Blazers would want to get into 40-50 win territory with cap space tied up in three players who aren't a good enough "big 3" and middling draft picks to try to build with.

Make sense?

EDIT: what did Orlando get for Dwight Howard, a top 5 player?

Aaron Afflalo, Al Harrington, Nikola Vucevic, and PROTECTED future picks. Harrington is 31 and has 3 years remaining at ~$7M per. Afflalo had a 14.7 PER. Vucevic was sub 15 PER as well.

 

[BlazerWookee]

I just can't wrap my head around someone calling themselves a fan of a team, and then actively rooting for that team to fucking lose in order to get a better shot at a high draft pick.

Fuck the draft. If we get a lottery pick, it'll be very small consolation for losing that many games.

 

[BrianFromWA]

That's not a sentence, so I had to translate.

Говард выиграл как много титулов с Орландо и список лучше, чем вы бы в Портленде?

Red Chinese...I knew it.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I said it in another thread, but I think you wait to see how Stotts designs an offense around LMA and Lillard. I mean, in theory (while I recognize that there is literally a ton of unknown/unproven/crap players on our bench) we have a PG who not only is a proven (collegiate) stud at the P&R, but can hit the deep shot if you play back off of him. You have one of the quickest and most mobile big men in the game just hitting his all-star prime. You have 2-3 guys who are premium 3pt shooters in Wes, Batum and Babbitt, assuming no other skills on their end. You have the ability to match LMA up on the frontline with either a high-motor defensive big (in Leonard), a low-ceiling but professional post player (in Freeland) or an undersized proven scorer (in Hickson).

I'm not against moving LMA this year, especially if a great deal comes along, but to advocate doing so now, when the team's had 2 weeks of practice and 3 preseason garbage games seems like madness. We DON'T know what we have, either does the rest of the league, and we therefore aren't going to get anything close to premium offers.

 

[mook]

I said it in another thread, but I think you wait to see how Stotts designs an offense around LMA and Lillard. I mean, in theory (while I recognize that there is literally a ton of unknown/unproven/crap players on our bench) we have a PG who not only is a proven (collegiate) stud at the P&R, but can hit the deep shot if you play back off of him. You have one of the quickest and most mobile big men in the game just hitting his all-star prime. You have 2-3 guys who are premium 3pt shooters in Wes, Batum and Babbitt, assuming no other skills on their end. You have the ability to match LMA up on the frontline with either a high-motor defensive big (in Leonard), a low-ceiling but professional post player (in Freeland) or an undersized proven scorer (in Hickson).

 

[Nikolokolus]

I say let it ride for a couple of years. I doubt Lillard will become a star and completely transform the franchise, but there's probably enough of a chance that it's worth holding on to Aldridge and seeing what they can do. If it's not going to work, they should know by sometime next year and then it's probably fine to consider trying to move LaMarcus before letting his contract expire.

 

[Rhal]

I don't think Portland would want players back if they trade LMA. If they do, they want expirings. The idea would be to maximize free cap space.

The benefit of draft picks is they can be good enough players on rookie scale (cheap) contracts.

I pointed out that you could get an all-star and a near all-star for LMA, but I also pointed out that I seriously doubt the Blazers would want to get into 40-50 win territory with cap space tied up in three players who aren't a good enough "big 3" and middling draft picks to try to build with.

Make sense?

EDIT: what did Orlando get for Dwight Howard, a top 5 player?

Aaron Afflalo, Al Harrington, Nikola Vucevic, and PROTECTED future picks. Harrington is 31 and has 3 years remaining at ~$7M per. Afflalo had a 14.7 PER. Vucevic was sub 15 PER as well.

Come on denny don't use the Howard trade as an example of anything except what it actually is. The worst trade of a superstar in the leagues history.

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[Denny Crane]

Come on denny don't use the Howard trade as an example of anything except what it actually is. The worst trade of a superstar in the leagues history.

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Seems like they could have had Bynum or Iggy. They were motivated by the things I said to NOT take those guys. Same motivation for the Blazers to not take back some older talent not enough to get them over the top.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Seems like they could have had Bynum or Iggy. They were motivated by the things I said to NOT take those guys. Same motivation for the Blazers to not take back some older talent not enough to get them over the top.

Andrew Bynum = older talent? He won't turn 25 for another week. He was only 17 when drafted and didn't turn 18 until 6 days before his first NBA regular season game - making him the youngest player in NBA history.

BNM

 

[Rhal]

Seems like they could have had Bynum or Iggy. They were motivated by the things I said to NOT take those guys. Same motivation for the Blazers to not take back some older talent not enough to get them over the top.

You don't take AI becausehe can't turn the franchise around, bynum is young enough for a five year rebuild plan. Whatever motivated Orlando they still made the worst trade in basketball history.

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[Denny Crane]

Andrew Bynum = older talent? He won't turn 25 for another week. He was only 17 when drafted and didn't turn 18 until 6 days before his first NBA regular season game - making him the youngest player in NBA history.

BNM

Right. Older.

Not as young as a draft pick after this year or after next, depending on the picks' protection schemes.

 

[Blazinaway]

Andrew Bynum = older talent? He won't turn 25 for another week. He was only 17 when drafted and didn't turn 18 until 6 days before his first NBA regular season game - making him the youngest player in NBA history.

BNM

Bynun's may be 24 but his knees are toxic and no way we would want him anywhere near POR - the land of knee implosions, if anyone gives him a big long contract after this yr they are crazy IMO

 

[Hobbesarable]

Seems legit in the Blazers' present scenario.

But, for whom?

I would like our team to go after James Harden (via trade by the trade deadline or FA if he makes it to the FA at season's end).

 

[BlazerWookee]

I would like our team to go after James Harden (via trade by the trade deadline or FA if he makes it to the FA at season's end).

I don't get the fascination with Harden. Really, really good player, but if he was your #1 or #2, you're not going to be a very good team...

 

[Hobbesarable]

I don't get the fascination with Harden. Really, really good player, but if he was your #1 or #2, you're not going to be a very good team...

I don't get the fascination with LA.

I enjoy the way James Harden plays. He can shoot the rock, handle the ball, and get to the free throw line pretty well.

We had LA and we were not a very good team last season. And possibly this season as well.