What I'd Change Next Game Is...

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

Our "Twin Tower" lineup got outscored by 1 point tonight.

Then why did Nate bother to take a timeout just to get the substitution?

That timeout was wasted it seems..but it was just to quickly correct his mistake in sub patterns....he had to get LaMarcus in there because the offense was stagnant with two low post centers. If you had watched the game, you would have seen it, but again with the box-score junkies.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

To ignore the consequences of not taking a timeout earlier the game would be equally idiotic. If Nate felt like he needed a timeout to stop a problem he's seeing being repeated or to take advantage of something the Rockets were giving us, then it's just as valuable in the 2nd quarter as it is with 10 seconds left in the 4th quarter.

The timeout he took to replace Pryzbilla with LMA was to correct his substitution mistakes in playing the "twin towers". Yao was minimially effective..the Blazers were losing by the Rocket's jump shot...why would he want to do a defensive lineup to contain what is not an offensive threat?

Before we dismiss second guessing his moves, it is important to provide justification for them...because it didn't make any sense from my perspective.

 

[bigbailes]

tince, i'm not sure why we can't blame this loss on nate? he sat rudy when he was the only one hitting, he used up all his timeouts when one would have been really nice to have instead of blake throwing up the ugly ass shot he did and all in all he has been out coached in this series.

once again, show some passion nate. get a T for your guys, they are getting raped on alot of these callls but you stand there with your arms folded and you don't do jack shit. i'm tired of it. this is playoff basketball, the rockets weren't pleased that game 2 wasn't called for them like game 1 was. what did they do? they bitched and moaned, and conincidence or not, they got the majority of the calls tonight. this is how the game is played, play it or get the hell off our sideline.

 

[alex42083]

This is simple to me. If Scola continues to outplay or neutralize LaMarcus, it's over for us. No way should Scola be outplaying LaMarcus, but he is. This is on LaMarcus. Win or lose, it's on him.

I thought before the series that this would be LaMarcus' coming out party where he'd really show he belongs among the top PFs in the game.
This was his chance to shine in the national spotlight, but instead, he's sort of wilted under the pressure of being the No. 2 guy on this team. Brandon cannot do this all by himself, and Aldridge needs to man up and play like he did at the end of the regular season.

We need him to be a consistent option, and right now, he's running really hot or really really cold offensively.

 

[B-Roy]

Contest some damn shots. Get out to shooters, why can't we do these things?

 

[Tince]

Then why did Nate bother to take a timeout just to get the substitution?

That timeout was wasted it seems..but it was just to quickly correct his mistake in sub patterns....he had to get LaMarcus in there because the offense was stagnant with two low post centers. If you had watched the game, you would have seen it, but again with the box-score junkies.

Do you have a link or an interview that says he took that timeout to make a substitution? Or do you assume anytime a substitution is made during a timeout, that's why the timeout was called?

You seem to throw out a lot of statements without any proof, in hopes that nobody will call BS. For instance, you implied I never watched the game and only look at boxscores. I haven't seen a box score, and I've watched the game twice already.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

Do you have a link or an interview that says he took that timeout to make a substitution? Or do you assume anytime a substitution is made during a timeout, that's why the timeout was called?

You seem to throw out a lot of statements without any proof, in hopes that nobody will call BS. For instance, you implied I never watched the game and only look at boxscores. I haven't seen a box score, and I've watched the game twice already.

Aldridge and Outlaw were at the sidelines waiting to check in. As you said, the blazers were only outscored by one point. You must have an excellent...almost photographic memory to recall that the Rockets outscored the Blazers by one point when the twin towers were in there for that short period of time.

When the game was happening, I knew they had to get that twin towers lineup out of there...there was no stoppage of plays and I am just assuming that Nate had to use it up to make a lineup change.

 

[Tince]

tince, i'm not sure why we can't blame this loss on nate? he sat rudy when he was the only one hitting, he used up all his timeouts when one would have been really nice to have instead of blake throwing up the ugly ass shot he did and all in all he has been out coached in this series.

