Politics Trump invokes emergency powers to sidestep Congress and sell arms to Saudi Arabia

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It allows you to post your feelings.

I beg your pardon sir, but that was not feelings, it is a fact.
Then I would credit the Constitution with providing me the freedom to express my views, fact or not.
A marvelous document and basis for our rule of law. Designed to counter the likely tyranny of the majority.
 
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1. “Who were we to challenge the unknown?” That is our right as American Citizens, and that is the DUTY of a journalist, to challenge the official narrative, especially when no facts are provided.
2. Venezuelans are starving and lacking medical care because of the sanctions put on them by the United States. Denying a country export of their only resource causes a crisis, imagine that. Now that the country is in shambles we can step in and “help out” like we did in places like Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.
3. The chemical attacks in Syria are definitely well documented, and it’s been all but proven that Assad was not behind them, nor would it have been in his best interest to perpetrate such an attack. It’s been reported by reputable sources inside and outside of the US for quite some time now that anti-Assad militants were most likely behind the attacks. Most of the mainstream outlets didn’t even deny it when The reports came out, they just didn’t care to report on it. Must have been more important Russiagate news happening at the time.
4. The mainstream media relentlessly pounded all three of these narratives into our consciousness until there was enough support to act on them. Up next....conflict with Iran. Everyone please remove your thinking caps!
 
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It is my opinion, that there is actually nothing that the current pres can do, that will not be rationalized by his supporters. My first memory of politics was in 1963.

Trump is the most rational President since Eisenhower, therefore no rationalization is needed.

So your first memory of politics was Kennedy's assassination by the Deep State?
 


Back in the day when I live in West Linn, I used to go Dirt Biking with my neighbor and some of his buddies. Not that I liked the guy especially, actually he was an insufferable ass, but you know, you sort of need to do that kind of stuff with other to cover you own fuckups that are bound to happen. Anyway this guy was the son of a local TV personality in Portland at the time, and when I say insufferable, I can't think of another word that would be a proper replacement.

This dude would get on his bike, a 450 Husky and just go balls out, fuck the tactics or what. Time after time, damn hard to understand how he lived to be 30. One day riding on the dunes near Heppner, I watch him and his closes buddy about 75 yards ahead of me doing the propeller,
Bike below doing endos, guys above switching ends in the air! When I got there, I could see they crossed a road with a sand burm on both sides, just like they had hit a double ski jump. This dude, Chuck was out but nothing appeared broken so I let him lay, sort of straightened him up but let him lay. The other guy was ok, smarting but ok. When Chuck came too in a few minutes, I told him not move, for Christ sake don't move!!!

About 30 seconds latter, he began asking, whats wrong? Then I started laughing, You put on the god damnedest dumb ass show I have ever seen, I just wanted to savior it awhile.

I can imagine only few others in this same way. Damn few you can enjoy seeing in a bike wreck! But they do exist.
 
The media is absolutely complicit in soliciting public support for our endless wars.
My war, Vietnam, the media was pretty far from hawkish...depends upon the media...you include the BBC? I sure don't remember reading gushing commendations about Vietnam by any stretch of the imagination. My father's and uncle's war...WWII...they showed patriotic pro war pep talks before the movies started. Told everyone how good things were going and how brave we were...didn't happen for my watch.
 
Neither. He left home because his mom and dad used to vacation here.
I suppose you think that those of us who go to Hawaii are leaving because we can't get freedom and have to live in bat-shit crazy, oppressive ignorance of the ruling morons in Oregon.

News Flash to Lannyinabubble! :beatinto:

Hawaii is part of America. :dry:
 
Trump is the most rational President since Eisenhower, therefore no rationalization is needed.

So your first memory of politics was Kennedy's assassination by the Deep State?
Eisenhower was my commander in chief during my years of service. I thought the man an idiot for shit he had us do. Sending us into harms way without anyway to defend ourselves with the rules of engagement. But it did back the dictator he had chosen against the dictator he opposed without actually starting a war. That is a good thing, it took 50 years to see it that way but it is a good thing. Still he was not a genius.
But then not a ass in history either.
 
My war, Vietnam, the media was pretty far from hawkish...depends upon the media...you include the BBC? I sure don't remember reading gushing commendations about Vietnam by any stretch of the imagination. My father's and uncle's war...WWII...they showed patriotic pro war pep talks before the movies started. Told everyone how good things were going and how brave we were...didn't happen for my watch.
You’re right. There was a huge anti-war movement during Vietnam. Bigger than there’s ever been before or since. The problem today is that there is no anti-war movement to speak of. None. Everybody says they don’t want war, followed by a “BUT”. The anti-war liberals of past are extinct, the Democratic Party has sold out, like the Republicans. They have succumb to the pressure of lobbyists and the new scheme is to dupe the masses into wars using the guise of humanitarianism. Gotta get rid of those dictators, even if we have to kill a couple hundred thousand civilians to do it. People say “yeah but it’s complicated.”
It’s not. War is bad and that is it.
 
