Exclusive Welcome Zach Collins!

[HailBlazers]

Collins checks the most boxes when compared to Aminu, Davis, Swanigan, and Vonleh. It's just a matter of time.

If Collins becomes a reliable stretch four, Aminu could play the three and our defensive liabilities (Dame/CJ) would be mitigated.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Have we seen him next to Nurk much yet?

Not that I can remember. Swanigan has but I don't think Collins has. If Terry tries it.... it needs to be Wednesday. Time is running out for experiments.

 

[Pinwheel1]

The first or second preseason game. It was fun.

Really? I can't remember it. Regardless I would start him on wednesday just to see how it works in the starting line up. Then go with his final decision for the last preseason game.

 

[mook]

A taller version of Andre Kirilenko is the comparable I'm finally settling on. AK47 was more of a 4/3 because of his height, while Collins is more 4/5. But they both have great mobility, help defense, man defense, shot blocking, and a little (but not great) play making.

I think Collins will have a hard time beating Swanigan out. Biggie is just so active out there.

Swanigan is just so similar to Zach Randolph to me, and I'd love to have a young guy produce like Z-bo did.

But when you look at the overall fit on this team, would you rather a young Z-bo or a young AK47 for your four?

Especially the way the league is heading, I'd definitely prefer AK. Even if we had a guy who was 100% as good as Zach vs a guy who was only 75% as good as AK, I'd still go with the AK guy.

 

[tlongII]

A taller version of Andre Kirilenko is the comparable I'm finally settling on. AK47 was more of a 4/3 because of his height, while Collins is more 4/5. But they both have great mobility, help defense, man defense, shot blocking, and a little (but not great) play making.



Swanigan is just so similar to Zach Randolph to me, and I'd love to have a young guy produce like Z-bo did.

But when you look at the overall fit on this team, would you rather a young Z-bo or a young AK47 for your four?

Especially the way the league is heading, I'd definitely prefer AK. Even if we had a guy who was 100% as good as Zach vs a guy who was only 75% as good as AK, I'd still go with the AK guy.

I want the better player to start. Too early to tell who that is right now.

 

[BlazerCaravan]

A taller version of Andre Kirilenko is the comparable I'm finally settling on. AK47 was more of a 4/3 because of his height, while Collins is more 4/5. But they both have great mobility, help defense, man defense, shot blocking, and a little (but not great) play making.



Swanigan is just so similar to Zach Randolph to me, and I'd love to have a young guy produce like Z-bo did.

But when you look at the overall fit on this team, would you rather a young Z-bo or a young AK47 for your four?

Especially the way the league is heading, I'd definitely prefer AK. Even if we had a guy who was 100% as good as Zach vs a guy who was only 75% as good as AK, I'd still go with the AK guy.

What I love is that we have both right now. And if Dame can get them to buy into the bench mob, we'll get really good really quick.

 

[mook]

What I love is that we have both right now.

Definitely. Last year we just got creamed at the PF position, night in and night out. We'd go 10 or 12 games in a row without once winning that battle.

Stotts at least has lots of decent options this year--ironically more than at any other position on the team. We're just bound to hit on something that works.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

I want the better player to start. Too early to tell who that is right now.

Too simplistic a view. "Better player" varies with situation. It's arguable that Swanigan might be the "better player", but that his advantage is primarily offensive, which is less important in the starting lineup alongside Dame/CJ/Nurk, whereas Collins' defensive abilities can make him the more effective player at the starting 4.

 

[BBert]

thats why we need to see them play together Casey, before we say they cant play together right now
Nurk and Jokic never got the chance to play together and yet they say they couldnt play together

if you dont try it, how can you know...

No kidding. I think Collins will be the teams best fit with Nurk before the end of the season. We'll see.

 

[blue9]

No kidding. I think Collins will be the teams best fit with Nurk before the end of the season. We'll see.

Hopefully before the start of the season!
As much as I like Biggie, there is only one choice at starting PF.

 

[tlongII]

Too simplistic a view. "Better player" varies with situation. It's arguable that Swanigan might be the "better player", but that his advantage is primarily offensive, which is less important in the starting lineup alongside Dame/CJ/Nurk, whereas Collins' defensive abilities can make him the more effective player at the starting 4.

