Undocumented no longer. (they are just illegal, with IDs now).

[EL PRESIDENTE]

http://www.ktla.com/news/landing/ktla-villaraigosa-id-cards-illegal-immigrants,0,4507496.story

Los Angeles City Council members Wednesday gave enthusiastic backing to the creation of a controversial city identification card that could be used by illegal immigrants to open bank accounts, borrow library books and pay utility bills.

Councilman Ed Reyes called it a way for the city's poorest workers to "come out into the light."

While the federal government has failed to pass immigration reform, the city of Los Angeles is able to manage its own affairs, said Councilman Richard Alarcon, who along with Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa is a chief sponsor of the card plan.

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An ID card that would allow as many as 400,000 residents who now live in a cash economy to access banking services and learn the intricacies of finance is beneficial to everyone, Alarcon said, not just undocumented immigrants, who are expected to be the main benefactors.

I might get one with a fake name and open up a voodoo bank account.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

brought to you by your future Vice Presidente 2016, Antonio Villaraigosa!

 

[Further]

brought to you by your future Vice Presidente 2016, Antonio Villaraigosa!

No, he's a dolt. I know that Obama and others have looked into him for the national stage, but he would never make it through primaries. He is dumb and has lots of baggage. Also, LAis a mess

Edit: just noticed "vice". So no primaries. Could be, but I hope not, really don't like or trust him

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

No, he's a dolt. I know that Obama and others have looked into him for the national stage, but he would never make it through primaries. He is dumb and has lots of baggage. Also, LAis a mess

Edit: just noticed "vice". So no primaries. Could be, but I hope not, really don't like or trust him

LA is basically what America will look like eventually. I get into arguments with one of my friends who's involved in Latino media, he hates Tony Villar too....but we'l see what happens.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

oh, yeah, for those of you who don't know....

His last name was really "villar" but then combined it with his ex-wife, "Raigosa", when they got married. :MARIS61: Not sure if he'll run for governor, seems more like Gavin Newsom will do that..then go for the Presidency in 2020 or so. I'm thinking amnesty and immigration will be a MAJOR issue in the next election, so Villar will be there to get the bases all excited to let the illegals in.

MeCha will rise. LA RAZA! :MARIS61:

 

[bluefrog]

I'm thinking amnesty and immigration will be a MAJOR issue in the next election, so Villar will be there to get the bases all excited to let the illegals in.

MeCha will rise. LA RAZA! :MARIS61:

I don't think so. Even Sean Hannity is calling for amesty now.

 

[Denny Crane]

Republicans once owned California in the elections.

GHW Bush won California.
Reagan won it twice.
Gerald Ford won it against Carter.
Nixon won it twice.

WFT happened?

Republicans built a fence across the border with Mexico. They went into attack mode against "illegal" immigrants. It's gotten to the point they want to put troops and drones on the border and kick over 10M people out.

Strategically, hispanics could have been for the Republican party what blacks have been for the Democrats - a reliable constituency. Republicans and Hispanics were a lot closer aligned than Democrats and Hispanics were. Religion has played a strong role in Hispanic culture. Hispanics were opposed to abortion, which was a much bigger issue 30 years ago. Hispanics are culturally conservative.

If hispanics voted for Republicans in the same proportion that blacks vote for Democrats, Republicans would be winning the presidential elections by 3-6% every time.

But they shot themselves in the foot. I don't get it. I never did get it.

Hannity has a clue at least. If Republicans want to govern again soon, they're going to have to revisit their harsh stance on immigration.

 

[Denny Crane]

Interesting. I write the above post and then I see Hannity is now talking about amnesty and then I see this by Krauthammer:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...92e302-29d8-11e2-96b6-8e6a7524553f_story.html

The only part of this that is even partially true regards Hispanics. They should be a natural Republican constituency: striving immigrant community, religious, Catholic, family-oriented and socially conservative (on abortion, for example).

...

For the party in general, however, the problem is hardly structural. It requires but a single policy change: Border fence plus amnesty. Yes, amnesty. Use the word. Shock and awe — full legal normalization (just short of citizenship) in return for full border enforcement.

 

[Denny Crane]

And though it derails this thread slightly...

Krauthammer says "border fence plus amnesty." I say just drop the whole "illegal" part and just let people in. It's a free country. If people want to become citizens as well, let 'em apply and go through whatever process that involves.