It is often asked, what would make a Trump supporter stop supporting Trump.
I see nothing of what you guys complain about. For the most part, I see, that you can not see what I see.
I do not see Trump doing any immoral acts as President.
I do not see Trump failing to enforce the laws of the land.
I do not see Trump starting feel good wars over feel good emotional causes.
I would cease support of the man in a moment if he starts a war by going on offense outside the interests of the US, no matter how emotional the triggering event.
 
My war, Vietnam, the media was pretty far from hawkish...depends upon the media...you include the BBC? I sure don't remember reading gushing commendations about Vietnam by any stretch of the imagination. My father's and uncle's war...WWII...they showed patriotic pro war pep talks before the movies started. Told everyone how good things were going and how brave we were...didn't happen for my watch.

Vietnam was a war for profit, the MIC/Deep State's profit. There was no moral battle or even sane reason to participate.

President Eisenhower warned us it was coming.

President Kennedy was murdered for resisting it.

The media still had remnants of the free press hanging on, and college papers were a large part of it. The college papers were written by young people who didn't want to be used as pawns of death.

There was no legitimate threat to America, and 18 year old males were forced into the "choice" of murdering strangers in a strange land, or forsaking the country they loved and running to Canada, or serve time in prison and be labeled a felon for life.

Every single day from the age of nine until shortly after my second non-selection in the draft, I made this decision in my head.

Most of the time I chose prison, which cast a pretty dark shadow on my dreams for my future as an adult.

A few times I chose Canada, and as my mother was a Canadian citizen I could have declared dual-citizenship but would still have been unable to return to the country I love.

Not once was the easy path of no resistance considered. Not once did I consider handing over responsibility for my own actions to the government.

Thankfully, kids today aren't faced with such nightmare choices, and those who join the military do it for their own reasons with no punishment if they're not interested.
 
There was no legitimate threat to America, and 18 year old males were forced into the "choice" of murdering strangers in a strange land, or forsaking the country they loved and running to Canada, or serve time in prison and be labeled a felon for life.

Every single day from the age of nine until shortly after my second non-selection in the draft, I made this decision in my head.

There was another path. You could have suddenly developed bone spurs, like your hero.

barfo
 
scheme is to dupe the masses into wars using the guise of humanitarianism. Gotta get rid of those dictators, even if we have to kill a couple hundred thousand civilians to do it.
I do not see Trump doing this sort of folly.
 
You’re right. There was a huge anti-war movement during Vietnam. Bigger than there’s ever been before or since. The problem today is that there is no anti-war movement to speak of. None. Everybody says they don’t want war, followed by a “BUT”. The anti-war liberals of past are extinct, the Democratic Party has sold out, like the Republicans. They have succumb to the pressure of lobbyists and the new scheme is to dupe the masses into wars using the guise of humanitarianism. Gotta get rid of those dictators, even if we have to kill a couple hundred thousand civilians to do it. People say “yeah but it’s complicated.”
It’s not. War is bad and that is it.
well said
 
Vietnam was a war for profit, the MIC/Deep State's profit. There was no moral battle or even sane reason to participate.

President Eisenhower warned us it was coming.

President Kennedy was murdered for resisting it.

The media still had remnants of the free press hanging on, and college papers were a large part of it. The college papers were written by young people who didn't want to be used as pawns of death.

There was no legitimate threat to America, and 18 year old males were forced into the "choice" of murdering strangers in a strange land, or forsaking the country they loved and running to Canada, or serve time in prison and be labeled a felon for life.

Every single day from the age of nine until shortly after my second non-selection in the draft, I made this decision in my head.

Most of the time I chose prison, which cast a pretty dark shadow on my dreams for my future as an adult.

A few times I chose Canada, and as my mother was a Canadian citizen I could have declared dual-citizenship but would still have been unable to return to the country I love.

Not once was the easy path of no resistance considered. Not once did I consider handing over responsibility for my own actions to the government.

Thankfully, kids today aren't faced with such nightmare choices, and those who join the military do it for their own reasons with no punishment if they're not interested.
I agree with you about the profit of war...the "deep state" I define as the arms dealers cranking out those Huey's and blowing through gazillions of rounds of ammo....then the black market coming back the other direction with "heroin" following. I ran a teletype machine and message processing...the military had a tendency to cook the books on stats and supplies. You might remember the 75 dollar toilet seat bolts?
 