Swanigan might have a rebounding advantage as well. I like a team that dominates the boards. Collins is a good rebounder too though.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Swanigan might have a rebounding advantage as well. I like a team that dominates the boards. Collins is a good rebounder too though.

No argument there--I'd agree that Swanigan is a superior rebounder, mostly due to his "motor", which is honestly another reason why he probably should come off the bench. "High motor" guys are generally better suited for quick-stint roles, so that their effectiveness can be maximized over the time that they're on the floor. It's arguable that Swanigan--despite his legendary work ethic--could see his effectiveness begin to tail off later in the game if he's going "all-out" for every loose ball for 25-30 minutes per game, especially later in the season, when the grind of the NBA schedule begins to wear on him. We might be better off--at least early in his career--with limiting him to 15-20 mpg, in two shifts per game (each of which span a quarter break), allowing him to go "full Caleb" for the entirety of his minutes.

All speculation, of course, but it's a thought.

 

[Natebishop3]

No argument there--I'd agree that Swanigan is a superior rebounder, mostly due to his "motor", which is honestly another reason why he probably should come off the bench. "High motor" guys are generally better suited for quick-stint roles, so that their effectiveness can be maximized over the time that they're on the floor. It's arguable that Swanigan--despite his legendary work ethic--could see his effectiveness begin to tail off later in the game if he's going "all-out" for every loose ball for 25-30 minutes per game, especially later in the season, when the grind of the NBA schedule begins to wear on him. We might be better off--at least early in his career--with limiting him to 15-20 mpg, in two shifts per game (each of which span a quarter break), allowing him to go "full Caleb" for the entirety of his minutes.

All speculation, of course, but it's a thought.

That's my feeling as well. And he can play with Davis because he can step out and shoot, or he can slide into the paint if he's playing with Meyers, and fill more of a center style position.

 

[Eastoff]

thats why we need to see them play together Casey, before we say they cant play together right now
Nurk and Jokic never got the chance to play together and yet they say they couldnt play together

if you dont try it, how can you know...

There fact that Casey thinks it's not possible is unsettling to me.

 

[BBert]

I definitely want to see Collins start at PF with Swanigan off the bench. Not a knock on Swanigan at all. I just think he'll be highly effective in that role, and Collins will be effective as a starter next to Nurk.

 

[BlazerCaravan]

I definitely want to see Collins start at PF with Swanigan off the bench. Not a knock on Swanigan at all. I just think he'll be highly effective in that role, and Collins will be effective as a starter next to Nurk.

I was on the C-Bo To Start train but now I’m all over the Collins train. They’re both great but Zach has shown a bit more dynamism to his game which makes that starting gig more his thing to take.

 

[dviss1]

There fact that Casey thinks it's not possible is unsettling to me.

Why?

This is just his opinion which is just as valuable as any of ours IMO.

 

[e_blazer]

There fact that Casey thinks it's not possible is unsettling to me.

He didn't say it wasn't possible, he just said he didn't know how good of a fit Collins would be with Nurk in the starting line-up. He doesn't give a reason, but it could be as simple as him thinking that Collins is just too inexperienced for that role at this point. I mean, Nurk's only 21 and this will be his first full season of starting for the Blazers. You could argue that having either Davis or Aminu as the starter is a better move until both Nurk and Collins get a little more experience.

 

[The Professional Fan]

I'm all in on the Collins starting at PF train. Choooo Choooo

It just seems to fit right for what we need out of our starting 5 and maybe more importantly what Biggie can bring to our bench.

 

[Sinobas]

I think Collins will have a hard time beating Swanigan out. Biggie is just so active out there.

I think Swanigan is being over-hyped. He looks like he can be a decent backup. But it's not like he's much of an inside scoring threat, and he'd be a liability defensively on the perimeter, and isn't big or athletic enough to be much of a rim protector.

 

[Sinobas]

A taller version of Andre Kirilenko is the comparable I'm finally settling on. AK47 was more of a 4/3 because of his height, while Collins is more 4/5. But they both have great mobility, help defense, man defense, shot blocking, and a little (but not great) play making.



