Two Muslims pulled off plane due to passengers feeling "uncomfortable"

[Denny Crane]

Lasted another 17 years under the new, less racist management.

F. W. Woolworth Company had the same racist lunch counters, including a very infamous one:

Greensboro sit-in

On February 1, 1960, four black students sat down at a segregated lunch counter in a Greensboro, North Carolina, Woolworth's store. They were refused service, touching off six months of sit-ins and economic boycotts that became a landmark event in the U.S. civil-rights movement. In 1993, an eight-foot section of the lunch counter was moved to the Smithsonian Institution and the store site now contains a civil rights museum, which had its grand opening on Monday, February 1, 2010, the 50th anniversary of the beginning of the sit-ins.


After a few years of violent stupidity, public demand for racist lunch counters ebbed and by Woolworth’s 100th anniversary in 1979, it had become the largest department store chain in the world, according to the Guinness Book of World Records. After Wal-Mart eventually bought all of it's Canadian stores, it diversified several times and is now in the form of Foot Locker, Inc..

There were two lunch counters in my neighborhood on the south side. One was in the Woolworth and the other was in the Wallgreens. They were both (lunch counters only) closed entirely by 1968. I don't know about Wallgreens, but Woolworth was a national chain, with stores in Canada too. Unlike Kress.

 

[RR7]

Sorry, are you going to give examples of companies that went out of business, and not 15, 20 years later. Or not Wallgreens eliminating their lunch counter, since Wallgreens is around still. It hurt many,for sure, as you said, yet examples you give are inner city schools and a company that lasted until the 80s. Solid!

 

[Denny Crane]

The company did not last past 1964, but nice try. It's like saying AT&T is still around - it's a brand name acquired by another company, Cingular. The original AT&T was broken up as a monopoly, and the surviving business went bankrupt and was sold off in pieces.

 

[RR7]

but if people refused to go there because they served blacks, even if it was just acquired for the name, how was it in business for another 15 years? With your argument, nobody would acquire it, because nobody would want to go there, and the company would go bankrupt. You gave one lousy example to support a wild claim. good job.

 

[Denny Crane]

but if people refused to go there because they served blacks, even if it was just acquired for the name, how was it in business for another 15 years? With your argument, nobody would acquire it, because nobody would want to go there, and the company would go bankrupt. You gave one lousy example to support a wild claim. good job.

It was in business in the same sense AT&T was after it was acquired by Cingular. All of it's stores and lunch counters were closed in 1964. The company that bought them out opened new stores under the name, but in The suburban shopping malls.

 

[RR7]

So you have no good examples to support your initial claim. Got it.

 

[Denny Crane]

So you have no good examples to support your initial claim. Got it.

I gave several, including schools and downtown Chicago as well .

Just because you insist on denying the facts doesn't make them less facts.

 

[RR7]

Several examples of places that went out of businesses, and your examples are walgreens and woolworths. False. Schools that still exist. And then a place that was bought and moved. So by that poor definition, the Blazers are no longer in business, because they were sold, and moved to the Rose Garden. I am not denying facts at all. You stated something, and have yet to back it up with an example that illustrates your initial point.

 

[Denny Crane]

Several examples of places that went out of businesses, and your examples are walgreens and woolworths. False. Schools that still exist. And then a place that was bought and moved. So by that poor definition, the Blazers are no longer in business, because they were sold, and moved to the Rose Garden. I am not denying facts at all. You stated something, and have yet to back it up with an example that illustrates your initial point.

When Kress was bought out, over 200 lunch counters were closed in the south. That's 200 examples.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

I would not want to eat at a lunch counter that would have me as a customer.

-SlyPokerDog

 

[maxiep]

And we'll keep going through this until you start thinking up some potential solutions to this problem you've apparently got figured out. For someone that pegs my knowledge of the situation as idealistic, you are extremely vague as to what could and should actually be done.

I've presented my solutions. I can't help it if you don't like them. Like I said, you're doing the easy part (collecting data) without doing the hard part (ignoring the data noise and coming up with solutions). Better graduate programs won't let you get away with only doing the easy part.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

I've presented my solutions. I can't help it if you don't like them. Like I said, you're doing the easy part (collecting data) without doing the hard part (ignoring the data noise and coming up with solutions). Better graduate programs won't let you get away with only doing the easy part.

What solutions? Speaking out? Rooting out extremist elements of Islam? "Reform?" Those, my friend, are idealistic and very vague ideas. If this were about basketball, I'd say "Learn the game, then post."

 

[bluefrog]

If it were more than a few people speaking out about it, perhaps they wouldn't be ignored. Note the pro-Bin Laden protests around the world. Meanwhile, where are the thanks to the US from imams and governments of muslim countries? Crickets.

The sad truth is, most imams and governments in muslim countries are afraid that their populace agrees with someone poking the eye of the West.

There is a vocal Arab majority praising the death of Bin Laden too.

LINK

Al-Qaeda ended up killing more Muslims than anyone else. They inflicted indescribable damage on the Muslim nation, while failing to inflict any real damage on the West…For us to confront the West, we need to be strong. But we will only become strong when we become free, well-educated citizens of democratic nations.

Al-Qaeda as an organisation hijacked the words Islam and Muslims, and put them into the same pot as terrorism. After the attacks on September 2001, Muslims were branded with the word "terrorism".

 

[MARIS61]

When Kress was bought out, over 200 lunch counters were closed in the south. That's 200 examples.

Examples of what?

Is it seriously your belief that the popularity of lunch counters died out because white people couldn't keep black people from eating there?

I think the proliferation of fast food chain expansions at that time simply changed our lunch culture.