It is often asked, what would make a Trump supporter stop supporting Trump.
I see nothing of what you guys complain about. For the most part, I see, that you can not see what I see.
I do not see Trump doing any immoral acts as President.
I do not see Trump failing to enforce the laws of the land.
I do not see Trump starting feel good wars over feel good emotional causes.
I would cease support of the man in a moment if he starts a war by going on offense outside the interests of the US, no matter how emotional the triggering event.

Outside the interest of the US needs clarity here in the context of offense in warfare. As I have stated before, Offense should never be undertaken until the sovereign can define victory in justifiable terms and the General knows how to achieve the victory. But all too often the sovereign can not define victory beyond the military victory as the General must achieve. Such a victory can only be momentarily achieved and probably lost with the first party. Afghanistan historically has been of this nature. The US, regardless of the persuasiveness of the leader should never play this roll.

Where will this be seen possible in the future?

Iran and N. Korea

Sending US troops to Iran in occupation would be about like Afghanistan.
The people there must free themselves no US leader will ever have the charisma to extend that far. Support from afar perhaps, but not lead. The leaders there could begin the conflict and we could succeed in the conflict but not an occupation. They do not seem to choose democracy and we can not install another Shaw.
No! Kick their ass if we must, but do not take up residence.

N. Korea

US interest are at least one thing, eliminate long range missile being targeted on the US population.
Taking down a regime like this is in our interest, it would leave no vacuum with S. Korea filling it immediately.
But at what cost? Probably way too high and can't be done with the US in the lead without massive losses. We can only support Asians in the effort. If the dude there begins the conflict, it would be short, terrible losses but short.
 
There was another path. You could have suddenly developed bone spurs, like your hero.

barfo

If life was fair, I could have simply been allowed to not participate as my conscience would not allow it.

Regrettably, I would have had to lie and claimed I believed in a mythical super-hero as "a conscience" is only something religious people are allowed to have under our laws.

As someone who now has bone spurs, they're quite debilitating and nothing to laugh about.
 
I agree with you about the profit of war...the "deep state" I define as the arms dealers cranking out those Huey's and blowing through gazillions of rounds of ammo....then the black market coming back the other direction with "heroin" following. I ran a teletype machine and message processing...the military had a tendency to cook the books on stats and supplies. You might remember the 75 dollar toilet seat bolts?

I was a purchaser for a few years of my Federal career. In the 90's computer parts were a favorite source to defraud the government.

A simple machine screw that you could buy at Radio Shack for 20 cents might cost $45 each from a government contractor. Reported a few, but don't know if they were prosecuted.
 
You’re right. There was a huge anti-war movement during Vietnam. Bigger than there’s ever been before or since. The problem today is that there is no anti-war movement to speak of. None. Everybody says they don’t want war, followed by a “BUT”. The anti-war liberals of past are extinct, the Democratic Party has sold out, like the Republicans. They have succumb to the pressure of lobbyists and the new scheme is to dupe the masses into wars using the guise of humanitarianism. Gotta get rid of those dictators, even if we have to kill a couple hundred thousand civilians to do it. People say “yeah but it’s complicated.”
It’s not. War is bad and that is it.

The anti-war movement died with the free press, whose death was verified the day Nixon was forced from office and the media spoke in a single voice proclaiming he should not be prosecuted because "our Democracy could not survive such a prosecution".

Since that day (at the very latest), America has had no media that was not owned by the Deep State.
 
I don't believe in waging war. Wars kill the innocent and the underprivileged, and the bad guys usually survive. I don't believe in "measured response".

I do believe in the quick, complete and total annihilation of any specific person, group or government that seriously threatens Americans.

When possible, I prefer to assassinate a dictator and his circle who threatens the US as opposed to bombing the cities his victims live in.

If a country actually declared war on America and their military attacked, I'm fine with nuking them into glass as a first strike response.
 
1. “Who were we to challenge the unknown?” That is our right as American Citizens, and that is the DUTY of a journalist, to challenge the official narrative, especially when no facts are provided.
2. Venezuelans are starving and lacking medical care because of the sanctions put on them by the United States. Denying a country export of their only resource causes a crisis, imagine that. Now that the country is in shambles we can step in and “help out” like we did in places like Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.
3. The chemical attacks in Syria are definitely well documented, and it’s been all but proven that Assad was not behind them, nor would it have been in his best interest to perpetrate such an attack. It’s been reported by reputable sources inside and outside of the US for quite some time now that anti-Assad militants were most likely behind the attacks. Most of the mainstream outlets didn’t even deny it when The reports came out, they just didn’t care to report on it. Must have been more important Russiagate news happening at the time.
4. The mainstream media relentlessly pounded all three of these narratives into our consciousness until there was enough support to act on them. Up next....conflict with Iran. Everyone please remove your thinking caps!
Hey, it was a war zone and jounalists were restricted on when and where and how they could travel.
Medicine is allowed in Venezuela.
You are wrong about Assad not being responsible. Even Trump has blamed them for chemical attacks and the world press has all been saying that Assad is attacking civilians with chemical weapons.
I'm not going to follow suit with you on the thinking cap removal statement.
 