Swanigan is just so similar to Zach Randolph to me, and I'd love to have a young guy produce like Z-bo did.

But when you look at the overall fit on this team, would you rather a young Z-bo or a young AK47 for your four?

Especially the way the league is heading, I'd definitely prefer AK. Even if we had a guy who was 100% as good as Zach vs a guy who was only 75% as good as AK, I'd still go with the AK guy.

Ha! I coined that comparison during the first pre-season game. I think Collins will be a much better shooter though, and of course, being 7-1 is going to make him more of a defensive presence inside. He reminded me of AK47 because of his length and how quick/agile he was defensively, good instincts to bother defenders and challenge shots.

Zach was a monster in the low post though, which is something I"ve not seen from Swanigan.

 

[dviss1]

I think Swanigan is being over-hyped. He looks like he can be a decent backup. But it's not like he's much of an inside scoring threat, and he'd be a liability defensively on the perimeter, and isn't big or athletic enough to be much of a rim protector.

Stop. There has been no Swanigan "hype". People are getting excited by what they SEE him do on the court.

Also, perimeter defense and rim protection weren't the reasons we drafted him.

 

[handiman]

Disclaimer: I've yet to watch a SL or preseason game in its entirety. Just a few highlights here and there.

With that said, I'm not surprised people have cooled a little bit on Swanigan. Not to the point of being down on him, by any means, but not quite the unbridled enthusiasm of a month ago. The reason being my earlier voiced concern that he looked too slow in college to defend in the NBA, so I was withholding judgement on his strong SL play until seeing him up against the real next level of competition.

There's no questioning his heart, but I do have reservations about his mobility keeping him from being more than "just" a fan favorite, blue collar, hustle player.

 

[Sinobas]

Stop. There has been no Swanigan "hype". People are getting excited by what they SEE him do on the court.

Also, perimeter defense and rim protection weren't the reasons we drafted him.

I'm watching him too, but see somehow who could be a decent rotational player, but not a guy that is who you say "wow we found our piece at PF". He seems more like a Dante Cunningham level player to me.

 

[Scalma]

I'm watching him too, but see somehow who could be a decent rotational player, but not a guy that is who you say "wow we found our piece at PF". He seems more like a Dante Cunningham level player to me.

The cool thing is neither opinion is right or wrong. We'll find out. I feel like his defensive concerns are more a narrative than something based on his play. I haven't seen him struggle that much on that side, and certainly not enough to be considered a liability. But like I said, we'll find out.

 

[Sinobas]

The cool thing is neither opinion is right or wrong. We'll find out. I feel like his defensive concerns are more a narrative than something based on his play. I haven't seen him struggle that much on that side, and certainly not enough to be considered a liability. But like I said, we'll find out.

This is a good breakdown of his defensive issues. And while he has a nice jump shot for a big man, he's got no post game.

 

[Scalma]

Can make anyone look the way you want editing clips together.

And yes he struggles on the perimeter. That's nothing new. There are ways to hide that.

 

[Sinobas]

Can make anyone look the way you want editing clips together.

And yes he struggles on the perimeter. That's nothing new. There are ways to hide that.

Right, but that wasn't a "hit piece" it's meant to be a thorough analysis. He concludes that Caleb is a good pick at #26. Swanigan is 6-8, and not fleet-a-foot, so I think you can imagine how his defensive issues are legit.

 

[Scalma]

Right, but that wasn't a "hit piece" it's meant to be a thorough analysis. He concludes that Caleb is a good pick at #26. Swanigan is 6-8, and not fleet-a-foot, so I think you can imagine how his defensive issues are legit.

Against guards and wings sure. He's an old school four. He can bang against the Favors of the league. Against smaller teams we can move him to the five. His length and strength has bothered guys in the preseason. Yes he has weaknesses, but he also has strengths. He's smart. He's got long arms. He's strong. He's a worker. I don't believe that he'll be a negative on defense. Just my opinion.

 

[tester551]

It's interesting to me that a lot of us really like the idea of Collins starting with Caleb coming off the bench.

If so many of us 'fans' can see it, why can't the coaching staff?