 

[Minstrel]

I say just drop the whole "illegal" part and just let people in. It's a free country. If people want to become citizens as well, let 'em apply and go through whatever process that involves.

I agree with you on that.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

And though it derails this thread slightly...

Krauthammer says "border fence plus amnesty." I say just drop the whole "illegal" part and just let people in. It's a free country. If people want to become citizens as well, let 'em apply and go through whatever process that involves.

The thing is they dont want to apply and do it the right way.

{Poasted via palm pilot}

 

[Denny Crane]

The thing is they dont want to apply and do it the right way.

{Poasted via palm pilot}

I said let them all in. They're not citizens, but can live here. If they want to be citizens, they have to apply. No citizen, no right to vote.

 

[bluefrog]

I said let them all in. They're not citizens, but can live here. If they want to be citizens, they have to apply. No citizen, no right to vote.

What about the gangs and criminals?

 

[Denny Crane]

What about the gangs and criminals?

If they commit crimes, put them in jail.

It wouldn't hurt to legalize drugs. I bet most of the gangs would just disappear.

 

[mook]

Interesting. I write the above post and then I see Hannity is now talking about amnesty and then I see this by Krauthammer:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...92e302-29d8-11e2-96b6-8e6a7524553f_story.html

The only part of this that is even partially true regards Hispanics. They should be a natural Republican constituency: striving immigrant community, religious, Catholic, family-oriented and socially conservative (on abortion, for example).

...

For the party in general, however, the problem is hardly structural. It requires but a single policy change: Border fence plus amnesty. Yes, amnesty. Use the word. Shock and awe — full legal normalization (just short of citizenship) in return for full border enforcement.

I read that Krauthammer article earlier this morning, and although I generally disagree with his opinions it's hard to find fault.

Problem is that this has been more than a mere policy issue. Following the rules and paying the price every time when you don't is a core part of conservatism, and something I respect about it. (I personally believe the world is much more grey, but I understand that outlook.) Amnesty flies in the face of this core belief. It's pretty hard to brush it aside as mere policy.

But it's pretty clear you can only stand on principle so long while the other side continues to rack up wins. I suspect it's going to take another presidential election loss, but I could be wrong. Regardless, the meter is running. The best predictor of who you'll vote for next time is who you voted for last time. A generation of Latinos are developing voting habits as we speak.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I said let them all in. They're not citizens, but can live here. If they want to be citizens, they have to apply. No citizen, no right to vote.

What's going to happen then is the Chinese will send plane loads and plane loads of people here to fight their overcrowding.

It'll be like black Friday at Walmart at the US/Mexico Border. Total unregulated chaos.

 

[BlazerCaravan]

What's going to happen then is the Chinese will send plane loads and plane loads of people here to fight their overcrowding.

As opposed to just moving them into the entirely empty cities they keep building with their government money?

 

[Mediocre Man]

Maybe we should make PR our 51st state, ship them all there and have a real survivor tv show. Pay Per View, of course to help fund it.

 

[BlazerCaravan]

Maybe we should ship them all to Texas, fire all the police but let them keep their firearms, and have a real survivor tv show. Pay Per View, of course to help fund it.

FTFY. If you're going to go murder on them, go big.

 

[donkiez]

What's going to happen then is the Chinese will send plane loads and plane loads of people here to fight their overcrowding.

It'll be like black Friday at Walmart at the US/Mexico Border. Total unregulated chaos.

If they pay taxes I don't see it as a problem. A few other things should be changed to help this, like education reform. Make our public schools better and our Universities affordable and we wont be competing for the same jobs.

 

[Denny Crane]

I read that Krauthammer article earlier this morning, and although I generally disagree with his opinions it's hard to find fault.

Problem is that this has been more than a mere policy issue. Following the rules and paying the price every time when you don't is a core part of conservatism, and something I respect about it. (I personally believe the world is much more grey, but I understand that outlook.) Amnesty flies in the face of this core belief. It's pretty hard to brush it aside as mere policy.

But it's pretty clear you can only stand on principle so long while the other side continues to rack up wins. I suspect it's going to take another presidential election loss, but I could be wrong. Regardless, the meter is running. The best predictor of who you'll vote for next time is who you voted for last time. A generation of Latinos are developing voting habits as we speak.

I think traditionally there was no restriction on immigration. Immigration is a relatively new thing, circa the 1920s. The few immigration laws that were passed before the 1960s were all racially motivated. Can't let in any more jews or chinamen or whoever.