You can blame Nate, I just don't agree. I'd rather blame Outlaw, Roy, and Aldridge for not converting a lot of easy opportunities. I also think you can lose a game without blaming anyone, but rather, give credit to the winning team for making plays on the offensive or defensive ends.

 

[Tince]

Aldridge and Outlaw were at the sidelines waiting to check in. As you said, the blazers were only outscored by one point. You must have an excellent...almost photographic memory to recall that the Rockets outscored the Blazers by one point when the twin towers were in there for that short period of time.

When the game was happening, I knew they had to get that twin towers lineup out of there...there was no stoppage of plays and I am just assuming that Nate had to use it up to make a lineup change.

The twin towers lineup came in around the 10:30 mark in the 4th quarter. There was a TV timeout at the 8:50 mark, so he easily could have taken one of them out there.

I think it's much more logical to assume that Nate would rather have LMA in at PF than either Greg or Joel. However, LMA gets his normal rest at the start of the 2nd and 4th quarter. It's possible he thought the team would be better off not waiting a few possessions for a dead ball to get LMA in, but that doesn't mean he thought the twin towers lineup was a total disaster. It's possible he wanted to change the tempo of the game. I don't know what he was thinking, but they certainly outscored Houston after that point, so whatever adjustment was made seemed to be a good one. If LMA could have played the entire 2nd half, maybe he wouldn't have had the twin towers in, and we would have had an extra timeout. Maybe we should blame LMA for not being in the best shape ever, and not being able to go for 24 minutes in the 2nd half. I don't think that makes sense either, but all these options are possibilities that we don't know the answer to. It's foolish to assume that the one we want to believe is the gospel and state it as fact.

 

[Tince]

Listen to Jeff Van Gundy when Aaron Brook is shooting free throws with 2.7 seconds left. "Far too many people criticize coaches for not having timeouts left at the end of the game. If Nate hadn't used those timeouts earlier, they wouldn't even be in the game now." It's amazing that he said exactly what I've been saying, especially for someone who "only looks at boxscores".

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

According to the ESPN box-score (I don't have access to the game now), Greg came in at 9:19.

To me, the Twin Towers made zero sense in a game where Yao ming is not scoring the basketball and Greg/Joel were doing fine on covering him. What I saw was a situation where the Rockets were doing well from the mid-long range jumpshot all game. That was on the defensive side of things. Offensively, both Oden and Joel cannot shoot midrange jump shots. Why would you have two guys like that, the Rockets will not play honest defense if they draw outside and if they are down on the block, they clog the middle. Just led to some very strange matchups...and at the time was quite puzzling.

What ended up happening is that

Also, when they are in somewhat of foul trouble, having them both in isn't the best move either because you have a situation where you may run out of leverage if they do foul.

This is what I said in the game thread at the time:

http://sportstwo.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2000760&postcount=444

they just did it to get LMA and TROUT back into the game, the offense is stagnant with two low post centers..they need to draw the defenders out with a midrange threat. When you have the PF and C down low guarding GREG and Joel, you can't run a screen and roll for Greg anymore since the extra defender is in the paint

What happened the next play when they had that midrange threat? Blake got an easy, uncontested layup because Aldridge's defender was out guarding Aldridge on the mid-range perimeter area instead of the low block. .

 

[bigbailes]

i am all for giving the rockets their due when they beat us because of them. you didn't hear me bitching about the officals or any of that other crap after game 1. they beat us that game fair and simple.

tonight they didn't beat us. we beat ourselves from the get go and nate is a major factor in this beating. just how i see it.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

Listen to Jeff Van Gundy when Aaron Brook is shooting free throws with 2.7 seconds left. "Far too many people criticize coaches for not having timeouts left at the end of the game. If Nate hadn't used those timeouts earlier, they wouldn't even be in the game now." It's amazing that he said exactly what I've been saying, especially for someone who "only looks at boxscores".

A time out would have VERY LIKELY gotten a better shot than a rushed airball. They could have drawn a potential game-typing 3 at that time.

Which time outs was he referring to, specifically? If you said that there was a TV timeout at about the 8 minute mark, why would Nate take a full about a minute later? To stop some kind of flow to the game?