I don't believe in waging war. Wars kill the innocent and the underprivileged, and the bad guys usually survive. I don't believe in "measured response".

I do believe in the quick, complete and total annihilation of any specific person, group or government that seriously threatens Americans.

When possible, I prefer to assassinate a dictator and his circle who threatens the US as opposed to bombing the cities his victims live in.

If a country actually declared war on America and their military attacked, I'm fine with nuking them into glass as a first strike response.
Thank God even the Trump administration has cooler heads with regard to the use of nukes.
 
Even Trump has blamed them for chemical attacks
He’s a reputable source now? It’s been debunked man. At best, there was never any proof. At worst, all signs point to anti-Assad forces and even the beloved white helmets, who are terrorist sympathizers, as having a hand in the attacks. The story has changed since 1 minute after the attacks when US intelligence pretended to already know who was responsible and begged congress to let us bomb them. Other groups actually did an investigation to find facts, imagine that. What they found was that nothing the US said was true, imagine that.
 
Thank God even the Trump administration has cooler heads with regard to the use of nukes.

My reference was to self-defense in a do-or-die attack on our country, so I certainly hope you're wrong, and I'm certain you are.

This is why Libs are regarded as too risky for positions of defense, and ultimately POTUS.

Obama's subservience to our country's most powerful and violent enemies has left America in the weakest "perceived" position worldwide, and several Psycho-leaders are rattling their swords. The surest way to put an end to all of those very credible threats is to erase the first one of them that crosses the line.

If there's a risk of error, always best to err on the side of self-preservation.
 
He’s a reputable source now? It’s been debunked man. At best, there was never any proof. At worst, all signs point to anti-Assad forces and even the beloved white helmets, who are terrorist sympathizers, as having a hand in the attacks. The story has changed since 1 minute after the attacks when US intelligence pretended to already know who was responsible and begged congress to let us bomb them. Other groups actually did an investigation to find facts, imagine that. What they found was that nothing the US said was true, imagine that.

Nonsense.

No such evidence/conclusion exists.

Weaker lie than the Russian Hoax.
 
2. Venezuelans are starving and lacking medical care because of the sanctions put on them by the United States. Denying a country export of their only resource causes a crisis, imagine that. Now that the country is in shambles we can step in and “help out” like we did in places like Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.

Fake News.

Venezuelans have been starving for nearly a decade, thanks to the Chavez/Maduro families stealing the nation's oil profits and bank accounts. The US under Obama was a partner in this crime and covered it up for years by propping the country up by buying the bulk of Venezuelan Oil.
 
Nonsense.

No such evidence/conclusion exists.

Weaker lie than the Russian Hoax.

Russian hoax? Is it a hoax when several people were either found guilty or plead guilty and some are in prison now? Is it a hoax when the Mueller report actually outlined at least 10 separate counts of obstruction? What a hoax that was.
 
He’s a reputable source now? It’s been debunked man. At best, there was never any proof. At worst, all signs point to anti-Assad forces and even the beloved white helmets, who are terrorist sympathizers, as having a hand in the attacks. The story has changed since 1 minute after the attacks when US intelligence pretended to already know who was responsible and begged congress to let us bomb them. Other groups actually did an investigation to find facts, imagine that. What they found was that nothing the US said was true, imagine that.
It has not been debunked by anyone reputable. All the world's leading press agencies that have visited the region concur that the Syrians have attacked civilians with deadly gas.
https://www.armscontrol.org/issue-briefs/2019-04/responses-violations-norm-against-chemical-weapons
 
Oh, and what she is saying is Trump is a Putin puppet and good old John Bolton can't do his job. John FUCKING Bolton.

John "I'm 300 years old and live off the souls of the innocent people I've helped slaughter" Bolton.

Really?? That's all you took from that??

The only person on the planet you could "defend" draft dodging, chickenhawk John Bolton from is draft dodging, chickenhawk Trump.

She wasn't so much defending him as much as trouncing trump for being a puppet.

She's basically calling Bolton a war monger for NOT being able to go after Russia...
 
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