I remember eating at the Woolworth's lunch counter every August in the mid-60's with my Mom when we bussed into Portland to shop for school clothes. It made little sense to me when they started picketing the store because the stores in the south would not allow blacks. Here I had been lunching with blacks at their counter for several years. The problem was clearly not the store since there was no problem in Portland. The problem was the ignorant people who frequented stores in the south.

 

[maxiep]

What solutions? Speaking out? Rooting out extremist elements of Islam? "Reform?" Those, my friend, are idealistic and very vague ideas. If this were about basketball, I'd say "Learn the game, then post."

It's specific enough. One doesn't need to create an exact plan to set a long-term action in motion. It would be akin to saying that you need to pick the exact battlefields to defeat Hitler before you enter the war. Instead, you start a broad campaign with an overarching message and then adapt as the specific circumstances come along. As they say, no battle plan survives first contact with the enemy. Your problem is you're confusing strategy and tactics.

 

[maxiep]

There is a vocal Arab majority praising the death of Bin Laden too.

LINK

I disagree with your terms "vocal" and "majority". There is one muslim country that has offered its congratulations: Saudi Arabia. The others have remained silent. Why? In this Arab Spring, the governments are afraid of enraging their streets even more.

 

[MARIS61]

I disagree with your terms "vocal" and "majority". There is one muslim country that has offered its congratulations: Saudi Arabia. The others have remained silent. Why? In this Arab Spring, the governments are afraid of enraging their streets even more.

Ironically, or not, nearly everyone involved in the 9/11 plot was from Saudi Arabia.

 

[MARIS61]

The others have remained silent. Why? In this Arab Spring, the governments are afraid of enraging their streets even more.

Sounds like paranoia.

What's the big deal?

[video=youtube;t2fpDaxq9rA]

 

[Denny Crane]

Examples of what?

Is it seriously your belief that the popularity of lunch counters died out because white people couldn't keep black people from eating there?

I think the proliferation of fast food chain expansions at that time simply changed our lunch culture.

I remember eating at the Woolworth's lunch counter every August in the mid-60's with my Mom when we bussed into Portland to shop for school clothes. It made little sense to me when they started picketing the store because the stores in the south would not allow blacks. Here I had been lunching with blacks at their counter for several years. The problem was clearly not the store since there was no problem in Portland. The problem was the ignorant people who frequented stores in the south.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_flight

 

[PapaG]

Reminds me a lot of the imams in Minneapolis years ago.

Dress in traditional Arab garb, deliberately act suspicious on a flight, and you're going to get removed. Had a bunch of Evangelical rednecks wearing overalls and trucker hats used airplanes as bombs in 2001, and had numerous other acts of terrorism against Western and democratic targets attached to their lifestyle, the same would apply to them.

The imams should blame the terrorists within their own religion for making them social outcasts, IMO, instead of provoking innocent civilians into making them the victim, and then running to the media crying about it.

 

[PapaG]

Way to be, Tennessee.

Maybe I should have complained that I was uncomfortable with the dude reading the book of Mormon on my last flight from Hawaii to Portland and got his ass kicked off the flight.

Why? So you could prove that you're also a bigot? Except in the case of the Mormon gentlemen, there is no history of people reading the Book of Mormon, or affiliated with the Mormon, attacking Western targets with acts of terrorism, let alone by using an airplane.

So, not only would you be a bigot, but you wouldn't even a have an excuse (flimsy as it may be) for your bigotry.

In fact, reading your post, I can only assume that you're are a bigot, since obviously you singled out somebody for reading the book of Mormon. That you didn't act on your impulse doesn't make you any less of a bigot than those who had the imams removed for acting suspiciously.

 

[PapaG]

This isn't the first time that imams have been kicked off of a flight on their way to a 'conference'. Coincidental timing, I'm sure...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_imams_incident

 

[crandc]

Who isn't uncomfortable on planes?

Seriously. Can't say "gay" or be Muslim in Tennessee. Good old First Amendment!

 

[RR7]

Uhm, I'm sorry, how were they "deliberately acting suspicious"?

 

[PapaG]

Uhm, I'm sorry, how were they "deliberately acting suspicious"?

They had shifty eyes.

[video=youtube;T55ArHjeR1c]

 

[RR7]

shit, I would have wanted them off the plane too, then. Damn shifty eyes.

 

[Denny Crane]

This is America, dammit. We're supposed to be free to dress and worship as we choose. How a person dresses or if they appear Muslim is irrelevant.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Why? So you could prove that you're also a bigot? Except in the case of the Mormon gentlemen, there is no history of people reading the Book of Mormon, or affiliated with the Mormon, attacking Western targets with acts of terrorism, let alone by using an airplane.

So, not only would you be a bigot, but you wouldn't even a have an excuse (flimsy as it may be) for your bigotry.

In fact, reading your post, I can only assume that you're are a bigot, since obviously you singled out somebody for reading the book of Mormon. That you didn't act on your impulse doesn't make you any less of a bigot than those who had the imams removed for acting suspiciously.

Just keep talking, you might just dig yourself out of that stupid-hole you dug yourself.

 

[Ed O]

This is America, dammit. We're supposed to be free to dress and worship as we choose. How a person dresses or if they appear Muslim is irrelevant.

I agree.

I think that some level of prejudice is natural and unavoidable, but in a situation like on a plane--where everyone has gone through a security check, etc.--there's no excuse for anyone to be discriminated against.

If the pilot is the one that refused to do his job based on the attire of some passengers, I hope that he is fired.

Ed O.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

This is America, dammit. We're supposed to be free to dress and worship as we choose. How a person dresses or if they appear Muslim is irrelevant.

I agree.

I think that some level of prejudice is natural and unavoidable, but in a situation like on a plane--where everyone has gone through a security check, etc.--there's no excuse for anyone to be discriminated against.

Denny Crane and Ed O swoop in as the voices of reason.