 

[Tince]

If the 9:20 mark is the same point Yao came into the game, then that is correct. I haven't looked at box score, so I'm sure you're right.

Your point about the next possession being successful makes me think that it was wise for Nate to use that timeout. I think we would all agree that that the second LMA was rested, it made more sense to have him in at PF as opposed to Joel or Greg.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

Here is Hollinger's analysis:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dime-090425

The one really interesting part is that we've yet to see much of Blazer coach Nate McMillans' favorite tactic: going small. With Yao Ming in the opposing lineup, Portland has been understandably reluctant to guard him with undersized players.

Yet at this point, he may need to damn the torpedoes and give it a whirl. Right now the Rockets can crowd the paint with Yao in the middle, because he doesn't have to respect the threat of Joel Przybilla or Greg Oden shooting jump shots. As a result, Roy has company any time he turns the corner.

But that all changes if McMillan goes small, and he's had success with it over the past two years. On a per-minute basis, one of Portland's most effective lineups this season has been playing Aldridge at center and Outlaw at power forward, with Roy, Blake and Fernandez on the perimeter.

That look has five shooters, so the Rockets have to stay honest; when Portland uses it and sets up Roy out high with the ball, opponents must pick the poison of allowing Roy to drive to the hoop or giving up a high-quality look from one of Portland's other shooters. Fernandez in particular was the one Blazer who proved deadly tonight, nailing five triples and scoring 17 points on just nine shots to keep them in the game.

Yet Portland seems so hung up on stopping Yao that it hasn't figured out how to attack him. The Blazers played in front of and behind him in the early going, essentially conceding a series of wide-open jumpers to forward Luis Scola and Carl Landry (29 points combined) before tightening their D in the second half.

But at the offensive end, Yao has been allowed to play free safety with impunity, utterly disregarding Przybilla and Oden while waiting for Roy to come off the turn on screen-and-rolls. He's controlling the glass too -- the Blazers were the league's best offensive rebounding team in the regular season, but retrieved only nine of their 41 misses Friday; for the series, they've grabbed just 24.2 percent of their misses.

 

[Tince]

i am all for giving the rockets their due when they beat us because of them. you didn't hear me bitching about the officals or any of that other crap after game 1. they beat us that game fair and simple.

tonight they didn't beat us. we beat ourselves from the get go and nate is a major factor in this beating. just how i see it.

Agree to disagree? Let's get them in game 4!

Hopefully Nate makes all the right decisions, our players hit all their open shots and follow the gameplan, and the ball bounces our way on Sunday night.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

If the 9:20 mark is the same point Yao came into the game, then that is correct. I haven't looked at box score, so I'm sure you're right.

Your point about the next possession being successful makes me think that it was wise for Nate to use that timeout. I think we would all agree that that the second LMA was rested, it made more sense to have him in at PF as opposed to Joel or Greg.

I knew he had to take that timeout...he made a mistake and had to correct it. While the rockets may have only outscored them by one, the feel and flow of the game was quite bad...clogged lane.

 

[Tince]

Here is Hollinger's analysis:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dime-090425

The section you put in bold made no mention of the twin-tower lineup. All he is talking about is how Greg OR Joel are always in the game, so Yao can always be in the key. This entire time we've been talking about the twin tower lineup, and I have yet to see you mention that we shouldn't have either of them in the game.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

The section you put in bold made no mention of the twin-tower lineup. All he is talking about is how Greg OR Joel are always in the game, so Yao can always be in the key. This entire time we've been talking about the twin tower lineup, and I have yet to see you mention that we shouldn't have either of them in the game.

IMO, the problems are exacerbated if both are in there. Both are there just to stop Yao..however, then we are missing a midrange shooter offensively while the middle is clogged up or the defenders can cheat a bit and help out on the wings.

When the blazers are on defense, what good is it to protect the low post when the Rockets are not really running a low post offense? It leads to more spacing for the jump shooters.

 

[Tince]

I knew he had to take that timeout...he made a mistake and had to correct it. While the rockets may have only outscored them by one, the feel and flow of the game was quite bad...clogged lane.

