What if Thibs is available?

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The latest on Thibodeau:

General manager Gar Forman has said consistently he and top basketball executive John Paxson make all decisions based on what's best for the franchise and the players. Forman has applied this even for unpopular decisions, like not renewing assistant coach Ron Adams' contract in 2013.

That's the same premise underlying the decision on Thibodeau, whose outside options appear to be drying up.

A few years ago, management changed its player exit meeting process. Instead of performing them in rushed, 10-minute chunks the day after a season-ending loss, which most teams do and the Bulls used to, they are spread out over time.

Emotions cool. Conversation is more relaxed. In this format, some meetings can stretch into hours, not minutes.

Here's guessing how players feel about Thibodeau got discussed with most if not all players, several of whom offered public support for Thibodeau after the season-ending loss. But multiple sources said Thibodeau also experienced more player pushback this season. Thibodeau's "who's in and who's out of the circle" postgame speech after a desultory January home loss still remains memorable.

The Bulls' coaching history has featured some wild twists and turns. Who can forget Scott Skiles' agent saying in June 2005 that "the way (Chairman Jerry Reinsdorf) does business is insulting" as he exasperatedly called off contract talks and then Skiles signing a three-year extension the next day? Or all signs pointing to Doug Collins returning for a second stint as coach until he and Reinsdorf, citing their friendship, nixed it and Vinny Del Negro arrived in 2008?

Things can change unexpectedly in the NBA, though signs continue to point to Thibodeau's exit. What won't change, whenever a conclusion on Thibodeau's future is reached, is Forman saying the decision was made with the best interests of the franchise in mind.
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So they are going to drag it out until there are no other coaching openings and then shit-can him? Pretty dirty. Of course he probably couldn't prove it but that would be worth a grievance against the team if so.
 
KeepOnRollin said:
So they are going to drag it out until there are no other coaching openings and then shit-can him? Pretty dirty. Of course he probably couldn't prove it but that would be worth a grievance against the team if so.
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What doesn't make sense about that is, the Bulls owe him about 9 million over the next 2 years. If they fire him now, and he signs on for 4-5 million to coach a different team, they basically are off the hook for his salary, with it offsetting. If they wait until there are no jobs, they have to pay him for the season. A personal vendetta that'll cost them 4.5 million dollars. Brilliant.
 
More:

The game of chicken is starting to get ugly.

According to a Bulls player, last week’s exit interviews between the players and the front office was “open season on Thibs,’’ as the suits had no problem making their displeasure with coach Tom Thibodeau known by the line of questions and discussions they had with on-the-court personnel with the season over.

“I’d be shocked if Thibs is back,’’ the player said.

The dirty pool hasn’t stopped there, either.

According to a league source, Thibodeau is under the belief that the Bulls will do all they can to make sure he’s not coaching in the NBA next season by letting the current job vacancies continue being filled up, and then dismissing him with two years left on his contract.

When the season was coming to an end, there was the belief that the Bulls would look to trade Thibodeau for a draft pick, hoping to add an asset for the inevitable. However, the league source said they were asking for outrageous demands for the rights to the coach, knowing that there would either be no takers or one that would simply overpay.

The three vacancies going into this week were Orlando, Denver and New Orleans, but according to the source, Thibodeau knew since the weekend that Scott Skiles would be named the Magic coach and wasn’t really hearing anything about any interest from the Nuggets through back channels.

With the Pelicans not having a first-round pick in this year’s draft as an immediate asset, as well as New Orleans seemingly not waiting on a decision from the Bulls on Thibodeau, the clock is not in Thibodeau’s favor on that front, either.

While it would seem that $9 million over the next two years to sit around and do nothing would be an ideal situation for most, Thibodeau isn’t most. Coaching is what he does, his passion. He is willing to sit a season if need be and see what the market brings, but it’s not ideal for him.
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What I don't get about this is why "waiting for the vacancies to fill" is supposed to keep him out of a job. Plenty of teams would gladly fire their current coach to get Thibs. It's certainly not unprecedented. Larry Brown got positions that way.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
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What I don't get about this is why "waiting for the vacancies to fill" is supposed to keep him out of a job. Plenty of teams would gladly fire their current coach to get Thibs. It's certainly not unprecedented. Larry Brown got positions that way.
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It was reported that Orlando was willing to pay him $8M-$9M/year and give him personnel decisions.

Bulls management is so arrogant they don't want to look like they're firing a guy making $4M who's worth $9M everywhere else and in high demand.
 
Thibs really ought to just go on the offensive, start making public comments about Bulls' management, or even publicly state that he'll refuse to coach in Chicago next season. Basically give Reinsdorf no option except to fire him ASAP.
 