Republicans can and should consider denouncing the racist nature of immigration laws of any kind. That'd be the big win.

 

[Denny Crane]

If they pay taxes I don't see it as a problem. A few other things should be changed to help this, like education reform. Make our public schools better and our Universities affordable and we wont be competing for the same jobs.

Exactly. I am not talking about giving them the right to vote, so there's no such strategy for taking over the country.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

If they pay taxes I don't see it as a problem. A few other things should be changed to help this, like education reform. Make our public schools better and our Universities affordable and we wont be competing for the same jobs.

The problem is that illegals are usually low IQ and can't understand English. It'll drag down the schools dramatically. Its great if you need someone for a shovel ready job I guess, but nothing more.

It'll essentially be a swarm of locusts.

 

[Denny Crane]

The problem is that illegals are usually low IQ and can't understand English. It'll drag down the schools dramatically. Its great if you need someone for a shovel ready job I guess, but nothing more.

It'll essentially be a swarm of locusts.

We've had immigration since before we're a country and people who didn't speak english. The school system did just fine.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

We've had immigration since before we're a country and people who didn't speak english. The school system did just fine.

You can't take different circumstances of the past (which aren't even remotely the same) and apply them to the present climate and say "hey, it worked now..we are a nation of immigrants". That is complete and utter bullshit and you know it.

Like I said, these illegals aren't the "best of the best", they are the poor, uneducated and working class of Latin American countries. Those that are actually qualified to contribute more than being weed pickers or fast food workers are coming in through the right channels. If you open up the borders, you're going to get a flood of low income, low IQ people who can't speak english, like I said.

Look what's happening in LAUSD schools, its like 85% latino now, 2nd and 3rd generations from the illegals that came here...now they are at the schools fucking shit up big time. You can't send kids to the schools because the quality of education has been absolutely decimated & racked to shit. Like I said, it'll be like a swarm of locusts, maybe your comfy and rich beachside community is safe for now, but the more you pack in, the more they're going to invade and poison the systems all around.

but the taco stands are great.

 

[Denny Crane]

It's not utter bullshit, and immigrants of the past were dirt poor, uneducated, etc.

The makeup of the country should not be decided by some govt. panel of experts, but rather by who is actually here.

You simply describe why the education system is fucked up. So fix it.

And you don't need to be able to speak english to thrive here. You can learn rocket science or brain surgery in any language.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

It's not utter bullshit, and immigrants of the past were dirt poor, uneducated, etc.

The makeup of the country should not be decided by some govt. panel of experts, but rather by who is actually here.

You simply describe why the education system is fucked up. So fix it.

And you don't need to be able to speak english to thrive here. You can learn rocket science or brain surgery in any language.

the migration of immigrants was regulated. that's the current system. the influx of illegals bypasses this regulated migration.

And you absolutely do need to speak english to thrive here. unless you're rich enough to hire a translator. as far as the US is concerned, spanish is the language of the poor working class, not those that thrive.

 

[donkiez]

It's not utter bullshit, and immigrants of the past were dirt poor, uneducated, etc.

The makeup of the country should not be decided by some govt. panel of experts, but rather by who is actually here.

You simply describe why the education system is fucked up. So fix it.

And you don't need to be able to speak english to thrive here. You can learn rocket science or brain surgery in any language.

Totally agree here, our education system is fucked and needs an overhaul on what we are teaching. Most European countires require their students to learn at least two other languages, we should be doing the same. Kids learn this stuff fast. We should also be prioritizing personal finance, money managment, health, and nutrition. Birth control and realisitic drug education should be included in health. Increasing our physical education requirments wouldn't hurt either.

 

[Denny Crane]

I've been to chinatown and there are plenty of people who speak little or no english. Yet they thrive.

If the hispanic people you don't seem to like couldn't thrive here, they wouldn't want to come here.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Totally agree here, our education system is fucked and needs an overhaul on what we are teaching. Most European countires require their students to learn at least two other languages, we should be doing the same. Kids learn this stuff fast. We should also be prioritizing personal finance, money managment, health, and nutrition. Birth control and realisitic drug education should be included in health. Increasing our physical education requirments wouldn't hurt either.

The problem is that illegals are basically the dregs of other countries. They take their values and raise their kids on these and they get injected into the school systems.