You know why you think he had to take the timeout. You don't know if he took it because he thought the twin tower lineup was horrible (after being outscored by 1 point) or if LMA was finally rested and he wanted to get him in ASAP because he feels LMA is a better power-forward than Joel or Greg.

I think you are mistaking the difference between "knowing" something and "thinking" something. You thought it was a bad lineup, and you think that is why he took the timeout. You nor I have any proof of why he took the timeout. I personally think it was to get his 2nd best player in the game who was getting his only 3 minutes of rest and was not a reflection of his dislike towards the Joel and Greg being on the floor together. I can't prove that I'm right, and likewise, you can't prove that you are right.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

You know why you think he had to take the timeout. You don't know if he took it because he thought the twin tower lineup was horrible (after being outscored by 1 point) or if LMA was finally rested and he wanted to get him in ASAP because he feels LMA is a better power-forward than Joel or Greg.

I think you are mistaking the difference between "knowing" something and "thinking" something. You thought it was a bad lineup, and you think that is why he took the timeout. You nor I have any proof of why he took the timeout. I personally think it was to get his 2nd best player in the game who was getting his only 3 minutes of rest and was not a reflection of his dislike towards the Joel and Greg being on the floor together. I can't prove that I'm right, and likewise, you can't prove that you are right.

uhhh...yeah, we're relatively anonymous message board posters, we can only speculate on anything really. I thought it was assumed that everyone's post was an opinion, not a fact???? what, should I put some disclosre on every post that the words in my post cannot be proven...perhaps some kind of legal disclaimer? Please, its just casual sports talk.

 

[Tince]

IMO, the problems are exacerbated if both are in there. Both are there just to stop Yao..however, then we are missing a midrange shooter offensively while the middle is clogged up or the defenders can cheat a bit and help out on the wings.

When the blazers are on defense, what good is it to protect the low post when the Rockets are not really running a low post offense? It leads to more spacing for the jump shooters.

I think we agree on this. I'm not defending the twin tower lineup either.

I actually think our best offensive lineup would have LMA at the 5, pull Yao out of the key competely. I think having Greg or Joel is there allows Yao to stay in the key at all times, which is causing Roy and Aldridge tons of problems in the paint.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

I think we agree on this. I'm not defending the twin tower lineup either.

I actually think our best offensive lineup would have LMA at the 5, pull Yao out of the key competely. I think having Greg or Joel is there allows Yao to stay in the key at all times, which is causing Roy and Aldridge tons of problems in the paint.

I'm still putting a lot of blame on Nate for these losses. The offense looked absolutely rank. The thing was, ESPN panned to him 2 or 3 times where he essentially told the Blazers they needed to stop going one-on-one..yet they weren't really listening....the execution was horrible.

Its really sad that we only played one point guard the entire game in a game where the offense was stagnant.

Travis Outlaw should not have gotten 11 shots in that game. Rudy Fernandez deserved a LOT more playing time...

I just don't get Nate McMillian right now. I really don't. He seems to be getting severely outcoached here.

 

[Tince]

uhhh...yeah, we're relatively anonymous message board posters, we can only speculate on anything really. I thought it was assumed that everyone's post was an opinion, not a fact???? what, should I put some disclosre on every post that the words in my post cannot be proven...perhaps some kind of legal disclaimer? Please, its just casual sports talk.

Message boards are full of both facts and opinions. The way you described your opinion came across to me as something you thought was fact, so I guess that is what I took objection to, especially since I didn't believe your opinion/fact to be true. I love your passion for your opinion, and more importantly, I love breaking down the game with someone such as yourself.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

well, after games like tonight, I can't sleep and I'm in an agressive mood as well.

 

[Tince]

I'm still putting a lot of blame on Nate for these losses. The offense looked absolutely rank. The thing was, ESPN panned to him 2 or 3 times where he essentially told the Blazers they needed to stop going one-on-one..yet they weren't really listening....the execution was horrible.

Its really sad that we only played one point guard the entire game in a game where the offense was stagnant.

Is that's a player issue then? If Nate is telling them to do something, and the player is choosing to do another, how is that on the coach?

If my teacher tells me 2+2=4, and then I take a test and say 2+2=3, is that the teachers fault? The teacher gave me all the information I need to do the right thing, but I failed to listen.