Every time the Bulls look like they're heading in the right direction, they step on their own dick.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Thibs really ought to just go on the offensive, start making public comments about Bulls' management, or even publicly state that he'll refuse to coach in Chicago next season. Basically give Reinsdorf no option except to fire him ASAP.
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I don't think he wants to give the Bulls cause to terminate the contract.
 
Denny Crane said:
I don't think he wants to give the Bulls cause to terminate the contract.
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If termination of the contract leads to a new deal with a new team for significantly more, he'd come out ahead.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
If termination of the contract leads to a new deal with a new team for significantly more, he'd come out ahead.
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He's taking the high road while the Bulls take the low one. I think teams would rather hire a gentleman than one who blasts his bosses. The Bulls have earned a terrible reputation - they can't get the big name free agents to come to the 3rd biggest market with a storied (oops dynasty) past. Maybe they figure it doesn't matter anymore, people see they're just milking the team for as much profit as possible.
 
Denny Crane said:
He's taking the high road while the Bulls take the low one. I think teams would rather hire a gentleman than one who blasts his bosses. The Bulls have earned a terrible reputation - they can't get the big name free agents to come to the 3rd biggest market with a storied (oops dynasty) past. Maybe they figure it doesn't matter anymore, people see they're just milking the team for as much profit as possible.
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And yet you keep crawling back, year after year, don't you Denny?
 
Rastapopoulos said:
And yet you keep crawling back, year after year, don't you Denny?
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I have some emotional investment in the players and Thibs. I've been a Bulls fan since the 1960s, before the current ownership and management. I hope those guys are gone ASAP...
 


Can't be Thibs, as EVERYONE sees that coming. Somebody fired to make room for Thibs?
 
get
 
RR7 said:
What doesn't make sense about that is, the Bulls owe him about 9 million over the next 2 years. If they fire him now, and he signs on for 4-5 million to coach a different team, they basically are off the hook for his salary, with it offsetting. If they wait until there are no jobs, they have to pay him for the season. A personal vendetta that'll cost them 4.5 million dollars. Brilliant.
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I don't believe that is correct. If the Bulls fire him they have to pay his whole contract and they don't get any offset back if he signs with another team. If they "trade" him for a draft pick they don't have to pay his contract.
 
Since when did trading coaches become a thing? I can't wait for the first actual coach-for-coach trade.
 
Draco said:
I don't believe that is correct. If the Bulls fire him they have to pay his whole contract and they don't get any offset back if he signs with another team. If they "trade" him for a draft pick they don't have to pay his contract.
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http://basketball.realgm.com/wireta...-Contract-With-Bulls-Contains-Offset-Language

Thibodeau's contract contain offset language, meaning the Bulls' financial commitment would be "offset" by the amount he would make if hired by another team.
 
Well thanks I stand corrected, I guess its a case by case scenario.
 
Draco said:
Well thanks I stand corrected, I guess its a case by case scenario.
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I got curious to see what the deal is and found that. I also just found this:

http://espn.go.com/chicago/nba/stor...increasing-consideration-firing-tom-thibodeau

The reality, sources say, is that the Bulls believe there is little chance they would have to pay that whole amount, since league rules on coaching contracts would inevitably see that figure reduced by set-off provisions once Thibodeau lands a new job.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Since when did trading coaches become a thing? I can't wait for the first actual coach-for-coach trade.
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Not sure. Knicks got draft picks way back when Riley went to the Heat. Heat got a 2nd round pick when Stan Van Gundy went to the Magic. Doc a couple years ago. I think there have been others.
 
I'd love to see him sign for $1 somewhere. Problem is he'll probably get offered 2x what he made with the Bulls which is way better for him than to stick it to the owner.
 
Denny Crane said:
I'd love to see him sign for $1 somewhere. Problem is he'll probably get offered 2x what he made with the Bulls which is way better for him than to stick it to the owner.
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Someone on twitter suggested he sign a contract with a really low first year that then expands. That way the Bulls would be paying most of it the first year.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Someone on twitter suggested he sign a contract with a really low first year that then expands. That way the Bulls would be paying most of it the first year.
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I wouldn't be surprised if the boilerplate coaching contract template is available via the WWW. Some lawyer type (not me, I only play one on TV) might be able to tell us if that's legit.

I'd love to see it, as I said.

$1 first year, $18M the 2nd.
 
This is what is on the Hoopshype page......Jeff Van Gundy and New Orleans officials met in the Bay Area to discuss the Pelicans' head coach opening, according to Yahoo! Sports ... Bulls close to firing Tom Thibodeau? ... Hawks confident about chances of keeping both Paul Millsap and DeMarre Carroll .
 
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