The players know exactly what Nate is saying when he says don't go 1:1, so if they continue to do so, they should be the ones who are at fault.

I guess this is where we are miles apart. I agree with more of the Utah philosophy where they tell incoming players that they are playing for Jerry Sloan, and if there is ever a conflict between the player and the coach, the player is the one who will be leaving.

You seem to like the Atlanta Hawk philosophy of, if you (the player) doesn't respect the coach, we'll just keep changing coaches until we find one that has the respect of the players.

 

[Tince]

well, after games like tonight, I can't sleep and I'm in an agressive mood as well.

Likewise, I hate when we lose! I don't think I get as angry as you (referring to your OT thread), but it burns me for sure.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

The thing is, he seems so set on his rotations, that even when they don't listen, he will not pull them. Even when a lineup doesn't make sense (i.e. Twin Towers), he'll throw it in there just to say he did. They were just taking god-awful shots in the first half, many weren't dropping. I would have loved to see what Sergio could do out there...Rudy only getting limited minutes was just sad. He was nailing all those 3s....he needs to be a bigger part of this team.

I'm not on a fire nate bandwagon, but we can't give him these freebies when he can't get his house in order. You are measured by your results...and he needs to get past the first round either this year or next, or I am pretty certain he won't have a job in Portland after that. I like the guy and want him to succeed but he needs to step it up. I never expected 54 wins and maybe I'm expecting too much of the blazers...but fuck it, its the playoffs...win or go home.

Perhaps the next game will be different but as I posted somewhere else here tonight to an older thread, he AVOIDED going over Game 1 tape at practice after that loss...rather focusing on "working hard"...and the problems come back. The blazers have to be more mentally ready than they have been. Slow starts, long periods of the game of not scoring and confused offense.

 

[Tince]

The thing is, he seems so set on his rotations, that even when they don't listen, he will not pull them. Even when a lineup doesn't make sense (i.e. Twin Towers), he'll throw it in there just to say he did. They were just taking god-awful shots in the first half, many weren't dropping. I would have loved to see what Sergio could do out there...Rudy only getting limited minutes was just sad. He was nailing all those 3s....he needs to be a bigger part of this team.

I'm not on a fire nate bandwagon, but we can't give him these freebies when he can't get his house in order. You are measured by your results...and he needs to get past the first round either this year or next, or I am pretty certain he won't have a job in Portland after that. I like the guy and want him to succeed but he needs to step it up. I never expected 54 wins and maybe I'm expecting too much of the blazers...but fuck it, its the playoffs...win or go home.

Perhaps the next game will be different but as I posted somewhere else here tonight to an older thread, he AVOIDED going over Game 1 tape at practice after that loss...rather focusing on "working hard"...and the problems come back. The blazers have to be more mentally ready than they have been. Slow starts, long periods of the game of not scoring and confused offense.

I really do understand what you are saying, and I think it's valid opinion, I just don't agree with you. Having played and coached, I understand the importance of set rotations. I know what it feels like to tell a team to do something over and over, and it seems like they understand it, they tell me they get it, but then come game time, one person, or a couple people screw it up. Then I get to hear someone in the stands say "why don't they work on their zone offense?" Guess what buddy, we worked on our zone offense for a freaking hour yesterday, and that is not how we ran it or taught it yesterday in practice. There are also instances where opposing coaches made great adjustments.

I can only imagine at this level, you have the brightest coaches in the world, watching hours of film, and trying to take advantage of anything you might do. Sometimes another team has the personnel, experience, or talent that make you feel like you are helpless as a coach.

And to your watching film of Game 1; they did end up watching film, just not the next day. They waited until before Monday's practice to go over film, so it's not like he ignored it completely. I read the same article you did, so I know why you think they never watched film. That's the problem with only reading one news outlet, it sometimes they are wrong, but you don't know any better than to believe them. From there, you take some professional journalists misinformation, hold it against the coach, and consequentially look misinformed yourself.

 

[AgentDrazenPetrovic]

well, they came out with the same energy and many of the same mistakes, so it was easy to assume they didn't learn anything.